Pink Triangulation

[kenny blankenship]

It seems clear now that Obama plans to push Gays -along with Anti-War folks, etc.- far away from him, and out of his party, probably so he can triangulate against us. This looks like a bid to capture the Church-goin' vote, which has long been the voting base of the Republican Party. Unfortunately, we are the lambs that must be offered to lure that monster to the Democratic Party.

What will our best response to this strategy be should it continue to develop and unfold in the way it has so far?

If you mobilize protest, you risk providing the target he seeks for his triangulation. He will point out our "outbursts" and "spectacles" as the "extreme" which all right-thinking Americans must stand with him to resist. We'd be making it easy for him to use us further. On the other hand if you do nothing you'll get nothing, or worse. He's made it plain he doesn't give a shit whether we contribute to his coalition, so keeping quiet sure as hell isn't going to work.

Do we boycott- withdraw support from Obama and his wing, from the Democratic Party entirely?
What do we do?

[ikojo]

1. I know I will not continue to

champion Obama if he continues the rightward shift of the Democratic Party. He NEEDS to hear from us. To let up on the anti-war groups and others who oppose his center right agenda.

[GreenPartyVoter]

2. I just have to say that Subject Title is very clever :^)

[Glorfindel]

3. It probably doesn't matter

there aren't enough of us to make a difference, anyway.

[PFunk]

6. Actually it does matter.

Like it or not we progressives (which gays are a part of) are a big part of the dems base. And the dems can't win unless they have enough of us on board.

[yardwork]

18. And, more importantly to Obama, individuals can't win without our support.

Obama convinced me that Donnie McClurkin was a mistake he wouldn't repeat, and I threw myself into supporting Obama over his competitor in the primaries.

Politicians don't really care about their party. They care about *themselves.* Their own personal success or failure is what drives them.

Yeah, we helped put Obama in the White House and I'm still pretty sure that he was the best candidate of the ones from which we had to choose, but I'll be redoubling my efforts to make sure that there are more progressive candidates next time.

[Creideiki]

7. 5-7% of the vote

Look at where the vote was in that range, and that's what we control and where we have power. Just if it's subtraction, that's an effect.

[LostinVA]

11. Along with many parents and friends

[yardwork]

17. It's not just us, though. We are part of a progressive coalition.

Look around DU and straight supporters of GLBTQ rights are everywhere. There's about a dozen loud obnoxious posters, and the rest are on the side of human rights.

Most reasonable people recognize that gay rights are human rights, as are worker's rights, the right to religious freedom, the right to constitutional protections, the right not to be dragged into a pointless war, etc.

The old accusation that gay rights are "special rights" has no resonance anymore, not when constitutions are being amended to deny us rights. It's clear what this is about to any thinking person.

If people were as angry with Obama during the primary as they are today, then he wouldn't have won the nomination. Obama does need us. We need to remember that and continue to demand that human rights be respected. Pay no attention to those attempting to shut us up.

[Maven]

4. This may be the last Democratic election I participate in. And a massive boycott may be in order.

Depending on what happens in the next year or so.

[PFunk]

5. If he does what you day then the dems will get a nasty surprise in '10

And not a good one either as those Obama pushes out wont be their to vote dem in the next election. Say what you want about the repugs (and I can say a lot). But at least they don't abandon their base like dems do. So right now i say it's time to start putting Obama's feet to the fire and force him to listen to the dems progressive base if they want our votes in '10.

[Libertas1776]

8. triangulation? boycott?...

All of this because of a 5 minute speech? Yes, do not get me wrong, I think it is a horrible choice (Rick Warren) and he still has time to change his mind, which I hope he does. But all this talk of an ultimate betrayal really bothers me, I mean come on the guy is not even president yet and people are ready to have his head on a silver plate.

In a perfect world, Obama would be the most perfect, liberal, just president doing right by our kind all the time. But in the world of pragmatic politics, things do not always go that way. Like it or not, there is a sizable majority of fucktard conservatives that won't goo away, and if Obama truly wants to stay in power, occasionally he will have to pander in some ways.
Look at FDR, the most venerated of POTUS' on this board, and his history.
Numerous times there were anti-lynching bills put forth in congress, and every time FDR was forced to oppose them. Why? The freaking Southern Democrats, thats why. He would have wanted to pass those bills, I know Eleanor certainly wanted him to, but if he wanted to stay in power, he had to pander to these southern asswipes. In a perfect world, FDR could have vetoed those bills right away, but in the real world things are just not so. Don't get me wrong I would have wanted him to pass those bills, but if he did you can rest assure their would have been no more FDR in 1936, 40, or 44 and no one to guide us in the second world war.


