The only time I have ever liked Cheney

[Craig Roberts]

was for a moment tonight during the debates.

I drove out to Berkeley to watch the debates on campus with a bunch of students. I wasn't early enough and had to stand in the back and crane my neck to see. So I listened more than I watched until somebody moved and I was able to slide into their place more to the middle of the back wall. This was right about the time Cheney was answering the question about gay mariage. I didn't hear everything he said, but I heard Edward's response and watched Cheney's reaction on the split-screen. Edwards handled the issue of Cheney's daughter perfectly and delicately, and you could see Cheney watching him intently as Edwards steered into this very personal territory. And you could see, I think, that he genuinely appreciated what Edwards said.

When Cheney was given the opportunity to respond he expressed his gratitude for what Edwards had said, and, I swear to God, for a moment the man seemed actually sincere, actually human. He said whatever his personal feelings, the president makes policy and he follows and that's that. Edwards then responded with the argument that, although he and Kerry believe marriage is between a man and a woman, they also believe monogamous homosexual relationships need to be respected and accorded some legal rights.

Then it was Cheney's turn to challenge what Edwards had just said, and he simply declined. He told the moderator he had nothing more to say.

The Berkeley kids laughed and applauded. They saw that as a point scored for Edwards. But during that one moment I was not in synch with them. I saw Cheney's choice not to respond as a rather sad but very human choice on the side of his daughter.

The moment passed. Soon he was snarling and lying again. But for that one moment...

I was thinking, if you could just crack off the black breath mask and remove the black samurai helmet, you might find some vestige of a decent human being under there. The atrophied, blue-faced, half-dead remnant of what this man must have been before he turned to the dark side.

I know nobody wants to hear this kind of thing right now. I'm just sayin'. I was shocked to find myself briefly touched by an unexpected glimpse of the humanity of Dick Cheney.

[LittleClarkie]

1. I was there with you

It made me almost want to cry to think that there was that tiny hint of a human being under all that crap after he wouldn't comment on this issue.

[murielm99]

6. He must love his daughter.

But he is terribly conflicted by his ideology, and his need to pander to the base. That spark of humanity is overshadowed by his other actions.

For me it would be no contest, even if I was in public life. Family comes first. I could never have an ideology that would hurt a member of my family.

[CrowNotAngelGRL]

7. I agree

I thought it was a great moment for the whole debate and that really helped Edwards big time. Maybe Cheney is so hard because of being involved with politics. I recently saw the movie "Nixon" on the true network and he was so paranoid etc. cause he cared about what people thought about him and everything. Only thing I can think of, but one mention of his family and he's a little different.

[sr_pacifica]

19. Every bastard has his soft spot n/t

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

2. No sorry

can't go there with you. He voted against funding Meals on Wheels.

He has to be a heartless bastard to do that. So no, no sympathy from me. Why? Because he has a gay daughter? That's no reason to feel sorry for him!

[Craig Roberts]

5. I didn't say I felt sorry for him

I just said this issue seemed to expose a hint of humanity.

[CrowNotAngelGRL]

9. Didn't it just

recently come out about his daughter? Do you think he new before hand of voting on the meals on wheels? :shrug:

[Craig Roberts]

18. I don't know how long HE's known...

[deadparrot]

3. Same here.

At that point, he seemed almost depressed. I'm almost positive that he's at serious odds with * on this one.

Still, he's a cold, hateful sonuvabitch, and my so-called "bleeding heart liberalism" ran out fast.

[punpirate]

4. Don't be fooled...

... Cheney's history is full of wrong-doing, and him acknowledging a nod to his family's interests doesn't change anything.

He's not a decent human being. He's been grabbing for power and voting for the far right ever since he entered public life.

He's got the soul of a mafia hit man--even they love their family. But, they love little else.

[Craig Roberts]

8. I don't disagree

I'm just sayin'. Although we may be loathe to admit it, and although it may be rather embarrassing, even Dick Cheney is a member of the human race. I'm tellin' you, somewhere in there is a human being.

[CrowNotAngelGRL]

10. I'm sure you have to really dig deep

[Craig Roberts]

12. Yeah

And I think that's what Edwards did with his graceful words of understanding. I think he managed to make contact with that shriveled human soul inside the black armor. And, as somebody else said, it colored the debate for several minutes afterward. Cheney seemed a little off balance for a few moments.

[punpirate]

13. I don't care if he's human with regard to...

... his own. That's my point. He's been inhuman with regard to the remainder of the country, and that's why he and his ilk have to be voted out.

