My "experimental" no-knead rye is about 10 minutes from going into the fridge

[Lucinda]

It seems to be rising pretty well.
Not as much as the normal base recipe does, but so far so good. And it smells great!

I halved the Artisan in 5 recipe and used 3/4c dark rye flour in addition to the AP, and a bit more water.

Also added 2T of molasses, some caraway seeds, and a bit of dill. Wish me luck!?

[hippywife]

1. Keep us posted.

We love a good caraway rye, as I've already mentioned. :9

[Lucinda]

2. Will do! The molasses fragrance is STRONG - perhaps I should have tried 1T first? But I love

molasses-y things, so we shall see.... :)

[troubleinwinter]

3. Oh boy oh boy!

I sure do want to try rye. I am a rank bread amateur. I love molasses, too. You'll have to walk me through the "a bit more water" part.

I had HAPPY SUCCESS!!!! My 5 min Artisan I thought needed more rest time than 40 mins because of my very, VERY cold fridge. Today I let it rest about an hour +. Perfecto! Made all the difference. It baked/browned in 30 minutes (rather than 45) and the crust was much more tender, thinner and crispy, the interior less heavy. I felt the floured loaves were looking dull and sad, so I painted with egg wash to help browning and add some gloss. Very pretty.

[Lucinda]

4. Excellent! I'm so glad you had great results. It's an addictive thing. I cant stop making bread now.

This recipe is so forgiving. It rocks! The egg wash is a great idea! I may try that on the rye. I use the 40 minute rest time before baking as a guideline more than an absolute.
I've always baked the bread at 450 degrees for 30 minutes.

My first batch. - I followed the water amount stated in the recipe and it turned out perfectly.
My second batch - with bread flour instead of All Purpose, looked too dry to me so I threw in about another half cup of water. It was a great batch.

Today, I made half a batch with all purpose and another half batch with All Purpose and rye. Both batches looked too dry again, so I added about a half cup of extra water to each. IMO the air temp in the house (and moisture levels) can effect the amount of liquid needed.

Since this dough isn't fussy it can handle a little tweaking and still turn out beautifully.

I also let the doughs rise 5 hours today before I put them in the fridge. I've been varying the times from batch to batch to see what difference that initial rise time makes to the finished product.

I'll be baking a loaf of the rye later tonight. I'll taste test and post a pic then!

[troubleinwinter]

5. Thanks! When I get me ahold of some rye,

I'll have a guideline to go by. I live in the high mountains (a mile high) of Arizona. It is cool but dry. Potato chips stay fresh forever, but you have to eat a sandwich immediately.

When I put the batch in the 5 qt. container to rise, it came to the tippy-tippy-top of the container in two hours (then went to about 3/4 in the fridge). Supposedly the altitude (lack of air pressure) makes things rise a lot here. Five hours sounds really scary! Hahaha! "The Base That Ate The House".

Yesterday I was talking to my dad (who lives across town) on the phone. He asked how the bread effort was working out. I told him I was still working it out. He said, "I sure do like rye bread." Do you think he might have been dropping hints?

[Lucinda]

6. LOL Certainly sounds like a hint to me! I live in the mountains too. We're not so high that

I have to think about adjusting recipes though. I went with the full rise time today because my house had to be aired out after I burned a cranberry reduction at lunch time. That was a smelly mess! So it was cold in here, and then I cranked up the heater for a while, and then the air was sort of dry when I started the bread...

I decided to bake the rye in the morning. I want to see what happens to the molasses-y-ness after a night in the fridge. If the flavor is good I'll be happy, but it smells a lot like one of my favorite molasses crisp cookie recipes right now. I may drop the molasses down to 1 T or omit it next time if it doesn't turn out yummy enough.

[troubleinwinter]

7. My oven is old and poorly insulated (so's my house)

so I've taken to scheduling my baking for when I'd otherwise turn the heater on to warm the house!

Paint that little puppy with egg, it will make him pretty!

[Lucinda]

8. Smart way to combine tasks!

We prefer the house cool, I don't feel well with forced heat, so we usually have a window cracked open somewhere.

I'll try the egg! It may taste lousy but at least it will be pretty!

[Lucinda]

9. It's formed and on the counter, will pop it in the oven in an hour.

Looks good!

[Lucinda]

10. Report and Photos (sorry for the blurry pics!)

My eyes are a bit weak today and I couldnt seem to get good pics, but close enough!

The dough at the end of its initial rise after mixing:


The loaf out of the oven:




Cut:


Sorry again for the blurry pics! I thought they were "ok enough" to give a general impression of the results. :)


The flavor and texture were great.
The molasses worked well. It isn't overpowering when it bakes, and I think it added a little complexity to the flavor.

