Bush 9/11 Lie?

[SoCalifer]

I am not sure how many of you have a problem with this like me. But one of the problems I have with the official 9/11 story are these two slightly different statements made by Bush totally conflicting with the timeline of events.

I think this is telling because as you know, when one is lying about something, especially to cover-up guilt, it is the lies themselves that betray the person telling them. And not matching with the timeline is a classic way lies expose themselves as lies. Something my brother who's a deputy sheriff Los Angeles County is very familiar with. And something any parent should be familiar with too.. hehe

Anyway here's one of the problems I have with the President's statements:

On December 4, 2001 during a town home meeting at the Orange County Convention Center in Orlando Florida the President made the following statement:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/12/20011204-17.html

QUESTION: "One thing, Mr. President, is that you have no idea how much you've done for this country. And another thing is that, how did you feel when you heard about the terrorist attack?"

THE PRESIDENT: "Thank you, Jordan. Well, Jordan, you're not going to believe what state I was in when I heard about the terrorist attack. I was in Florida. And my Chief of Staff, Andy Card -- actually, I was in a classroom talking about a reading program that works. I was sitting outside the classroom waiting to go in, and I saw an airplane hit the tower -- the TV was obviously on. And I used to fly, myself, and I said, well, there's one terrible pilot. I said, it must have been a horrible accident."

"But I was whisked off there, I didn't have much time to think about it. And I was sitting in the classroom, and Andy Card, my Chief of Staff, who is sitting over here, walked in and said, A second plane has hit the tower, America is under attack."



------------



Then On January 5, 2002 during a town hall meeting at Ontario Convention Center in Ontario California the President made the following slightly different statement:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/01/20020105-3.html

QUESTION: "What was the first thing that went through your head when you heard that a plane crashed into the first building?"

THE PRESIDENT: "Yes. Well, I was sitting in a schoolhouse in Florida. I had gone down to tell my little brother what to do, and -- just kidding, Jeb. (Laughter) And -- it's the mother in me. (Laughter.) Anyway, I was in the midst of learning about a reading program that works. I'm a big believer in basic education, and it starts with making sure every child learns to read. And therefore, we need to focus on the science of reading, not what may feel good or sound good when it comes to teaching children to read. (Applause.) I'm just getting a plug in for my reading initiative."

Anyway, I was sitting there, and my Chief of Staff -- well, first of all, when we walked into the classroom, I had seen this plane fly into the first building. There was a TV set on. And you know, I thought it was pilot error and I was amazed that anybody could make such a terrible mistake. And something was wrong with the plane, or -- anyway, I'm sitting there, listening to the briefing, and Andy Card came and said, "America is under attack."

---------------



Now NOTE: There seems to be an obvious correction from his first statement made in Florida where he says "I saw an airplane hit the tower to his second statement made in California where he says "I had seen this plane fly into the first building.

Now this correction is important because he was being criticized by some for his lack of reaction on September 11th and given the fact that he was in the middle of having school kids read to him, he couldn't have seen the second plane hitting the second tower. So in his second statement, he seeks to make it clear that when he said he saw a plane fly into the tower, it was the first plane flying into the first tower.

Well, well, well Mr President, you're a fucking liar!! You couldn't have possibly seen ANY PLANE fly into ANY TOWER while you were in that school because NO media station had live video of the first plane flying into the first tower, and the ONLY video of the first plane flying into the first tower is a recording by amateur video seen days later on TV.

The first plane struck the first tower at 8:46 AM ET. ABC NEWS Good morning America broke in with a special report showing flames coming out of the first tower at 8:52 AM ET. You Mr. President arrived at the school a few minutes later at 8:55 AM ET. And the second plane hit the second tower while the whole world could see you sitting in a chair looking like a dumbass at 9:02 AM ET.

So why don't you tell us what really happened you Nazi Jackass.. :mad:

[fooj]

1. Give em hell, SoCalifer!

We here in California tell it like it is!:smoke:

[SoCalifer]

2. Here, here fooj :)

Barbara Boxer is my Senator.. :)

[zann725]

12. Me too!

I agree his two stories had curious discrepancies. What I noticed most however (since I'm VERY into speech patterns and dialogue)was Shrub's curious NEED to explain in BOTH interviews why he was in Florida. In one case he says, "You're not going to believe where I was." Why would the interviewer question Shrub's presence in Florida? Why did he HAVE to explain (as he did in the other interview) that he was visiting his brother to run his life. Why did he feel COMPELLED to explain, or joke (which one often does when one is nervous) about something which should've been matter-of-fact...if no lying or cover-up were involved. In fact, I was most intrigued by his EXTREMELY wordy reference to being in Florida to run Jeb's life...immediately followed by a curiously LENGTHY explanation of how important school Reading programs were. Shrub is being interviewed about a catastrophic attack on America, and his response is TWO lengthy side-tracks to the main story. Of course, Shrub's nervousness, and need to explain his trip to Florida to run Jeb's life...completely ignores the "elephant in the room"...that Jeb had INEXPLICABLY declared "Martial Law" in Florida about 4 days PRIOR to 9/11...and 3 days prior to Shrub's arrival in Florida ALLEGEDLY to visit Jeb. Could THIS be why Shrub felt a nervous need to OVER-EXPLAIN "acceptable" reasons why he was in Florida, and in a classroom reading "Pet Goat" at the time of the obviously anticipated (by Shrubco) 9/11 attacks.

The other thing that bothered me linguistically about his varying accounts, was his excessive need to keep adding that there "of course" was a TV there. Why does he NEED to convince us there was one? Plus he couldn't seem to establish exactly WHERE the TV was on which he first saw the attack. The TV seemed to move about in each account. (You can hear the ambivalence in his words...that he can't place exactly where it was...because it really WASN'T there...except in his "story." Also in both accounts he STRESSES he was aware of the first attack PRIOR to entering the school room. Why would he feel the need to say something so unflattering to his inteligence? For an Admin. that "spins" everything to their advantage, why would Shrub go out of his way to admit he was aware of the first attack PRIOR to entering the classroom? And why would he go out of his way to explain that he thought the first attack was simply an inexperienced pilot? Particularly in light of the 52+ prior warnings he and his Admin. received about possible Terrorist attack to hi-rise buildings. Yet knowing all this prior to entering the classroom still makes perfect sense in light of the fact he was COINCIDENTALLY at the time in a State his brother was Governor of...where Martial Law had COINCIDENTALLY been declared days before.

Since he's not particularly linguistically skilled, his statements are EXTREMELY telling, and the lies stick right out there in plain-sight. I'd love to read more of his quotes surrounding 9/11. I'll bet there's a lot more there.

[Vickers]

14. Zann, those have always been my concerns, too

I can almost see getting timelines screwed up, and I think most folks do it at some point.

