Blacks and Jews should stay they hell out of the political process...

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

Oops. Sorry. I meant to say "Evangelical Christians."

I keep forgetting that on DU it's all right to hate and disenfranchise some groups, but not others.

Please continue dazzling me with your pseudo-liberal philosophical gems.

[Madam Mossfern]

1. I'm sorry if you are offended

I have said nothing against Evangelical Christians, but you must face the fact that most Evangelicals do not agree with the more liberal policies of the Democratic party.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

2. So gratuitously insulting those who DO agree with the Democratic Party

is a wise political strategy on which planet?

[Madam Mossfern]

7. I don't think I said that.

You need to grow thicker skin.
I know as a Jew, I have had to. Those who would purposely insult Evangelical Christians would have no compunction against insulting others as well. Just take it where it came from. The bottom line is that Obama did not demean Evangelicals.

A question:
Do you think there should be more faith forums run by Jews, Muslims, Atheists or Buddhists?
I think that you may not understand that as a Jew, I may be just a tad put out when the test of a presidential candidate is whether he is Christian enough.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

13. I wasn't referring to you personally...

I meant elsewhere tonight and virtually every other night, when people around here seem to thing posting slanders based on one's religion is somehow less outragous than posting racial or sexist slurs.

Personally, I don't think the Saddleback Forum was a good idea in the first place. While the moral and ethical values of a candidate are certainly worth discussing, I agree that this forum was an attempt to make both candidates seem sufficiently Christian. We're electing a President and not the next Pope. So in answer to your question, I don't think we need more faith-based forums.

[Madam Mossfern]

17. Thank you for clearing that up.

As has been posted elsewhere in this thread,they are probably referring to Fundamentalist Christians who do not agree with Democratic party principles just at Fundamentalist Jews don't.

Honestly, a forum like this should have been sponsored by the Ethical Culture Society.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

20. Here's the problem...

The broad-brush, inflammatory rhetoric being used around here touches all persons of faith and it makes the entire board look bad.

Just referring to a certain group? So if I call just certain people niggers and kikes because they've run afoul of some person standards that I've set, am I not a flaming racist?

Can I make gratuitous insults to your mother based on her beliefs, then turn to you and say, "Oh, I don't mean YOU" and expect you to not take offense?

[saltpoint]

3. I block the path of no fundamentalist Christian who wishes clear

passage to church.

I hold in complete contempt the fundamentalist who attempts to remove CATCHER IN THE RYE or SLAUGHTERHOUSE FIVE from my public library or local high school Lit classes.

[Peacetrain]

4. Jeff, most people get Evangelical and

Republican Right Wing religiosity mixed up. Liberal theologians are Evangelicals too. Progressives are Evangelicals. There is a branch in the Catholic Church that is Evangelical.
Edit:

Let me add, what they are thinking is Fundamentalist. :)

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

8. But apparently they ALL need a shot of thorazine...

At least, that's what I'm getting from DU tonight. People of faith are idiots, are delusional, are every other thing under the sun.

Statements made here, had they been made about any other group, would have resulted in the author's being tombstoned in a heartbeat. Slander against Christians is tolerated on this board.

[Orangepeel]

5. Nobody should try to use the political process to inflict their religious beliefs on me

I don't think that's too much to ask, what with our constitution and all.

[cliffordu]

6. Blacks and Jews HAVE been banned from the political process on THIS level since

the founding fathers wrote the Constitution.


You have the right to keep your faith, as do I.

When Fundamentalist Evangelical Christians stop hating women and homosexuals, I'll back off, till then, they need to shut the fuck up and pray for Armageddon.

Or blow up an abortion clinic. Or the Murrah building.


Edit for clarity. Edit #2 for sticky "h"

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

9. Thank God you edited for "clarity"

Because for a second there I thought you were just spewing indiscriminate invective about an entire group of people based on the actions of a handful of deeply disturbed individuals.

For a second there, I thought you were so stupid and ill-educated that you were lumping Jimmy Carter in with the Montana Militia.

For a second there, I thought you were so asinine that you were condemning a host of decent people, including the 2008 Democratic nominee, because of the actions of others with whom they have almost no philosophical agreement.

For a second there, I thought you were just some ignoramous who had no earthly clue what you were talking about.

Thanks for that moment of clarity.

[cliffordu]

15. In a Southern Baptist church, in 1960, I was taught that the

best way to "cut a ni**er's throat" was with a Hawksbill knife.

And we all loved the fuck out of Jesus.


*****

I have several friends who are practicing Christians. You won't see them at any thousand dollar a plate soire.

They do the work that Jesus described with his life, they treat the addicts, feed the hungry, bring the Word to prisoners and comfort the dying.

They don't do it for megachurches, television evangelists or self-promotion.

I love THESE Christians with all my heart. That fat pimp on television tonight???

Not so much.

[Forkboy]

10. I've never heard of the Separation of Blacks/Jews and the State.

[TexasObserver]

11. There is a difference between beliefs and proselytizing those beliefs.

I don't care what anyone believes for their religious or spiritual beliefs, as long as they don't insist on telling me about them.

When people ask me to attend church with them on Sundays, I decline and ask them instead to miss church that day to come to my home and watch the TV news shows. I don't think one of those activities is inherently more spiritual or godly than the other.

On my list of things I want to do on a Sunday morning, suicide comes before going to church.

But, to each his or her own.

[Balderdash]

12. Welcome

to the new Democratic Underground. It's become such a nasty place I hardly
ever come here anymore. Just dropped by to see how folks were taking how
the religious forum went and I see that the same folks dominating DU are still
here trashing the place.

[Top Cat]

14. I'm glad that you corrected your statement.

I only hope that you truly mean it.

