I am so encouraged!

[mamalone]

A little background first... I live in a very conservative area of Upstate NY, and attend a very conservative Baptist church. The folks there are wonderful in many ways, very loving, hardworking, selfless even, but as Republican as can be imagined (unless of course the Repubs are "too liberal" for them.) Lots of members of the 29% club 'round here if you know what I mean:eyes: I basically agree politically with no one in my usual social sphere, which is difficult, but something I've gotten pretty used to over the years. Well, this morning I had an interesting conversation with the 10yo boy, who is a member of the only other racially mixed family in the church. He was talking about how it was exciting that "our next President might have black skin," and did I know that "Obama is a Christian, and that other guy isn't one." He finished up by saying that his father is probably voting for Obama, and they are all hoping that he's our next President.

I thought I was going to start hooting and hollering right in the middle of the church nursery, folks... but I didn't want to scare the poor kid, lol. The idea of someone in my little conservative church- which is the epitome of what you all would call "fundie," to be planning on voting for Obama, well it's a huge shift.. just HUGE! I felt so encouraged, and I want to encourage all of you... don't allow yourself to get discouraged! Don't give up, even on those who you think will never see the light. We have an amazing candidate in Obama, we need to follow his lead, have confidence in his leadership skills, keep working hard... and if you are a praying kinda person, well a little bit of that won't hurt either;)

:grouphug:

[JSK]

1. Sorry to rain on your parade

but you say this kid is from the "only other racially mixed family" in the church. So they are probably the "only other" Obama supporters! Tell me that a few of the purple-haired church ladies are looking favorably at BO and then I'll start hootin' and hollerin' with you.

Sorry to be a Debbie Downer, but it's been a bad weekend...

[FrenchieCat]

2. What's bad about the week-end?

[JSK]

9. My friend's hubby was killed in that f-ing train wreck

:cry:

[mamalone]

13. Oh, my goodness...

I am so very sorry to hear that.. :hug:

[FrenchieCat]

18. I'm real sorry to hear that.

I understand then.

But things will get better......although that's easy for me to say, from where I sit. :(

[mamalone]

4. Well, you may be right...

But I'm still gonna stay encouraged:D

[joefree1]

3. Positive thinking

Thanks. Stories like this are great to hear. We are going to win.

[MorningGlow]

5. Hi Mamalone--which part of upstate are you in?

Downstate upstate, Catskill upstate, capital upstate, or western NY upstate? :evilgrin: (Western NY upstate here! :hi:)

[mamalone]

7. Western NY upstate here too!!

:hi:

[MorningGlow]

8. Kewl!

Love your anecdote--and to know it's 'round these parts is even better. I do worry about our red rural WNY counties (as I am firmly ensconced in one of them). But then again, the folks locally have surprised me already--I'm in Dist. 26 and got to witness Kryzan grease through the negative, namecalling, slapfesting menfolk of Davis and Powers for a win! :woohoo:

[mamalone]

15. That was wonderful wasn't it!

:woohoo: is right!

[JSK]

10. My mom is from Watertown

My great-grandfather settled there in 1848. She gets really annoyed when she hears people refer to places like Albany as "upstate!"

[mamalone]

12. Watertown?

Now that's what I call upstate!!

[MorningGlow]

16. LOL I know how she feels

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=7066552&mesg_id=7066698

I get completely torqued when someone says "upstate NY" and it turns out they're talking about Pougkeepsie. That's a freakin' NYC suburb, as far as I'm concerned!
:rofl:

[mwb970]

6. Great story!

I am interested in your comment about how the people in your church are generous, hardworking people, but are also right-wing bushbots. I have noticed this same dichotomy in my sojourns into rural Ohio - the people are invariably friendly, kind, helpful to a fault - and extremely far-right politically.

My problem is this. Today's conservatives and right-wingers, at least the ones on radio and TV, seem to be angry, dishonest, hateful, hostile, and mean-spirited, exactly the opposite of the way your church people and my rural folk come across in person. Why then are they drawn to these awful, inhuman political views and horrific spokesmen? Wouldn't liberalism be a better fit for "nice, kind" people - you know, liberty, equality, justice and all that?

In the church setting, how do these people keep themselves from noticing that Jesus, with his obsession with helping the poor and downtrodden, comes across as having liberal values? Are they able to create an imaginary "warrior Jesus" who approves of war to worship instead? How?

