How To Tell If You're An Unpatriotic Butt-Head (comments please)

[ckramer]

"Unpatriotic butt-headedness has nothing to do with what political party you're aligned with, who you voted for in the last election, who you plan to vote for, whether you like certain politicians, or whether you agree with the current administration's policies.

It means you don't trash your own people. It means that if your country's at war, even if you have reservations about that war you know that it's your war too--and you know to express dissent patriotically, with love and passion and thoughtfulness and respect--not hatred and resentment and defeatism.

It means you understand that partisanship ends at the nation's shores. It means that you know that even if you don't like the people in charge at the White House or Congress today, we all have a chance to change it every two or four years. It means you understand that there will always be screwups and unpleasant surprises and disappointments and that obsessing over these things is defeatist rubbish. It means you don't call people "liars" for disagreeing with you, or when they might be just plain wrong.

In short, you love your country more than your own narrow, selfish interests.

Anyone else got any suggestions?"

link

[MisterP]

1. people shouldn't gibber insanely: it's impolite

[Hello_Kitty]

2. "Please note that in the event of a Presidency

Past or future, of anyone named Clinton, or of any President with a D beside his or name, the above non-partisan statement becomes completely null and void. Thank you."

[salvorhardin]

3. You really believe this?

#7) You think Michael Moore's movie Fahrenheit 9/11 is anything other than vile fascist hate-propaganda.

If so, why? In what way is Michael Moore a fascist? What hate did you see espoused in Fahrenheit 9/11?

[sui generis]

4. well color me unpatriotic butthead

them's fightin' words.

Seriously, it absolutely is patriotic to question whether a war "is mine", especially if I (we) did absolutely everything in our power to prevent it in the first place. Do you sit home at night owning the 100,000 plus human deaths that we have caused? That would be real patriotism. Or shame, as the case may be. Although civility and diplomacy are almost always the best first courses of action, you have to be willing to back yourself up.

Tacitly agreeing to stand in "free speech zones" twenty blocks away from the flag waving PATRIOTIC NON-BUTTHEADS is tacitly agreeing to be wrong and wronged.

There comes a time for vocal dissent and for civil disobedience, and that time is when your patriotism is questioned, when you are described by less polite people politely as a butthead.

[salvorhardin]

5. Also...

#10) When America has an enemy that slaughters our people, your first and foremost reaction is "we must have really offended them--we should figure out why so they won't be mad at us anymore."

I'm not sure what you're referring to.

The 9-11 attacks? Don't you think that asking why a group of people would be so angry that they would commit suicide by flying large planes into tall buildings is a valid question? That perhaps before flying off half-cocked and invading a whole country that was, for the most part, wholely unrelated to the people who planned and committed the act was perhaps the gesture of an administration unconcerned with root causes?

[July]

6. It sure as hell isn't my war.

And I try to dissent "with passion and thoughtfulness and respect" (skip the love, though). But I AM going to dissent, especially when the other guys are "just plain wrong."

I reject the idea that I can't criticize someone because we're from the same country. I don't have a clue what dissenting "patriotically" means, but this message suggests that it means "not dissenting."

The "love it or leave it" mentality on display here always involves pretty talk about dissent, along with suggestions that we stow our dissent in difficult times.

In my view, those are just the times when dissent is required. Some people can only bear "dissent" when it is of the "I like chocolate" vs. "I like vanilla" sort. When we disagree, we MUST dissent. If we are discouraged from doing so, do we really even have the right to dissent? Or is that just a lovely phrase that makes us feel all tolerant and free-like?

[salvorhardin]

7. ...and

#12) You believe that if anyone questions your patriotism, that person is employing "McCarthyite tactics" or is a closet fascist who is threatening your freedom of expression. (We didn't threaten your freedom of expression, butthead--we used our freedom of expression to express our opinion of you. You unpatriotic butthead.)

Don't you find that patriotism is often nothing more than jingoistic posturing?

[SteppingRazor]

8. My war too?

No freakin' way. I guess you can call me an unpatriotic butthead, because Bush did not bomb Iraq in my name.

[bklyncowgirl]

9. Here's a Republican on Patriotism

Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the president or any other public official...

~Theodore Roosevelt

[Ravy]

10. That read (and link) was 50 seconds of my life I wish I could get back. nt

[Goblinmonger]

11. My reaction for the first 3 minutes:

:wow:

My next reaction:

Kiss my ass.

[Capn Sunshine]

12. Let me know when my country is at war

Profiteering is NOT a WAR

[welshTerrier2]

13. aaaaarrrrrggggghhhhhhhhh ...

this is the biggest pile of nationalist crap i've ever seen posted on DU ... i'll agree only with your statement that butt-headedness is non-partisan ... but beyond that, much of what you posted is more like head-up-your-buttedness ...

you said "you don't trash your own people" ... is that true even if "your own people" (they surely aren't mine!!) violate the constitution by allowing big money to pollute our democracy ??? is it true when "your own people" allow all federal policies to cater to trans-national corporations at the expense of American citizens ??? is it true when "your own people" use the country's military might and economic power to exploit weaker nations all over the globe ???

you said "It means you understand that there will always be screwups and unpleasant surprises and disappointments and that obsessing over these things is defeatist rubbish." ... UNPLEASANT ??? you mean it was a teensy-weensy bit UN-FUCKING-PLEASANT for the million people, most of them children, our "oil-for-food" program murdered in Iraq ??? or the little DISAPPOINTMENT some may have suffered as we killed an additional 100,000 Iraqis after invading a country that never attacked the US and posed no fucking threat whatsoever ???

gee, no reason anyone should OBSESS OVER DEFEATIST RUBBISH like caring that my government is going around the world slaughtering innocent people who never attacked this country ...

you said "It means you don't call people "liars" for disagreeing with you" ... did you read the UK memo ???? bush lied ... what pretty, patriotic, nationalistic euphism would you like to put on that ??? he lied; 1600+ Americans are dead, 100,000+ Iraqis are dead, Iraq is in shambles, the suffering of the Iraqi people is unimaginable and you want to wave your little nationalistic flag ???

and finally, you said "Anyone else got any suggestions?" ... oh yeah ... i've got several ...

[ckramer]

15. Love Teddy bear!

Hey you nailed it! Bravo!

[salvorhardin]

14. I guess

he didn't really want suggestions. Hasn't been back since.

[geckosfeet]

16. What a pitiful post that is,,,,,

I read over some of that post you linked too and found it to be partisan finger pointing nonsense devoid of any critical thought process.

Generally I consider people liars when they knowingly make statements that deceive, misrepresent and mislead.

People are also liars when they are lazy and irresponsible. By saying "I did not know" or "my subordinates are at fault", when in fact endless streams of information, data, and resources are available to make decisions with, is lying.

The originator of that post and * fit that bill.