Does this quote bother any Obama supporters?

[Enrique]

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hXv22TA8n_gCCyNSRFnGVEqMvidgD903BF080

_ OBAMA: "Well, you know, I think that having the advice and counsel of all former presidents is important. I'm probably more likely to ask advice of the current president's father than the president himself, because I think that when you look back at George H.W. Bush's foreign policy, it was a wise foreign policy. And how we executed the Gulf War, how we managed the transition out of the Cold War, I think is an example of how we can get bipartisan agreement. I don't think the Democrats have a monopoly on good ideas. I think that there are a lot of thoughtful Republicans out there."

[zanne]

1. You realize he's talking about Bush's father, right? nt

[Enrique]

6. yes

Bush's father, who invaded Panama and waged the Gulf War. That Poppy Bush.

[Joe the Revelator]

56. and who is also best friends with Bill Clinton

This is the wrong tree to be barking up.

[MattBaggins]

74. The firsts Bushes Gulf War

was well executed and getting out as soon as possible was the right choice as apposed to his dipshit sons decision to occupy the country. I have no problem with what Obama said at all.

[Enrique]

83. ok, you approve of the first Gulf War

what about Panama?

[lyonn]

123. Poppy may have mislead the Ambassador to Iraq deliberately by

not making it clear to her that if Saddam invaded Kuwait we would attack when Saddam was saber rattling. That was always up for debate and never got much attention. At least Poppy knew to leave after getting them out of Kuwait and the main Iraqi Guard smashed fairly well. But, then Poppy said that he would back the Kurds and Shiites if they attacked Saddam and his people. They raised hell and Saddam smashed them and Poppy didn't raise one plane to help. Remember all those graves filled with thousands? That seemed to be why the Shiites were not that thrilled when we invaded this time and sure enough, it is even worse than before.

Dems must try to get along with the repubs but cautiously. Obama could be trying to be peace maker since we have been at war with each other, to the extreme, and that is not helpful either.

[merh]

102. You realize that Bill Clinton said that he had no qualms with Poppy's

Gulf War I and/or reagan's foreign policy. You do realize that Bill did not alter their foreign policy in the middle east, he actually perpetuated it and made this war possible by continuing those "no fly zones" that were illegal, don't you?

You do know that Bill Clinton, not poppy, not reagan, began the extraordinary rendition program, don't you?

[Enrique]

106. he chose Al Gore as VP partly because of Gore's support of that war

most democratic senators opposed that war, Gore supported it and Clinton thought that hawkishness would help him. Yes I believe Clinton didn't substantially differ from Bush on Iraq.

I did not know about Clinton and rendition.

[merh]

121. Well if you don't know about renditions and you don't know that he

did not substantially alter the foreign policy of the USofA relative to the middle east, that he continued the ILLEGAL "NO FLY ZONES" then you don't know much about his administration and you don't realize that the distortions and manipulations, the abuses of power didn't just happen under Poppy Bush or Reagan.

[niyad]

2. that's one more to add to the list of comments of his that worry me.

[Windy]

8. Why the hell would that worry you? Bush Sr. had the sense not to invade Iraq!!

You apparently are not a student of history!

[niyad]

21. are you nuts? who do you think was president during the first gulf war?

[sandnsea]

25. So you like the US being the ME's "security umbrella"?

You think an attack on any country in the "security umbrella" should be met with "massive retaliation" by the US? That's what SHE said.

[Taxmyth]

absolutely

and until America cuts back seriously on it's use of oil and gas then that will HAVE to be our posture.

[sandnsea]

67. So you supported the invasion? n/t

[Taxmyth]

116. I supported the ejection of Iraq from Kuwait

and knew people that went to do the job. As far as Iraq goes, I understand what happened but in no way think it was the right thing to do.

[Taxmyth]

54. don't play cards and post at the same time

makes for making duplicate posts

[Taxmyth]

55. and triplicate

[MattBaggins]

76. Well there is a lot of grey area and nuance

but basically..... yes.

