WTF KO was right.. Hillary and her Bots are REALLY trying to make caucus delegates 2nd class...

[Thepricebreaker]

After watching KO talk about Hillary's new "3rd type delegate" I really didn't believe it until the posts from the Hillbots on this board as of today....

Do you know how much crack you have to smoke to think this will actually work?

WTF is wrong with the Clinton's... Holy shit...

--

example threads of the hillbots trying this tactic..


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5008729&mesg_id=5008729

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5015418&mesg_id=5015418

[grantcart]

1. or was it parody or was it real - so hard to tell these days

[Thepricebreaker]

3. No it was real.. look at the posts.

[grantcart]

17. No I know it was it just seems like a parody

[AX10]

2. Imagine: NO Keith Olbermann.

I'm optimistic.

[Hieronymus]

4. And I'll bet you liked Keith until he began telling truths about Hillary.

[Thepricebreaker]

5. Bingo...

[dchill]

10. Nail - meet hammer.

XActo!

[Window]

18. LOL!

You know it.

[neverforget]

8. You hate him because he's right. I take it Hillary is giving up her

caucus delegates since they are what? 3rd class?

[high density]

46. Imagine: Hillary Shills Stop Acting Like Rovian Bushbots

I'm not optimistic.

[cooolandrew]

6. The Clintons have changed long ago that's why I was for Obama. He's saved us.

Hanging round with the Bushes was a big sign says in their biogrphy's even how they started their friendship with bush senior back in 92 in transition. They've been round each other so long it changed them . Main reason we always need fresh candidates the system ahs ahd no time to get to them... check this out...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSMQqxPYYNY

[PseudoIntellect]

7. You can't please Hillary Clinton.

Keep caucuses, and caucus results become undemocratic.

Turn them into primaries, and Barack's popular vote lead becomes substantial. Popular vote is one of the only statistical factors, of course, that HRC is holding onto. (IF you include the primaries people were told wouldn't count, and if you LEAVE OUT 4 more states that would favor Obama when factored in, but they haven't reported the popular vote results, yet) And it's still only by 0.1%, even when you include fake primaries and keep out some real primaries that Obama led in.

[The_Casual_Observer]

9. After "Sir, I command you to resign immediately!!" didn't work

it's all about that big bad Hillary. Fuck Olbermann.

[dchill]

11. Yeah, sure...

Fuck Olbermann, and his stupid hatred of outright lies disguised as politics. It is getting tiresome.
:puke::sarcasm:

[MagsDem]

14. I'm pretty sure if I personally know lobbyists that are bundling cash for Obama...

... that KO knows Obama is telling outright lies about not taking "lobbyist" money. As do most of the media that has been complicit in more than a few lies being told by Obama.

[dchill]

27. You again.

:eyes:

[MagsDem]

13. KO has turned into a complete and total ASSH*LE

Pure and simple.

[dionysus]

26. i take it you still need ur banky.... is this your daily tantrum?

[genie_weenie]

41. Keith has? Keith? The Same Keith Olbermann who had the courage

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/07/04/2279/">to say on air:

I accuse you, Mr. Bush, of lying this country into war.

I accuse you of fabricating in the minds of your own people, a false implied link between Saddam Hussein and 9/11.

I accuse you of firing the generals who told you that the plans for Iraq were disastrously insufficient.

I accuse you of causing in Iraq the needless deaths of 3,586 of our brothers and sons, and sisters and daughters, and friends and neighbors.

I accuse you of subverting the Constitution, not in some misguided but sincerely-motivated struggle to combat terrorists, but to stifle dissent.

I accuse you of fomenting fear among your own people, of creating the very terror you claim to have fought.

I accuse you of exploiting that unreasoning fear, the natural fear of your own people who just want to live their lives in peace, as a political tool to slander your critics and libel your opponents.

I accuse you of handing part of this Republic over to a Vice President who is without conscience, and letting him run roughshod over it.

And more but okay he's an asshole...

[MagsDem]

12. Only in Obama land is letting people vote a bad thing

Look, here in WA Obama won the caucuses by 30%, but the non-delegate awarding primary by only 3%. What do Obama supporters have against letting people actually choose the candidate of their choice?

[dchill]

15. Riddle me this, MagsDem...

Who is the candidate now preparing to go back on her pledge not to try to poach Obama's pledged delegates? How does THAT not disenfranchise those who voted for him? The difference between 30% and 3% is the strength of their conviction. Hillary's people have it - Obama's have MORE.

[pnwmom]

19. No, the difference in the vote is that the caucuses are exclusive affairs

for people who don't work on caucus day, have the hours required to spend at them, are healthy enough to come, have transportation, and who are assertive enough to be able to tolerate the whole process and don't mind the lack of privacy in voting.

