Ferraro needs to apologize and resign. PERIOD.

[mythyc]

If you're a Hillary supporter and said, even demanded that (1) what Samantha Power said was wrong, (2) Obama needed to condemn her comments and (3) Power needed to resign, but don't apply the same standard to Geraldine Ferraro than YOU ARE A HYPOCRITE. spin it any way you choose, that's how it is.

and if Hillary doesn't condemn Ferraro's comments and demand her resignation the same way she did Power's she is a hypocrite. PERIOD.

Both were representatives of their campaigns. Both were discussing the campaigns, not side issues. Both made comments that were not simply wrong, but were offensive personally and stupid politically. I loved Power, but held from moment one have held that that kind of statement has no place in the political domain. Same goes for Ferraro---more so actually in my opinion not just because she has a lifetime of experience in politics and has been in a presidential race, but because she made her comments in a public interview whose topic was the campaign.

And this is not about partisanship, for me at least. I thought from the beginning that Power needed to go for the good not just of Obama's campaign but of principle and uprightness in the political and public arena. Same goes for Ferraro, and if Obama doesn't uphold this principle and standard, I will be just as disappointed in him as well. His inability or reluctance to take a stand against attacks like these is one of my chief concerns about him (no, I haven't taken the kool-aid, I can actually not blindly agree with everything my candidate has to say or do. can you?

[wndycty]

1. Yes she is on Hillary's finance committee and she needs to resign

:kick:

[roguevalley]

37. she raises money and Hillary needs money so that will trump ethics

and common decency every time. If "Monster" is bad and requires a firing, this is worse. Don't expect it to happen however. Ferraro is some kind of queen (in her mind) and would never leave for the same crimes mere plebes have to swing for.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

2. Agreed.

[mythyc]

4. O my gosh, really?

after everything you wrote in the original thread, this blows me away to hear you say this. Please refer though to my one reply to you (#157 of http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5017732): I usually disagree with you politically, but think you nearly consistently show principle in what you say. same goes here. thanks for reconsidering the ethics of this situation :thumbsup:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

5. Of Course. I Don't Support Her Comments At All, And I Think It's The Right Thing To Do.

To be clear, my battle in that thread was in relation to if some would use ferraro's comments and exaggerate the issue to make it appear as if Hillary herself would condone such a message or is involved with such a message. As it relates to Ferraro, I didn't defend her for a second. Here are some snips of mine from that thread, when in fact addressing Ferraro directly:

"I'll Criticize Ferraro's Comments Just Fine. They Were Disgusting"

"Furthermore, Hillary should, if she hasn't already, condemn the remarks"

"She Probably Should." (in relation to her stepping down)

[mythyc]

11. we're on the same page then

thanks for the clarification. I read all the comments on that thread including yours, and while not missing these saw them in a different context within the polemics. you're alright OMC :thumbsup:

btw, i actually did draw this (the logo part) on my wall many years ago back in my wilder head-banging anarchical high school days :headbang: :



everytime I see your handle i'm reminded oi vey :eyes: ;)

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

15. LOL I Color Penciled That Cover On A Huge Poster On My Door Too!

I spent HOURS working on it and couldn't believe how good it came out, especially since I can't draw for shit! But since I was grounded all the damn time in my room anyway, it gave me something to do lol.

Cheers!

:toast:

[mythyc]

19. grounded too, lol .... cheers!

:toast:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

8. LOL

[BumRushDaShow]

3. K&R

:kick:

[GoldieAZ49]

6. Apologize for stating her opinion or having that opinion

I doubt she will, she doesn't need to

It goes more to the same of 'reject and denounce' of the candidate, which is getting pretty old

[Buzz Clik]

42. Pure bullshit.

Hillary demanded on a national, public platform that denouncing Louis Farakhan was not good enough; Obama had to flatly reject him. Obama did just that.

If Hillary winks yet another in-your-face racial trashing, then it isn't Ferraro who needs to step aside -- it's Hillary.

[mythyc]

55. touche. Obama called that word-mincing for what it was:

a rhetorical bluff. Reject Ferraro Hillary.

[tandot]

7. both campaigns should get rid of loose cannons who represent or speak for them

There are so many important issues to deal with and the only thing the media is reporting on is about who said what about the other team. It is stupid and only plays into the hands of Republicans

[AnarchoFreeThinker]

9. Actually, I'd rather she stay on and keep acting like a fucking moran.

[OzarkDem]

10. Her comments are being misrepresented

She does not need to resign.

She said nothing racially offensive, this is simply a case of Obama supporters trying to play the race card.

[americanstranger]

12. Of course not!

No one on the Clinton campaign ever says anything offensive.

It's just those damned people who read what they say and draw the wrong conclusions!

You should get that blind spot checked out.

- as

[OzarkDem]

27. Have you actually read exactly what she said?

She said Clinton is being treated unfairly by the news media during this campaign by attacking her because she's a woman. She further stated that the media is giving Obama favored treatment because the news media fears being labeled racist if they criticize him.

