Sigh. Any responses on this?

[XanaDUer]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3144095

[JI7]

1. nope, it's the same old shit

[WildEyedLiberal]

2. SKULL N BONEZ

I'm also not sure I believe that one guy's kid died. I'm really not.

[XanaDUer]

3. The problem with it is

even if they did, which is sad and tragic (all deaths to me are sad and tragic), it immediately shuts down any critical thinking about the first post.

Everyone is afraid to disagree or gently point out logical flaws in the argument of the deceased's family. It is like the "talkshowitization" of America.

I should never venture over there.

There are people who honestly believe that Kerry threw Bush the election because of the Skull and Bones? That says more about critical thinking in America than anything, to me.

[JI7]

4. it's almost like the attacks on Kerry from the right wing

claiming we lost the Vietnam war because of Kerry's protests and the things he said. and the swift boat assholes saying he is a traitor for doing the things he did.

there seems to be some types who needs things to be simple, black/white etc.

[XanaDUer]

5. And it is always a the supporters of one person

We know who that is.

[JI7]

6. so true

wonder why they don't hold that person to the same standard . i mean, i never saw that person call for many of the things they demand Kerry do.

[XanaDUer]

7. Not only that

but their Precious is no anti-war candidate. I used to post what he really said here all the time.

[JI7]

10. i know all about it

i remember earlier on how he talked about how he was more different from other dems in that he was conservative leaning and he criticized Kerry for speaking out against Bush on Afghanistan.

i paid attention VERY early on and i think this is one of the reasons i never fell for it. instead i was thinking "what the fuck" since i remember what he had said not too long before.

[karynnj]

12. I really question if they believe what they write

The throwing the election makes no sense on any level. You would have to believe that he and his whole family choose to run around the country campaigning hard for over a year, that he was wonderfully articulate, informed, sane and personable in all three debates, and
carefully calculated how to narrowly lose Ohio.

On The Skull & Bones thing can't we use the often repeated statement "Vietnam changed JK" to say if S&B was a cabal involved in CIA type things, Kerry when he got back was clearly not part of those things.

[JI7]

13. there are just certain types who feel a need to believe these things

this includes those who believe Bin Laden was not involved in the 9/11 attacks and that's it's all really a conspiracy and the ones really responsible are Bush, CIA etc.

in fact i think when polls on DU ask who was responsible most think it was some conspiracy theory and not Al Qaeda.

there are even some who claim the earthquake and resulting Tsunami in Asia was a result of government secrets. such as weapons testing which resulted in global warming and global warming resulting in the earthquakes. it's just really crazy.

it was the same with Republicans who felt a need to believe the Clinton's killed Vince Foster because of an affair with hillary and Ron Brown because he knew about some horrible things they were doing.

[Firespirit]

14. It absolves them of responsibility.

If they believe that the entire world, that every aspect of the system is rigged and stacked against them, it completely absolves them of responsibility -- either for anything that goes wrong, or to do anything to fix said wrongs ("why bother if they're all working together").

They're entitled to their thoughts; I wish they wouldn't be so public though. For instance, the election thing is a real possibility, or else there wouldn't be members of Congress launching investigations. But the 9/11 CIA/Skull & Bones/Freemasonry (whatever incarnation they're pushing) conspiracy theory is whack. But those who scream about both at the same time damage the credibility of the possible one, by associating it with the crazy one. So that's why I wish they'd be less vocal.

They won't, though. :(

[karynnj]

18. It's too bad they don't realize they sound like the Freepers

the difference is they tell of a Bush conspiracy, the freepers thing Bill and Hillary Clinton were behind everything. (Kerry seems to be especially lucky now as to the RW he's an evil traitor and to these LW lunatics he's GWB's Skull and Bones buddy, It's hard to think that anyone who heard him speak even once would think either were possible.)

They are an embarrasment to the Democrats.

[karynnj]

15. At least I've stopped questioning them

Because I got back nonsense saying I was naive and had to read more (or more credible sources) Logic clearly doesn't help.

[Vektor]

17. I pointed it out. Gladly.

I'm sick of hearing that rant. Even if it were true, any sympathy I might have is canceled out by the bashing and blame laying I have been witnessing from this person for months on end. Same post, over and over again.

It doesn't ring true and I don't buy it.

[muse]

27. "weapon", Vektor?

And I quote:

"He single handedly mowed down thousands of people with his own weapon."

You and I Vektor, were one of the thousands. :)

[Vektor]

29. Shock and Awe

I'd fall to it again.
Gladly....

So you caught that deliberate innuendo?

[Vektor]

16. You and me both, WEL.

I keep hearing the same canned rhetoric over and over again from that one and it STINKS.
Oh, and the Skull and Bonez blaque majique?

Georgie and John drinking goat's blood from a pewter chalice, in their druid hoods, by the light of the full moon in a graveyard at midnight? Pledging to do one another's dirty bidding for an eternity. Pricking their fingers and making a "blood brother" promise...
Bwaaaa-hahahahah!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
Jesus. What rot.

[Laurab]

28. I think it's a woman, and I've had the same thought

It really bothers me to be so cynical, but in this one case I am. Every time I see her name, I know what she's going to post, and I couldn't figure out if it was for the sympathy or what. More and more, it looks like it's for attack purposes only. Anyway, I'm glad to see I wasn't the only one wondering about that.