[dbonds]

16. All religions as a group should stay the hell out of the political process.

If that offends you look at the constitution. But they absolutely should be involved as individuals.

[cliffordu]

18. Yep.

[ChimpersMcSmirkers]

19. It's not ok, but you know what? The other groups you speak of don't have a choice to be in the group

they're in. Blacks, gays, etc. don't have a choice. Evangelicals do. That's the difference.

[npincus]

21. Your OP makes makes me bitter.

[Deja Q]

22. WWSDD?

(that's not to dis Sammy Davis Jr; he was a cool guy... life just takes weird turns at times.)

[Mass]

23. Obviously, most of you think that atheists should not even exist and

certainly not state their opinion. It was made clear last night and this morning.

As for Evangelical Christians, they should participate as CITIZENS.

[Tutonic]

24. Always throw the Blacks and Jews beneath the bus first huh Jeff?

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

28. Yeah. That's where I was going with this...

Your perceptive mind smoked me out on that one right away.

I hope you enjoy the eighth grade - it may be the best three years of your life.

[old mark]

25. Jeff, I have never heard so much self-pity,so much whining

bullshit as I have from the "evengelical right" over the last 10 years. They are at the same time the most closed minded and arrogant gruop I can recall, and have nothing positive to give to this country.
Yet they demand and demand and demand.

I have no respect for them at all, just as they have no respect for anyone else,whether in religious beliefs or politics.

mark

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

27. Your lack of subtlety is embarrassing

I find it amazing that the same pseudo-liberals who scream bloodly murder when one interest group is being slammed by the conservatives can so completely close their mind to another group -- particularly when up to a third of that group supports progressive values.

Time was that religious voters were split evenly by the two parties. The Democrats basically conceded this group to the Republicans about thirty years ago, and now Democrats act surprised that a majority of religious voters go the other way. We're going after EVERY vote -- we're not going to assume that religious voters don't share our values.

Obama's appearance last night was one part of that effort. The rest is going on behind the scenes as the campaign reaches out to local congregations.

[rucky]

31. They're starting to fracture.

I'm not saying we could or should try to "convert" them to our camp, but we can help expose the fact that they have been duped by the GOP all these years (which they're beginning to realize). Meanwhile, there are Evangelical movements from the left that are picking up steam - big focus on helping the "least of thee." That just may take out some of their hate. More hatred towards them will just send them back to their old ways. This is just from my experience with fundie in-laws and their church-member friends I've encountered over the years.

[Azathoth]

26. Any Blacks and Jews who want us to return to a 12th century theocracy should stay the hell out too

Fair?

[Bluenorthwest]

29. A few things

First J in Mil, the prime focus of the 'Church' for decades has been political power via the bashing of gays, women and in the past the Jews and Blacks you use in your OP. I mean you do understand that the 'chruch' has killed countless Jews and blacks via such wonders as the inquisition and the slave trade (look it up)? So Christians calling for Blacks and Jews to stay out is satire for you, even though it has been the fact of the matter for centuries?
People who proclaim faith in public are to be taken with a grain of salt, or to be more accurate, rejected out of hand, according to Jesus. He also taught that those who follow him should expect to be persecuted for His sake, and those followers should REJOICE when that happens.
And here you are, panties all stiff over a few words on the internet. No rejoicing. Nothing close to persecution.
One wonders how you would fair under the persecutions that the 'church' imposed on the Jews for so many long centuries? If you were really prevented from participation, you'd crumble like a coffee cake, your 'faith' as weak as your knowlege of the teachings you whine over. But inquistions and pogroms are just joking matters to you, akin to frat hazings and internet postings?

[Buddy Tess]

32. Hmmm....

Seems to me Jesus did quite a bit of proselytizing in public. Sermon on the mount, throwing the money people out of the temple, stuff like that.

[Bluenorthwest]

35. They say he walked on water and made the blind see

So do you do that as well?
Try reading the NT on those who proclaim thier own holiness and the sinfullness of others. It is all there in red letters.

[1Hippiechick]

30. Are you that desperate to have your thoughts read that you would create a post entitled this?

No better than yellow journalism, imo.

[DU GrovelBot]

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[Hugabear]

34. I will hate ANY group who attempts to turn the US into a theocracy

And as far as "disenfranchising" goes, please provide one single instance where someone has been disenfranchised because they were an evangelical Christian. Just one.

[JTFrog]

36. Keep Your Mother Fucking Religion out of My Mother Fucking Politics.

Our rights are spelled out in our Constitution.

I have much more faith in the constitution than I do in those who believe in imaginary friends in the sky.

[terrya]

37. Pardon me for not falling in love with a group of people....

who continue to deny me and other GLBT Americans the same legal rights you enjoy. Solely because of who we are.

I guess I'm just so silly that way.

[PurityOfEssence]

38. Well, people who go around believing in the sacred right to shove superstitions down our throat

deserve a little resistance.

Jews don't proselytize. It's not possible for someone to try to convince someone to become black.

"Evangelical" means, BY DEFINITION, those who intrude on very private and tender subjects as if it's their god-given (literally) right. They are intrusive and domineering by nature, and being called out for aristocratic, anti-democratic conquering abuse belies a feeling of arrogant superiority and an outrage that anyone would consider him/herself anything approaching "equal".

To this mindset, resisting complete domination is some form of wicked persecution.

"Christian" is one thing, "Evangelical Christian" is quite another. Bear in mind, though, that proselytizing is BUILT INTO Christianity, so "evangelical" Christians are simply those who are EVEN WORSE WITH THEIR CONQUERING MINDSET.

Things are not equal, but that doesn't mean that those few who resist being conquered and subjugated by a majority are somehow evil persecutors of this poor, tormented EXTREME MAJORITY.

Got it?

(edited for spllling)