[mckeown1128]

109. What do you think would have happened if Saddam got control

of Kuwait and Saudi oil fields... are economy would have been completely destroyed. I don't know where you were in the early 90's but I take it you liked having food to eat and clothes to wear.

[sandnsea]

113. So Hillary supported the war

and you're glad of that, right? Just getting clear as to what possesses Hillary's supporters to stick with her. Now that I know it's because they actually support this insane war, I understand better.

[Taxmyth]

118. Senator Clinton was not the only one to vote aye

most of the D Presidential candidates did the same thing. Doesn't mean they supported a pre-emptive invasion into Iraq.

[sandnsea]

122. Are they touting an ME "security umbrella"???

Any "Democrat" who thinks it's a good idea to divide up the ME and put some of the countries under a US umbrella is a FOOL. That is the line in the sane for me. The IWR vote is just one part of the evidence that Hillary supports a Bush-like foreign policy. THIS Bush, not the father.

[mckeown1128]

120. I'm not a Hillary supporter...

and I am ONLY talking about the Persian Gulf War...not this sham going on currently.

[Arrowhead2k1]

73. Right, and the first Gulf War accomplished what it was supposed to masterfully.

Kick Iraq out of Kuwait. After that, we left! Great! You can't compare that to the gigantic mess we're stuck in now.

[Straight Shooter]

119. Guess what? If chimp bush had begun that war, we'd probably still be in it.

Everything chimp bush touches turns to FUBAR. So I guess we'd be blaming everyone who promoted and supported that war.

It isn't about Kerry, or Edwards, or Dodd, or Biden, or Hillary, it isn't about anyone who voted for the IWR. It's about george w. bush and no one else. His war. His responsibility.

By the way, we're all responsible because of our addiction to oil. Anyone who voted for Reagan over Carter is twofold responsible. We might have more of a solar-based energy policy now. But noooo, people wanted to hear "happy talk."

[RaleighNCDUer]

86. Yep, not a student of history.

Coalition troops chewed up Saddam's armies, coalition jets bombed Iraqi cities, but despite pressure from some quarters we did NOT invade and occupy. We did not try to take down Saddam, throwing the country into chaos.

And the entire war cost something like 312 American lives.

SOMEBODY was making halfway decent decisions, even if the original impetus for war was trumped up.

[PeaceNikki]

140. When you are a loved one of the something like 312, it didn't feel like a "halfway decent decision"

What was it for and what did it accomplish?

[Tesha]

3. It's called "politics"

You want a few more votes than we've been getting lately,
you say stuff like this.

Tesha

[niyad]

4. he doesn't think the dems have a monopoly on good ideas? didn't he say

not so long ago that it was the repukes who had all the good ideas/

[Connie_Corleone]

9. He never said the republicans had all the good ideas.

Nice rewriting of history like Hillary, though.

[niyad]

41. bs--YOU are the one who is trying desperately to pretend your candidate didn't say

such things:

” But that wasn’t all the praise Obama had for Republicans in his 80 minute interview. “I think it’s fair to say the Republicans were the party of ideas for a pretty long chunk of time there over the last ten, fifteen years, in the sense that they were challenging conventional wisdom,” Obama said during the interview.


http://www.fantasypoliticsusa.com/?p=719

your candidate is not a saint, and has said some very stupid things. funny how his supporters foam at the mouth when these things are pointed out.

[CreekDog]

64. you added the word "good" to the quote

big difference.

[Connie_Corleone]

82. And where does he say that they had "good" ideas?

I didn't think so. Try again.

[DJ13]

5. No, why should it?

Advice and actually being in charge of creating policy is two different things.

[Enrique]

11. some people didn't like Poppy's foreign policy

[DJ13]

19. "some people didn't like Poppy's foreign policy"

Again, for the reading impaired........

Advice and being in charge of policy is two different things.

[Enrique]

35. he called Poppy's foreign policy "wise foreign policy"

Obama's going to be in charge of foreign policy if he's president. Do you think his foreign policy might resemble Bush I's, based on his calling it "wise"?

[niyad]

13. going to poppy for advice? you really think this is a good idea?