This didn't rise as much as the dough normally does, maybe the molasses bogged it down a bit?
All in all it's pretty good, though I am going to try the original rye recipe that sazemisery posted next time.

[troubleinwinter]

11. Oh! Thank you for these!

You say it didn't rise as much. But you did add (rye) flour and water to the basic. Do you think one should add a tad of yeast?

Remember, my dad is waiting for his hinted-for rye bread. He must be pretty interested in getting it, as he showed up at my door with a present for me today: a small book, "The Constitution of the United States with the Declaration of Independence and the Articles of Confederation".

[Lucinda]

12. I substituted 3/4 cup of the all purpose flour with the rye flour and followed the

regular recipe (yeast water salt etc), adding the molasses, dill, caraway and a little extra water. My OP is very unclear about that, sorry!

That was for a half batch. Will list the correct recipe amounts in the following post.

[Lucinda]

13. *****Corrected recipe -------- This is for a half batch of rye:*****

3/4 cup - dark rye flour
2 1/2 cup - all purpose flour
1 package yeast (3/4t to 1 tablespoon if you're measuring)
3/4 tablespoon salt
1 1/2 c warm water*****
2 Tablespoons molasses
Dried dill weed
caraway seeds

*****I added an additional 1/2 cup water to the 1 1/2c listed above because it needed it. You might not need any extra.

[troubleinwinter]

14. THANK YOU!!!!

I had overlooked the dill in the OP. Yessirree... that sounds gooood.

I DID try to get rye flour today. My two nearest grocery stores do not carry it. AND they do not carry caraway seed! I'm not aware of stores here that might have it.

As I was preparing to move here about three years ago, my dad (who's lived here longer) said, "Now, remember... this is a one-horse town." I just adore it here, except I cannot get sour-dough bread, decent Japanese food, rye or caraway.

I may just get it online. Bob's Red Mill has it, I know.

[Lucinda]

15. Thats the brand I have. The little package of the dark rye. Weird about the caraway.

I can relate though. I'm in a tourist town and the grocery store doesn't carry a wide variety of items that long term residents might want. But I can get rye!

[troubleinwinter]

16. I've got a story for ya.

My dad (80) phoned me today and said, "I finished my taxes and want to celebrate. Wanna go out for Indian dinner?"

Over his curry and my saag (lamb and SPINACH, of course), I told him that I couldn't find rye flour & caraway in town, that I had tried to find a 'hippy' market with bins of grains & flours but could only find "health" stores with pill suplements.

He said, "Oh, I know where there's a hippy natural store. I went there a year ago to buy really fresh ginger. We'll go there after dinner." So we did, and I got dark rye flour and caraway seeds and some very nice dill!!!

As we left, he said, "Now you tell your cooking friends that your eighty year old dad had to show you the hippy market!" I promised I would.

I asked why he had bought ginger last year. He said he'd had some friends over for dinner and had made home-made macadamia ice cream and made a candied ginger sauce to pour over it.

Weird. I'd posted about candied ginger earlier today.

So I'm all set to attempt rye bread (that he's been hinting for)! I guess he earned it.

Can you gimme a guideline on how much caroway? Couple TBS in a 1/2 batch??

[Lucinda]

17. LMAO. Good for him!

I'd say a couple tabs would be good if you like a strong caraway flavor. You could also go with half that inside, and then put more on the top. If it was too strong you could knock the ones off the top...?

I'd also say - go with two packets on the yeast for sure. The rye doesn't lift as well. I also think it would be fine without the molasses.

[troubleinwinter]

18. Ya even answered a question I hadn't asked yet!

I was gonna ask your thoughts on putting seed on top. He likes caraway... he'd showed me his stash, but didn't offer to share it! He adds it to sauer kraut.

I have been painting the AP loaves with egg, I really like the gloss. I've sprinkled with kosher salt, and sometimes old-fashion rolled oats (doesn't taste like anything, but looks very pretty).

I'm wondering about watering down some molasses to use as the glaze, or maybe mix a tad in with the egg wash.

BTW, I guess I can refer to "hippy" stores OK, as I grew up a teen in Berkeley in the late '60s. I got the qualifications! Just shorthand for whole food/natural/organic stores. Boy, was I impressed with this one... Daddio said, "Come see the vegetables!" They were just beautiful. Now I know where to get my sushi rice, too.

I bought the equivalent of half a jar of beautiful, bright green fragrant dried dill for 70 cents... the dull stuff in the grocery is $6.50 a jar. Caraway was 80 cents an oz.

