CBC: Liberal, NDP insiders talk merger

[tuvor]

Senior insiders with the federal Liberals and New Democrats have been holding secret talks about the possibility of merging their parties to form a new entity to take on the Conservatives, CBC News has learned.

Many Liberal insiders confirmed that discussions between the two parties are not just focused on forming a coalition after an election or co-operation before one, but the creation of a new party.

The new party would possibly be named the Liberal Democrats and there has been tentative talk about what a shared platform would look like and an understanding that a race would be required to choose a new leader.

"Serious people are involved in discussions at a serious level," Warren Kinsella, a former adviser to former prime minister Jean Chrétien, told CBC News.

...

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2010/06/08/liberal-ndp-new-party.html

[Clintonista2]

1. Very happy about this

It's exciting.

[Arrowhead2k1]

2. It's about damn time.

I hope it's not led by Iggy though. He needs to go.

[shockedcanadian]

3. Herein lies the problem...

MR.Ignatieff knows that such a merger would probably require him to step down. Layton is the obvious choice as he is most popular and would most certainly win an election in a merged party. Where would this leave Mr. Ignatieff? Therefore, you can be sure that many people will closely surround Ignatieff and keep his focus on NOT merging. Therefore, the election will remain a split and Conservatives will remain this countries government. He would have to ask himself and his party what is most important, maintaining a seperate and independent party, with their own views and a constant runner up for the foreseeable future, or, merging as one and having the leading party in power.

Of course, if he was comfortable with a slightly smaller role in a coalition (or possibly a 1-2 combo as in England) than the future is there's to grasp. This merger would also benefit the Green Party as it would establish them as the most left of centre of the available parties. Hey, I am all for different opinions and election options (even though I have never voted in my life), most importantly, I am all for even power of the parties and seeingf smaller grassroot parties like the Green Party gain seats. I don't want to see a clear majority for anyone, this ensures there are some checks and balances in place with the opposition and their constituents having some input.

I say don't hold your breath. This really and truly comes down to Mr. Ignatieff and he doesnt seem willing to cede any power. Right now his opinion of this coalition talk is that it is "absurd".

[RedSock]

4. gotta be a coaliton, not a merger

no way on earth layton destroys his party forever to take a back seat to michael "i love torture" ignatieff, who is a far worse leader than dion.

[Spazito]

5. I think, if the two parties do merge as they should (imo), the leader...

should be 'new', neither Ignatieff nor Layton, someone without 'baggage' each of the current leaders carry when it comes to the supporters of each party, Liberal, NDP, imo.

[Fallenserpent]

6. this is going to be a failure

If these two parties merge,they will become a watered down version of themselves. The NDP will no longer be a socialist party, and the Liberals will be far less a neo-liberal capitalist party.

The good thing is that the core NDP supporters, the social democrats in this country... will turn away from this new party, and hopefully start a new social Democrat party that isn't willing to sell it's core values away just to get into power in Ottawa.

If the NDP really consider this in the next election... I'll be voting Green... out of protest.

[shockedcanadian]

7. A failure in what way?

It seems clear to me that they would win the election if they merged, probably a majority. The Conservatives and Canadian Alliance merged with obvious success and there is nothing to suggest anyone lost their foundation with their policies.

There is no doubt though, that the Conservatives do not want this merger to occur, it would essentially eliminate them from power in one swoop. It's that simple really.

[Fallenserpent]

15. failure

the PC and Alliance were both right wing capitalists. The Liberals are also right wing capitalists with a slightly more center position when it benefits them in the polls. The NDP are social democrats, that at their core oppose capitalism. This is oil and water.


The Conservatives and the Liberals are a far better match to form a merger. They have a lot in common, and are currently in a quiet coalition. I see the government currently being run by the cons, with lib support. sorry for not being more specific in my personal view.

[Metric System]

9. THIS is why the Harper Cons will likely remain in power for years to come. Ugh.

[BolivarianHero]

14. Yep...

Greedy, corrupt Liberals like the patronage trough so much that they would rather exchange majorities with Conservatives than fix our electoral system and share power with New Democrats and Greens.

Even the BQ is better than either of the major parties; it's more pro-Canada to stand up for Quebec than to bend over for Washington.

[CHIMO]

8. Ignatieff, Layton squelch ‘ridiculous’ coalition rumours

Michael Ignatieff and Jack Layton categorically rejected rumours on Wednesday that the Liberals and the NDP are considering any sort of coalition.

Flanked by Liberal MPs. Bob Rae and Domenic Leblanc, Mr. Ignatieff emerged from his party’s weekly caucus meeting to discount reports that senior Liberals were discussing the merger with senior members of the NDP.

NDP Leader Jack Layton dismissed as “fiction” reports of merger talks between his party and the Liberals.