But, I have kids and I have seen the dynamic you describe, where they will overemphasize the smallest points, almost thinking if THAT part is taken as true then the big things (i.e., the lies) are gonna be perceived as true, too.

Nice to see somebody put it in words much better than me, though. :)

[EFerrari]

18. Me, too, Zann.

He's as false and as transparent as water! I'd love a project like that as well.

The sophisticates in the Cabal can be read by what they deny (it's true) what they assert(usually the opposite is true) and what they accuse their opponents of doing (they are doing it). Bu$h has a hard time staying with these strategies unless he's been drilled, is my guess. Unscripted, he's a disaster (or, as you say, extremely telling).

[Old and In the Way]

24. He must have thought there were lots of terrible pilots in Florida, too.

Because he brought a SAM battery with him to the Resort complex he stayed at in Florida on 9/10.

[me b zola]

26. Yeppers.

How many times since 9/11 has he read to children, since it is so important to him.

You nailed a lot of the nuances dead on.

[FreedomAngel82]

37. Now that in itself

is very intresting. Hmm. Funny how he hasn't mentioned his reading program at all since 9/11.

[porkrind]

70. Nice synopsis.

[fooj]

47. Ditto, darlin'!

[UL_Approved]

3. You are right

This is a SEVERE screwup, and indicates MIHOP.

NOBODY has video footage of the first plane strike. NOBODY.

Not CNN, FOX, NBC, ABC, CBS, NOBODY.

And why was a TV on in the school for him to see, anyway?

[Al-CIAda]

6. The only footage of the first plane hitting was from the

French filmakers.

The French filmakers (brothers) were visiting a stationhouse doing a documentary on a firehouse that just so happened to be near the towers. They give an account in their film. The footage however was not available and hour later much less real time as it would have to be if Mr. Treason is telling the truth. They submitted the footage late that day and that was the very first we all saw it 'on TV.


Unless- he was shown the 'job' on a closed cercuit camera set up by the culprits.

[FreedomAngel82]

38. I saw that

They were doing it for CBS or NBC or something weren't they? I remember watching that and then they showed one guy talking about the bombs going off and explaining what it's like. And of course they never aired this program for some reason.

[DulceDecorum]

46. Reverend Kenneth A. Angell ALSO SAW THE FIRST PLANE

Editor's note: As the horrific events of last September 11 unfolded, media reports came in that among the dead on American Airlines Flight 11, the first airplane to hit the World Trade Center, was David Angell and his wife, Lynn. Angell was an Emmy Award-winning writer and producer for the television sitcoms Cheers, Wings, and Frasier. On this first anniversary month of the September 11 terrorist attack, David Angell's brother, the Most Reverend Kenneth A. Angell, Bishop of the Diocese of Burlington, Vermont, shares his thoughts about the events of that black day, about the life of his brother, and about what it all means in the context of faith in God.


When I was first informed of the horrible events that were unfolding at the World Trade Center and the Pentagon last September, I released a statement to the media that said, "We are in shock as we pray for countless, innocent victims and their families. The calculated, cold-blooded, cowardly taking of precious human lives in the name of religion is beyond blasphemy. It is pure evil"
Little did I know in those early moments that my own brother, David, and his wife, Lynn, were among those "countless, innocent victims."
As I watched the first airliner crash into the World Trade Tower on television, I didn't think they were on that plane.
http://www.catholic.com/thisrock/2002/0209fea1.asp

BUT BUT that is not the strangest part of the story.
There is something called the Social Service Death Index.
When someone dies, the hospital and the funeral home report the death to the SSA and that person is then added to the SSDI.
So lets see what happens when you look up David Angell and Lynn Angell.
You have to match the age.
David Angell, 54
Lynn Angell, 45
Here is the SSDI link
http://ssdi.genealogy.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/ssdi.cgi
Good luck.

[Richard Steele]

56. They are NOT there...interesting catch!

[DulceDecorum]

68. Most of the people

listed on the CNN website are not there either.
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/memorial/index.html

A few of them ARE though,
which only goes to show that something is not quite right.

Now,
Google up the N-numbers for the planes,
for example N644AA (Flight 77) or N612UA (Flight 175)
and see what happens when you type them into the FAA civil aviation registry.

When a plane crashes and burns,
according to the law,
it loses its registration certificate on the same day that it is destroyed.

Therefore, please pay particular attention to
the date that the plane was manufactured
and the date upon which it received its registration certificate
and the date upon which the registration certificate became defunct. Please note that the plane was legally able to fly during the ENTIRE TIME between the last two dates.

Here is the site.
Do not include the N at the beginning.
http://162.58.35.241/acdatabase/NNum_inquiry.asp
Enjoy.

[Al-CIAda]

4. LYING sack of $hit.

OOPS!!!

Bush Caught in a Lie About the 9/11 WTC Attacks
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/bushlie.html>http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/bushlie.html
=====
Filmakers who shot the footage of the 1st plane-

French Filmmakers Jules and Gedeon Naudet were there to witness this tragedy. They found themselves in lower Manhattan as the attack unfolded, and they captured unique footage from the area, including the only images from inside Tower 1, where firefighters were trying to get a handle on the dangerous situation.

Their footage includes scenes of firefighters trying to escape from Tower 1 after Tower 2 had collapsed. Jules and Gedeon, who are brothers, were within a block of Tower 2 when it collapsed, and narrowly escaped death.

On Sunday, March 10 at 9 p.m., almost six months to the day after the terror attacks, CBS will broadcast 9/11 - an extraordinary film, telling the story of that day from the perspective of those who survived it. The two-hour film will be hosted by actor/director Robert De Niro.

http://www.frenchculture.org/tv/programs/naudet911.html>http://www.frenchculture.org/tv/programs/naudet911.html

=====

Memory: Remember It Right?
Newsweek
Sept. 20 issue

- It's well documented that President George W. Bush was in a Florida classroom on 9/11 when chief of staff Andrew Card told him a second plane had hit the World Trade Center. But how did Bush learn about the first crash?

Two of his recollections are similar, but factually impossible. On Dec. 4, 2001, and Jan. 5, 2002, Bush told audiences he saw the first plane hit the tower on TV before he entered the classroom. But he couldn't have seen it; nobody saw it live on TV. Between those recountings, on Dec. 20, Bush told The Washington Post that Karl Rove told him. This isn't to say the president is a fabulist. He's just exhibiting a prominent example of a common memory glitch, says UCLA psychology fellow Dan Greenberg, who published a paper this summer in the journal Applied Cognitive Psychology called "President Bush's False Flashbulb Memory of 9/11/01."