Otherwise, they're just great. . .

:sarcasm:

[Madam Mossfern]

21. Is that a straw man fallacy?

Are you saying that only those who support Hillary have jobs and that those who support Obama don't?
Can you read the subtext there?

[pnwmom]

23. No, you are the one who said that. I neither thought nor said anything

of the kind.

Caucuses are unfair for the reasons I stated.

But now that you mention it, if one candidate has the support of the vast number of college students -- who usually have flexible schedules -- then that candidate might have the edge in a caucus system. Also, people who attend caucuses tend to be more well-educated than the general population. So a candidate whose support was greater at higher educational levels would also tend to do well. Is this the subtext to which you refer?

[dchill]

24. It's saying it without saying it...

caucuses are "exclusive affairs" for people who "don't have too work." I see it, but people who say these things fully expect the message to get through without having to say anything out loud. Like this: "Jesse Jackson won South Carolina in '84 and '88. Jackson ran a good campaign. And Obama ran a good campaign here." No subtext there. Right.

[pnwmom]

56. No, I meant it exactly the way I said it. No subtext intended.

But college students are among his biggest supporters, as you know. And so are other highly educated people -- and caucuses typically draw from a more highly educated population.

[Milo_Bloom]

48. Since it is an internal party process, what is the problem with that?

The democratic party choice does not need to reflect the will of the masses, but instead the choice of democratic party.

Once the democratic party makes that choice, you can decide whether you wish to vote for that choice.

We need to go to an ALL CAUCUS system and end this open primary BS once and for all.

[pnwmom]

57. The problem is that it isn't reflective of the support a candidate might

draw in the general election.

George McGovern, for example, did quite well in caucuses. And he lost 49 states in the general election.

[Milo_Bloom]

58. Neither system works if that is your guide.

[pnwmom]

59. Primaries are not perfect, but they're better. n/t

[Milo_Bloom]

63. No, just different.

[johnnydrama]

16. what happened

What happened to 10 weeks of whinging about how can we disenfranchise voters in MI & FL.

All bullshit because their candidate is losing.

[indimuse]

20. they are undemocratic!!

f*cking period!!!!

[scheming daemons]

25. Which you were perfectly fine with for the past several election cycles.....

Caucuses have been part of some Democratic party nominations for more than 100 years.


Only *THIS YEAR* has anyone moaned about them.


You want it changed? Work for it to be changed in 2012. You can't change the rules for this time because your candidate didn't take caucuses seriously.

[Jersey Devil]

33. except in Nevada

where, of course, the caucus procedure was eminently fair. :sarcasm:

[Maribelle]

22. Kieth gets yet another one dead wrong. There is nothing new about caucus delegates.

Caucus delegates could swing results in tight Democratic race


By JUNE KRONHOLZ
Wall Street Journal
February 12, 2008

When Iowans caucused four years ago, Massachusetts Sen. John Kerry’s share of the turnout should have earned him 21 of the state’s 45 delegates to the 2004 Democratic National Convention. Former North Carolina Sen. John Edwards should have received 17 and former Vermont Gov. John Dean should have taken seven.

But when the Iowa delegates showed up at the convention in Boston six months later, 39 delegates were committed to Mr. Kerry, four to Mr. Edwards and two to Mr. Dean.

In Washington state, meanwhile, Mr. Kerry seemed to have earned 46 delegates to Mr. Dean’s 30 in 2004. But Ohio Rep. Dennis Kucinich snagged six of Mr. Dean’s delegates by convention time and added a seventh by the final floor vote.

...
The Obama campaign plans in the next few days to begin approaching the 4,207 delegates to county conventions that Mr. Edwards earned during the Jan. 3 Iowa caucuses in hopes of swinging them to the Illinois senator’s side. “It’s a soft ask. It’s not edgy” or high pressure, says Jackie Norris, who is coordinating the Obama delegate process in Iowa.



more ...
http://www.poconorecord.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080212/NEWS/80211026/-1/NEWS030101

[meow mix]

28. the clintons are a couple of (insert profanity)

:grr:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

29. Never Heard That Before, But I Actually Won't Disagree. I Do Consider Them Second Class Delegates.

Since they use such a tremendously flawed, undemocratic and disenfranchising process, I have no problem with those chosen from it being regarded as less genuine than those chosen through means with more integrity.

