Should Obama's pressing the wrong button 0.12% of the time as State Senator be an issue?

[zulchzulu]

Poll question: Should Obama's pressing the wrong button 0.12% of the time as State Senator be an issue?

Let's do the math:

Obama's eight years as Illinois State Senator:

4,000 = votes (approximate over eight year period)
    6 = times he hit wrong button when voting and changed the vote to correct vote
-----
0.125% = percent that wrong button was pushed and then changed to correct vote over eight year period

[Labors of Hercules]

1. Not if he corrected it afterward.

nobody's perfect.

[neutron]

2. Did he always correct it afterward?

And was this a common mistake among senators.

[zulchzulu]

4. Yes and yes

If you've ever watched CSPAN, legislators sometimes hit the wrong button on votes, which sometimes are 30 at a time in a session.

[neutron]

3. Why is he running Hit Diaries against HRC

and then claiming that he's being victimized bythe Clintons?

The Smear Campaign has been going on for months. I guess he's
gonna claim he never heard about it? And lives on another planet?

[zulchzulu]

12. Whuh?

So are you saying that Obama shouldn't defend himself? Should we let compulsive liars like the Clintons be allowed free reign to say whatever the hell they want?

I don't think so. I also think that people bringing up the "button" issue are just desperate and pathetic.

[Dogmudgeon]

24. And yet you're still spreading a Big Lie, yourself

Twenty million repetitions of "the Clintons are liars" would be considered a Big Lie by some people.

But of course, Obama's supporters would never lie. They're good people, not like those nasty Betas -- I mean, Clintons.

--p!

[zulchzulu]

30. Are you implying that Bill Clinton is not a liar?

:rofl:

Wow, stop it! You are just too damn funny! I feel your pain! I didn't have sex wit' dat girl! Stop! Stop!

[Dogmudgeon]

55. Yep -- when all else fails, break out Mr. Rofl

On the other hand, at least the Clenis drives you to laughter, rather than the other kind of hysteria.

By the way -- it's Hillary, not Bill, who is running for President.

--p!
Ridicule -- It's What's For The Election.

[Occam Bandage]

50. "Twenty million repetitions of the Clintons are liars would be considered a Big Lie by some people"

[Dogmudgeon]

63. Right -- that's ONE.

Shame on Bill (not Hillary) -- for one lie. It hardly justifies 20 million reps of "the Clintons are liars". One down, 19,9999,999 to go.

And, if I recall, the Republicans engineered the scandal. Were you with the Republicans on that one?

Could Barack Obama testify in front of a Grand Jury about HIS sex life? Could YOU? You, Barack, or I, would have no hesitancy in telling the jury to fuck off. Bill did not have that option. And if Team Obama chooses to resurrect it, they will also resurrect popular sympathy for Bill. And the people will realize that Hillary is running against Barack, but Barack is running against Bill.

--p!

[Occam Bandage]

The investigation was bogus; no doubt there. And Bill, to his credit, did not lie to the grand jury.

He did not commit perjury; he was acquitted of that charge.

[maddiejoan]

5. The problem isn't that he hit the wrong button

The problem is he expects me to swallow that horsehit.

He hits the right button 3,994 times --but just happens to hit the wrong button those 6 times?

yeah --okay.

[Occam Bandage]

9. "He hits the right button 3,994 times --but just happens to hit the wrong button those 6 times?"

So you're saying he made a mistake a statistically-insignificant proportion of the time?

[maddiejoan]

17. I'm saying

that he's a liar.

[Occam Bandage]

29. Because he made six mistakes over his career, and requested they be rectified immediately?

[maddiejoan]

35. He did?

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-obamavotes24jan24,1,7079399.story

[Labors of Hercules]

38. That would be the point, no?

One is making bad voting choices, and the other is "oops, hit the wrong button, 'Johnny, can you change it to the right one? Thanks...'".

If you don't agree with the decisions he's made, that's a different issue.

[maddiejoan]

43. I don't believe for a moment

that he hit the wrong button.

[TwilightZone]

44. I think a key statement in the article you posted was...

"Two of the admitted flubs were on hotly contested issues."

It does seem to be a bit more than coincidence that he very, very rarely made a mistake, but two of the six that did happen were on controversial issues.

[Occam Bandage]

47. In one of those, he immediately attacked everyone who had voted

as he did--then, after members of his party cried foul, he realized his error and apologized. If he were trying to avoid drawing fire for his vote, you'd think he wouldn't stick his neck out like that.

So, you've got one vote in which it looks kinda suspicious--one. And in that one vote, he requested that the record of the vote be changed to reflect his actual position immediately.