Greenberg says this is more evidence that "flashbulb memories"—major events people remember "like it was yesterday"—are not as indelible as experts thought. (This was proved in a four-year study after the 1986 Challenger explosion, when witnesses dramatically altered their memories of the disaster.) Greenberg thinks Bush saw the first-tower crash footage replayed so often that it seemed as if he had seen it as it happened. Greenberg struggles to explain why Bush, having remembered events differently in his second recounting, went back to the original version. The White House declined to comment.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5970907/site/newsweek/]http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5970907/site/newsweek/

=======

[Tracyjo]

7. Why is george bush the only one with the memory glitch?

I saw the first tower burning and replays of the second plane flying into the second tower all day long and I have never once thought that I saw the first plane hit the first tower, EVER! How about you guys?

[FreedomAngel82]

39. I've seen at least

three documentaries with the plane's and 9/11. One is the "In Plane Sight" one, another one was Alex Jones and then I saw the one from the french network on the firefighters. I'll have to go back and watch the other two but I'm pretty sure the other two just have the second plane and it's the same footage they showed on the air that day.

[dbeach]

5. bush reading a goat story..

is really symbolic..but the govt story is so well..
lets hear the bushhevik story..a tall saudi millionaire whose uncle was having breakfast with GHWB in D.C. that morning at the carlyle group,dying of kidney disease,with a cell phone,from a cave 12,000 miles away directed the greatest attack against the USA in history by having 19 hijackers trained on piper cubs with no experience driving jumbo jets making aerodynamic impossible turns while NORAD had live training exercises that morning and also was under standown..

and folks don't belive in the tooth fairy or santa claus or fairy godmothers..

I believe in fairy tales but I don't believe in the govt sanctioned story of 9/11..

there is no main media first video..only the amateur video..
I have question.

Dems call bush a liar yet most believe bush version of 9/11 WHY??

THANX for post

[Old and In the Way]

10. Why?

Anthrax.

[FreedomAngel82]

41. Yep

On http://www.informationclearinghouse.info they have the movie "The Carlyle Group" and they talk a bit about Bush senior being in the hotel room (like a eating room or something) with the BinLadin family. I wonder if they stopping him from flying was just a show setup.

[dbeach]

45. Papa bush breakfasting with uncle bin laden..

in D.C. and marvin owned the security at Dulles airport and
WTC {he sold it in 7/01}

but its just biznizz as usual for the red,white and blue-blooded criminal bush family..
"What me worry"?

[leftofthedial]

8. the little bushturd lied??

I'm shocked!!

[Old and In the Way]

9. Why did he think it was "one terrible pilot"?

He knew before he walked into the school that it was a hijacked plane that hit the 1st building. Why would he say that? This was said before the 8/6 PDB was released (which they fought mightily not to release). We now know that there were plenty of warnings that terrorists were planning an attack. Again, I think that's a major reason why they fought the release of pre-wrnings in the 9/11 Commission.

So why did he think "it was one terrible pilot" and a "horrible accident"? An AWOL ex-TANG pilot really thinks a commercial airline pilot is "one terrible pilot" and would accidently hit the WTC on a flight from Boston to LA?

Assuming he was completely surprised, I can see making this excuse once at the time; to try for some feeble attempt to cover his lack of reaction, before he was told of the 2nd plane hit. But why repeat it a few months later?

Now that we really know the extent of his prior knowledge, I think it was purposely laid out that way to cover for the lack of AF reaction to the events. Because, he's the CIC and if he's thinking it's an accident, nothing's happening to intercept the other aircraft still flying.

[FreedomAngel82]

42. I don't know why

but this reminded me of what Kerry said about his experience on 9/11. So I don't know.

http://kerrylibrary.forumflash.com/index.php?showtopic=206 (Kerry's statement about what happened with him on 9/11)

[Old and In the Way]

11. Maybe he really did see the 1st plane hit the WTC.

Remember that story of those Israeli's filming the event in NJ? What if they were doing a CCTV uplink? Is the Presidential Limo equipped with CCTV? I'll bet it is.

I suppose it's possible he arrives at school and sees the aftermath on TV and assumes that they have caught the whole event.....but if he thinks it's an accident he wouldn't expect them to capture the event as it happens, right?

Dimson might have been so caught up in the moment, that he forgot that detail...or maybe broadcast TV were slow in getting their live feeds turned on and missed the 1st event. I've wondered about that....a commercial airliner goes off track in upper New York State and no one in the major news networks have any idea the plane is heading for NYC? Or did they know, but not in time to capture on TV?

[gumby]

13. I've always thought he saw the first plane hit.

Cheney said that he and Bush have constant video communication capability when they are separated. He may very well have seen that footage while 'waiting' to go into the classroom; he was in the limo.

[Vickers]

15. But from what feed? There was no BROADCAST footage until

the next day.

:shrug:

And if he DID see it on some private feed...why? Why would they have been looking at the WTC?

[Old and In the Way]

22. Read my post #9.......

This is a entry at cooperative research website:

September 14, 2001 (K) Complete 911 Timeline
Dominick Suter, owner of the company Urban Moving Systems, flees the country to Israel. The FBI later tells ABC News that “Urban Moving may have been providing cover for an Israeli intelligence operation.” Suter has been tied to the five Israeli agents caught filming the WTC attack. The FBI had questioned him around September 12, removing boxes of documents and a dozen computer hard drives. But when they returned a few days later, Suter is gone (see September 11, 2001 (W)).

Here's more detail. Note that most of this is not attributable to sources that are considered mainstream. But if this did happen, it wouldn't surprise me that the corporate media would blackout these facts immediately.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fiveisraelis.html

[gumby]

27. sophisticated communications equipment used

by our government/military is surely not dependent upon broadcast footage or feeds.

[Vickers]

31. Yeah, you're proving my point.

:)

There are two scenarios:

a. he's an idiot (not knowing/remembering the sequence of events)

b. he's complicit (actually saw the 1st plane hit because it was arranged)

[SammyWinstonJack]

79. b.

"he's complicit (actually saw the 1st plane hit because it was arranged)" :mad:

[12345]

17. Could have been a Freudian slip a la Rumsfeld...

[Chelsea Patriot]

28. Agreed, I've always Assumed * saw The Attack Via CCTV in The Limo

[Old and In the Way]

30. It really would be typical of this guy.

The moment the Big Lie is introduced, he starts ad-libbing and blows the cover. I'll bet Card and Rove pooped their pants listening to him wander off the script.

