Man fatally shoots suspected robber in Terrell park(Concealed Carry)

[WriteDown]

Source: Dallas Morning News

A 17-year-old died after trying to rob a man at gunpoint Wednesday night at a park in Terrell, police said.
100 block of Lions Club Lane

Terrell police were dispatched to Ben Gill Park in the 100 block of Lions Club Lane about 10:20 p.m. Wednesday after receiving a report of a possible robbery and shooting, said Capt. Arley Sansom of the Terrell Police Department.

A man told police that after walking his dog at the park, a group of males robbed him at gunpoint. The man, a licensed handgun carrier, pulled his weapon, shot one of the men and shot at the vehicle the men were using, Capt. Sansom said. The shooter was not injured.

Officers found Markee Lamar Johnson, 17, on the ground with serious head injuries. He was taken to a nearby hospital and later transferred to Parkland Memorial Hospital in Dallas, where he was pronounced dead.....

Read more: http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/yahoolatestnews/stories/121908dnmetterrellshooting.75e0fade.html?npc

---

Lucky this guy had a gun.

[baldguy]

1. And for every story like this, there's ten of an innocent being inadvertently killed.

[WriteDown]

3. Feel free to post the 10 gun death links caused by legal

firearms.

edited for spelling

[KansDem]

Here are two...

Friday afternoon, the 14th of November, 2007, 61 year old grandfather Joe Horn was working in his home when he heard glass breaking at his next door neighbor’s house. He investigated the sound and saw two men in the act of breaking into and then entering his neighbor's house. What happened next was a textbook example of how every American citizen should behave.

When Mr. Horn saw the two men breaking into his neighbor's house, he called 911 to alert the police. Over the next six or seven minutes, he conversed with the 911 operator as he waited for police to arrive. Mr. Horn was outraged at this act of brazen criminal behavior and rightfully so, would that every law-abiding citizen felt such outrage when a crime is being committed. Mr. Horn was absolutely determined that he was not going to allow these two criminals to escape and he told the 911 operator of his intention.

Having waited for the police to arrive, Mr. Horn then did what I would hope every citizen would do, he acted to defend his neighbor's property and very possibly his own. When he witnessed the perpetrators leaving the crime scene and it became apparent that the police would not arrive in time, Joe Horn grabbed up a pump shotgun and went outside to stop them and hold them for the police. He warned them not to move. They moved and he shot them.

--more (conservative publication)--
Houston Conservative

[TomInTib]

14. And he was judged innocent of any crime.

I would've done the same thing.

Screw 'em.

[KansDem]

17. You would have executed two suspects for B&E?

Even when the 911 dispatcher told you not to?

Really?

[WriteDown]

21. Having been the victim of a B&E...

I would have shot them both multiple times. Not even any doubt.

[frylock]

29. he wasn't a victim of b&e..

he was just some asshole itching for an excuse to execute someone. i'm all for protecting oneself, and as an owner of many guns i would excercise my right to defend my life in an instant, but this shitheel was never in any danger whatsoever.

[WriteDown]

31. I meant I wish my neighbor had done that. nt.

[KansDem]

32. May I ask, were you in your home when this B&E occurred?

I have no qualms about defending myself or my family. If you break into my house and confront me, then I put a .357 slug between your ears. No problem...

But if see two suspects crawling out of my neighbor's house so I call 911 and am told to sit tight while the police arrive, then I get impatient because the two suspects are walking away so I say I'm tired of this and I'm going to do something about it and the 911 dispatcher says no, no, just stay still the police are on the way, but I get my shotgun and go outside and tell them to stop but they don't so I pump a couple rounds into their backs, killing them. Big problem...

[WriteDown]

35. No I was not...

but my poor dog was. And my valuable reptile collection.

[TomInTib]

27. If I thought my property might be at risk, as well.

Or if the neighbor was a friend.

In Texas, one has the right to do that.