So, er, zero votes.

[Occam Bandage]

46. So he meant to vote in favor of human cloning, then stand up and request his vote

be changed?

[Occam Bandage]

45. He noticed immediately on two votes. He noticed within a day on the others.

In each of the cases in which he was actually in the Senate when his misfire was called to his attention (or when he noticed), he requested the record reflect his mistake. And that's just according to your article, btw.

And really: why would he actually vote--as the only dissenter--against a ban on human cloning?

[maddiejoan]

54. I don't know

You should ask Obama

[Occam Bandage]

57. He's already provided an explanation, and frankly, it's the only one that makes sense.

The alternative is to believe that Obama voted in favor of human cloning (as the only Senator to do so), then immediately stood and requested the record be changed, for some nebulous political gain. That's nonsense.

[maddiejoan]

59. maybe he got embarrassed

at being the only one?

:shrug:

[Occam Bandage]

60. As I'm sure you're noticing, the problem with pushing invented issues is that you have to say

sillier and sillier things to maintain some semblance of cohesion.

[maddiejoan]

64. in your opinion

:shrug:

which I don't , fortunately for me, hang my life on.

[rodeodance]

19. It's his Waffling on excuses after he hit the wrong buttens that are the Issue!

[Occam Bandage]

31. So he did hit the wrong button, then.

[TwilightZone]

6. I guess it depends on if there were any ramifications.

If the issues were important ones, and his error was not corrected, then it could be an issue.

Context is important.

[noamnety]

7. Other

not enough info.

What percentage of the 4,000 votes were on controversial issues?
What percentage of the 6 votes were on controversial issues?

[ccpup]

37. info for you

But two of Obama's bumbles came on more-sensitive topics. On Nov. 14, 1997, he backed legislation to permit riverboat casinos to operate even when the boats were dockside.

The measure, pushed by the gambling industry and fought by church groups whose support Obama was seeking, passed with two "yeas" to spare -- including Obama's. Moments after its passage he rose to say, "I'd like to be recorded as a no vote," explaining that he had mistakenly voted for it.

Obama would later develop a reputation as a critic of the gambling industry, and he voted against a similar measure two years later. But he was clearly confused about how to handle the issue at the time of his first vote, telling a church group on a 1998 campaign questionnaire that he was "undecided" about whether he backed an expansion of riverboat gambling. And, months earlier, he had voted in favor of a version of the bill.

The senator who led the opposition to the gambling measure, Republican Todd Sieben, said he took Obama at his word that the initial vote was an error. But Sieben also said the thin margin of victory was a sign that perhaps there was more to the vote than met the eye. "He was obviously paying attention to this vote. It was a major, major issue in the state, and it was a long debate," Sieben said. "The inadvertent 'Oops, I missed the switch' -- I'd be kind of skeptical of that."

...

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-obamavotes24jan24,1,7079399.story

[ccpup]

41. more info

On June 11, 2002, Obama's vote sparked a confrontation after he joined Republicans to block Democrats trying to override a veto by GOP Gov. George Ryan of a $2-million allotment for the west Chicago child welfare office.

Shortly afterward, Obama chastised Republicans for their "sanctimony" in claiming that only they had the mettle to make tough choices in a tight budget year. And he called for "responsible budgeting."

A fellow Democrat suddenly seethed with anger. "You got a lot of nerve to talk about being responsible," said Sen. Rickey Hendon, accusing Obama of voting to close the child welfare office.

Obama replied right away. "I understand Sen. Hendon's anger. . . . I was not aware that I had voted no on that last -- last piece of legislation," he said.

Obama asked that the record reflect that he meant to vote yes. Then he requested that Hendon "ask me about a vote before he names me on the floor."

...

Hendon said "it happens" that senators press the wrong button. But he was quick to add: "I've never done it."

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-obamavotes24jan24,1,7079399.story

[jlake]

8. That is the lamest excuse I have ever heard.... and I cannot believe anyone

would buy it.

[Occam Bandage]

10. "I didn't know that the Authorization for Use of Military Force in Iraq might lead to a war!"

[grantcart]

68. well now your hitting the right button

[Azathoth]

11. I am doing everything in my power to prevent war with Iran, which is why I voted for Kyl-Lieberman!

[jlake]

14. Not anywhere near as lame. And how did Obama vote on K-L...

[1corona4u]

15. OR SCHIP...

let's not forget that one....of course he had an excuse there too....