He's been totally consumed with the acquisition of power and control, and even he can delude himself that he did so for the benefit of his family. He's hurt many more people by his votes and his actions.

Do we measure him as someone who loves his family, or do we measure him by the manner of his public service which he sought out? Even Hitler loved his mother.

[Craig Roberts]

21. I agree with everything you are saying

As voters, we judge him by the manner of his public service, and hopefully his days of public service are soon to be over.

[sr_pacifica]

26. Wasn't it his German Shepherd that Hitler loved? n/t

[incapsulated]

17. Of course he is

He's a human being and when we make people like him out to be demons, we not only sound like fundie loons who say Kerry is the Devil, we fool ourselves into believing that the sort of behavior he indulges in is somehow a bizarre exception. "Evil" or evil acts, can be banal, and are always done by human beings.

[sr_pacifica]

22. Loathe to admit it? It's rather stating the obvious

And it has no bearing on the dark deeds he has committed. It's like making a movie to show that Herman Goebbels was human. What's the point?

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

11. Craig, what is so likable about hypocrisy?

He supports a president's platform to use the constitution to oppress at the expense of his own daughter and when he gets caught and has to answer for it both hides behind the president's divisive agenda and then says NO COMMENT?

What is to like about that? It isn't as though the safety and security of his country depends on him discriminating against his daughter.

[Craig Roberts]

15. Ok, don't get excited

I'm not saying the guy has DONE anything right. I'm saying for a moment he seemed caught off guard by his own humanity, and I was struck by it. Nothing more. He's still an evil bastard and what I'm talking about doesn't change anything. It was just an interesting moment during the debate. And it probably is important on some level to remember that we are all human, especially when we hate this man so much.

It's not something worth arguing about. It was just a weird emotional moment for me. I'm not even saying it made sense, and I'm not interested in defending it. I only wanted to share it and see if anybody else had the same reaction, which at least a couple of other people did. But I don't think anybody is suggesting it changes anything, it was just interesting.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

25. I'm really not trying to dis you

my point is if he did show an ounce of humanity..it's about time...my other point is that he was hoist by his own petard...caught in the glaring floodlights of his own hypocrisy...that's why he didn't respond...it was an act of cowardice.

[Craig Roberts]

31. I don't think

my view of it is inconsistent with it being hypocritical or cowardly.

[sr_pacifica]

14. A sincere moment, true, but

all the same, the guy doesn't have the balls to truly stick up for his daughter by publicly disagreeing with Bush.

[jayctravis]

29. I think he stuck up for her...

by conceding the point and waiving a 30 second rebuttal.

It showed where he stands. He agrees with Edwards but is tied by his party's fundie base. He said what he needed to, that he "stands by the President" though you could tell he hated it.

[sysoprock]

16. I agree.

I also noticed that.

It's like at the end of Jedi when Luke takes the mask off and sees the man underneath.

Except he immediately put the mask back on and started killing ewoks again.

[okieinpain]

20. agree, I even think he lost steam after that exchange.

[grace0418]

23. I know what you mean,

it is sad to see a trace of humanity left, like lost human potential.

However, if he really loved his daughter, he would be a better father. And a better human.

[Gemini Cat]

24. I didn't see any humanity from dick.

What I saw was a cold blooded reptilian reptile (and I apologize to all reptiles) snarling there and happily selling his daughter out for the "greater glory" of the bush and his own politics.

[babylonsister]

27. That was a nice moment for both

Cheney and Edwards. Cheney 'gave it up' for the real right wing in honor of his daughter, so he must have a shred of dignity somewhere. Unlike Shrub...

[cheezus]

28. Cheney looks like the Anikan under the Darth Vader mask

I think tonights give-in on gay marriage was an intention slap in the face of the fundie-right that the neo-cons need, but hate so much.

[TheWebHead]

30. I was kind of worried when Edwards

mentioned his daughter and being gay when the moderator wasn't that specific and neither was Cheney in the beginning of the answer, Cheney could have said someone about mentioning his daughter was uncalled for... though that may have made Cheney seem ashamed of his daughter and he had just recently for the first time talk about his daughter being gay so it wasn't unprecedented.

[Craig Roberts]

32. Yeah, that was part of it too

The drama of that moment. You were really worried for a moment where Edwards was going with it, and not sure he should be going there. You could see Cheney was thinking the same thing. But Edwards knew what he was doing, and he seemed sincere in his understanding.

[seabeyond]

33. that was a good moment for cheney

yes it was