Call me overly sensitive, if you wish, but violent crimes (B&E is not like, say, simple vandalism) against persons and property really bother me.

edited due to the fact that it is still early, and I am having trouble with speeleng.

[Lucky Luciano]

111. I would have done it gleefully. nt

[DonEBrook]

119. I would execute however many criminals were B&E

Fuck a bunch of dispatchers, they are far away and safe.
:grr:

[WuzYoungOnceToo]

128. Really

"Even when the 911 dispatcher told you not to?

Really?"

Are you really such a sheep that you'd make life-and-death decisions based on instructions from a 911 flunkie, rather than your own judgement regarding the situation at hand?

[Paladin]

133. So Nice To Know Someone Like You Has Access To All The Guns He Wants

Do me a favor and stay the fuck out of my neighborhood. And enjoy your stay here at DU---however short it might be...

[Xenotime]

41. So, youre basicaly saying screw em to human life.

Thats really progressive..

[TomInTib]

46. Not all of them.

Just jerkoffs who break into people's houses and rob, rape and murder.

For some reason, I have a difficult time feeling all warm and fuzzy about that sort of scum.

In all honesty, when this account first aired, my first thought was, "Damn, if he had them on the ground, he should have knee-capped them". Give 'em something to think about, every minute of the rest of their miserable lives.

[KansDem]

48. Here's another...

Yoshihiro Hattori (服部剛丈 Hattori Yoshihiro) (November 22, 1975 - October 17, 1992) was a Japanese exchange student residing in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, United States at the time of his death. Hattori was on his way to a Halloween party and he went to the wrong house by accident. The property owner, Rodney Peairs, mortally wounded Hattori with gunfire, thinking he was trespassing with criminal intent. The controversial homicide, and Peairs' subsequent acquittal in the state court of Louisiana, received worldwide attention.

--more--
Wikipedia

Here...
Hattori and Haymaker rang the front doorbell but, seemingly receiving no response, began to walk back to their car. Meanwhile, inside the house, their arrival had not gone unnoticed. Bonnie Peairs had peered out the side door and saw them. Mrs. Peairs, startled, retreated inside, locked the door, and said to her husband, "Rodney, get your gun." Hattori and Haymaker were walking to their car when the carport door was opened again, this time by Mr. Peairs. He was armed with loaded and cocked .44 magnum revolver. He pointed it at Hattori, and yelled "Freeze." Simultaneously, Hattori, likely thinking he said "please," stepped back towards the house, saying "We're here for the party." Haymaker, seeing the weapon, shouted after Hattori, but Peairs fired his weapon at point blank range at Hattori, hitting him in the chest, and then ran back inside. (Kernodle 2002; Fujio 2004; Harper n.d.) Haymaker rushed to Hattori, badly wounded and lying where he fell, on his back. Haymaker ran to the home next door to the Peairs' house for help. Neither Mr. Peairs nor his wife came out of their house until the police arrived, about 40 minutes after the shooting. Mrs. Peairs shouted to a neighbor to "go away" when the neighbor called for help. One of Peairs' children later told police that her mother asked, "Why did you shoot him?"

The shot had pierced the upper and lower lobes of Hattori's left lung, and exited through the area of the seventh rib; he died in the ambulance minutes later, from loss of blood.<1>

The "suspect" wasn't even near the house when he was executed.

And fianally...
Peairs testified in a flat, toneless drawl, breaking into tears several times. A police detective testified that Peairs had said to him, "Boy, I messed up; I made a mistake."

The defense argued that Peairs was in large part reacting reasonably to his wife's panic. Peairs's wife testified for an hour describing the incident, during which she also broke into tears several times. "He was coming real fast, and it just clicked in my mind that he was going to hurt us. I slammed the door and locked it. I took two steps into the living room, where Rod could see me and I could see him. I told him to get the gun." Peairs did not hesitate or question her, but instead went to retrieve a handgun with a laser sight that was stored in a suitcase in the bedroom, which he said "was the easiest, most accessible gun to me."