[msallied]

20. Poppy was wise to not invade Baghdad

and he explained as much why he chose not to, because he was afraid of the very same results we're seeing out of Iraq right now. So yeah, in that aspect, I think he exercised wisdom and restraint where his son chose not to.

[NYCGirl]

7. No, he just said he'd talk to him. Not travel around the world and become a

part of the family.

:shrug:

[Enrique]

16. he called Poppy's foreign policy "wise foreign policy"

and he specifically approved of the Gulf War.

[NYCGirl]

28. It was handled a damn site better than the current war. NT

[MattBaggins]

80. I fought in the first gulf war

and have no regrets.

What is your point?

[RaleighNCDUer]

89. Approving of the war and approving of the handling of the war

are significantly different things.

But of course, for the strawman arguement you are presenting, that's easily overlooked.

[Enrique]

101. that's absolutely right

Obama specified the "execution" of the war. He might disagree with the war itself. Does he, do you know?

Regarding the execution of the war, however, that would include the use of depleted uranium, and would include the slaughter at the Highway of Death.

[sabra]

10. how about this pic?

[Enrique]

27. Hillary's hawkishness bothers me

and I'm not comfortable with her association with Newt Gingrich.

Does Obama's praise of Bush's foreign policy bother you?

[msallied]

12. It doesn't bother me in the slightest. In fact, it's refreshing.

I'd be no more comfortable with a groupthink Democrat government than I am with the current Republican one. It's about unity, not a take-over of ideals.

[Stand and Fight]

143. That's "group-think DemocratIC..."

There was a time when the DEMOCRATS on this board cared about things like your little misstep.

[guyanakoolaid]

14. No. I appreciate the way he can reach out, but without compromising his message (and voting for IWR)

[niyad]

44. he wasn't in the senate to either vote or not vote the IWR.

[guyanakoolaid]

51. True, he didn't have the chance to sell-out on that, but Hillary did, and she took it

And played her part in the neocons murder of thousands of Americans and hundred of thousands of civilians.

[NJmaverick]

15. Bother? I think it's great

You know just because you have someone with different political views, doesn't mean they are completely stupid or they are not capable of providing useful infomation. Why cut off your nose to spite your face?

[cliffordu]

17. No.

Ya gotta get in bed with all kinds of critters to get anything done.

Even you.

[donheld]

18. Not too much

Do you think Hillary would say anything different from that?

[sandnsea]

22. Does Hillary's ME "security umbrella"

bother any of her supporters? It ought to.

[Enrique]

42. yes

does Obama's praise of Bush's "wise foreign policy" bother you. (I'm assuming you're an Obama supporter).

[sandnsea]

85. It was wiser than this Bush's that Hillary supports

With her IWR vote and her "stay the course" and her Kyl-Lieberman vote. Wake Up.

[Enrique]

87. I disagree with both the IWR vote and Kyl-Lieberman

do you agree with Obama on Bush I's foreign policy?

[sandnsea]

104. He didn't invade Baghdad, yes I agree with that

Why are you still supporting Hillary the warmonger??? She just promised you we are going to stay militarily involved in the ME. Do you support that??

[Enrique]

105. I don't know if Obama differs with her on Israel

I think all mainstream democrats have the same policy on Israel.

My preference for Hillary is slight, and to answer your question it's because of experience. There's a democratic agenda that both would pursue as president, and I think Hillary would be better able to advance it. That's why I support her.

[sandnsea]

107. No. She called for a "security umbrella" over the whole Middle East

She said there would be "massive retaliation" if any country in that security umbrella were attacked. That is completely different from Obama. You're supporting someone whose experience is to promise you the same hideous foreign policy that this country has operated under for decades. If you didn't support the IWR and you don't support Kyl-Lieberman - you've got the wrong candidate and you're supporting her because you're a woman, gay, paid, or a fool.

[Enrique]

110. I'm not a woman or gay or paid

and I'm not a fool, I just prefer a different candidate than you. A slightly different one, imo.

By the way, do you think Obama's policy towards Israel is radically different from Clinton's?