Also, BTW, I found jarred whole nutmeg at a grocery store (Fry's/Kroger) $9.99 for 1.9 oz., whereas the spice dealer online was $2.99 for 2 oz. The spices in the jars at the market are absurdly expensive.

Thanks for your help!!!!

[Lucinda]

19. This recipe is so flexible I think you can make almost anything work!

I never got to the egg wash. I was trying to get the crust crispy and not too thick when I hit on the covered baking with a brush of melted butter right after I take it out. So I get the crust I was looking for with a lovely shine. I still plan on trying the egg wash too. How does it effect the crust's thickness and crispiness?

A little molasses in the glaze sounds interesting. I don't know what the sugars would do to the browning. It might make it go too fast, but I think I'd try it, and sprinkle some caraway on top. But I might do it when I took the lid off for the final browning...? Not really sure. Let me know what you do and how it turns out?

I'm very jealous about your dill score. I'm planning on drying more dill this spring. I need to try growing some inside too. I love dill.

[troubleinwinter]

26. !!!!????!!!!!!?????

I just mixed up a full batch of rye, completing the mixing one hour ago.

I exactly doubled your half batch, into a 5 qt. container.

ONE hour later, it's risen to the rim! WTH?!

I didn't know whether to let it continue or not... I stuck it in the fridge.

Maybe it's the 5000 altitude. But you're close to that high, aren't you?

It smells positively divine!!!!!!! I smell they rye, molasses, caraway and dill.

[troubleinwinter]

20. Holy Cow!!!!

I just saw this video with Zoe & Jeff, authors of Ain5. http://us.macmillan.com/BookCustomPage.aspx?isbn=9780312362911&m_type=2&m_contentid=119255#video

WTF??? I use the same size mixing/storage bucket they do. After the 2 hr rise, his bucket was about 1/4 full. Mine was full to the TIPPY tippy top 1st time, 3/4 second time. It deflates in the fridge to 1/3 - 1/2 full, but I was stumped to see this. I wouldn't think my 5000 ft elevation would make that much difference? I have read that one might either use LESS yeast OR a bit of Bread flour (more structural strength to hold a rise) at high elevs. I don't get much rise on prebake rest. Hm.

My loaves have improved each time I make one. One problem happened with the latest... the bottom crust was very thick and tough. I knew what it was right away. I always put a very thin spinkle of flour on the peel (a small cheapie plastic cutting board w/ handle), then a very thin sprinkle of cornmeal. THIS time I was busy with other things and laid down a pretty thick layer of meal... bad move- tough bottom crust.

Jeff has now become a believer in covered baking using an overturned foil roaster in lieu of the water pan. Since I am baking on a large terra cotta pot saucer rather than a baking stone, a foil pan won't work for me. I have taken to using a upsidedown 7" deep cookie tin (I intalled a glass knob as suggested here for retrofitting a pot with a non-oven-worthy pot handle! It's gooney looking, but kinda cute.) It has worked wonderfully.

For sour dough, they say to "scrape down the sides" of the canister and incorporate those bits. My container seems too smooth to have anything left on the sides, so I took about 2 tablespoons of the last dough and disolved it, rubbing in my fingers, in about 3/4 c of the water for the new batch. Seems to have carried over a bit of the souring flavor to the new batch.

Next, I'm gonna try baking in a covered pot.

[Lucinda]

21. I've switched to covered baking exclusively. Much better results.

I have a La Cloche coming - 4.99 from ebay!! - but right now I'm using one of those inexpensive enameled "granite" stock pots with a lid. It produces really good loaves.

Amazing what a difference elevation makes in the rise. I see different results with different yeasts too.

[troubleinwinter]

22. Inspired by your granite pot,

I ordered this:



I just thought it was so darned cute. 5 qt.

[Lucinda]

23. It is cute! And I bet it will make a great loaf.

I let mine rise on a sheet of parchment paper in a stainless bowl - so it doesn't spread out too much. Then I use the parchment as a sling and put it, and the dough in the pot. Works perfectly.

[troubleinwinter]

24. The idea of a bowl to prevent spreading is terrific.

I will sure try it.

When you use parchment, can ya skip the cornmeal?

[Lucinda]

25. Yup. I don't use the cornmeal at all.

I just lay out a large piece (you want to be able to have the end pieces long enough to make "handles" so you can use it as a sling) and put the dough on the paper, and move it to the bowl. Then I move the whole thing to the pot when it's time to bake. I've preheated the pot and lid, and put them in the preheated oven cold, both ways work well.

Don't worry about the paper smushing the bread in the cooking pot. It sorts itself out as it bakes.