"There was no thinking involved. I wish I could have thought. If I could have just thought," Mrs. Peairs said.<4>

The trial lasted seven days. After the jurors deliberated for three and a quarter hours, Peairs was acquitted under Louisiana's "Kill the burglar" statute.<5><1>

[Hangingon]

117. Sorry that example doesn't fly.

Two grand juries no billed Horn.

[slackmaster]

18. Bullshit

I see no point in trying to be nice about it. You pulled that figure out of your ass.

If you want to come up with a verifiable figure for something that might be worth discussing, try this:

http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/wisqars/

[baldguy]

20. There are six in posts in this thread alone.

[slackmaster]

23. Six posts of anecdotes, and no verifiable statistics

Which do not support the claim that I am calling out as Bullshit.

[krispos42]

22. For every story like this...

There are about 6,000 where a person used a gun in self-defense where the attacker did not die.


Law abiding people rarely shoot criminals because criminals don't like to confront armed people. Criminals can disengage from their criminal attempt by simply running away. Intended victims can't. This is why there are relatively few (about 200) justified homicides a year despite the large number of of defensive gun uses a year.

[RaleighNCDUer]

43. Like the guy who pulled a gun on me when i confronted him about

his road-rage driving that could have gotten both of us killed.

I demand "What the FUCK do you think you're doing? Are you TRYING to kill someone?"

and he pulls a gun.

To this day, I'm sure he thinks that gun saved his pasty ass, and uses it as an example of what you're talking about.

[Xenotime]

54. You are lucky the gun didn't go off.

This is proof that gun fundies are an accident waiting to happen.

[Endangered Specie]

57. Guns do not just 'go off'

without human input.

[krispos42]

115. Probably not

I really am not going to defend his actions. If the guy, unprovoked, behaved that way then he should be in jail for brandishing a firearm.

And I'm sorry that it happened to you. :hug:

[Endangered Specie]

52. or even wounded...

most the time, a shot is not fired when a gun saves an innocent life.

[Stellabella]

26. Yep, exactly.

I'll never understand gun nuts. Nor do I want to.

[alllyingwhores]

33. Yea...and for every story like this, there are a hundred where the armed robber...

...shoots and kills the victim. If I'm being robbed at gunpoint, I would like to be the one that walks away, not the f__ker that walks up to me and holds a gun to my head.

[WriteDown]

37. And those guns are always legal.

:eyes:

[Scout]

2. that's America for ya' ... forget due process, death penalty for property crimes! n/t

[slackmaster]

19. Robbing someone at gunpoint is not a property crime

It's a violent crime against a person.

[Xenotime]

44. Robbery is the crime of seizing property

YOU need to read the post.

[slackmaster]

100. No, simply seizing property is called "theft"

Robbery is the unlawful taking of property by force or with the threat of force.

Theft is not a violent crime. Robbery IS a violent crime, face-to-face, malum in se and all that.

Here's a link to the part of the Texas Penal Code that defines robbery, for your education. Note that it by definition involves the use of force.

http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/SOTWDocs/PE/htm/PE.29.62130.53446.htm

[WuzYoungOnceToo]

129. LOL!

You moron.

[Endangered Specie]

61. oh but I'm sure the robber was 'forced' to do it for some such reason...

how dare someone shoot him back! :sarcasm:

Why do people defend the criminal so damn much?

[slackmaster]

102. Because that criminal was someone's baby once

And for just about every baby there is a mother who will say "My baby didn't do anything wrong!"

[Gwendolyn]

74. Pointing a gun at someone is far more than a property crime.

[villager]

4. "Man Shoots, Kills Ex-Girlfriend, Turns Gun On Self"

Whoops! Someone "accidentally" forget to report all of today's gun news!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28242580/

[WriteDown]

5. Yes because a knife wouldn't accomplish the same result...

wow Dorothy, that is quite a strawman.