“It looks like Liberals talking to Liberals,” he said. “It’s not credible. To have a discussion, you need to have two sides, two participants, and we don’t have that. ... Nobody’s assigned to talk to anybody about these topics.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/ignatieff-layton-squelch-ridiculous-coalition-rumours/article1597836/

Conclusions:
Iggy and Jack are not talking to each other.
Iggy and Jack are not insiders.

[shockedcanadian]

10. This was a fairly obvious conclusion...

The Conservatives had the will and desire to find a way to win the election, they swallowed their pride and recognized how bleak their chances were without a coalition. I do not think that the NDP and Liberals have the same foresight at this point in time, once the polls show that they are both obviously trailing far behind they may reconsider, but it would have to be an 11th hour decision. Most certainly the Conservatives will be winning the next election, and probably a couple more in the foreseeable future as if no other party can gain traction under these circumstances, what will they be able to do when times are good and controversies are lower?

There is noone on this board who has a bigger issue with this current government in regards to their accountability than I do. I have faced it first hand and I know all too well how much this country has changed, we are no longer that sweet innocent progressive nation which focuses on the rule of law, humanitarian causes and justice; at the very least if we do, it's in a massive decline from years past. In fact, the government doesn't even hide their disdain for anything that isn't economically based, period, and Canadians agree with them.

Noone on this board or elsewhere, myself included, can deny that they have "played the political game" successfully. Using classic tactics that work, especially when people are having difficulty as alot of Canadians are now. They realize what it takes to get votes. I do not agree with the manner in which they govern, but many more do agree with it, so I suppose I am in the minority. Their position on issues and accountability will not change until enough heat is put under their asses, that will only happen if they have a threat to their re-election. The only threat that would pose this would be a merger, in fact, they could replace both the Liberal and NDP leaders and put someone new in the leadership role and the Conservatives would probably lose against a coalition. It ain't happening.

[CHIMO]

11. Liberals' Apps discussed NDP merger: Kinsella

In a sworn affidavit, Liberal Party strategist Warren Kinsella says the party's president, Alfred Apps, told him in May about "high level" discussions with NDP officials about the "creation of a new party."

The document comes amid fierce denials by leaders of both parties of a CBC News report that the Liberals and NDP have been holding secret talks about possibly merging to form a new entity to take on the Conservatives.

Kinsella, who was an adviser to former prime minister Jean Chrétien, writes that he took "detailed notes" of his conversation with Apps and was surprised when Apps told him there was "a lot of interest in merger in the NDP."

He said Apps told him the NDP would have to comply with three conditions: renouncing socialism and embracing a mixed-market economy, accepting Michael Ignatieff as leader, and having senior party "saints" such as Ed Broadbent and Roy Romanow promote the concept.

http://www.cbc.ca/politics/story/2010/06/09/liberals-ndp-merger-kinsella.html
No serious discussions?

[shockedcanadian]

12. What odds would you place on this?

Really Chimo, I am not being a smart-ass, just an honest question, in your heart of hearts. You are more politically astute than most, certainly more than me, do you think it is a viable option with the current line-up of leaders and/or egos? I think the Conservative party has even rubbed off on some of these guys, they know they are being bullied and don't want to feel they are "giving up", thats how I view thier opinion of what a merger represents (very much a personal opinion gleened without science, just the change I have seen and heard from these leaders over the last year).

Michael Iggy might be a very intelligent man, probably more book smart than any of the party leaders, but the public does not gravitate to him. Layton in my opinion would be the best choice, and to be honest I never looked at the NDP as "socialist". Yes, maybe more socially focused than other parties, but we are not losing capitalism anytime soon, hell I would run against him if I thought this was his ideology.

The left has lost it's will, the morale in historically left supporting areas of the country is at a low, while Alberta is still doing well thanks to the oil resources there. Again, I am just an unvoting, take-no-sides type of person, though I have leanings in all directions depending on the issue, but I can objectively say that this bunch, especially with the move of parties from Rae (an obvious move for his own gain based on what he sees as the better party to hit paydirt with; i.e PM perhaps?) does not appear to understand how far behind they truly are. There has just been more than $1 BILLION dollar spent on a three day event, there is public outrage per se, yet, I saw a recent poll that suggested that there was nary a peep of movement in party voting allegiance AFTER this fact was made public.

I see this as a situation in which NONE of the parties are particularly trusted or strongly supported (this was shown to be true in a recent large scale poll about Canadian dismay with politicians of late) and therefore people are running to the "safest" bet.

[CHIMO]

13. Hard

To put odds on it at this point. I do know that there are factions that want to block Harper. They are willing to do what is possible.

I do not know the size of the movement but I know that it has had movement since at least the beginning of this year.

Between merger, co-operation and coalition. Well it probably depends on how things fall out.

All that I can say at the moment is that anyone that contributes to the NDP or the Liberals utilize the power they have in getting rid of Harper.