Ferraro was calling out the news media on the double standard they are using in covering this primary race - not fearing sexist treatment of Clinton, yet treading carefully in their comments about Obama. They're afraid of appearing racist, but not of being sexist. That's a double standard.

Now, please tell me how that's a racist attack on Obama. Ferraro is honestly analyzing media coverage of this campaign. Calling her comments racist is dishonest and cowardly.

[americanstranger]

34. It's all in the phrasing.

Ferraro is from Queens. I used to live there for a few years.

Her comments (Verbatim: "If Obama was a white man, he would not be in this position...") can be heard by Queens stoop-sitters or bar patrons to this day, complaining how black people have taken away their jobs.

Ferraro grew up there, and she grew up to be a fairly accomplished attorney - one-time member of the Queens DA team. So she's trained by profession to carefully weigh her words. She did not take the carefully constructed rout that you did in the post above, and if she had it might be easier to give her the benefit of the doubt.

But, nope. She went for the language of the racist Queens stoop-sitter. Dog-whistle politics at its worst, insidious and subtle.

Ronnie Reagan would be damn proud.

- as

[mythyc]

38. ozark please reply to this:

thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5020674

[MadHound]

14. It's not much more direct than this:

"If Obama was a white man, he would not be in this position. And if he was a woman (of any color) he would not be in this position. He happens to be very lucky to be who he is. And the country is caught up in the concept."


Sorry, but that sounds racist to me. It sounds like every single freeper I've heard whining when an African American gets hired instead of them. All about how they're lucky to be black.

[OzarkDem]

30. Taking comments out of context

the oldest, cheapest trick in the book.

Her entire comments deal with the fact that Obama is getting favored treatment by the news media because they fear being called racist if they criticize him. At the same time, the media is providing sexist comments and coverage of Clinton's campaign - using a double standard.

When it comes to the news media's fear of honestly criticizing Obama because he's black, but heaping unwarranted criticism on Clinton, yes, Obama is very lucky. If he were a caucasian man running against Clinton, the news media would not hold back on their crticism of him. In this primary race, in this situation, with the favored media coverage he's getting - yes, he is a lucky man. And he knows it.

If you think that's racist, you have a screw loose.

[americanstranger]

36. That is the direct quote from the article!

Unless the damned sexist bastard who wrote the article took her quotes out of context, that is exactly what she said.

More excuses for statements made by the Clinton campaign. You guys seem well-stocked with them.

- as

[mythyc]

39. again, please reply, with argument rather than invective

to the above post: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5020674

[LSK]

49. I have a screw loose n/t

[MadHound]

58. Gee, sounds more and more racist to me

Especially after your rationalization above. In fact her entire spiel sounds about like I said earlier, like a freeper's racist rant that a black man is getting the job, getting better treatment, whatever simply because he is black.

First of all, I have to contend the notion that Obama is receiving better media treatment than Hillary is, especially if you take the long view. Last year, all the way up until the Iowa caucus, Hillary was getting great press, was in fact all but crowned president by the media. Once Obama had withstood her initial onslaught, yes, he started getting better press because of the simple fact that he had actually weathered the blow and stood up to Hillary's best effort. Not because he was black, but because he was a serious contender. Then Obama reeled off a string of victories, and Lord knows, the media loves a winner. Not a black winner, not a white winner, just a winner. Now after the Texas, Ohio, RI, Vermont round, things have pulled about even, Clinton is getting criticized, Obama is getting criticized. Hell, Hillary got major press coverage right before the Texas, Ohio round on SNL, Daily Show, Sixty Minutes, etc. Where was Obama? Oh, yeah, not getting the press.

Only die-hard Hillary supporters would think that an even handed press, or any press coverage less than coronation levels that she was getting is somehow biased against Hillary. Nope, instead they start coming out with these inane racist rants blaming this less than stellar press on the man's skin color. Pathetic, just fucking pathetic.

[Quixote1818]

13. I think the Obama camp wants to avoid this kind of battle. They won't touch this. nt

[wndycty]

16. OBama conference call within minutes! Jan Schakowsky to call out the Clinton camp. . .

. . .over this, per THE PAGE!

[Quixote1818]

17. Really? Do you have a link? This should be good. nt

[MzShellG]

18. They just showed a clip of Susan Rice....

Condemning Gerraldine's comments on MSNBC. She was understandibly upset.

[mythyc]

20. do you have a link?!? n/t

[MzShellG]

35. Sorry, it was live on MSNBC.

I saw after posting that there was already a thread about Susan Rice's comments.

[book_worm]

21. forgive my ignorance but what did she say?

[mythyc]

23. see reply #14 above. full interview is on youtube

no time to find the link... gotta run to work lol!

[Quixote1818]

24. Link

http://thepage.time.com/

[anigbrowl]

51. Or on Youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqL_sm0J8jc

Geraldine Ferraro talks to....John Gibson(!)