I am gay and I voted for Obama and I still believe he will do good by us and the idea of some conspiratorial triangulation is ridiculous. I know this man wants to help us but their will be times when he must tread carefully. What would you prefer, he turn his back to the more conservative people in this country (In my perfect world he would) but in the real world he just can't or we won't have a Democratic president to help us anymore. What would you honestly want, another Republican, how about Sarah Palin or Mitt Romney then see how our rights will go.

Go ahead, chew me apart cause I know I just pissed off a hell of a lot of people. I must be some kind of self hating gay or something, willing to believe anything. Well I am not. I am not going to blindly follow Obama and I will make sure he takes a straight and narrow path, and if he doesn't I will speak out. Obama's choice of Warren is outright wrong and we must protest it, but my god people, must we throw this man under the bus before he is even inaugurated. If we are already picking him apart, imagine what the other side will do.

[LostinVA]

12. Is that you, Uncle Liza???

Gay my ass.

[bluedawg12]

14. Or, just a gay ass?

Uncle Liza. :rofl:

[Libertas1776]

21. ...

Oh yes, I see how it is. I disagree with you, probably very young people, and you bite my head off. Go ahead, make your petty labels like "uncle liza" and be divisive. You know nothing of the life that I lived and the struggles I have faced for what I am. I thought this board was for open minded progressives, not small minded idiots. Go ahead, label me and others like me uncle liza just as straight people have called me a faggot for who I am.

[bluedawg12]

13. So now gays are truly "left behind"

The fame and money driven life.



>>May 16, 2007 10:27 AM
A Real Compassionate Conservative
Jerry Falwell was one of the giant figures who towered over the 20th-Century American church. While most people knew him as the founder of the Moral Majority, the face of the Religious Right, and by some of his more controversial statements, many saw only his opponent’s caricature of the real man.

The story was never told about his compassionate heart, his gentle spirit, his enormous sense of humor, and the millions he invested in helping the underprivileged. Jerry founded the Elim Home for alcoholics, the Center for tutoring inner city children, the Hope Aglow ministry to prisoners, Liberty Godparent Home for unwed mothers, and literally dozens of other compassion projects to help the poor, the sick, and others in desperate need.

I believe Jerry Falwell’s primary legacy will not be his political leadership, but the church he pastored for 50 years; the university he founded that has produced two generations of leaders; the millions who heard him preach the Good News; the innovations in ministry he introduced; and the thousands of young pastors, like myself, whom he constantly encouraged, even when we did it differently.

Posted by Rick Warren <<

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/rick_warren

:grr:

[beaglelover]

15. Finally!

A voice of reason around here! Good post!!

[t0dd]

27. I appreciate your comments..

I think Obama made a very poor decision, but I don't think we should abandon him just yet. He still has many opportunities to defend us. Yes, in an ideal world Obama would ignore the conservative bigots of this country, but that can't happen just yet. Let's give him some time..

[Zuiderelle]

9. No one will get another penny from me or a minute of my time until they support our rights.

[bluedawg12]

10. Protests, boycotts, activism on the inter net

are useful to keep our message out there.

It's working in so far as there is media coverage (good and bad) and there is rising political awareness.

The worst thing to do would be to STFU, fade away and do the bigots a favor by becoming invisible.

I am remaining a Democrat because it is an existing political frame work from which to work from the inside.

They are in power - but we need to hold them accountable to their promises and principles.

I will however, spend my time, my volunteering, and my funds for those causes and candidates that support gay civil rights.

[yardwork]

16. This is how Obama used Donnie McClurkin to win the SC primary and the nomination.

I hoped that Obama wouldn't do it again, but he has. I agree that it is a cynical manipulation of voters based on numbers and demographics. Obama wants the religious right on his side, and to do so he will cater to them, because he figures that progressives have nowhere else to go.

This pattern of U.S. politicians catering to the lowest common denominator instead of showing true leadership and courage is what has gotten us in the mess we're in now.

I'm not going to support Obama in this wrong-headed approach and I'd feel that way even if I were straight. Supporting Republicans is clearly not an option.

My only option, as I see it, is to refuse to be cowed by the people yelling at me to to sit down and shut up. I'm going to continue to make noise and insist that elected officials pay attention to human rights, worker's rights, and the environment.

Obama didn't need me in South Carolina, but he sure as hell needed me in my home state of North Carolina, where I voted for him in both the primary and the general election and contributed money.

[bluedawg12]

19. Power always has to be monitored carefully.

The last guy didn't listen to anyone and did what he wanted to do.

I hope this next one, doesn't listen to everyone and then does exactly what he wanted to do anyway.

POTUS is too powerful of a position to ever be left unquestioned.

Speak truth to power.