Do these same people simply not realize that America is a liberal democracy, which is exactly what has made it great? Do they simply not realize that the Constitution is a liberal document that protects us from fascism and tyranny? Is it ignorance, or something worse?

When I visit my family in the Cleveland area, I tune in a Christian station in Canton just to hear what they have to say. During the day, the station broadcasts a variety of religious and family-help programs, which I find to be sensible, uplifting and inspiring. But when it gets dark, the same station broadcasts right-wing political shows that consist entirely of sputtering outrage and bitter, dark hatred for liberals. This is the most vile right-wing political programming I've ever heard - and it's on the Christian radio station! It's like Count Dracula takes over when the sun goes down. How can the two kinds of programming be reconciled?

I'd like to understand what gives with these people. Any thoughts?

[mamalone]

11. It's truly bizarre isn't it?

I have felt at times that I've entered an alternate universe... especially since Palin has come onto the scene. These folks are just all aglow over her, and it just bewilders me. Just because she is so adamantly pro-life they are willing to ignore all of the other Biblical mandates and philosophies she is ignoring or outright contradicting.

Anyway... to answer your question a bit (don't think I have the whole answer by any means!) There are two factors at play as I see it. Firstly is the plain fact that many of these people are easily manipulated. They adhere to the Biblical mandates of integrity due to their faith in Jesus, so they assume that others who claim His name also do the same. They really do believe that a person who calls themselves a Christian would not willingly lie or act in a deceitful or cruel manner. So you have someone like Palin come waltzing in... and they are ripe for the picking. Honestly, choosing someone like her was the absolute best thing McCain could have done to shore up that base. They may rationally see that she is flawed or inexperienced, but they see her as a woman of faith and therefore placed in this position "for such a time as this" (that's a quote from the Biblical story of Esther, which Palin has apparently referred to herself.) It's very tough to counteract this type of thing...

The other factor that comes into play with these folks is the idea that although God is all loving and compassionate, He is also judgmental and hates "sin." I think sometimes this side of the equation gets out of balance, and folks end up rationalizing their own human desire to point out everyone else's flaws, and build themselves up. I apologize for not articulating this very well- I know what I mean, but I'm having a hard time putting it into words, KWIM?

Thanks so much for asking. This whole issue of religiously conservative Christians and how they align themselves with those who are politically conservative fascinates me. They are going against their own most dearly held beliefs and they don't even seem to realize it:(

[Kind of Blue]

14. Hi, mamalone!

Thanks for posting your good news because sometimes I forget about the small but delightful people that pop up now and then in this town I live in, in very Republican San Diego. I'll share mine. I live in a town called Fallbrook that's really very charming. Well, I was at the grocery checkout last month when out of nowhere the cashier lady said, "Isn't it wonderful about Barack Obama? I don't care what they say about Michelle but I've never been prouder of this country either." And then she goes on about being a young woman in the 60's, being a hippie, and her disappointments in the system through the years. Because I was the only black in the store, I thought, maybe she's trying to out me, or something, by pointing out the obvious Obama infiltrator in the community, but I decided to give her the benefit of the doubt and relaxed. It was so clear how much she wanted to talk about it and it was a joy for me to talk about it outside of my home, for once.

[mamalone]

17. That is a great story!

You wrote:
"it was a joy for me to talk about it outside of my home, for once."

Oh my, I completely know the feeling! Sometimes when my repub acquaintances are rattling along about politics, my teenage daughters and I will exchange meaningful glances, but for the most part we just stay silent, or change the subject. On the rare occasion when we are able to talk about our politics it feels like such a wonderful gift... so like I said, I know exactly how you must have felt:)

[mamalone]

19. Just wanted to post an update!

This evening I saw the father of the child I mentioned earlier, and of course I mentioned that I had heard he was planning on voting for Obama. We had quite the interesting conversation:D He has only recently started paying attention to the campaign (as an aside, what is up with How can anyone not be paying attention to something as important as a Presidential election??) Anyway, he sees things that "cause him concern" in McCain, mainly his war mongering, his complete lack of concern for the poor, and the health insurance issues. He does not like Obama's stand on abortion, but at this point there are enough other things that he likes about Obama to be intrigued enough to be tentatively planning on voting for him. He said that he found Palin "interesting," a statement that I just couldn't let lie... I talked about my concerns about her poor character and lack of integrity (I'll be emailing him some videos and links later tonight!) And one of the best things he said was that he knows of several other Evangelicals who are leaning towards Obama at this point! :woohoo:


So.... I'm still encouraged!