[sickem]

16. 9-11 was great for bush

Every time I hear Bush talk about "the day of fire" and so on I get sick to my stomach. For this clown to pretend that he was somehow a victim of 9-11 like the rest of America is ridiculous! It was actually the greatest thing that could have happened to his presidency. I know that "conspiracy theories" is a dirty word now days. The Bushies and FOX news have made sure of that. But I still believe the Bush White House was behind the 9-11 attacks. They have gained to much from this tragedy. All the clues point to their complicity. I think it's time for Congress to do the unthinkable and start looking at the Bush administration as the engine behind the 9-11 attacks.

http://www.workingforchange.com/article.cfm?itemid=18557

[Dinger]

36. I Seriously Wonder What Part The Giggling Murder

had in the 9-11 attacks.

[FreedomAngel82]

43. And remember

when Bush gave his first speech about 9/11 he said not to listen to conspericy theorist of 9/11? Anybody know what I'm talking about and could find the video? I remember hearing this. I wonder why. And I also remember he didn't even want a 9/11 commission hearing but people pushed and pushed for one and he caved and aloud it. I guess because people would get so suspecious and everything. With 9/11 he was then aloud to do whatever he wanted and nobody would question it because he could play the safety card and whatnot.

[driver8]

51. Not only did he not want a 9/11 commission, he refused to

testify under oath and without Cheney present. I wonder WTF these criminals are hiding??

But we are all supposed to believe that shrub rallied the country and "saved the day" after 9/11. What a crock of shit.

[leesa]

19. So many lies...so many inconsistencies...so many impossibilities.

How can anyone think they were NOT involved in 9-11?

[B3Nut]

29. IMHO...

they had to have been, in some capacity. It's so glaringly obvious, even from Bush's gaffes and verbose meanderings on the topic of what he was doing on 9/11. They've gotten more mileage out of the "September Eleventh" meme than a million sets of Michelins could ever give them. The insider trading, the swift removal of evidence...there was some level of US complicity. Has to be. Many can't bring themselves to beleive that their own government would slaughter some of its own citizens to further an agenda, but even casual students of history know that that is the oldest trick in the book. Ask Nero Ceasar. Ask JFK, who recoiled in horror at just such a proposal given him by his military advisors.

Todd in Beerbratistan

[PennyK]

20. Somewhat off topic

"The science of reading"?
Damn it, isn't faith based reading the way to go?

[Vickers]

21. The crazy part...his hand-picked crowd APPLAUDED that part.

:eyes:

[applegrove]

23. Stop with your denial!! 9/11 happened and it allowed the nut-bombs

to take over America. It gave them the excuses they needed to up the 'patriotic state'. Rather than dealing with reality like: Western nations have hit maturity and need to prepare to be World Citizens, people are running around in rapture and married people of getting remarried. It is awful. It is sad. Osama bin Laden set up a terrorist attack to destabilize the Western World .... and he succeeded.

So stop pretending there will be a miracle. The truth is much worse than a simple little trick on 9/11. The monsters have control of your country and the heart & minds of many Americans. Cry for your country and wake up ready to fight long and hard and boring to get your country back.

Denial only works in the favour of freepers.

[Old and In the Way]

25. Thanks!

Keep posting your "give up and accept things" drivel. I want to see justice served for the 3000 Americans who died on 9/11. Because the root of all evil in this country today stems from the uninvestigated actions of 9/11.

The freepers have accepted 9/11 and their Bush as Lord. Why would I ever want to be like those people?

[applegrove]

49. Ninety - Five percent of the whole world accepts 9/11. The monsters

in the WH you hate so much are just horrid opportunits. And instead of healing his country, Bush, ever the self-centered adolescent, put his own agenda ahead of concensus building and helping all his people to heal.

I know from other bulletin boards that freepers get online and rev up the conspiracy theorists. That is how cruel they are. They want to stir the pot for folk who are really hurting and having a hard time getting to acceptance. And the freepers do this because just like Hitler youth - they are encouraged to be disconnected from their actions so they bait Democrats and people who are very hurt on the left. And those other Bulletin Boards kick those freepers off.

You wouldn't believe something the freepers wanted you to ... would you?

[Old and In the Way]

53. Total BS

Give me a cite on 95% of the world that accepts 9/11.

You can't because it's not true.

Stop being an administration apologist for 9/11. Grow a backbone and stand up for justice for the 3000 9/11 families, the 1500 American soldier's families, and the 100,000 innocent Iraqis who have died because of this administrations lies about 9/11.

By spreading your baloney, you enable them to continue to pull the same shit in the future. Funny how Freeper Central never utters a word about 9/11. The next time a Freeper asks a question about this administration's involvement on 9/11....it will be the first time.

Here's a clue. If you don't like to read about 9/11, don't open the thread.

[applegrove]

80. Your last line was very informative. If you don't like something - you

just look away.

Yes Bush & co failed to protect USA from bin Laden. So did the intelligence community to a certain extent. But those families fought long and hard to get a bipartisan investigation and report and got it (even though Bush & co tried to stop it and Bush tried to not "testify").

Yes it was terrible. But pretending that a whole other bunch of events took place (was a set up by Bush & pals) when there is no evidence of this is not only harmful to the families (who are grieving and whose kids will be grieving their whole lives - unlike you), it is cruel.

So yes we need to dig out every piece of evidence to make sure Rice is in fact telling the truth & so we know that she made a bad National Security Advisor. Yes dig - but you have no right to make stuff up.

And for the sake of those kids you are grieving ... we need to stop it with "conspiracy theories". Because you may have the luxury of bathing in one 'idea' after the next concerning the events of 9/11 but the actual serious victims do not. Their struggle is to move on and accept and try and see something other than the horror of those weeks. The families of 9/11 are the ones who actually do not have the lite & sprite ability to ‘look away’. You publish and stir the pot on this issue … and they will have to take it in (because at this point everything 9/11 is in their bones).

If you are truly outraged at 9/11 than volunteer in your community, or build a garden or help out monitoring an election. There are so many things you could do that do not involve inhaling the fumes of 9/11.

That Bush lied to cover up his immaturity caught on camera that day is no big flag. Politicians lie all the time.

[Old and In the Way]

83. Again, a nice apology post for the Bush junta.

Keep rationalizing why we shouldn't continue to ask questions and search for the truth.....I'll keep responding.

The same people that let 9/11 happen are still in power. What's your threshold to demand justice? 30,000 innocent deaths? 300,000 innocent deaths? or maybe, if it was your husband/wife/son/daughter, your threshold would change to 1.

You still haven't posted a cite for the "95% of the world is past 9/11".

[applegrove]

100. They believe and have accepted that bin Laden used 9/11 to help

the Islamists recruit new members. Because their plans to take over the Middle East by causing terrorism in the Middle East didn't get them any converts. So they did what the USA did to the Russians in Afghanistan: they lured the USA into the Middle East so that their membership (which had been stagnating after 20 years of trying to make each Arab nation Islamist). And it worked for them. Recruitment has gone up.

Read Gynn Dyer's book. Very good.

As the 3,000 innocent deaths: they are being revenged. There have so far been two wars.

