Can anyone explain "Chemtrails" ?

[Wonco_the_Sane]

Not mocking here. Like many I'm here to learn.

What little I understand leads me to think "tin foil hat" time.

Am I wrong?

I hate that some stuff here just seems to make us look kookier than most of us really are. That said. I want to be open minded as well.

For what it's worth I grew up around Air Force bases and I'm now, not to far from a Columbus airport. I've never thing that concerned me or didn't seem above the board.

[Lautremont]

1. Why even bring it up if you have an aversion to kooky stuff?

Surely a few minutes alone with Google will satisfy both your curiosity and your wish not to bring up stuff that makes this site look like it's crawling with kooks.

[MADem]

4. Ah, yes, Google is indeed a fine friend, is it not?

And really easy to use, too!!! Type in your subject, and voila--all is revealed!

[Wonco_the_Sane]

5. that's a good point

I've seen some stuff just lurking and figured there may be someone who knew of the "better" sites or could break it down in simple terms.

DU is just a nice place to find folks who are informed and not overly influenced by the MSM. No harm meant and I'm not asking so I can shoot ideas down.

I like the community here for it's lack of judgmental jerks. It's not kookie to ask for info. It's kookie to be an absolutist conspiracy nut.

Just cuz everyones not out to get me does not mean that some aren't. :)

[RBHam]

2. The guy who broke the story. Send him some love.

Award winning journalist
who also was one of the first to report on Gulf War syndrome...


http://www.willthomas.net/

[Project_Willow]

12. Thanks for the link

That is the most lucid and reasonable explanation of the phenomenon I have seen.

[dbt]

19. Hello, Project_Willow, and welcome to DU!

[anarchy1999]

3. Okay, chemtrails are the source of many heated debates. You do

appear to be baiting many of us and most of us don't allow it. If you want more info go to www.chemtrailcentral.com or to www.carnicom.com there is lots of info there with links to many other sites.

You grew up around AFB's, make up your own mind and don't as a new person around DU try to start anything.

Welcome to DU and in the beginning, until you get to know a few of us, keep it simple. Just a few words of advice, take them or leave them.

[Wonco_the_Sane]

9. Thanks for link

There seem to be many theories about them. (I may have been out of line by even bringing up tin foil, sorry)

As I started this asking for info I ask that people be respectful of alternate ideas. Skepticism is OK of course but please leave this thread to people who have valid theories or people who genuinely wish to be educated a little on a "hot" topic. Thanks.

The William Thomas looks pretty interesting (and lends credibility) thanks for that link too.

I take it there is no DU consensus view? One theory that is more plausible than others? (the source of the debates)

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Swamp Rat]

24. HAHA! You so funny!

Welcome to DU! Good luck!:D

[BurningCandy]

25. Thanks

AS long as I just agree with everyone until I get over 1,000 posts, I'll be fine!

[Swamp Rat]

26. I don't know about that.

:D

Good luck! :D

[BurningCandy]

27. See!

You're starting already! Maybe I should just go back to lurking. You guys are brutal on newbies!

[Swamp Rat]

28. Eureka! I proved your theory!

:D HAHA!! :D ... GREAT FOR YOU!!! YAAY!!! :party:

[BurningCandy]

30. Whatever

[anarchy1999]

37. With good reason.

Sorry and not sorry at all. We have an awesome community and many members and we do have rules of behavior. We really are not "brutal", we just have expectations.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

33. And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the textbook definition of

"self-fulfilling prophecy."

[lenidog]

6. Don't worry about making us look kookier than we actually are

the people who have already formed opinion about us are the people that we really don't want here any way. But to the point Chem trails are a recent addition to the tinfoil brigades list of weird things. Basically they are trail in the sky that look like contrails but they are supposedly different because they don't disappear as quickly as a contrail would or they from weird patterns or when they mix together they from weird colored clouds. So the theory is that our government or the NWO is actually spraying the population with either biological or chemical weapons in an effort to test them or mind control drugs to be able to control us. Then there are others who believe that they are a form of weather control. Supposedly there is a giant conspiracy consisting of thousands of military and civilian personnel whose sole purpose is to spray this stuff and keep it quiet.


For a little more info try this. They wont try and sway you one way or another.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemtrails

[Jim Sagle]

7. It's a series of farts from Jeff Rense's ass.

[Fescue4u]

8. Here's the ingredients for a Chem Trail

Ingredients:

Water vapor left by high flying aircraft
Active imagination
Distrust of government
Several internet conspiracy sites.

Take each of the above ingredients in equal amounts, shake and stir well. Wait 30 minuts and you too can post nutty Chemtrail storys on the Internet!

:)

[0rganism]

10. Sure. They're the Sky-God's answer to "Crop Circles"

Now let's go get sushi or something!