[villager]

7. "Guard fatally shoots ex, self at Pa. weapons plant"

Lotsa strawmen in the news today... guess you just "forgot..."

And yes, this is a *different* domestic shooting -- note: not knifing -- than the other one:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ieWbkdd14u0FyMorg4Sa59oOl7VAD95442TG0

[WriteDown]

9. So you're for removing guns from guards too? nt

[villager]

11. "Police Continue Search for Suspect Who Shot Virginia Officer, Neighbors"

Wow -- you're chockablock with strawmen today!

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,468464,00.html

[baldguy]

8. Guns make it easy to kill. That's what they're designed to do.

We rely on the shooter to choose who is a bad guy and who isn't.

And the real straw man is comparing knives to guns.

[WriteDown]

10. Knives makes it difficult?

Do a google news search for "stabs" or "stabbing."

[villager]

12. Right! Like that mass stabbing at the mall the other... oh. Never mind.

n/t

[Endangered Specie]

53. How about the one in Japan

guy knifed like a dozen people to death.

[villager]

89. Exactly -- the "one" in Japan compared to how many mass shootings here?

n/t

[Stellabella]

25. Yes, actually, they do make it more difficult.

You can run away from a knife, but it's difficult to run away from a gun. Stabbing someone takes a physical commitment and a fair amount of strength. Also, because you're physically close to the victim, it takes a certain rage and mindset.

But if I have to tell you this, it's hopeless.

[WriteDown]

30. If someone is determined...

a knife works just fine and the strength needed is really minimal. Also, guns are not hard to make. Ever hear of a zip gun?

[Tejas]

132. Tell that to the boyfri, er, EX-boyfriends

You can run away from a knife,



http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/intimates.htm

"Boyfriends were more likely to be killed by knives than any other group of intimates."

[brentspeak]

49. If a knife is such a formidable weapon

why isn't the article about a guy who used a knife to kill his attacker?

[onehandle]

78. A knife reference is the strawman.

Why not something original instead of an old NRA cliche.

How about a watermelon?

[Locrian]

6. huh?

How did the guy manage to shoot someone *while* being held up a "gunpoint"? Quick draw?

[TomInTib]

16. Probably as they were walking away with his cash.

Dumb bastards probably turned their backs on the victim.

Too bad he wasn't quicker on the trigger.

Good riddance, Markee, the world is a slightly better place without you.

[Endangered Specie]

62. Moment of distraction, maybe he swiped the attacker's gun with

one hand whilst drawing with the other.

[JeanGrey]

87. The man did the right thing.

[LeftHander]

13. good thing someone died....

for money. Guns don't kill people, money kills people.

[TomInTib]

15. Now THAT'S an effective deterrent for you.

Dear Markee won't be robbing anyone anytime soon.

[zonkers]

24. I have no problem with the victim defending his life. Shooting at the fleeing car is

another story. At that point, his life was probably not in danger. A stray bullet could have killed someone or whatever. I bet he was glad he had a gun. Probably saved his life.

[TomInTib]

28. Agreed. Shooting at the car was reckless.

Unless the car was at point-blank range (which, obviously, it was not), that was a dumb thing to do. I'll bet they don't teach that in Carry Class.

[mattfromnossa]

34. Exactly.

You can only use deadly force as a last resort because no other alternative is available to save life. Once the threat flees you are no longer in danger unless the threat is firing at you as they flee.

[slutticus]

40. It's easy to make that statement when you're not in that situation.

The word "probably" in your statement is very telling. Is it worth your life for a "probably"?

[Xenotime]

45. His life was never in danger. It was only a property crime.

[Rebubula]

58. CARNAC THE MAGNIFICENT SPEAKS!!!

Seriously, how in the world do you know the intentions of the robbers? Many people die whether they resist or not. If I was being robbed by someone with a weapon such as that...shoot first, find out intentions later. Too many assholes in this world to feel bad because some little punk exits early.