[rodeodance]

22. She was right and your post is full of arrogance. Shame on you.

[Quixote1818]

25. Do you really mean that?

Wow, what a disgusting thing to say. Even the Hillary camp is distancing themselves from that comment: http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0308/Disagreeing_with_Ferraro.html

[americanstranger]

28. I can't believe that Clinton supporters excuse Ferraro's remarks.

I shouldn't have really expected any different thought - they were perfectly fine with the praise of McCain, Bill's 'Jesse Jackson' comments, etc. All manner of objectionable statements are fine, because, well, they're in defense of their candidate.

I think they've all been staring at the sun, because there are some massive blind spots at work over there.

- as

[Quixote1818]

31. I was an Edwards supporter and I never thought Obama was doing well because of his color

I never even saw his color. His message of change and his ability to be a great communicator has taken him to the top. No question about it.

[mythyc]

41. Ferraro is ---IN--- the Clinton campaign

n/t

[Catherine Vincent]

26. She probably should step down.

From whatever her position was.

[2rth2pwr]

29. She won't. and Hillary won't ask for it. She is playing you , the media,

and more importantly Obama for fools. By she I mean Hillary of course, she is getting Obama to respond to everything she does, including firing his close supporters (and look at how he is even distancing himself from Austan Goldsbee). She even has Obama sideways about the VP offer.

He is out of his league here.

[Quixote1818]

32. .

:rofl:

[RiverStone]

33. 100 % agree

Ferraro's comment was about as overtly racist as it gets - she exemplifies the old guard who feel threatened by Obama's fresh wave of change.

Hillary should reject or renounce or what ever terms she wants - Ferraro off her campaign ASAP!!!

[Buzz Clik]

40. I agree, but it will happen when hell freezes over. Hillary is much too stubborn

[ProSense]

43. As a manager, this incident is demonstrating how quick Hillary is to the punch

What's taking so long?

Where's Hillary's tax return?

[Independent-Voter]

44. Hell no! Keep Ferraro on as long as possible.

Keep the face of washed-up candidates attached to Clinton's campaign. Before anyone gets on me about that, remember that Ferraro was part of that powerhouse team that absolutely got their asses handed to them in 1984. That made the 20% buttkickings that Obama's been regularly handing HRC look like child's play.

[suston96]

45. What did Ferraro say? That Barack Obaama is where he is because he is an African American?

Well, that is true. Check out all the official state election statistics that definitively document that very fact. Those same stats also document how people voted by sex, ethnics, age, religions, and more. Why would official government statistics be so demographicated if there was anything wrong with such demarcations and stats?

Check out all the news channels that report election results. Their analysts all do the same thing.

You wanna pillory Geraldine Ferraro for making a comment that all those places and people clearly make before and after every election?

[mythyc]

46. please refer to the sister thread to this one

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5020674

also, just because "they all say it", doesn't make it true ----------- or right

[suston96]

48. I already posted there. Are you saying that the state's election headquarte statistics are false?

Are you saying that exit polls by the various media indicating the election day demographics are all false?

[rodeodance]

53. OP and others are looking for a quick sacrifice on the alter!

[mythyc]

56. If you're basing your argument on blacks voting for Obama, it is INCREDIBLY weak

African Americans showed up (1) in record numbers and (2) as tight unity behind Jesse Jackson when he ran back in 88. Obama is winning thanks to far more than the black vote, and anyone who looks at the "DATA" honestly and objectively will tell you the same.

[Barack_America]

47. What's worse. Ferraro meant her comments to be on record, and defended them today!

She has taken her comments much further than Powers took hers.

[psychopomp]

50. Good point

:kick:

[City Lights]

52. And with Billo of all people!

Seeking justification for her remarks from the RW hate machine!

What team is she on again? Hillary loves her some McCain and Geraldine loves her some hate talkers. :puke:

[suston96]

54. She defended them because she is right.

Let me recount a little primary history....It happened some 46 years ago in Massachusetts.

A 30 year old Ted Kennedy, younger brother of the then President of the United States, was running for the Democratic nomination for the US Senate seat vacated by his brother. Yes, he just made the minimum age. His opponent was the Attorney General of Massachusetts named Edward McCormick - yes, a nephew of the then Speaker of the US House, John McCormick.

I watched the TV debate as did millions of democrats all over the state. At one point Ed McCormick turned to Edward Moore Kennedy and said:

"If your name was Edward Moore instead of Edward Moore Kennedy, your candidacy would be a joke." The rest is history, as Kennedy won the nomination and the election and has been in the senate ever since.

So, cheer up. Whether Barack Obama's race has anything to do with his success so far, doesn't really matter. In the end, what we groan and moan about on these boards and blogs doesn't amount to a hill of beans.

The people will decide whether Hillary Clinton's sex or Barack Obama's race mean anything. But to argue that either one of them would be this far along if it wasn't for the historical impact of Hillary Clinton''s sex and Barack Obama's race is a perfectly valid discussion.

[rodeodance]

57. Yes, it is a valid discussion but as we can see--they want her sacrificed on the savior's alter.