[Wonco_the_Sane]

11. Can the truth be in the middle

OK some here clearly think there is nothing to this. Fine. I again ask that all are respectful and if you think there is NOTHING to this then I respect that and ask that I and anyone who cares to can try to learn as much as possible without mocking.

Thanks to lenidog for the advice as to "what others think". Noted.

I'm not really new here I just don't post a lot and have irregular access to the Internet.

Anywho.

Is there a middle ground on the issue. The government and/or shadow movements will often put up "trial balloons" to see what they can get away with. I can understand the possibility of SOMETHING funy going on, then getting blown out of all proportion to kill the credibility of those who ask legitimate questions.

What's the middle ground on CT? Is there one?

On edit:

I did not know the issue had been brought up in congress already. (from one of the links I was investigating)H. R. 2977 (Kucinich) listed in exotic weapons systems in Space Preservation Act.

I make no judgments tonight but admit I have a lot to learn. So far many people have many ideas as to what chemtrails are or could be. While I don't think it's any of the more far-out options (the further out, the more vague the theory) but I'm sorry for being so dismissive right off the bat.

I hope not to have ruffled feathers or offended anyone.

[greatbubba]

13. Here is the TRUTH they are real.. read this article that appeared today

The media is already making excuses for what they called nanobacteria. Do the research yourself. Look up at the sky see how the chemtrails dispurse over the sky like a blanket of fake clouds. I remember as a young boy I could look at the sky and see blue.....That was in 1988 now you cant look up without seeing white. Remember Contrails dissapear in minutes...Chemtrails stay around for hours and hours...Try going outside at 9am look at the sky then on your lunch go outside and then on your commute home go outside look at the sky..Take notes...YOU WILL FIND THE TRUTH YOU ARE SEEKING.

-------------------------------------------

Clouds May Harbor Nanobacteria By Amit Asaravala

Story location: http://www.wired.com/news/planet/0,2782,67176,00.html
02:00 AM Apr. 11, 2005 PT
Tiny particles linked to a number of painful and sometimes deadly diseases may spread across the globe by hitching a ride in clouds, claim researchers in a recent issue of the Journal of Proteome Research.
The particles, known as nanobacteria, are 100 times smaller than typical bacteria and have been found in kidney stones, arterial plaques and ovarian cancers.

But scientists have yet to agree whether the particles actually cause the diseases or how they infect humans.
Also unknown is whether the particles are life forms or an unknown type of crystal -- a rift that has sparked one of the biggest controversies in modern microbiology.
Now, a new theory by Andrei Sommer, of the University of Ulm, Germany, and N. Chandra Wickramasinghe, of Cardiff University in the United Kingdom, attempts to show how nanobacteria moves from humans to the environment and back.
In a letter in the February issue of the Journal of Proteome Research, the pair describe studies suggesting that nanobacteria exist in the atmosphere -- at least above Hyderabad, India, where the researchers captured samples of the air with a specially designed balloon.
The nanobacteria particles closely resembled those found in humans when compared on seven key criteria, including size and shape -- a finding that suggests humans can be infected through the atmosphere.
In the journal's introduction to the paper, Sommer theorizes that the particles may be introduced to the atmosphere through human urine, which enters waste-water streams and becomes aerosolized.
Once in the atmosphere, the nanobacteria can fall back to Earth in dry or wet form. The researchers think dry forms are relatively harmless, but wet forms, in raindrops, would be more likely to be infectious because the nanobacteria would still be "active."
"Inactive, transiently desiccated microorganisms, transported back from the dry atmosphere to the Earth by gravity, are likely to cause little harm, compared to those returning in rain drops, after having been incorporated for some time in long-lived clouds, where they would encounter better conditions for revitalization," wrote the researchers.
The researchers also suggested that nanobacteria could help clouds develop by clumping together at the perfect size to promote the collection of airborne water droplets.
Attempts to contact Sommer and Wickramasinghe after business hours Friday were unsuccessful.

[anarchy1999]

38. My personal favortie, "milky skies" forecast in the DFW area.

"Milky Skies", what the hell is that??

I grew up in the country, raising cows, alfafa and chickens. "milky skies" never existed until the last couple of years and I can't get the most reputable weatherman to answer a phone call to explain to me "milky skies"!

I'm not buying.

[greatbubba]

14. Here are some pics taken in Sacramento Ca....Everyday..same routine

Everyday I take pictues..I have even got my coworkers to take notice and look at the sky as they poison our skies.

[LeftyMom]

17. Isn't that Scandia as seen from I80? (pic 1)

Why would vapor trails in between Mather and McClellan be unusual? They aren't AF bases anymore but they're still used as airprts and pretty busy.