As far as gay civil rights, it will be fought for by gays and our allies. It's certainly not going to be handed to us and the notion that we are bridging anything by bringing a bigot to the podium to celebrate the man we voted for as Democrats and progressives, when that bigot has done nothing to amend his views is the wrong message.

[yardwork]

20. Some of Obama's supporters are developing a bit of a God complex.

Any criticism of Obama is perceived as a personal affront by a number of Obama's supporters. This is not healthy for his presidency and Obama would do well to tone down the divisive rhetoric that some of his supporters are using. Telling progressives to sit down and shut up is not winning Obama any friends on either side of the aisle. The religious right will never support Democrats unless we capitulate to their heterosexist patriarchal war-waging agenda, and if we do that we are worse than them because we've betrayed our party's platform.

[bluedawg12]

23. It's very dangerous to fall into a cult of personality.

That's not what I imagine Obama himself would want.

There is a big difference between being able to stand back from a dispute about policy, or tactic and taking it as another attack on our dear leader. Again, some supporters don't seem to be able to step back.

[readmoreoften]

26. They are seriously looking for an enlightened dictator. It's frightening when you think of it.

It's almost as if celebrity worship and conservatism is turning us into a servile nation in search of an action hero. When I see people praising him for having "no ideology" that's what terrifies me the most. He just "does what's right." RIGHT BY WHOM? FOR WHAT PURPOSE? This isn't a goddamn action movie or a feel-good drama. You can't put labor and capitalism in a room and expect them to get along. You can't put high school kids from the Bronx in a Klan Ceremony for the sake of "cultural harmony."

Seriously. People always blame the "dictators". I blame the people. The people are failing. We see it here every day.

[libnnc]

29. I'm with you.

I gave him a chance (more than once). I argued to "wait and see" during the most heated times in the primaries. My partner and I gave money (lots of money) to the Obama campaign.

I'm astonished that after Prop 8, he is either so tone deaf that he didn't realize what the backlash would be, or he just doesn't give a shit. This election is not ordinary--it is historic and symbolic. And because it is so unprecedented, every detail of the transition, including the inauguration, is also symbolic and historic.

To give a bigot like Warren a platform--the HONOR of delivering an invocation is unforgivable.

[racaulk]

22. It's a lot to think about with a lot of unknowns, but there is one thing I *do* know.

Barack Obama is the final candidate to say "I think marriage is between one man and one woman" and still get a contribution from me. Not one red cent from my pocket will go to any more politicians that do not place value on my civil rights, but only see me as a means to get elected. Neither will I volunteer, make phone calls, canvass, or spend any more of my valuable time helping to elect candidates that publicly state the same.

As of right now, on the national level the Democrats have a claim on my vote, and only that. Judging by the way they are going, that hold is only tenuous at best.

Going forward, I will spend my money and time on more local candidates who are progressive and make LGBT issues a priority (not that there are many of those in Georgia, but still). Focusing my efforts on more local races seems to be a more effective way to make my voice heard.

The national Democrats, going forward, can suck it until they get their collective heads out of their asses and start showing some leadership, at long last.

I'm willing to change my mind based on what Obama and the Congress are able to accomplish over the next four years, but this latest development doesn't leave me too hopeful.

The Democrats do not need to pander to religious ideologues to get elected or maintain power. By compromising on this, they compromise who they are, and the resulting damage this inflicts on me and those I love is palpable. I will no longer hold an active role in maintaining my second class citizenship.

[readmoreoften]

24. I believe that we need to team up with disgruntled labor to start the Egalitarian Party

Many labor folks feel disenfranchised by their leaders. The strikers who just won in Chicago were from a radical union (I'm almost positive it's outside the AFL-CIO.) We need to stand strong with left-leaning labor. Almost all of these folks are pro-LGBT. I believe that those who aren't can be won over if we fight alongside them.

I'll vote for local Democrats, but over the past 8 years the party's lack of leadership on civil rights and bread-and-butter justice issues has wholehearted pushed me elsewhere.

I don't think "environmentalism" is a strong enough platform for America (maybe when the Statue of Liberty is under a glacier, but not a day sooner will it happen...) so I think the Green Party is silly. The Socialist Party won't happen because of our history and because of leftist history.

I vote for the Egalitarian Party. The party of civil rights and workers rights. The party of the people.

[David Zephyr]

25. kenny, I was going to post tomorrow about how early Obama has begun triangulating.

Your kenny "Pink Triangulation" was better than anything I could have come up with.

Obama is playing the card that Dick Morris taught to Bill Clinton: triangulation.

Who'd have ever thought Obama would begin it so soon and that we would be his victim.

[Sub Atomic]

28. Regardless of the legality, my 2 cats plus the 6 stray/feral cats that I care for

are now deductions.

Taxation without representation led to revolt before.

I say it's time again.

Why do I have to bankroll institutional discrimination?