[sandnsea]

125. Look. If you oppose the IWR and Kyl-Lieberman

then you oppose expanded military agression in the ME. Hillary very clearly stated last night that she supports it. Quite differently than Obama as I have clearly laid out. He didn't say there would be a "massive retaliation". So if you can't hear those words and process them, to understand they are in exact opposition to what you say you believe - then you are either paid to post this shit or you're a fool. What the fuck do you think "security umbrella" and "massive retaliation" means??? The Clintons have duped a lot of people. Dump them while you can.

[Enrique]

127. I support her with my eyes open

I'm aware of these things and know that if she becomes president that I will oppose some of her foreign policy.

This differs I think from some Obama supporters, who don't seem to want to face some realities about him.

You, for example, seem to have a hard time answering my questions about Obama's policies toward Israel.

I'm not going to call you a fool or any other name, but that's my opinion about your support of Obama.

[sandnsea]

128. You have exposed yourself

She does not believe what you believe in matters of war, but you keep posting your garbage in support of her.

I answered your question about Obama and Israel. He does not believe what Hillary does, he did not say anything about a security umbrella or massive retaliation.

So. Who are you that you don't care whether we elect someone who promises 8 more years of militarism in the ME? How do you live with yourself, no matter what your agenda is for being here.

[Enrique]

132. if that's being exposed, then I was exposed long ago

I have never agreed with all of her foreign policy, or all of any establishment democrat's foreign policy, including Bill Clinton's.

And yet I support Hillary for president.

[sandnsea]

135. No really

What is it that is more important to you than a President who is promising continued war, that we all know could likely start WWIII.

[Enrique]

136. she's promising to end the war

[sandnsea]

138. No, she just told you last night she isn't

She's going to create a "security umbrella" for a bunch of countries in the ME and antagonize the shit out of the rest of them. Where does that say "end the war" to you? What is it that keeps you posting this shit? I know you don't believe what you're posting.

[Enrique]

139. she's promising to defend Israel

you are interpreting that as warmongering and as promising endless war, I interpret it as conventional Democratic support of Israel which Obama shares.

I do believe this, and it isn't shit. Why are you so abusive?

[sandnsea]

142. No she said she's going to create a "security umbrella"

to protect any ME country that wants to join, and that she will protect any of those country's with "massive retaliation" if another ME country attacks them. That's what she said.

Everything YOU have said indicates you don't support that, don't support the IWR, don't support Kyl-Lieberman, don't support any of this saber rattling. So, there must be some other reason you're posting talking points supporting Hillary's warmongering, which is what it officially became last night. It isn't abusive to ask you why you're doing that. I just want to know what motivates you.

[lyonn]

129. Notice that the media is not talking much about the Security Umbrella

Now this is an issue that needs scrutiny. We are not the policeman of the world. How arrogant is that attitude? We can not have another president that wants to rule the world, we gotta show some respect for others... That is Obama's outlook.

[crankychatter]

23. evangelical with your progressive purity message

but only if it aids your candidate... who flips and flops... like the puppet on a corporate string, that she is.

[LSparkle]

24. No ... Barry Goldwater and Richard Nixon would be MODERATES these days

Goldwater was in favor of gays serving in the military and Nixon established
the Environmental Protection Agency. Before the party was taken over by
Newt Gingrich and the Religious Right, I even had respect for some of its
members. Only during the past 20 years or so have I come to loathe them (as
they've demonized us). But I think many Republicans are realizing that
they've gone too far right, and are moving more toward moderation, and Obama
is the perfect Democrat to reach out to those people and convince them that
we CAN find common ground on some issues.

[msallied]

30. So true...

The Republicans in the last 50 years have been forced to mangle their message in order to court the holy rollers. Before that, there were actually some pretty progressive members of the Republican party.

[Jed Dilligan]

26. Not particularly. The Bush I-Clinton policy of containing Saddam

was much wiser than the Bush II policy of killing him and destroying his country. As for the transition out of the Cold War, that was handled very badly in every respect but I don't expect a candidate to admit it because we have not reaped the whirlwind just yet.