It is simple math...rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

[Endangered Specie]

64. I'm sure you'd tell the officer that if YOU were held at gunpoint

"It was just a property crime, sir..."

[remedy1]

66. Bullshit.

If someone pulls a gun on you, your life is in imminent danger.

[Xenotime]

84. What if there are no bullets in the gun??

Then there was no danger whatsoever.

[Rebubula]

85. OK

Now you are just being ridiculous.

Unless it is a revolver, there is no way to tell if it is loaded.

Unless you are just trolling - you are being a moran.

[Xenotime]

96. OH IM BEING RIDICULOUS!!!

I thought all guns have a Loaded Chamber indicator??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_chamber_indicator

NOW who's the moron?

[remedy1]

101. Yes. You are.

A loaded chamber indicator is not for the benefit of the person on the wrong end of the gun. There is no way you could see the LCI on my gun. But I can.

[Rebubula]

108. Still You....

Your link does mention that, but (as it is stated in the article) it is for the shooter.

Please continue to dig

[remedy1]

91. Right.

You are being ridiculous. If one pulls and points a gun, whether it is loaded or not, they are committing the crime of aggravated assault.

If someone points a gun at me in those circumstances, they are going to get shot.

[Hangingon]

120. Robbery attempt with a gun.

Sorry, that is life threatening.

[Tejas]

126. Point a gun at a LEO, get back to us with the results (if you live that long) nt

[WuzYoungOnceToo]

130. What part of...

..."at gunpoint" did you have the most difficult time understanding?

[Endangered Specie]

55. Monday Morning Quarterback...

no telling what the situation was, maybe a guy in the car was pointing a gun at him etc...

[slutticus]

36. Awesome. If he had a CCW, he was better trained than SF's very own police chief.

http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/local&id=6183720

Who would you rather walk through a dark park with?

[slackmaster]

39. He was also better trained than the punks who tried to rob him

That's why he was able to draw and get a shot off before they could shoot him.

[Xenotime]

47. The police chief. At least they won't be judge, jury and executioner all at the same time.

[WriteDown]

50. Instead they may just be.

Dead, dead, and dead in the same situation.

[DonEBrook]

118. Why are you defending the perp here? Are you a robber too?

:eyes:

[wartrace]

38. The kid killed himself.

If you want to live you ought not rob people at gunpoint, they just might be in the position of defending themselves. Pretty stupid thing to do in Texas. He could have gotten away with it in Wisconsin or Illinois where people (non criminals) can't carry concealed.

[slutticus]

42. They should come to SF and have a field day.

It's open season for chumps in my hood.

[Rebubula]

51. Favorite quote

I'll kill a man in a fair fight. Or if I think he's gonna start a fair fight. Or if he bothers me. Or if there's a woman. Or if I'm gettin' paid. Mostly when I'm gettin' paid

-Jayne Cobb

[Hangingon]

121. Nice quote.

I have no idea what it means in this context. But it does build post count.

[onehandle]

56. Yeah. Lucky he had a gun. Instead of the gunman losing a few bucks...

...a seventeen old kid is dead.

America! FUCK YEAH!

[Rebubula]

59. Right

Because America is the only place where gun crimes exist.

:eyes:

[Endangered Specie]

65. Sympathy for the criminal and not the victim huh....

gotta love DU.

[RaleighNCDUer]

68. A dead 17 year old IS a victim.

Even if he was committing a crime.

[Rebubula]

71. Victim

Sorry...when you put a gun in someone's face - you cease to be a victim. Anything that happens during that altercation is fair game. Again....too many violent assholes out there for me to muster up any sympathy for this one's early exit.

Now...if you would like to talk about the young man's family as being the victim - we would have a lot of common ground.

[Endangered Specie]

72. :facepalm: Would you tell him that if he were holding you up?

At what age would he no longer be a victim and a criminal? 18? 21? age is just a number and I only have sympathy for the guy who was (attempted) robbed.

