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stickdog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:08 PM
Original message
What They Don't Get About Dean, Anger & Anti-War
A poignant rembrance of who stood up for us while so many were selling us out with so little thought, reward or remorse. A message of hope for so many of us who have recently cried for our beloved country.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2003/12/28/2167/2733

But I'm telling this story as someone who lustily cheered Bush's Al Qaeda speech of Sept. 20, 2001 along with (I daresay) most of the rest of the nation; and as someone who literally got down on my knees, in those dark days, to pray for God's guidance for the man. Yes, I confess. I prayed for George W. Bush. Because back then, he was just a president who happened to be not from my own party. I figured he needed some personal prayers.

I don't know when exactly the disappointment started to set in. For me, it came slowly. The realization that not only was Bush not going to avoid the traps and pitfalls of fighting terrorists (by becoming repressive)... but that he was actually going to actively, willingly take our country down a wrong path.

...

But as the summer wore on, it became clear that it wasn't just talk, and that someone had to say something. And I looked for a peace movement, I looked for the American people to stand up and make sense, people I might join. People protested, people marched, but it didn't seem enough. And Bush called them "focus groups." As summer turned to fall, my view turned more and more grim and angry and disappointed in the Democrats as well. Why wasn't anyone saying anything? Where were our journalists? Where was our leadership?

...

For many weeks, months even, Howard Dean was the only one even near to a position of political leadership and initiative, and who was getting any coverage, saying things that were little periodic beacons from the alternate world of sanity, in a strong and confident and provocative voice. The only one.

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mikehiggins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. Except of course for Dennis Kuchinich eom
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XanaDUer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:12 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. You read my mind.
eom.
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stickdog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Try reading the entire article.
DK gets his due.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:17 PM
Original message
Yes.
Well, if Dean himself can't play straight, why would his supporters?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=39573
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:20 PM
Response to Original message
7. Dean WAS the ONLY one....
that the media paid attention to. Gee...I wonder why the corporate media shut out everyone else? I wonder why they never covered Kerry on Tora Bora or Kucinich on Iraq?

I wonder why the press only pushed Dean as an antiwar liberal when he was neither?
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Scott Lee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. I'm pretty sure it was Satan's fault.
Yes, the more I think about it....I'm positive.
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killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. "and who was getting any coverage" - Key phrase.
Kucinich wasn't even in the race when Dean started speaking out, and he didn't get much coverage even after he jumped in.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. "the only one
even near to a position of political leadership and initiative?"

Excuse me. While Dr. Dean was free to campaign, the political leaders were working. And Dennis Kucinich was taking the initiative against GWB and his war, and organizing opposition, from the floor of the house. Funny how the media "covers" campaigners and doesn't give equal coverage to those actually doing the job.

Dennis Kucinich stands head and shoulders above the pack, Howard Dean included, when it comes to political leadership and initiative. And if the corporate media doesn't choose to "cover" that leadership, it doesn't make it any less real.
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killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:34 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. That's great...
Dean is a leader as well. A highly effective one.

And if you'd read the actual article, you might be able to understand why.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #12
17. I did read it.
Edited on Mon Dec-29-03 10:12 PM by LWolf
I for one, did not "cheer Bush's Al Qaeda speech of Sept. 20, 2001 along with (I daresay) most of the rest of the nation"...I didn't expect anything more from him than what we got.

I heard what Dennis Kucinich said in February of 2002; the speech that started the "draft Kucinich" movement:

Let us pray that our nation will remember that the unfolding of the promise of democracy in our nation paralleled the striving for civil rights. That is why we must challenge the rationale of the Patriot Act. We must ask why should America put aside guarantees of constitutional justice?

How can we justify in effect canceling the First Amendment and the right of free speech, the right to peaceably assemble?
How can we justify in effect canceling the Fourth Amendment, probable cause, the prohibitions against unreasonable search and seizure?
How can we justify in effect canceling the Fifth Amendment, nullifying due process, and allowing for indefinite incarceration without a trial?
How can we justify in effect canceling the Sixth Amendment, the right to prompt and public trial?
How can we justify in effect canceling the Eighth Amendment which protects against cruel and unusual punishment?



We cannot justify widespread wiretaps and internet surveillance without judicial supervision, let alone with it. We cannot justify secret searches without a warrant. We cannot justify giving the Attorney General the ability to designate domestic terror groups. We cannot justify giving the FBI total access to any type of data which may exist in any system anywhere such as medical records and financial records.

We cannot justify giving the CIA the ability to target people in this country for intelligence surveillance. We cannot justify a government which takes from the people our right to privacy and then assumes for its own operations a right to total secrecy. The Attorney General recently covered up a statue of Lady Justice showing her bosom as if to underscore there is no danger of justice exposing herself at this time, before this administration.