[SoonerPride]

30. Then change the rules for the next election

This changing the rules in the middle of the contest is Orwellian.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

32. I Haven't Ever Said The Rules Should Be Changed In The Middle. Get A Grip Pal.

I'm still allowed to have an opinion on those rules though, and am free to have them whenever the fuck I want. Get over it. :hi:

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

36. Awwwwww, So Cute That You Get All Name Cally And Stuff After You Were Bested.

There there SP, it'll allllllll be ok. Just think a little before you speak next time, ok? But don't take it too hard. There there...

:hug:

[SoonerPride]

37. You call flying off the handle "bested"

OK

Whatever.

Ignore for you.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

39. You Call That Flying Off The Handle? Oh, Your Melodrama Is Hilarious!

You said something stupid, and I threw it back in your face. Awwwww, too bad so sad. :hi:

[tabasco]

31. Hillary is following Chicken Dick Cheney's example

and trying to create her own reality.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

35. And ROFLMAO At You Using A Fake SATIRICAL Piece As Your Evidence!!!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Oh, and the first thread you linked was a perfectly acceptable, non partisan, intelligently put and refreshingly non inflammatory thread trying to discuss the topic sincerely. Shame that you are so biased and closed minded that you want to try and reference it as being some egregious violation or something. Pathetic.

But the use of that satirical piece? PRICELESS!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[AtomicKitten]

38. The Clintons are looking for an angle.

ClintonCo has nonstop campaigns in the press and on message boards to try to convince people that caucuses are mean to Hillary and shouldn't count, that the vote is tied, and that everyone is clamoring for a combined ticket with her at the top.

It's all bullshit and a lame attempt at subterfuge.

[Medusa]

40. By any means possible

that's their new motto. Wait, maybe it's always been their motto. :eyes:

[suston96]

42. Caucus delegates would be fine if ALL voters could attend or caucus with proxy votes...

...due to physical inability to attend.

Caucuses require physical mobility and attendance and therefore are not all inclusive as all democratic processes must be.

The Texas primary/caucuses are illustrative. Almost 3 million attended the Democratic primary and only a few hundred thousand, maybe less, caucused.

Yeah, caucuses are really democratic.

[SoonerPride]

43. You can debate their value or how fair they are, but that is not the issue

The issue at hand is Clinton wanting to unseat or re-value the Caucus delegates in the middle of the contest.

That's the issue.

And that's why it stinks.

She is constantly shifting the rules, moving the goalposts and screwing with the process.

[suston96]

47. Clinton cannot move goalposts or change rules....

...because she is not the regulating authority. Those are stupid observations.

But she can focus attention on a long broken and discriminating caucus process that was designed to control who and how many and what kind of people voted.

That democrats on this forum board and elsewhere can be blinded by fanatical candidate support to the voting abridgments and the trashing of votes cast by fellow democrats in Michigan and Florida is indicative of the deterioration of democratic party basics.

[SoonerPride]

49. But she is trying to change the rules.

She wants to de-seat the caucus delegates and only count the primary delegates.

[suston96]

51. One more time: she cannot change the rules. Only the regulating authority can....

She is NOT the regulating authority.

[SoonerPride]

53. She will ty to use her delegate power to influence the regulating authority

Obviously, no one is saying she alone can change the rules. No kidding. We understand there is a process involved.

But she is trying to get the rules changed.

So is it ok with you if, under duress and badgering from Clinton, the regulating authority is pressured to de-seat caucus delegates and they reach some sort of compromise position whereby those delegates votes count less?

[suston96]

54. It's ok with me if the arcane and discriminatory caucus process disappears forever...

I have witnessed supporters of candidates of every stripe ignore blatant voting rights denials and abridgments as long as their candidate wins.

Check the recent Texas voting. Almost 3 million democrats turned out for the primary and some 200,000 of the same democrats turned out to caucus.

What's wrong with that picture?

[high density]

44. As a person who spent FOUR AND A HALF FUCKING HOURS

casting my vote in a caucus, I am increasingly becoming pissed off at the Clinton campaign and their Rovian attempts at making new vocabulary. The time for this activism against caucuses was long ago, not in the middle of a damn race.

[K Gardner]

55. Exactly. She had no problem with them until she started losing them.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

45. I like how the Clinton campaign makes up new terms...

and then expects her supporters to believe them.

She must think they're stupid.

[Cha]

61. She knows her

supporters.

[anonymous171]

62. And I thought Bush was Orwellian. nt

[Greyskye]

50. 2nd link is SATIRE

Really good satire, but satire nonetheless. :hi:

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

52. It doesn't take a genius to figure that out. Hillary is only out for herself . . .

Democratic Party be damned.

[TML]

60. Here's What's Wrong

The Clintons will stop at nothing to get the nomination, even if it divides the party.