[LTR]

29. This happens all the time in politics

When Harry Truman sought an expert to help out with administering the Marshall Plan, he didn't hesitate to call Herbert Hoover, who had experience in that field. Never mind Hoover was a Republican, and was a terrible president, this was one field he was good at. Hoover was grateful toward Truman for being one of the few politicians who actually sought him out.

Keep in mind that Bill Clinton also consulted with Nixon while he was president.

[Bensthename]

31. No problem at all.. Especially since the independents are in play against McCain.

That is part of his change. Working with both sides of the isle to get the best ideas.. And that is how you get congress behind you too.

[The_Counsel]

32. Better Question: Should It?

I happen to agree with that statement. If I were Obama, had just been elected President, and were forced to choose between Bush41's foreign policy and Bush43's as a foundation for my own, I'd choose Bush41's every day of the week. And twice on Sunday. Not saying Bush41's FP is the best-ever, just FAR better than Bush43's.

And no, Democrats DON'T have a monopoly on all good ideas, just most of 'em. The problem with Republicans is that whenever they have a good idea they tend to abandon it the moment it no longer suits them politically.

[AllentownJake]

33. Bush's daddy

Was terrible in a lot of ways...however he did navigate a somewhat soft landing to a collapse other the other world superpower.

[otohara]

34. Yeah It's Gross

but it's not going to make me a Hillary supporter. Her husband has been attached at the hip to GHWB - so that tells me, Hillary & Bill think GHWB wasn't as bad as the evil spawn.

[JuniperLea]

48. "Hillary & Bill think GHWB wasn't as bad as the evil spawn"

That adds points in their favor! He wasn't... not even close. GHWB knew full well what would happen if Saddam was taken down... he spoke against it... and he was right.

[redqueen]

36. Nope.

Don't see how it could bother Clinton's supporters either... hell she's practically buddy buddy with McCain, and her husband is awfully chummy with GHWB as well.

:boring:

[JuniperLea]

37. Not an Obama or Hillary supporter

But I like this statement... a lot.

I wish I had a dollar for every time I wished GHWB were POTUS instead of GWB over the past six years or so.

GHWB knew better than to take Saddam down, or he would have done it when he had the chance. He knew what would happen if Saddam were taken down. He said it many times. And everything he said about that has come to pass. That tells me he has a good idea of how the world is working right now. He knows a lot of things hell of a lot better than his stupid son.

I think there are a lot of thoughtful Republicans out there too. They aren't all evil neo-cons.

[Armstead]

38. It bothers me a little bit -- But I understand his basic point

Compared to his son, GHW Bush was Ghandi.

not really, but Bush 1 was basically a pragmatist on foreign policy. I'd have preferred Obama use someone more enlightened to use as a model for foreign policy, but given political realities -- and given the idiotic question that prompted it -- his answer was not too upsetting.

[Cant trust em]

39. Not really. It's pretty well qualified.

There's detail in it that doesn't bother me.

[depakid]

40. It won't bother blind partisans

there are (as we all know) a good many here in both camps that will defend or tolerate most anything that comes out of their anointed ones' mouths- no matter how ridiculous or, in this instance, weighty.

I'd like to think that Obama was simply being nuanced here (and also showing his inexperience in foreign policy).

[peoli]

43. No I believe ALL REPUBLICANS are EVIL and ALL DEMOCRATS are GOOD!

I mean, all people who were born and then declare to be republican when they get old enough to think can only be though of as inherently evil souls and spawns of Satan. There is not one good thought or ounce of God or goodnees in them.

Im going to post the sarcasm button for those of you that cant pick up on sarcasm.
:sarcasm:

[Enrique]

45. what about Bush I's foreign policy

does it bother you that Obama called it "wise?"

[bowens43]

53. He went in , did what need done and left.

How is that unwise?

[Enrique]

60. ok

so the answer is no, it doesn't bother you.

[peoli]

63. Do you believe that all republicans are evil at the core of their soul?

[Enrique]

66. no

of course not, that's silly.

[peoli]

69. do you believe that Hillary Clinton is an honest person?

[Enrique]

77. she's a conventional politician

her dishonesty has been exagerrated.