[Azathoth]

18. The people who stand to lose their lives in an Iran war might disagree with you n/t

[jlake]

22. Well, at least she didn't claim she hit the wrong button....which would have been as lame

:eyes:

[Azathoth]

33. Exactly, she claims she knew exactly what she was doing

In other words, saying one thing, doing the exact opposite. And people wonder why they call the Clintons 'triangulators.'

[jlake]

42. And you believe Obama made these mistakes...not that it is a lame excuse

for bad votes..... that he meant to make?

[rodeodance]

21. OOPS--Obama had an excuse that day for his not voting--campaigning.

[jlake]

26. well, he had plenty of excuses for that... but we all know why he missed it.

[Azathoth]

28. Gee, sounds like the attacks leveled against Kerry in 2004

"He misses votes cause he's out campaiging. He's not fit to be President!"

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

13. The campaigns have gone from the usual ugly to downright silly.

And, their entertainment value is dropping precipitously.

[Pathwalker]

16. I only used an ATM once. I hit the wrong button, and it

ate my card. I threw a hissy fit, called the police, who called the bank manager in my small town. He gave me back the pieces of my card and canceled the transaction. I've never used an ATM since, and never will. So, I assume this disqualifies me for any public office. Ever.
As someone who already voted for someone other than Barack Obama in my state's "meaningless" primary, I find this whole "issue" silly.

[jlake]

20. But you didn't do it 6 times, did you?

[Occam Bandage]

32. I'm pretty sure most every DUer has edited a post at least six times.

[jlake]

39. ??? Total non sequitur.

[Occam Bandage]

48. Nope. Thousands of posts, six errors.

[jlake]

51. There could be any number of errors in each post..... there are not 3 buttons on a keyboard

.... let alone clarifications, new ideas, facts, updates etc..... not comparable.

[Occam Bandage]

58. Votes in the IL senate are frequently very fast,

with only a few seconds of voting, and with many bills being voted on. All it would take for an error is two seconds' lapse of thought as to which bill was before the Senate. Obama is certainly not the only Senator to have made a handful of mistakes over his career.

[zulchzulu]

23. I once touched an oven when it was really hot and I got a burn

Once I lit a cigarette from the filter side first...it was in college.

[TwilightZone]

36. I have to ask - why would you call the police?

You hit the wrong button, so you called the police? Did you think about calling...I don't know...the bank?

[Pathwalker]

49. 1: I live in a very small town where everyone pretty much knows

everyone. 2: I was making a very large deposit, and was unwilling to lose that deposit. 3: There was no number for the bank's manager anywhere on the building, and his home # is unlisted. 4: The police station is just down the street from the bank, so an officer just walked over to help. In our town, they still try to help you, not just react to crime. 5: It jammed the ATM, and the other people waiting in line wanted to use the machine, but could not until the problem was fixed. The manager helped them complete their transactions after he was finished with me. This is the only ATM in our town, and no one wanted to drive several miles away to another ATM. 6: The manager said he was glad he'd been called, as did the other patrons of the ATM. It was one of those "all's well that ends (mostly - except for my card) well" moments.

[TwilightZone]

52. Got it.

I grew up in a similar town, so I understand how that would be an effective approach.

[William769]

25. I guess it would depend on what he's pressing the wrong button for.

Oops! Sorry China.

[JVS]

27. OMG he's gonna nuke us all

[Zynx]

34. Hey with how often I fuck up I might do it 12% of the time.

Haha.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

40. He saw the error and corrected it?

That's like correcting a typo. It means nothing. End result is that the vote was the way he intended.

As president, he'd have to be more careful. One of those buttons launches the nuclear-tipped missiles. The other button summons tea.
:rofl:

[BigDDem]

53. Don't forget when doing an Obama poll

always have an option of "Present" :rofl:

[Azathoth]

56. The Clinton campaign has devolved into Bush/Cheney 2008

I've never seen so many invented issues in my life.

[Skip Intro]

61. The fact that he uses it as an excuse should be an issue.

Do we really want another president who throws out dog-ate-my-homework excuses?

[Occam Bandage]

62. Excuse? He stood immediately after the votes and requested the record reflect his error.

That's called taking responsibility for your screwups.

[robbedvoter]

65. I would be worried to trust Obama with THAT button :

:nuke:
The truth is, he was caught with a lie and equivocated badly "I wasn't aware I voted no"
otherwise, push poll much?

[grantcart]

66. when you have absolutely nothing else to go against him with

I guess that will have to do

[Texas_Kat]

67. One thing this discussion of Obama's time in the State Senate has taught me

There's actually a WORSE state senate than the one in Texas.