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Dean says that Kerry should quit "whining"

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PurityOfEssence Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:18 PM
Original message
Dean says that Kerry should quit "whining"
This is precisely why I have such troubles with this guy. This is a thuggish tough-guy word that's mostly used by the nasty right. It rankles me to no end, and is typical of the pushy dismiss-all-opposition tactics of autocrats.

Hasn't Dean sniveled aplenty about being picked on? Isn't this an awfully hypocritical statement from the self-proclaimed "pincushion"? Maybe it's statements like this that's had him picking so much "buckshot" from his hindside, as he was so fond of whimpering.

Geez, who does this guy think he is? Does his IWR stance give him a blank check on comportment? What gives him the right to be above the laws of behavior he expects from others? There was a brief respite from strutting puffery, but it's obviously back.

Sound off folks, doesn't this bug you too? More than anything, though: isn't this rather blockheaded crabbiness from someone who wants to get people to vote for him?
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HFishbine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
1. Sorta like
"Quite crying in your tea cups." Except that that sentiment was expressed to voters, not a political opponent.
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A-Schwarzenegger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
2. What, Kerry, whine?
How low
will Dean go?
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bearfartinthewoods Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #2
38. it was a typo...should read "quit winning"
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displacedtexan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
3. Where did you hear/read this?
?
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bryant69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Good question
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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #3
10. It's been on all the news channels
I think what Dean was trying to say was Kerry should stop "whining" over the other candidates attacking him. It's funny how a lot of things changed in just one week.
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:36 PM
Response to Reply #10
30. Turn about is fair play....



Dean just giving Kerry a dose of his own medicine.
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #30
51. Dean's campaign was negative on the other candidates from day one
and he got a lot of mileage out of it.

Why are attacks only negative when the other guy does it?



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bigwillq Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #51
53. I agree with your statement about Dean negative from Day 1
but I also think it's very funny that when Dean accused his rivals of attacks and wanted help from the DNC, some people and media outlets criticized Dean. Now that Kerry is complaining, it's a whole different story. I know this is a touchy subject but I really feel the media and the country is not ready for Dean to be prez but boy what a better country it would be with the doctor in the white house, imo.
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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #53
54. Dean wasn't alaways so negative
There was a time when Dean used to compliment Bush*
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emulatorloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #53
58. He is a good man, no doubt about it, and GWB days are numbered!
If not the nominee, I know we will see him there fighting to help the Dems get GWB. If he is nominee, I'll be marching down the street with Howard Dean, and fighting along side him!

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TexasSissy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #53
62. I couldn't agree more. I've softened to Dean lately, because
of his troubles in IA and the "I Have A Scream" speech. But despite that, he has continued with the negativity.
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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:24 PM
Original message
I heard something about Kerry
asking McAuliffe to help get the other Dems to stop attacking him
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ModerateMiddle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:47 PM
Response to Original message
37. LOL
Yeah, right.
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hippiechick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
4. It's less bothersome than Kerry walking off stage ...
acting like a spoiled brat, muttering "Dean Dean Dean ....."

:eyes: HOW PRESIDENTIAL


:hippie:
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cindyw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #4
40. That is not what happened. Fox was interviewing him outside
in the summer time and they caught him saying it as he walked away. They spent the entire interview asking him about Dean. If you are going to trash Kerry, do it right.
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PurityOfEssence Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #4
42. That's a far different kind of screwup
Kerry was frustrated after a debate and forgot that his wireless mic was still on. Yep, that's clumsy, and it's unwise to let your true emotions show in public in those kind of situations, but it's entirely different than making a deliberate statement. Kerry thought nobody could hear him; it wasn't like Gore's calculated sighing in his debate with Junior.

Kerry loses points for not maintaining composure, but Dean's sneering is of a far different nature: it's hypocritical, deliberate and reeks of the self-proclaimed privilege of the morally superior.

Nope.