And if you are so concerned with death you should try looking into the story behind the 3,000 Americans who needlessly die 'gun'deaths EVERY SINGLE MONTH in the USA. That is 3,000 'innocent deaths' via murder, suicide or accidents with guns. Now that is something that needs some snooping.

[jdots]

89. Earth to Dorris come in Dorris.

If everyone was so afraid of the truth ............

[SoCalifer]

32. More Things That I Think Smell Like A Rat

Here's a list of a few other things that don't pass the smell test with me. Where The Hell Are The So Called Professional Journalists On These? These anomalies all have serious implications in my opinion.

Oh, I almost forgot all these people to include the owners of our news media are all members of the CFR (council On Foreign Relations). Then of course lets not forget about the CIA's operation mocking bird.

----------------





-- As reported by the Chicago Securities Exchange; stock orders to go "short" on American Airlines and United Airlines increased by 1,200% in the week prior to Sept 11th. And according the the New York Times, Wall Street Journal, and The London Independent; A high percentage of this activity came from one investment called Deutschebank. The principle manager of this bank until 1998 was none other than George Tenet the director of the CIA during Sept 11th. << This is very serious shit right here.. Where's the freakin News Media?



-- We were told that nobody in our government had any idea whatsoever that this terrorist attack was planned. But just hours after the attack had happened, the government has the names and pictures of all the nineteen hijackers and who the the master mind was. And to make this more of a joke. Many of the so called hijackers that are named - are not dead. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1559151.stm



-- According to the law of falling bodies as originally put forward by Galileo Galilei, and excepted by science up to today is: The total distance traveled at the end of any specific time in a total vacuum is calculated by this formula: Distance (D) = (32.16/2) X Time In Seconds Squared. And if there is ANY resistance, then the speed and the time of the falling body slows down in relation to the resistance.

In the case of the WTC towers we know that they were 1,350 feet tall. Thus you have this equation for the absolute fastest time these two towers could free fall in a vacuum: 1350 = (32.16/2) X Time In Seconds Squared. This works out to 9.16 seconds.

However, the south tower came down in 10.4 seconds (just one second slower than free fall in a vacuum) despite all the resistance put up by all the 250 major interior and exterior steel columns in that fall. --And-- Even more unusual is that the north tower came down in 8.1 seconds.

Thus if we are to believe the government's official story as to why the towers fell, then we are to believe something that defies the laws of gravity! However if we understand that demolition charges were used to "pull" the towers down, then we would not be believing in something that defies gravity.

Also, "never" has there been a case in the world where fire caused steel in a steel building to weaken, and cause the building to collapse. It has NEVER happened.

[Old and In the Way]

34. That's interesting, but I don't think the formula quite fits

In the case of the WTC, it didn't fall as a complete entity from 1350 feet. It developed more mass as it started collapse floors on the way down.

That said, I'd think that a theoretical model of the WTC could be built that could test the speed of the collapse based on various scenarios....for instance:

(1) The rate of fall expected for a scenario exactly as defined by the official 9/11 report.

(2) The rate of fall based on various explosion scenarios.

That would be interesting to see if scenario (1) would match the actual time expected to collapse....or whether the aid of explosives match the actual time better.

[thereismore]

55. No, the formula stands.

...because all objects released from the same height hit the ground at the same time, regardless of weight (if you can neglect air resistance). So for example a single drop of rain and a drop of rain that had been getting bigger and bigger by joining with other droplets and growing in mass will hit the ground at the same time.

[rumpel]

58. Yes, and survivors from the maintenance below ground level heard and saw

the aftermath of an explosion one floor above them, which was still below ground level. The timing of this witnesses account does not coincide with the timings of the plane crash itself as I recall.

[Old and In the Way]

61. Don't think so.

The formula is evaluating a discrete body moving through space....from point A to point B. The WTC event is a collapse of the body on itself...in effect no movement in space. Not sure that formula applies. I'm no physicist, though.

But it could be modeled to see if the structure behaved as expected - for a simple collapse that was due to failure of the structure at the heights for each building. Probably would require lots of variables and rerun the model many, many times to get a nominal collapse time value. Compare that with the actual time event. You could also model it to see how it compares with the "explosive's" theory.

I'm surprised that it hasn't been done and the results published. It would make one really interesting science project.

[SoCalifer]

62. Law Of Falling Bodies

Old and In the Way, I am going to be argumentative with you, and I hope you don't take it the wrong way. If I upset you, I apologize, its not my intent to upset - its just to illustrate.

------------

The point of the formulas is to illustrate that the absolute fastest those buildings could fall (unimpeded), is at the rate of free falling bodies in a vacuum. The fact that it's a structure falling down upon itself has no baring other than one of "resistance."

And yes, the WTC collapsing is movement through space - any movement is movement through space. My fingers striking this keyboard is movement through space. So I am not quite sure what you're envisioning when you say a collapsing building is not movement through space; because certainly every molecule that made up the WTC moved through space when they fell to the ground.

Now as the towers moved through space on their way down to the ground (provided by gravity), they certainly didn't do so without being impeded by the resistance put up from the 250 massive steel columns used to hold up the buildings.

It takes force to break these columns. And that force can either come from the force of the falling building itself or from something like an explosive. If that force comes from the force of the falling building itself, the energy it takes to break that column is the amount of resistance that column applies. Certainly if you punch a steel column, the steel column is going to resist your fist's movement through space. And of course unfortunately for your fist, the steel column's resistance is so much more greater than the force of your moving fist, that it's not going to just slow down the movement of your fist, it's going to instantly stop it.

Now if you apply shaped charges to cut the steel column and other ones to knock the columns in and downward to create an implosion type demolition. The knocking downward force being applied to the column will have a "pulling" affect on the build itself -- Not unlike the downward force being applied to a piston on it's power stroke.

[Old and In the Way]

65. No offense taken!

Been many, many years since my college physic's course and I can't say that was one of my shining moments in my education. :-)

I'm sure I've not explained my point very well. What I think you described in the formula (correct me if I'm wrong) is, if you took, say WTC1 and lifted it up so that the very bottom (say ground level) of the building was in the same plane as the top of the WTC 2, then dropped it. Wouldn't that be the experiment that the formula describes?

I hope you add your post to the one I started in the September 11 forum. I do think it's an interesting discussion that deserve's its own thread. We do know the exact time it took for each WTC to collapse and I'd think it could be used to validate one collapse scenario or the other....but not both.

[SoCalifer]

67. I Am Glad To Have A

Discussion such as this with you and for it to remain just a discussion..

Anyway, what you just explained could be used to illustrate the speed of falling bodies too. And my point is not too un-different from what you're describing, but instead of dropping something off the top of one WTC building. I am referring to the top of the WTC itself falling straight down to the ground.