[futureliveshere]

46. Hillary just admitted yesterday night that she would follow the REAGEN approach..

..to set up a commission to investigate how we can improve the Social Security Account. Does this mean she is also to be ABUSED? This is such a childish attitude.

[Enrique]

49. no it doesn't mean that she should be abused

or that Obama should be abused.

I was just wondering of Obama's calling Bush I's foreign policy "wise" bothered any Obama supporters.

So far, a couple have said it does.

What about you?

[futureliveshere]

72. But Obama is the most NUANCED poltician around & we must learn to hear him similarly

It is not Black & White. He is answering one specific question and appreciating the fact that Bush Sr. was able to fight a war against Saddam and had the wisdom to withdraw then w/o getting bogged into quagmire of his own making. He would have been justified going after Saddam then as he had more of a reason but made a strategic call and got out in one piece. Thats all!!

The best thing about Obama is that he looks at ALL sides of an argument and has the intellectually capacity to strike at the heart of the issue. Thus, it is more important that the idea is GOOD, not which party suggested the idea. This, in marked contrast to the baboon in human clothing who currently inhabits the WH makes him the president America desperately needs.

Of course being more liberally inclined than the Repubs the liberal ideas will make more sense to him and thats a good thing too.

[NJSecularist]

47. This is what George HW Bush wrote in his memoirs about Iraq.

"Trying to eliminate Saddam .. would have incurred incalculable human and political costs. Apprehending him was probably impossible ... We would have been forced to occupy Baghdad and, in effect, rule Iraq ...there was no viable "exit strategy" we could see, violating another of our principles. Furthermore, we had been self-consciously trying to set a pattern for handling aggression in the post-Cold War world. Going in and occupying Iraq, thus unilaterally exceeding the United Nations' mandate, would have destroyed the precedent of international response to aggression that we hoped to establish. Had we gone the invasion route, the United States could conceivably still be an occupying power in a bitterly hostile land."

Was he wrong? It seems he had the wisdom his son did not.

[Enrique]

59. Poppy stood up to the neocons in his administration

a lot of them were there, Wolfowitz for example was pushing hard for regime change.

But the Gulf War itself is problematic, as was the invasion of Panama.

[NJSecularist]

65. What exactly was problematic about the Gulf War?

Some of you live in this dream world where under a President Hillary Clinton we will not enter into a single military conflict.

Was GHW Bush right in his assessment of an invasion of Iraq? Does he not deserve credit for standing up against the neocons?

I realize none of us like many Republicans here, but let's at least give credit where credit is due. GHW had the wisdom that his son did not.

[TankLV]

50. Of course not, silly - NOTHING the "saint" could do would ever bother them...

they resemble bush* supporters more and more each fucking day...

sigh...

[bowens43]

57. You think that Obama is a saint? How strange.

[bowens43]

52. Nope. Not at all.

Popa Bush wasn't quite the fool that sonny is.

[mkultra]

58. not me

I could probably debate that position but its hard to debate the idea that counsel itself is bad. I would say that hes giving junior the back hand.

[PM7nj]

61. Not much. Does Hillary's promise to attack Iran if they attack ANY mideast ally bother you?

[Enrique]

62. yes

in general I think the rhetoric against Iran should be cooled down.

[PM7nj]

68. Definitely

I was rolling my eyes when Barack was talking about attacking Iran, and when Hillary made her little promise... I was blown away. I hope this is one campaign promise they break, along with not raising taxes on "normal people" who make lest that $250,000 :eyes: Since when the fuck do normal Americans make between 100 and 250k?

[Melinda]

70. And as Pres, HRC's #1 priority will be to dispatch Bill and Bush 1 on a world mission

Bill Clinton: George H.W. Bush will help President Hillary


ORANGEBURG, South Carolina (CNN) - Former President Bill Clinton said Monday that the first thing his wife Hillary will do when she reaches the White House is dispatch him and his predecessor, President George H.W. Bush, on an around-the-world mission to repair the damage done to America's reputation by the current president - Bush's son, George W. Bush.