Let us pray that our nation's leaders will not be overcome with fear. Because today there is great fear in our great Capitol. And this must be understood before we can ask about the shortcomings of Congress in the current environment. The great fear began when we had to evacuate the Capitol on September 11. It continued when we had to leave the Capitol again when a bomb scare occurred as members were pressing the CIA during a secret
briefing. It continued when we abandoned Washington when anthrax, possibly from a government lab, arrived in the mail. It continued when the Attorney General declared a nationwide terror alert and then the Administration
brought the destructive Patriot Bill to the floor of the House. It continued in the release of the Bin Laden tapes at the same time the President was announcing the withdrawal from the ABM treaty. It remains present in the
cordoning off of the Capitol. It is present in the camouflaged armed national guardsmen who greet members of Congress each day we enter the Capitol campus. It is present in the labyrinth of concrete barriers through which we must pass each time we go to vote. The trappings of a state of siege trap us in a state of fear, ill equipped to deal with the Patriot Games, the Mind Games, the War Games of an unelected President and his unelected Vice President.

Let us pray that our country will stop this war. "To promote the common defense" is one of the formational principles of America. Our Congress gave the President the ability to respond to the tragedy of September the Eleventh. We licensed a response to those who helped bring the terror of September the Eleventh. But we the people and our elected representatives must reserve the right to measure the response, to proportion the response, to challenge the response, and to correct the response.

Because we did not authorize the invasion of Iraq.
We did not authorize the invasion of Iran.
We did not authorize the invasion of North Korea.
We did not authorize the bombing of civilians in Afghanistan.
We did not authorize permanent detainees in Guantanamo Bay.
We did not authorize the withdrawal from the Geneva Convention.
We did not authorize military tribunals suspending due process and habeas corpus.
We did not authorize assassination squads.
We did not authorize the resurrection of COINTELPRO.
We did not authorize the repeal of the Bill of Rights.
We did not authorize the revocation of the Constitution.
We did not authorize national identity cards.
We did not authorize the eye of Big Brother to peer from cameras throughout our cities.
We did not authorize an eye for an eye.
Nor did we ask that the blood of innocent people, who perished on September 11, be avenged with the blood of innocent villagers in Afghanistan.
We did not authorize the administration to wage war anytime, anywhere, anyhow it pleases.
We did not authorize war without end.
We did not authorize a permanent war economy.

Yet we are upon the threshold of a permanent war economy. The President has requested a $45.6 billion increase in military spending. All defense-related programs will cost close to $400 billion. Consider that the Department of
Defense has never passed an independent audit. Consider that the Inspector General has notified Congress that the Pentagon cannot properly account for $1.2 trillion in transactions. Consider that in recent years the Dept. of
Defense could not match $22 billion worth of expenditures to the items it purchased, wrote off, as lost, billions of dollars worth of in-transit inventory and stored nearly $30 billion worth of spare parts it did not need.

Yet the defense budget grows with more money for weapons systems to fight a cold war which ended, weapon systems in search of new enemies to create new wars. This has nothing to do with fighting terror. This has everything to do with fueling a military industrial machine with the treasure of our nation, risking the future of our nation, risking democracy itself with the militarization of thought which follows the militarization of the budget.

Let us pray for our children. Our children deserve a world without end. Not a war without end. Our children deserve a world free of the terror of hunger, free of the terror of poor health care, free of the terror of homelessness, free of the terror of ignorance, free of the terror of hopelessness, free of the terror of policies which are committed to a world view which is not appropriate for the survival of a free people, not appropriate for the survival of democratic values, not appropriate for the survival of our nation, and not appropriate for the survival of the world.

Let us pray that we have the courage and the will as a people and as a nation to shore ourselves up, to reclaim from the ruins of September the Eleventh our democratic traditions. Let us declare our love for democracy. Let us declare our intent for peace. Let us work to make nonviolence an organizing principle in our own society. Let us recommit ourselves to the slow and painstaking work of statecraft, which sees peace, not war as being inevitable. Let us work for a world where someday war becomes archaic.


<snip>

Obviously, someone else was speaking. Howard Dean wasn't the "only one." And Dennis apparently got enough coverage, enough people heard him, that he was drafted to run for president. By tens of thousands. Apparently, the author of this ed piece wasn't listening.
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dkf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. Guess who wasn't on TV speaking out against the war.
Hmm.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. No.
He was too busy speaking out against the war from the floor of the U.S. House of Representatives. Working for America.
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killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:17 PM
Response to Original message
3. That is a great article
sums it up nicely.
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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
8. Dean as the "beacon of truth"
"Howard Dean was the only one even near to a position of political leadership and initiative, and who was getting any coverage, saying things that were little periodic beacons from the alternate world of sanity, in a strong and confident and provocative voice. The only one."

He's the only one if you're only listening to him. It's like having a TV that only gets one channel with only one show.

Between his lies and attacks about the other candidates' records and stances, the half-truths and flip-flops about his own record and the nearly-daily gaffes that make wonderful Rove ammo, Dean does say some fairly run-of-the-mill warmed-over diatribes to appease those that either won't vote or are a small part of the American voting electorate.
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killbotfactory Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. He was the only one making any sense.
It sure was a relief to here him on TV during that time.