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kaitykaity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
5. Link?
Where? When?
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
6. That statement from Howard sounds like whining to me
this ain't no game of tiddily winks here....
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PROGRESSIVE1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Howard Dean.....
acts like a Repub when he loves to dish it out but cannot take it.
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HalfManHalfBiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:22 PM
Original message
I don't think we will have to deal with Dean much longer
His campaign will be history shortly. Getting pounded in Iowa, NH, and SC will do the trick.
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Abigail147 Donating Member (117 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:51 PM
Response to Original message
57. When Dean goes, all the energy goes out of the room.
Edited on Tue Jan-27-04 03:52 PM by Abigail147
A moribund Democratic party was brought back to life and enjoys media attention because of this man and his refreshing candor. With him, you know he will be standing tall and talking back, not just more of the same old, same old. Your candidate?
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PretzelWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
8. I think Dean will lose on his smile alone.
It looks fake every single time. John Kerry has really worked to soften his face and project a smiling, interested candidate--something he didn't have before. John Edwards and Wesley Clark also both have disarming smiles. Clark is a bit short, but he's handsome to some people. Kerry and Edwards "look" presidential.

Howard Dean looks like a party boss for old style city political machines or something. I hate to say it...but in TV age, these things matter.

I sure wish Dean's ideas and stands on issues were packaged in a different personality and physical being because I'd vote for him in a heartbeat. But he's just too easy of a target for the GOP, and he lost some of his luster for me, personally.
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #8
21. LOL!
You mean the botux worked to paralysize the sagging face, ala David Duke's infamous face lift. At least Clark ages with dignity. Kerry with his doofus snagletoothed small mouth, with reptilian tongue lashing out looks like a prettied up Harry Dean Stanton.
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A-Schwarzenegger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. Hey! Do not knock
Harry Dean Stanton!
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #25
29. It's true though, A
Look at the little picture some people keep on their posts and tell me it ain't so?


;-)
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RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #21
46. Hey, Harry Dean Stanton is Brilliant
don't compare him to Kerry, that's not fair to Harry Dean.
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #8
27. oh please
kerry looks like his face is melting, i.e., HE COULD STAND A FACELIFT!
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ibegurpard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #8
28. Didn't you just post a thread about stopping this kind of stuff?
:shrug:
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denverbill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. He meant other people.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
9. Dean's "whining" has bugged me for a while
His intellectual dishonesty about the other candidates is one thing, but his whining about being being "attacked" when he has made his candidacy based on attacking others is so transparent and smarmy.

After watching Dean sometimes on TV, I feel like I need to take a shower.
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Abigail147 Donating Member (117 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
59. Intellectual dishonesty?
After watching the other candidates, I want to give them a shower. Some people are just unctuous and go whichever way the wind is blowing. If he is such a bad man, why have the other candidates incorporated his material, hmm?
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adadem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
12. And who went running to
McAuliffe whining 'cause everybody was picking on him. Give me a break...how hypocritical.
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JohnKleeb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
13. I saw Kerry's interview on face the nation with Schieffer
He didnt seem that whiny to me honest. Ive seen Kerry on TV lately and he doesnt seem to be whining at all. :shrug:
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MaineDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
14. I don't like any candidate saying things like that
I saw it on CNN and I found it rather uncomfortable to hear.
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
15. We do not need any of you damned Yankees
coming down here and telling US what to do during our church hour.

Forever ringing in my ears.
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jsw_81 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
16. Someone is going to be whining tonight
But I don't think it's going to be John Kerry. With back to back victories in Iowa and New Hampshire, Kerry will be well on his way to the nomination; Dean will collapse unless he comes in second.
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TheDonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
17. Dean will be painted as an angry thug, and gives them plenty of ammo
Kerry also was disrespectful for that awful, crying over your teacups line (wtf who says that anyway?).
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #17
45. As absurd as it might seem...
... that comment about the election and the teacups ruined me for Kerry. Before that, he was a close second to Dean.

That comment spoke volumes, and he's said nothing since to make me think it wasn't sincere at the time. It was disrespectful on many levels, particularly to Dean and the all the supporters he already had at the time. Dean paved the way, set the agenda and the message, and now, Kerry's advancing using the tenor that Dean set.

Kerry is my least favorite nominee besides Sharpton. And I don't see how he can run against a president that he voted with on almost every single issue. And I'll be less than sorry if Dean get the nomination that Kerry seems to feel entitled too, because Dean actually stuck his neck out and earned it.
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AP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
18. Sure Dean didn't say "Kerry should quit WINNING"???
That would make more sense.
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. LOL :)
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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #18
31. heh!
Whining is for losers. Kerry is no loser.
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #18
32. Well we know he didn't say that about Edwards....