Either way, its still the same distance to travel but with one major exception. And that being: If you just drop something off over the side from the top of the WTC, it's only going to encounter the resistance caused by aerodynamic drag through the air. But on the other hand, if we're talking about the building itself falling, then we're talking about all the resistance it's going to encounter as the collapsing top encounters the structure below it.

I too remember my college physic's courses, and I loved them.. hehe :)

After I was an infantryman in the Army but before I became the Longshoreman that I am, I went to Northrop University and worked for McDonnell Douglas building the AirForce's C-17.. I've always loved math and science.. :)

[Old and In the Way]

71. The thing about the collapse that bothers me.....

I can understand those floor support carriers giving way due to the heat. I can see the joint failure allowing the floors to pancake. But that inner core should have been left standing, IMHO. Seems to me that the cores would act as a guide allowing the floors to pancake on one another, following the path of least resistance. In fact, I wonder if the structure might have been designed to be demolished that way. I agree that all of those internal columns and interior box structure should have acted as a backbone and resisted the forces of the floor collapse. They were connected directly into the bedrock on massive footings. I'd expect to see an uglt thin tower when the smoke cleared.

Have you seen those seismic graphs? I can't get my head around why each tower has such a sharp momentary spike in the signal at the front end of the collapse event. The seismic signature should have been a gradual ramping increase until the collapse was complete, IMHO.

I, too, enjoy a reasonable discussion.

;-)

[DulceDecorum]

73. This photo pisses me off more than I can say.

Pentagon hit by hijacked plane
http://www.mdw.army.mil/news/news_photos/911/pages/barbers.html

[SoCalifer]

75. About The Heat And Floor Carriers

I know it sounds like it makes sense; but it discounts a couple of very important factors.

- Fist: Buildings (especially tall ones such as the WT.) are made to flex, bend and expand because of the huge aerodynamic forces buildings encounter. Its no different than the way we build airplane wings. So for heat to cause floor carriers to expand and give away in a steel building and cause it to collapse doesn't pass the smell test with me. (especially since never in the history of steel buildings burning on fire has this ever happened).

- Secondly and most importantly, I direct you to the two photos below.. Steel has a melting point of around 2700 degrees, and the hottest a hydrocarbon fuel can burn is around 1500 degrees. But when we see all the black smoke coming from the WTC, that tells us that the fire was not burning efficiently; so that's going to cause the fire to burn much cooler.

--BUT--

As you can see in those two photos, there's people right where the fire is suppose to be hot enough to weaken steel.. If that's the case, those people you see right there would be toast from the radiant heat..


I am telling you, I don't trust this government any more than I would trust a kleptomaniac with the keys to my house. :)

[genius]

105. Even the firefigters said it was brought down by explosives.

They've been threatened with loss of their pensions if they give any more interviews.

[RC]

103. BINGO!

YOU GOT IT exactly correct! I have never seen any evidence of any column left standing after the collapse. Not even coming out of the bedrock.
At the very least, the bigger columns in the center should have acted as guides and should have been sticking at least 30 to 50 feet in the air after the towers came down.

[genius]

107. The pancake theory is impossible. No steal framed building has ever

collapsed from fire and there have been far worse fires than occurred that day. The fires were going out on Building 2 when they blew it up. Check any news footage.

[thereismore]

81. Exactly. The formula gives the absolute shortest possible time that

it takes for the roof of that building to reach the ground. The fact that there were structures underneath that exerted resistance to the fall would only make the collapse time longer. That's the whole point. If the actual collapse time was close to the minimum possible, it means there was very little resistance from the structures below. Possible indication of active removal of structure (as in a controlled demolition).

In other words, if you removed all supporting structures (walls, windows, the concrete core) instantaneously by some miracle, the roof would hit the ground at a time given by the formula (just like a stone released from that height).

[DU GrovelBot]

33. ## PLEASE DONATE TO DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND! ##

==================
GROVELBOT.EXE v3.0
==================



This week is our first quarter 2005 fund drive. Democratic
Underground is a completely independent website. We depend almost entirely
on donations from our members to cover our costs. Thank you so much for
your support.

[FreedomAngel82]

35. Exactly

Also notice the statements are very different. The second one he claims to be in the schoolhouse and in the room there was a tv on and he was talking about his program. We all know he was in the classroom and the kids were reading to him, so therefore there couldn't have been a tv set on. I remember reading how a reporter asked him, when he arrived, if he knew what was going on (so the first plane already hit) and he said "yes" and went on his merry way. Now my argument with people is if he knew what was going on why did he continue to go to the school and do a photo-op instead of taking care of the security of our country? His brother is the governor of Florida and he could've easily rescheduled and told the kids he had some business to do and he they would've understud since he is supposed to be the President. I also remember seeing a photo of Bush and the people who were with him in a room (like a teacher staff type room) watching a tv and had video footage of the plane(s) hitting the tower. This was early in the morning. Didn't they not have video footage till later in the day? :shrug: I remember I heard and saw everything around 10:30am est. I can't remember if there was video footage of both plane's or not. Here's a link telling of Bush's day on 9/11. It's pretty interesting.
http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline/main/essayaninterestingday.html

[FreedomAngel82]

40. Something else weird

with 9/11, I think, is how we never see the Pentagan being attacked or the other plane that hit around Camp David I believe it was (the one aimed for D.C.). Has anybody else? :shrug: I've seen those few photos.

[SoCalifer]

44. Hi FreedomAngel82

Oh man, I have to gets some things done before I get ready for work later (I work nights). But I'll come back and post what I think about the Pentagon and the other flight that didn't make it to Washington.

These two have a LOT of things about them that just simply don't add up at all..

[Old and In the Way]

48. Another plane it around Camp David?

Got a link on that? News to me.

[DulceDecorum]

72. Another question

The yellow-green paint,
Dexter Aerospace's 10P20-44
was qualified as a low-VOC primer system by
Boeing Materials Technology
in JULY 2000.

N644AA (the Pentagon plane)
was built in 1991
which is NINE WHOLE YEARS
BEFORE
that lime-green exterior paint entered general usage as a primer at Boeing.

HOW IS IT
that a Boeing 757 plane built in 1991 using dark-green primer
is reduced to a few small pieces of metal coated with yellow green primer?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=20583&mesg_id=20583


See also:
The Pentagon Thread: Part 5.1
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=125&topic_id=3550

[genius]

84. This is one of the best discussions I've seen on this board.

[Uzybone]

50. This is why at laugh at those raising a big stink about Gannon

after the events of 9/11, the lies about 9/11, the lies about WMDs, Plame, lies to the NY firefighters, TANG lies etc etc etc....the media have given Bush a total pass. Now somehow we are expected to get excited about a gay guy? If they dont have Bush on tape fucking gannon then there is nothing to get excited about.