[RaleighNCDUer]

79. "If a man demands your cloak, give it to him, and another besides."

I've never been robbed by anyone who needed something LESS than I did. No property is worth a life.

[Endangered Specie]

81. double :facepalm: maybe you'd like to wear a sign that says

"IF YOU NEED SOMETHING, ROB ME" then.

:eyes:

[Rebubula]

82. Do you watch the news?

Read the paper? Scan Internet stories?

People are killed every day by other people stealing from them. Sometimes the victim is not resisting and gets killed anyway. 100's of fast-food\7-11 type workers are killed every year (most of them under 25) even when they go along with demands.

Many people are not as nice as you.

Some of us will never turn the other cheek.

[RaleighNCDUer]

88. Actually, no. I don't. People who do tend to be inordinately fearful

of the world, and I do not wish to live in fear of my neighbors.

And I don't turn the other cheek. Touch me, and I'll tear you a new one or go down trying - I'm a former Marine and old habits die hard - but again, no 'stuff' is worth a life.

Incidently, hundreds every year still keeps the odds very low - 75% of murders are committed by friends and family. Stranger murders during robberies are rare. Better chance of being struck by lighting, I believe. So thinking you need to be packing 24/7 is nothing more than paranoia.

[Rebubula]

93. Actually...

I do not even own a gun. Life is life, death is death. The only thing I really fear is how my cats would get by if I died.

So...at what point will you 'tear someone a new one or go down trying'? A gun in your face? A knife to your throat? A sucker punch while you grab your wallet?

Again simple math to me - better judged by 12 than carried by 6.

I will not begrudge a man (woman) that has probably seen violence up close (going by your Marine comment) and becomes a pacifist. I just do not agree with you in this situation.

[Mike Daniels]

124. No, the victim is the person he tried to rob. The parasitic assailant was a thug

who was done in as a direct result of his attempt to victimize a innocent bystander.

[onehandle]

70. Hell no! I'd hate to lose a few bucks. I'd be mad.

And I never seem to have a gun when I'm really, really mad.

[Endangered Specie]

75. Money is one thing, but how the hell do you know that he wouldn't get jittery

and shoot you after you gave him your wallet?

I doubt the victim was mad either, probably scared shitless.

[onehandle]

80. I don't. But pull a gun and an exchange of fire is guaranteed.

The gun puller was not lucky he had a gun, he was lucky he came out on top.

Period.

[RaleighNCDUer]

92. Extremely lucky.

Only a fool would draw on someone who already has him covered.

Of course, the article doesn't mention if the robber's gun was loaded or not, which could be an explanation of how he 'outdrew' him. Doesn't mention if the thief was facing him, or running toward his car when he was shot in the head.

Maybe it wasn't 'luck' at all.

[azureblue]

98. Wrong

It depends on a person's marksmanship. Most thugs "spray" and hope to get away because the person they are shooting at ducks for cover. They can't aim a gun. A person who takes they time to learn how to shoot, practices shooting, knows the rules and how to aim and hit the target. One shot to the head or heart and there will be nor returned fire.

[onehandle]

104. Yeah. We're all Dirty Harry and the criminals are hapless targets.

What's it like to live in the two dimensional universe of an NRA brochure?

[Hangingon]

122. When the perp pulled the gun, it stopped being about money.

[Hangingon]

127. My CHL trainer stressed "do NOT get mad" in a bad situation.

Keep calm, try to get control of the situation and use your training.

[Gwendolyn]

67. Guess you've never had a gun pointed in your face, been threatened with death?

Your soul flies out of your body and everything seems like it's happening in slow motion. That alternates with your heart beating a thousand beats a minutes and huge amounts of adrenaline shooting through your body. It doesn't surprise me that someone would react by pulling out his gun afterward, and doubt he was thinking clearly. Guess it's a good idea forf 17-year-olds to stay in school and not become criminals. It tends to extend life expectancy. You know what they say "live by the gun, die by the gun."