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AP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #32
49. To Edwards, Dean says: 'will you stop beating me!'
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TexasPatriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
19. whining or winning? i need a phoenetics judge...
or would he prefer he stop both ;)
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lastknowngood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
22. funny Dean is always the but of this but Kerry always gets a
pass. Kerry is a problem for the Dem party he is a 48 state loser
mark my word he won't even be competitive outside of New England in the
G.E.
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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #22
26.  Kerry has already won a non-Northeast state
and is leading in at least one other
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LiberalTexan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:30 PM
Response to Original message
23. Kerry can't quit whining
That's the way he talks! Ditto on Joe Lieberman.
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MindPilot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:30 PM
Response to Original message
24. Yes, Dean's consistent opposition to the Bush administration
does give him license. Unlike Kerry, Howard Dean has not spent the past three years wearing a pink tutu saying "yes Mr. President, whatever you want Mr. President".

Face it: Kerry cannot beat Bush which is why the media is working so hard to discredit the other candidates and put Kerry ahead.

We don't need any more trying-to-be-like-George in this campaign; we need fighters who will represent DEMOCRATS.
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sangh0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #24
34. Consistent?
Dr. HOWARD DEAN: " have never been in doubt about the evil of Saddam Hussein or the necessity of removing his weapons of mass destruction. "

http://www.wtv-zone.com/Morgaine_OFaery/HDean4pres/dean...
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #34
60. Yes consistent, which is clear if you read more than half a sentence.


Which is why the dishonest folks attacking Dean can never post a whole sentence in context.

Because if you read the whole statement and not just one cherry picked half sentence, you see Dean is consistent, against the war, and supporting the UN.

Care to try another misrepresentation to prop up a piss poor attack?



"Tonight, for better or worse, America is at war. Tonight, every American, regardless of party, devoutly supports the safety and success of our men and women in the field."



"Those of us who, over the past 6 months, have expressed deep concerns about this President's management of the crisis, mistreatment of our allies and misconstruction of international law, have never been in doubt about the evil of Saddam Hussein or the necessity of removing his weapons of mass destruction."



"Those Americans who opposed our going to war with Iraq, who wanted the United Nations to remove those weapons without war, need not apologize for giving voice to their conscience, last year, this year or next year. In a country devoted to the freedom of debate and dissent, it is every citizen's patriotic duty to speak out, even as we wish our troops well and pray for their safe return. Congressman Abraham Lincoln did this in criticizing the Mexican War of 1846, as did Senator Robert F. Kennedy in calling the war in Vietnam 'unsuitable, immoral and intolerable.'"



"This is not Iraq, where doubters and dissenters are punished or silenced --this is the United States of America. We need to support our young people as they are sent to war by the President, and I have no doubt that American military power will prevail."



"But to ensure that our post-war policies are constructive and humane, based on enduring principles of peace and justice, concerned Americans should continue to speak out; and I intend to do so."



Sincerely,



Governor Howard Dean, MD
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #24
36. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #24
50. MindPilot, Conason saw it differently than you in August 2002:


Kerry Shows Courage In Challenging Bush
Thursday, August 8, 2002 By: Joe Conason

New York Observer
>>>>>
But it was John Kerry who delivered the most interesting, substantive and challenging message. His subject was George W. Bush's shortcomings as a world leader.

The New York Times reported that Mr. Kerry "offered a long attack on Mr. Bush's foreign policy," although the paper gave short shrift to the details in the Senator''s speech. What he began to articulate was a Democratic critique of this administration''s blunt and myopic unilateralism, and a vision that restores international alliances to the center of American diplomacy.

>>>>

There is, however, at least one benefit for Mr. Kerry in speaking out on those faraway places and problems. While his rivals sound as if they''re campaigning for the offices they already occupy, he sounds as if he is running for President.