I'm not trying to be a wiseass. Please explain why those aren't vapor trails incidental to air traffic.

[dbt]

23. Well done, greatbubba, and welcome to DU!

Keep watching.

[alexisfree]

15. Here is a link to a great place to start.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/chemtrailtrackingusa/

[LeftCoast]

16. Don't worry, when properly applied

aluminum foil blocks all the harmful effects of 'chemtrails' :)

[lies and propaganda]

18. Everybody is being a bit shitty....

Dont you fucking hate when trying to explain to people the stolen election of either term, and they tell you that you are a tinfoil, liberal, conspiracy theorist? if you dont agree, fine, but you dont have to make the posters who believe in this feel stupid.
Jeff Rense? Thats insulting to anyone who feels that they value their researched beliefs.

And if we didnt discuss things that were kooky they would be getting away with a fuck lot more than they are now.

[muriel_volestrangler]

21. *Everybody* being a bit shitty?

Given that both sides of the argument have already contributed, I don't see how you can say that.

Why do you think mentioning Jeff Rense is insulting to 'researched beliefs'? He believes in chemtrials, and is one of the leading publicisers of the idea. You can't talk about them without mentioning him.

Now, a question for those who say "contrails disappear in minutes". How do you know? What practical research have you done with what you know to be 'contrails' rather than 'chemtrails' (and then tell us what the chemical difference between the two is) on how long they last, in various weather conditions?

[dbt]

20. In my opinion, artificial cloud cover is being deliberately made.

Having studied this subject since 1999, that is the least complex scenario I can discern among the many that are offered. It is less complex, even, than the "persistent contrails" explanation that is brought up so often. You will ultimately note that it is, most of the time, put forth without any accompanying explanation of the factors that would make contrails suddenly start lingering and expanding laterally--after having behaved in the opposite manner for the previous fifty years.

In other words, there is no explanation of the tipping point. These are merely contrails, and anybody who questions the situation is to be mocked as a loony. People who would not lift a finger to save you from driving your car into a brick wall will suddenly become VERY concerned over what you see in the sky.

As to why the cloud cover would be deliberately generated, look up Edward Teller's theories of combatting Global Warming. In a 1997 Wall Street Journal article, "Sunscreen For Planet Earth," he proposes a solution: "Injecting sunlight-scattering particles into the stratosphere appears to be a promising approach. Why not do that?"
The article is at this link: http://www.hooverdigest.org/981/teller.html

I thank you for bringing this subject up, Wonco. With every passing day, more people are wondering just what's going on up there. I would advise you to watch the sky. Every human being has a built-in sense of Discernment; if you listen long enough, that "inner voice" will begin to help you determine what's true and what's not.

One more thing: this thread that you started will undoubtedly be moved to the September 11 Forum, though the subject has no connection with 9/11. If you should find that curious, you will not be alone!

dbt

Committee On Noticing Spray Programs Involving Real Aircraft Calculated Yearly

[SidDithers]

29. I've asked the question many times...

Surely if the trails were the dispersal pattern of some unnamed chemical or biological agent, somebody would have chartered a plane flown up to take samples. Testing would have to show 2 things:

1) that there really is something other than water vapour there
2) that the measured concentration of the "something" increases as you get closer to the trail.

I've read some of the chemtrail sites that have done testing, but it's always been ground level testing. Sampling the ground is useless because there are too many variables which could provide for false positive tests.

I believe the trails are water vapour prouduced by jet engines, which condenses in the cold at high altitudes. They are CONdensation TRAILS - contrails.

Sid

[DemonFighterLives]

31. Originally, I may have called chemtrailers Kooky

Until I got a good dose of them in a relatively pristine area. Never before in 45 years did I see anything like it. Cross hatch patterns covered the whole sky. My thoughts were that they matched the pictures on the Kook websites.
Conclusion: No conclusion. They entire spraying or dumping thing is not followed up by the media. With a big mafia family in charge of America, it could be anything. This is not the contrails of old.
If anyone gets to see them, they will completely go hmmmm.
:shrug:

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dbt]

34. Perhaps it has something to do with the fact

that posts here cannot be nominated for the Greatest page?

:evilgrin:

[WoodrowFan]

36. this is the default "tinfoil" forum now I think

Since so many of the 82d Tinfoil Brigade hang out here (as do the 101st Sceptics Division) other topics sometimes get moved here.

[WoodrowFan]

35. here are some good links

here are some good sites.. Teh first two are especially good. If anyone believes in "chemtrails" after reading these find a bridge to sell them...

http://www.nmsr.org/pilotsvu.htm

http://iangoddard.net/contrail.htm

http://cimss.ssec.wisc.edu/wxwise/contrail.html

http://worldzone.net/science/reality2u30/