[onehandle]

73. Yes I have. I remember my heart beating wildly.

I really miss that 40 bucks I lost.

The next day I went to the bank and withdrew 50 bucks.

[Gwendolyn]

90. Good for you. You're very brave.

I was traumatized and afraid to go out alone for over a year. I'm a coward and that's why I have empathy for other people who in the flash of a moment find themselves wondering if some scum suddenly standing in front of them with a gun will end them and leave their loved ones with a lifetime of grief and despair.

[xocet]

103. Well...

This thread is contentious as many on DU are.

Everyone has his or her own take on what is justifiable in the circumstances of the aforementioned robbery/homicide. Fine. Some people have Utopian beliefs and would care for guns to be removed from society - others have beliefs that justify any action against anyone for the slightest of reasons. One side claims statistics without adducing large-sample-size-based statistics, while the other side ignores single instances as "anecdotes" when, in reality, they are valid data points.

Your post has now rendered the argument to be one largely of pure emotion. "Your soul flies out of your body..." hardly describes any observable phenomenon, and "a thousand beats per minute..." seems to be on par with winning a "bazillion" dollars.

Clearly, emotions rule the revenge shooting you write about: "...by pulling his gun out afterward, and doubt he was thinking clearly."

Finally, the moralizing comes in to cap the emotional argument - npi.

So, your posted argument is:

Emotion
Emotion
Emotion
-------
Conclusion
Moral
Aphorism

Now, that is a form of "valid argument" that I am unfamiliar with. It seems to be neither empirical nor rational.

I suppose you win - as they say "live by the post, die by the post."

[onehandle]

106. Welcome to DU.

That was pretty "thinky" for the likes of this place.

:)

[Gwendolyn]

107. I'm simply capable of putting myself in someone else's shoes.

Having been the victim of a violent crime involving a gun, and judging by my own reaction, I can easily visualize a myriad of possibilities for the outcome of such a crime, including a victim possibly overreacting.

And yes, when guns and threat to life meet, emotions run high and all kinds of shit happens, as someone else sagely commented.

[razors edge]

69. The "gunman" lost his life.

The law abiding citizen protected his, and most likely other, law abiding citizens lives.

[remedy1]

83. A few bucks??

How about his life?

Anyone who pulls a gun to rob someone indicates by that action that he is willing to use it. It is very likely that this POS would have shot the man anyway.

I am as liberal and non violent as one can be. Nonetheless, I have a CCW and I carry a weapon. I have had excellent training. If someone pulls a gun or any other weapon on me, I assume they mean to kill me and they will get shot, and they will not survive.

I have no qualms about protecting my self, my home, and my loved ones.

Good for this guy, one less criminal in the world.

[onehandle]

86. Why stop at one less criminal?

Automatic death penalty for all criminals.

Thin out their ranks real fast.

[RaleighNCDUer]

94. I am as liberal and non violent as one can be.

I am a former Marine, and have no fear of weapons. But I will not carry one.

No property is worth a life.

So maybe you are NOT as non-violent as one can be, if you are so willing to KILL.

[remedy1]

99. I agree.

No property is worth a life.

So, steal my property when I'm not around, if you really want it.

However, come into my home or car when it is occupied, or confront me or my loved ones with a deadly weapon when I am minding my own business, and you will likely get shot and killed.

I am perfectly willing to protect myself and loved ones. If I have to use deadly force I will without hesitation should the need arise.

I would not ever want to do so, but but I will.

That doesn't make me a violent person. I do not CHOOSE violence, only respond to it.

[Mike Daniels]

123. Sometimes people end up dead even when they do what the assailant wants

But keep on apparently siding with the dead "victim".

[WuzYoungOnceToo]

131. Fixed your post for you

"...a seventeen old thug with no regard for the rights of others, and who threatened the life of a citizen is dead."

You're welcome.

[JeanGrey]

60. Good. That is why we have guns for protection.

May the man not be hassled over this.