In a sense, Mr. Kerry enjoys an unfair advantage that mitigates the burden of his home state. He''s a decorated Vietnam veteran whose Navy service may help shield him from attacks on his patriotism. Throughout his years in the Senate, that credential has allowed him to investigate and criticize disturbing excesses of American policy abroad, as he did when he probed U.S. aid to the contra gangsters in Nicaragua. (That rather lonely crusade made him a target of the notorious Arkansas Project, funded by Republican billionaire Richard Mellon Scaife to bring down President Clinton.)

Whether Mr. Kerry can engage the electorate in a discussion of America''s global responsibilities is far from certain. His own dispassionate style may hinder him. Yet he deserves great credit for reclaiming international leadership for his party when others cannot or will not.

************************************************************

Here's how Dean was propping up Bush in July 2002 along with other Dems who were afraid to attack Bush's leadership as Kerry did:

MR. RUSSERT: Do you believe the military operation in Afghanistan has been successful?

GOV. DEAN: Yes, I do, and I support the president in that military operation.

MR. RUSSERT: The battle of Tora Bora was successful?

GOV. DEAN: Ive seen others criticize the president. I think its very easy to second-guess the
commander-in-chief at a time of war. I dont choose to engage in doing that.
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #50
61. Yet a short two months after that piece.. Kerry was voting for the Iraq war


Funny that you have to go back to August 8, 2002 before Kerry bent over for Bush and supported the Iraq war in October 2002 in order to find a quote that he was standing up to Bush to try and claim he stood up to Bush on the Iraq war.

Then you have to find some statement about Afghanistan and try to spin that like Dean was agreeing with Bush in Iraq.


Truly pathetic.


By October Kerry was supporting the war and by Feb 03 he was attackign Dean for saying we should insist on UN support before going into Iraq. Guess you forgot about that... again.


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/02/25/opinion/lynch...

Kerry's campaign manager, Jim Jordan, snapped at Dean's insistence on getting U.N. backing (a position supported by three-quarters of Democrats and 53 percent of Independents). "Gov. Dean, in effect, seems to be giving the U.N. veto power over national security decisions of the United States. That's an extraordinary proposition, one never endorsed by any U.S. president or serious candidate for the presidency," he told the Associated Press' Ron Fournier.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #61
63. That's your view. Don't pretend Dean stood up first
and was the only one. That meme is demonstrably false.

The difference is that the networks wouldn't give Kerry the coverage, but they sure wanted to give Dean the coverage because he was tagged a "loose cannon" early on.
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Virgil Donating Member (410 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
35. I call non issue. This is not a soap opera.
It is as trivial as talking about the clothing they are wearing.
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BearFlagDemocrat Donating Member (333 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:51 PM
Response to Original message
39. Why act pushy?
The typical Dem response of being "polite" and "above the fray" has done us so well in the past couple elections. :eyes:
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PurityOfEssence Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #39
44. Just because a tactic is different doesn't mean it's better
Much of the mistaken thrill with Dean's candidacy is his furor. That excites activists, fringe voters and many others throughout the party, but it also turns off others.

It's like Bush's policy of pre-emption: for it to be viable, the speaker has to be unfailingly ACCURATE.

Dean's made mistake after mistake, and he's done so with resounding applomb. The amount of ammunition this man's created for his enemies is inestimable.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
41. Well, it would be refreshing if Kerry would stop whining and
start voting against goober's war.
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Virgil Donating Member (410 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #41
43. I broke out laughing
I guess you told him. Out with Goober.
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HazMat Donating Member (318 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:12 PM
Response to Original message
47. Funny. IIRC it was Howard who went crying to T.Mac
to save him from all of those meanies attacking him when he was the presumed frontrunner.

I just can't wait 'til this guy is finished.

Hopefully we will land a fatal blow tonight.

Go home, Howard.
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Feanorcurufinwe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
48. Kerry's not going to quit winning just because Dean says so.
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killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:37 PM
Response to Original message
52. killbotfactory says people should quit whining over everything Dean says
He's just giving Kerry a taste of his own medicine.
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wyldwolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
55. no no! Dean says that Kerry should quit "WINNING"
...but I think Kerry isn't listening.
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Abigail147 Donating Member (117 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-27-04 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
56. Dean said something about Kerry that you think is mean?
Implying he is a whiner? Oh my gawd, how awful.Start looking over Dean's material. You can probably find a really good line for a reply.
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