"Well, the first thing she intends to do, because you can do this without
passing a bill, the first thing she intends to do is to send me and former President Bush and a number of other people around the world to tell them that America is open for business and cooperation again," Clinton said in response to a question from a supporter about what his wife's "number one priority" would be as president.
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2007/12/18/bill-clinton-george-hw-bush-will-help-president-hillary/

:shrug:

[ieoeja]

71. How does it bother me? Let me count the ways.

0. He reversed Reagan's reversal of Detente, welcoming the Soviet Union's entrance into the market place with open arms, resulting in the immediate collapse of the Soviet Communist regime.

0. He allied the United States with a coalition of Muslim nations to liberate Kuwait. Aside from Iraq itself, only Libya opposed that coalition.

1. He stayed in Iraq after liberating Kuwait. That led to the only two Islamic terrorist attacks ever on US soil.

My judgement on staying in Iraq is 99% 20-20 hindsight. I thought it was a waste of our time and resources. Iraq wasn't any threat after the beat down we gave them in 1991. So why hang around? But I really didn't give it any thought. I certainly didn't expect the reaction it provoked from the Muslim Brotherhood and Al Qaeda.

[izquierdista]

75. Being diplomatic

He's still wooing over disaffected Republicans; that's why he says things like this.

I'm hoping for a sharp left turn after Inauguration Day, when the real thoughts can come out: "Why would I want the advice and counsel of EITHER George Wanker or George Hideous Wanker, they were both Wankers who screwed up everything they touched. I think there are a lot of brainless Republicans out there and they should be shoveling shit instead of offering advice."

My services as speechwriter are available.

[Adelante]

78. No

It didn't bother me all the other times it was posted, either.

[4_Legs_Good]

79. Not a fan of Bush I, but he was light years better than Bush 2, and Obama was talking about

Bush 1's ability to get other nations on board, where Bush 2 didn't even bother.

Bush 1 gave us Panama, though.

Stupid fucking Bushes!

David

[DrFunkenstein]

81. My Faux Indignation Knows No Bounds!!!! Grrr!!!

We need a peacenik like Hillary Clinton in the White House! We can't afford to let someone so hawkish take the nomination!

[goletian]

84. this is the foreign policy obama is referring to:

Had we gone the invasion route, the United States could conceivably still be an occupying power in a bitterly hostile land. It would have been a dramatically different - and perhaps barren - outcome.

light years ahead of his son's.

[Crunchy Frog]

88. No. Does this picture bother you?

[Enrique]

93. no

I don't have a problem with democrats praising Poppy, or with working with him or other republicans, up to a point.

I did disagree with parts of Bush I's foreign policy and I hope any dem president would differ from it.

[BlooInBloo]

95. Then you should have all sorts of problems with Clinton, who praises a CURRENT candidate..

.... and says the republican is better qualified for the job than the Democratic frontrunner.

But I suspect THAT doesn't particularly bother you.

[Enrique]

96. that did bother me

I much preferred her statements last night that the most important thing is having a democratic president.

[Lost-in-FL]

90. And you don't think Hillary supports GHWB? Her husband's "buddy"?? n/t

[Enrique]

91. no, I don't think she differs from Obama on this

[AZBlue]

92. Not at all. It was a smart way to answer a stupid question.

He was asked if he'd use Bush Jr. in any way - obviously no candidate could give the blunt response to that, so he spoke of his father instead. And, he simply said he'd ask him for advice given he's a past president. Very smart thing to do - no matter which party they are from, a past president can give a lot of insight and help (I don't include Bush Jr. in that group because he's a moron and I don't really think of him as president anyway). And, he just indicated he'd seek advice, not give him a cabinet position or anything like that. The best way to make a far-reaching decision is to find out more about the situation and then speak to people who have differing opinions on it - that way you hear from all sides and are able to make a smarter decision yourself.

I think Bush Sr. is very knowledgeable and good at foreign policy - that doesn't mean I agree with everything he did or said, but I respect his background, his experience and his insight in that area. I also agree with the idea that we need more bipartisanship in this country and that Dems don't have a monopoly on good ideas. The Bush Cabal is like the Moral Majority - they are small but so loud that they seem big and all-encompassing, but actually they are only a percentage of the GOP. This administration has ruined the reputation of the GOP but once they clean house - and it may take them 5-10 years to really do that - they will go back to being an actual party. Even in the meantime, they aren't all evil and some do put forth good ideas.