[Al-CIAda]

52. The public may refuse to believe some in government is mass murdering

its own people(despite overwhelming evidence), but they love a good sex scandal.

[Acryliccalico]

54. We have to keep talking

about this. Somebody out there knows more. If we say 'Oh well it doesn't matter because nothing comes of it' then they win. Keep digging , keep the pressure on, keep the word out. The only way to get to the bottom is to keep the information out and in full view. You can only walk around an 'elephant in the living room' for a while before it becomes a major problem to be dealt with. The net is the NEWS now and the public will realize this and when they do the information should be here for them to see. The people are the power they just don't realize it yet.:kick:

[rumpel]

57. There are a lot of links and info on this, and I have always had a strange

feeling about the attacks in general.
The recent high rise fire in Europe, well did that building immediately collapse? No, it burned and burned for hours and I did not see anything collapse demolition style as with the towers.

FYI truthout just send me an e-mail about Waxman:

Request for Hearings by House Members
    By Rep. Henry A. Waxman; Congresswoman Carolyn Maloney
    Ranking Democrat House Committee on Government Reform; Member of Congress
    t r u t h o u t | Statement

    Thursday 10 February 2005

    The Honorable Tom Davis
    Chairman
    Committee on Government Reform
    U.S. House of Representatives
    Washington, DC 20515

    Dear Mr. Chairman:

    We are writing to request that our Committee hold hearings to investigate two extremely serious questions raised by an article that appeared in this morning's New York Times. The first question is whether the Administration misused the classification process to withhold, for political reasons, official 9/11 Commission staff findings detailing how federal aviation officials received multiple intelligence reports warning of airline hijackings and suicide attacks before September 11. The second question relates to the veracity of statements, briefings, and testimony by then-National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice regarding this issue.

full letter and NY Times article
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/021705W.shtml

I am afraid it may be years until we will know the truth.

[Lisa]

59. well, at the very least ...

... it shows he has trouble with tenses (saying "I had seen this plane fly into the first building" instead of "I had seen that a plane had flown into the first building") -- or even with his memory (confusing footage from later in the day, or even the day after, with what was on the TV screen then).

So he's either a liar, or an insecure arrogant fool who doesn't bother checking his facts (kind of ironic given that the Bushies are always going on about "revisionist historians" who "don't believe in the facts").

When people suggest to me that he "just" made a mistake with that timeline mismatch, I remind them that this is also rather dangerous, given his job. He hasn't retracted the statement or corrected it (in fact he repeated it). He's the kind of guy who hates to admit he was wrong or mistaken about anything, so I'm not too surprised, but it's pretty unprofessional.

I seem to recall an incident not long after he took office, when he accused North Korea of having broken an agreement ... and it turned out he was trying to say something along the lines of "if they've done this, our reaction will be". Screwing up the subjunctive like that can cause a lot of misunderstanding. Not what you want when engaging in diplomacy. (Of course, since when has he been big on diplomacy?) And conflating things to make a "new story" in his mind, even if it's not conscious deception, has a similar end effect -- a fictional scenario that doesn't hold up to scrutiny. (Like the time when he got Sweden mixed up with Switzerland ... I wish I were making it up, but it happened.)

http://www.dubyaspeak.com/incidents.shtml


This guy is like the Imperial stormtrooper in the original Star Wars movie -- very suggestible. No wonder Karl Rove and Co. have no trouble convincing him that "God picked you to be President".

[rumpel]

60. it is probably more important then to look at what Cheney was doing

he had ordered a phanotm practice flight to intercept a "phanotm hijacked airliner". The jets were in the air heading towards Canada.

[buddysmellgood]

63. Damn right. What did he know and when did he know it.

[jojo54]

64. It's just a damn shame

that everyone (except us poor folk) are getting paid to not say anything or bring up any controversy about this. * had got a lifetime pass to do whatever the hell he wants to do and nobody is allowed to question his motives. Fucking pig. :wtf:

[genius]

66. Thank you for posting this.

Also, please do more postings like this. A lot of people here need to look at what happened.

[SoCalifer]

69. Thank You Genius..

:hi:

[libodem]

74. he really did have a flat reaction to the news

He just had that goofy blank stare and kept reading withe the school kids. I'm sure you all saw that in Fahrenheit 9/11

[Rhiannon12866]

76. You're absolutely right

The only video footage of the first plane hitting the first tower was only caught on film, totally by accident, by one of a team of two French brothers, in NYC to film a documentary about the life of a rookie firefighter. I have the amazing video which came from that day, in which they had unprecedented access, which was shown twice on CBS, under the title "9/11."

As for Bush*, he was obviously clueless, or just putting off the inevitable. He had no idea what to, without guidance. There is the infamous seven minutes, after what he was told that the country was under attack, and when he managed to get up, and react. A really scary reaction, coming from there "leader of the free world."
:scared:

[seabeyond]

77. i want to know too

have been asking for years. wasnt the only film, first film of first plane isreali art students cheering from new jersey shores filming the first plane?

also why he had two ground to air missiles installed on the roof of his hotel 9/10

[tinanator]

78. Its the mother in me?

He's gay. Not that theres anything wrong with non-lying, non-murdering, non-invading gays...

[genius]

82. kick

[Up2Late]

85. This is just a flat out LIE!

First, Bush was still en route to the school(in the Limo) when the first plane hit.

Second, He didn't see the first plane hit, because the ONLY video that has ever shown up of the first Jet, didn't air for the first time until a few days later, and it wasn't a LIVE shot. It was caught on video by a documentary Video crew that was setting up a shot, just before the first jet hit.

This time line is well documented in a Show called
"9/11 Clear the Skies"

[genius]

86. The question is: Did he lie or did he see it in a live feed to the event?

If the administration pulled off 9/11, I wouldn't be surprised if they were watching it on close-circuit feeds.

[Up2Late]

87. You forget, Everything * says is a Lie

So if he said he saw it, he's is lying.

But seriously, he was still in the Limo when the first Jet hit, he didn't see it.

[Contrary1]

88. He could have seen the first plane hit...

if it was a completely different video he was watching.
How else could he have seen the first plane hit?

If he said he saw it on CCTV, that would be admitting
that he knew it was going to happen beforehand. Once he
went off script, and accidently blurted out that he had
seen it, he would have had to follow that up with the
television at the school BS.

[DulceDecorum]

90. Bush might actually be telling the truth about the 1st plane

But this scenario actually makes things WORSE.

You see, over in Pennsylvania,
the the US Air Force maintains
the 193rd Special Operations Wing,
which is stationed at
Harrisburg International Airport.
This Special Ops wing is responsible for Commando Solo.