Between the other candidates lies and attacks about the his records and stances, the half-truths and flip-flops about their own record and the nearly-daily gaffes that make wonderful Rove ammo, they do say some fairly run-of-the-mill warmed-over diatribes to appease those that either won't vote or are a small part of the American voting electorate.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #8
18. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. What are you trying to say?
I see through Dean's lies. I've been around the block before and can spot a conman a mile away.
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stickdog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. I can't argue with your divine inspiration.
But Dean was the only guy telling Wolf Blitzer the Iraq War was a big mistake while almost everybody else was saluting the American flag draped over Saddam's fallen statue.
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HFishbine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
13. Or as I'd put it: WTF where they thinking?
Edited on Mon Dec-29-03 09:36 PM by HFishbine
Millions in the streets of America -- all across America. What did they think would happen if they turned their backs on us? That we would eventually come around? That we'd forget that they stood with the man and for the policies we were protesting against; forget that their actions helped marginalize our efforts at a time when we were looking for voices to give us credibility?

No anger here. Just a pragmatic recognition that some democratic "leaders" declined to represent my beliefs at an important time.
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Scott Lee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Kerry's got to be saying that through gritted teeth and closed eyes
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Nicholas_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 09:51 PM
Response to Original message
16. Yeah
Edited on Mon Dec-29-03 09:54 PM by Nicholas_J
Dean stated even before the IWR was voted on:

FTN - 09/29/02
WASHINGTON


DEAN:

Look, it's very simple. Here's what we ought to have done. We should have gone to the U.N. Security Council. We should have asked for a resolution to allow the inspectors back in with no pre-conditions. And then we should have given them a deadline saying "If you don't do this, say, within 60 days, we will reserve our right as Americans to defend ourselves and we will go into Iraq."

But there's been this kind of bellicose talk going on for three or four months now about unilateral intervention and all that. I think the American people are confused about this, and I think it could have been very easily stated from the outset: "Here's the problem. Here's the threat. Here's the conditions under which we will go in."

SCHIEFFER: Let me ask you this, because listening to your first answer this morning, it sounds to me like you may be taking Saddam Hussein a little more seriously today than perhaps you were last week. Is that fair to say?

DEAN: I'm taking Saddam Hussein a little more seriously today than I was two days ago when he began to -- when he, at that time, was not saying what he said yesterday. Today he's very clearly looking like he's going to resist a return of the inspectors. That is not acceptable. He has got to allow the inspectors in, and if he doesn't, then we will be in the position of having to intervene.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/09/30/ftn/printable523726.shtml

and again in February of 2003


Unilateralism

While Dean has repeatedly emphasized his belief that war efforts should be pursued through the U.N., Dean has also appeared willing, at times, to accept unilateral war in Iraq.

As recently as February 2003, just a month before the war began, Dean appeared to accept a unilateral approach in Iraq as a necessary evil.

According to an interview with Salon's Jake Tapper, when Dean was asked to clarify his Iraq position, Dean said that Saddam must be disarmed, but with a multilateral force under the auspices of the United Nations. If the U.N. in the end chooses not to enforce its own resolutions, then the U.S. should give Saddam 30 to 60 days to disarm, Dean said, and if he doesn't, unilateral action is a regrettable, but unavoidable, choice.

Five months before this statement, according to a Des Moines Register report on October 6, 2002, Dean said, "It's conceivable we would have to act unilaterally , but that should not be our first option."

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/000940.html

Given that the Bush Administration went to the United Nations in Novemeber of 2002, Dean would have unilaterally gone to war in Iraq by the end of January, 2003, according to the terms he would have dictated to the Security Council.

Dean being the only candidate who opposed the war from the start...

Doesnt look so from his earliest statements about the war, which did not change until after the invasion. Only then did he try to cover up his early statements in which Dean, following his own statement about what he thinks should be done, would have had the U.S. attack Iraq a full two months before the current administration did. Dean did not discuss exhausting peaceful and diplomatic means before looking at the situation deciding whether Saddam posed an imminent threat or not.

Deans statements indicate not that the U.S. should determine the level of threat that Iraq posed before attack, as is stated in the IWR, but before that legislation was signed, Dean set up his own time frame for attacking Iraq based only on the U.N.'s failure to enforce its own resolution.

This is hardly leadership.

It is shaping a campaign that states what the voters want to hear based on the polls.

What was among Deans earliest statements on Iraq...

The words "We will go into Iraq" came out of Deans mouth before the IRW was even voted on.


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stickdog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. Once again, we were all alive during the entire year of 2003.
Edited on Mon Dec-29-03 10:57 PM by stickdog
We know what happened. We know that Dean was standing up for the truth while Saddam's statue was coming down. Meanwhile, Kerry was hiding and Clark was cheerleading.
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HFishbine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-29-03 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. Yep
Edited on Mon Dec-29-03 10:36 PM by HFishbine
"He has got to allow the inspectors in, and if he doesn't, then we will be in the position of having to intervene."

Yep, and then the inspectors got it, so we no longer had to go to war and Dean and Kucincih were saying so, and others...?
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