[Endangered Specie]

77. A lot of people here would like to see him hanged probably...

:eyes:

[marshall]

63. Here is another version of the story

http://www.terrelltribune.com/articles/2008/12/18/news/doc494a936dcd468737227011.txt

The thieves had a gun as well as the victim. I do wonder why he shot at the car--maybe he had reason to believe they were going to shoot at him from the car. I've been to this park, there really isn't anyplace to hide and a road runs down the middle of it. A pedestrian could be easily shot at from a car.

[Shardik]

76. "The incident was one of three separate armed robberies police responded to between 8 and 10 p.m. "

It seems as there is an easy avenue to acquire guns in Terrill.

[RaleighNCDUer]

114. The one he shot had a gun.

The others he shot at as they were running away.

Not quite the same thing.

[opihimoimoi]

95. Lamar paid the price of confronting the wrong victim. Did he deserve to die...?

Some say yes...and others...no...not for a few bucks...

But when Lamar and others who flash a weapon during robbery...it means "Give me what I want or you die/get hurt"

Its a series threat.....

and sometimes series shit happens....

He should been home doing homework instead of robbing peeps

This is one of them cases where shit happened...

[azureblue]

97. a person who uses a gun to commit a crime

is basically saying- "do what I tell you to do I will kill you". Ergo- they don't care about the victim or the victim's life. In my eyes when a gun is used to commit a crime the criminal relinquishes his right to life, and it becomes a matter of the victim choosing to defend or preserve his or her life by any means necessary. Once the criminal's gun is displayed then the crime becomes a matter of survival. And, to me, the criminal with the gun also loses his status as a person and becomes a predator- a killer or person with intent to kill.

I had a gun stuck my face over a few bucks- it was amazing to me that this thug was willing to kill me over about $35.00, and he threatened to kill me when he found out I didn't have any more money than that. I feared for my life and, if I had a gun, I would have shot him in the head.

[Javaman]

105. The Wild West. nt

[old mark]

109. One less criminal.

Should have shot the rest of them, too.
If you chose to rob someone, you take your chances. He lost. Fuck him.

Would you have been happier if the robbers had killed the guy walking his dog?

mark

[Lucky Luciano]

110. To the robbery victim: Good on ya Mate!

Nice shot. One less worthless piece of shit on the streets.

I have the same attitude. If someone tries to rob me, then I have license to kill them - Period.

[Xenotime]

112. Unbelieveable the attitude I'm reading.

This thread really sounds like a RW forum.

We elect Obama and throw our progressive values out the window?

[CRF450]

113. This aint about RW BS, its about common sense.

Anyone that pulls a gun on you is putting your life in imminent danger, their hardly anyway to tell if there going shoot you anyways or just run off. The would be robber in the OP should have thought things through more carefully, he dug his own grave and deserved it.

[Tejas]

125. So you APPROVE of giving criminals a license to rob/rape/murder?

Your attitude is not progressive, it's suicidal.

[jerry18340]

116. gun troubles.?!

Just observing some comments and felt I should interject my position as well. Some people say he should have not had a gun, although, he is lucky he did. The four suspects had at least one gun, therefore, he was in danger. Put yourselves in the victim's or should I say victor's shoes and decide what you would have done.. It's a trick question, you can't possibly have a logical answer. You were not there!!! Maybe everyone should stop trying to outlaw guns and figure out a way to teach proper gun safety and care. If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. With the economy and the world in the situation it is in, police departments are laying off officers every day, and more people are resorting to extremes to provide, you do the math. I'm not happy that a child is dead but I can only imagine, 1: the victim was killed, 2: the gangs, (yes they were a gang) got away unidentified, and the escalation of crime and possible murder this would have led to.
If you read the entire story before replying, you would know that this was the last of several robberies for this kid. Only one incident to consider for all of the gun haters out there. I will always own guns, and I will always respect the dangers of owning those same guns, which are fewer and smaller dangers than if I had no guns at all...