So, no, I have no problem with that statement at all - I think it shows just how incredibly brilliant he is and just how much he "gets it."

[Enrique]

94. ok

lots of love here on DU for the patriarch of the BFEE. A bit surprising, but ok.

[AZBlue]

100. Well, you can dislike a person in general, but admire some of their abilities.

Overall I can't stand the man and if Obama had indicated that he would use him in a role in his WH, I'd have to reconsider my response. But, like I said, any president (real president) can offer assistance and insight that no one else in the world could ever offer.

And, as a relevant example, I'll be honest - right now, I no longer hold Hillary Clinton in any esteem in general, but whenever there are those threads that ask Obama supporters to post something nice about her, I have no trouble coming up with something because there are areas that I still think she is experienced and knowledgeable about and there are things that she has done that I will always admire. If Obama as President were to ask her for advice on some of those areas, I would have no problem with that at all - in fact, depending on the circumstances at the time, it might be a very wise thing to do.

[uponit7771]

97. You know we only paid around 40 million for that war right?

[Enrique]

98. that's correct, the Saudis paid for most of it

I do have to say I'm surprised how much support the Gulf War, with the depleted uranium and the "turkey shoot," is getting here on DU.

[SeaLyons]

99. As if Bush senior would have anything to do with him....

He makes some stupid remarks. I guess it's the inexperience showing.

[JoFerret]

103. It bothered me

Seemed he was scrambling to be polite.
GHWB was a towering genius compared with the son but a midget in real terms and his policies were awful to live through both at home and abroad.

[dpbrown]

108. Yeah, since the question was "how are you going to use George W" and he couldn't even brush it off

Not only that but he couldn't think of a Democratic president to seek the advice and counsel of?

There are a couple around.

edit:html

[Enrique]

112. I actually thought he was going to say Clinton

while listening to his answer, "I would be more likely to consult with..." I anticipated Clinton and was a little shocked he said Bush.

As I remember, things sucked during Bush I and improved a ton during Clinton. I would go to Clinton first, but I guess in Obama's position saying Clinton wouldn't help him.

[dpbrown]

117. I think saying Clinton would have been the better answer - GHW Bush was a disaster

Not quite as bad as Reagan, but plenty bad.

[indimuse]

111. IT bothered me...

Obama hates DEms and loves Repukes?

[nichomachus]

114. As opposed to Hillary

who said she wanted to send Poppy Bush around the world as a goodwill ambassador for her administration? That bothers me a lot more than Obama's quote.

[Triana]

115. No. It doesn't (n/t)

[Exultant Democracy]

124. I wish the Chimp thought more like Obama, if Chimpy had followed his fathers advice we wouldn't be

in Iraq right now.

[smiley_glad_hands]

126. At least he doesn't practice the republican arts like Hill. eom

[EFerrari]

130. Yes, it bothers me and it bothers me a lot.

He's not as bad as Hillary and Bill being pals with the Bushes but it's bad enough.

[Orsino]

131. This one.

The first and last lines are simply diplomatic, but what comes in between is pretty damned fatuous.

But yeah, even Poppy looks good next to *.

[Ka hrnt]

133. Not a fan of Obama...

...but I have no problem with it. Why not seek the advice of past presidents?

"I don't think the Democrats have a monopoly on good ideas."

In fact, I really like that quote--something the party of "open-mindedness" should keep in mind.

[anonymous171]

134. Better than Hillary's plan.

:scared:

[ElsewheresDaughter]

137. Obama loves to channel repuke presidents

[LisaM]

141. What bothered me about the quote was that he left Bill Clinton out of his answer

not to mention Jimmy Carter.

In fact, both of them acted as if George H.W. Bush was some sort of saint, when in reality, I think he's as bad as any of the other Bushes.

[grantcart]

144. it was a clever put down of George W.