If true, it's very sad, but she's blaming the wrong person. If true, I think some serious counseling is needed, fast. Hell, if not true, I think serious counseling is needed, too.

[Vektor]

31. I think it's a load of B.S..

Several people have asked his/her son's name, branch of service, when he enlisted, etc..and got NO answer. Someone who is willing to mention that same repetitive story over and over in EVERY POST would surely be willing to talk about the guy if the situation were real.

This person appears on every thread relating to the war and says the EXACT same thing. In fact, I have never seen him/her post anything else. I'm convinced it is a rabble rousing tactic.

And even if it were not, what happened would not be Kerry's fault, and I'm not too politically correct to criticize someone who is making baseless attacks and character assassinations, even if they are a grieving parent. That does not absolve them from being a responsible citizen. Slander is slander, no matter who it comes from.

[Firespirit]

8. Do blm and merh frequent this group?

Their responses to the IWR slam were good.

But ugh, now I feel filthy. What a hateful thread. Those assholes who are referring to him as "cold," "calculating," "bonesman," etc., don't know what the fuck they are talking about and should shut their ignorant mouths and start shitting out of the correct end for a change.

Boy, it's a good thing I'm not going to respond on that thread; I'd be banned in an instant for stuff I'd say. Lefty freepers turn me into a potty mouth. :(

[JI7]

9. yes they come here at times

i have seen blm do this for over 2 years, especially during the primary campaigns . she is so good because she never personally attacks others and sticks to facts.

i use to kind of respond during the primary campaign but have stopped doing it since it's usually the same type and responding to them wont change anything. i guess if you are like blm and merh and can put up with it then it's ok.

but i'm kind of like you and it's much better to stay away and ignore. actually, i have just learned to try not to take them that seriously anymore. i think during the campaign i would take things so seriously but i have since learned how DU overall represents a minority of not just the country but even among those who lean left. so i just think if i work for Kerry in the future it will be by getting out and talking to people who are willing to listen , not the ones who spew out the skull and bones and other crap.

[Firespirit]

11. Yes, I've developed a very short fuse post-Nov. 2

In no small part thanks to the large boards on this site, which I by and large steer clear of now. I guess the whiny juvenile meltdown on January 6, the wholesale slamming of all those people who stood up and took such crap for it from the GOP, was the straw that broke the camel's back, so to speak.

But I figure, if their primary source of commentary is the Socialist website, there's not much I can do for them. There are some decent ideas in socialism as an economic ideology, but you just can't use that name in this country when advocating them, and anyway you need capitalism too to promote competition and innovation.

And you definitely have to be a pragmatist when you "have your finger on the button" so to speak, or even in part "on the button" as a Senator. I hate it as much as anyone that we can't just up and leave that place (Iraq) immediately, but we can't and those people don't seem to get that.

[JI7]

19. and by the way, Rumsfeld is OPPOSED to Kerry's plan

to expand the military by 40 thousand troops. does this make Rumsfeld anti war ?

if they would actually see why Kerry wants to increase the size of the military by 40 thousand and why Rumsfeld opposes it rather than just view things in black and white , as anti war /pro war etc maybe we could work towards getting something done. but i really don't think that's what some of these people want.

but these people look at this and claim Kerry is just like Bush when Bush doesn't even support it in the first place.

well i guess they have an ally in Bush just as the anti progressive left often helps the Republicans .

[Vektor]

20. Locked!

A little alert goes a long way.

Oh, and lots of "last word in" from *someone* you all know. :-)

[XanaDUer]

21. Locked?!

Good. Makes us (libs, Dems, etc) look like tin-foil hat loonies.

[New Earth]

24. LMAO

you did well Vektor :hug:

lol, Dungeons and Dragons!!!!

[Vektor]

25. That's what they remind me of

with that Skull and Bones crap. Like a bunch of snot-nosed whiny kids caught in a fantasy world of wizards and witches and mages....

It's SO lame.
HAHAHAH I mean COME ON!

[saracat]

22. I already argued this on another thread.

And we have already talked about this here. What is done is done. i didn't like Kerry's vote.I didn't support the war. I don't support the war now. But we can't just walk away from this "Messpotamia" now that we started it. We have to mop up and get out. I recall Kerry asking for more troops during the election. This isn't new. Nor is needing money to get out. These people are just agitators! Kerry was the best and only choice we had. And if Vanity Fair is right, and I think it is , we will find that he was elected President, though it might not do us any good. I am probably just as angry at some Dems as some of these people, and god, do I HATE the DLC. They are the real villains who bullocks things up, but this Kerry bashing has got stop. They are trying to rip apart our party's only credible leader. They should STFU, but I will defend their right to criticize.Some, however should be sued for slander!

[XanaDUer]

23. Thanks, SC

:hug:

Others here will tell you I am a veteran of the "primary wars" and tried to argue a lot of this crazy stuff.

and to Vektor-Damn! You're good on that thread! Take a bow.

[elshiva]

26. Vek's responses were good:

Skull and Bones = Shit and Bull. That whole thing is lame. Like Nader whining "the repubs and the Dems are the same! the same I tell you!"
Lies, lies, lies...

[Vektor]

30. I just get so...

..SICK of that loony bull crap. Skull and bones plot? Now THAT is out there. I just wish these D&D nerds would wake up.