Commando Solo is based out of modified C-130 planes which are called EC-130 because they participate in Electronic Warfare.
Now, we know for a verified fact, that there was a C-130 at both the Pentagon and the Shanksville crashes and we have bee told that it took off from Andrews Air Force Base.

As part of the Air Force's Special Operations Command, the 193rd is to perform what are known as psychological missions. The specially-configured EC-130J aircraft can broadcast transmissions using all commercial AM and FM radio bands, VHF and UHF television bands, and the military's VHF, HF, and FM frequencies. Broadcasts from the aircraft are conducted in areas of military or political unrest to inform or influence both military and civilian personnel in the area.
http://www.specialoperations.com/Aviation/EC_130/Commando_Solo/default.htm

In other words, Commando Solo is designed to HIJACK the airwaves,
radio, TV, cable, you name it,
of AN ENTIRE COUNTRY
and then broadcast whatever it wants to instead.

Commando Solo can tap into military frequencies
and tell them that it is running a test, this is only a test, please do not respond,
while the other US Air Force planes bomb the bejayzus out of that nation's capital city.

Commando Solo may very well have broadcast the first plane crash,
but perhaps something went awry and prevented it from being viewed on most civilian channels.
There are quite a few accounts of people seeing the first plane hit,
and if Commando Solo was in any way involved in this entire caper,
then there is some SERIOUS explaining to do.

[Old and In the Way]

91. "There are quite a few accounts of people seeing the first plane hit,"

Any cites for that?

[DulceDecorum]

93. Google.

The thing that makes it curious is the fact that the Bureau of Transportation Statistics (BTS) which maintains meticulous recored on every single civilian airport and everything that takes off from or lands on them,
does not have any record whatsoever of Flight 11 not or Flight 77
Apparently those flights were never scheduled for take-off and they never actually did -- according to BTS records.

The mystery is deepened by the fact that the FAA, which maintains meticulous records of every single US registered civilian plane that is authorized to fly within US airspace, insists, to this very day that both United Airlines planes are maintaining valid registrations.

Go figure.

[Up2Late]

95. It's not "curious," it's called "Scrubbing" or another term...

most of us know is called "cover-up."

It's just amazing to me, that they would do this type of scrubbing and just expect know one to ever notice:wtf:

I mean, this makes them look MORE guilty of fraud and conspiracy.



What a bunch of dumb asses they are, Lord help us.

[Old and In the Way]

97. Accounts of seeing it on TV?

I know people saw the 1st plane hit firsthand, but there are reports of people watching it on TV? That's what I'd be interested in reading. Can't find anything about that on Google.

[DulceDecorum]

102. I will try to rustle some up for you

I know they are somewhere around here.

There are quite a few people who claim that besides Kenneth Angell.
It does not make sense unless one looks at Commando Solo
or the checks that Armstrong Williams and Co. have been receiving to say stuff.

[charlie]

92. Little shithead's lying coming and going

Ask Peter Jennings when Bush knew about the first plane.

ABC News transcript:

Want to check in very quickly with the president of the United States. John Cochran with the president in Florida. John:

JOHN COCHRAN reporting:

Peter, as you know, the president's down in Florida talking about education. He got out of his hotel suite this morning, was about to leave, reporters saw the White House chief of staff, Andy Card, whisper into his ear. The reporter said to the president, 'Do you know what's going on in New York?' He said he did, and he said he will have something about it later. His first event is about half an hour at an elementary school in Sarasota, Florida.

JENNINGS: Thanks, John. John Cochran with the president. The president's in Florida today pushing his education reform. It will get wiped off of the agenda today in view of this extraordinarily serious accident.

http://emperors-clothes.com/9-11backups/abc911.htm#mybust

[Up2Late]

94. Hey,great transcript link. If only the ABC "reporters" knew what ...

...they were talking about.

O.K. it was shocking, but that was truly terrible reporting.

What you quoted above, made it sound like Andy Card whispered in his ear about the first plane, as he left the Hotel to get into his Limo. This happened as he sat in the classroom (see video link and earlier in the transcript).

<http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/bush-911.htm>
or
<http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/>

Then, later they said, "...John Miller, we haven't--(clears throat) excuse me--we haven't had an aircraft fly into a building in New York, as far as I know, since just after the second world war when a...

MILLER: The Empire State Building.

JENNINGS: ...plane flew into the Empire State Building.

MILLER: That's right. A B-52 flew into the Empire State Building then, and this is--this is really the first time there's been anything like that since..."

:wtf: Here's the real report:

"Too late the pilot of the U.S. Army B-25 bomber with three men aboard, saw the Empire State Building loom up before his eyes. At 300 miles per hour, he plunged through the 34th Street side of the building wreaking havoc. The major portion of the wreckage penetrated the 78th floor.
<http://www.evesmag.com/empirestatecrash.htm>

I don't think the first B-52 flew until about 1957. Yes, it was a bit crazy that day, but these ABC people are just stupid.

[charlie]

96. No

Card told Bush about the second plane in the classroom, not the first. Some accounts have Card telling him about the first crash when he emerged from the limo at the school. Others said it was Rove. A Navy captain said she got to him first with the news.

Yes, Cochran goofed when he reported that Bush was leaving the hotel. But what he got right is that Bush knew before he set foot in the school. It's almost certain he knew before he left the limo anyway, since it carries a communications center. And others in his motorcade were apprised before arrival.

In any case, Dubya's full of shit. He's been lying about his awareness of when the first tower was hit, for no explicable reason.

[Up2Late]

98. "NO?!?" I think you miss read what I wrote

:wtf:I wrote "...What you quoted above, made it * sound like * Andy Card..."

And I don't disagree he knew about the first plane before entering the school.

I doubt he saw it on Closed Circuit TV in the Limo though, that would be a very difficult technical challenge to pull off. Let us Know if you find any evidence that the Limo is equipped like that (and has a direct satellite down link too)

Bush is just a Lier, end of story. :evilgrin:

[charlie]

99. I probably did

I took this part to mean that Card told him about the 1st plane in the classroom. My mistake then:

"...made it sound like Andy Card whispered in his ear about the first plane, as he left the Hotel to get into his Limo. This happened as he sat in the classroom"

Fantasies about closed circuit TV are your own though.

[Up2Late]

101. The CCTV thing, came from an earlier post

from genius
Number 86

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1598983&mesg_id=1607714&page=>

Sorry, on active threads, we tend to get confused.

[BushIsBurning]

104. You Have Uncovered One of 1,000,000,000 9/11 LIES LIES LIES !!!

[leftofthedial]

106. the truth is we KNOW the little bushturd lied about 9-11

it's not tinfoil-hat stuff

as you pointout, he flat out lied and neither his "moral" followers nor our media seem to care a bit.