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eyesroll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-26-05 08:27 AM
Original message
Advice on avoiding collisions with cars?
Long story short -- I looked both ways, didn't see the van (or any other cars) coming, almost got hit while trying to cross lanes to do a U-turn on a semi-busy city street. He was speeding (according to my riding companion who did see him), and not interested in slowing down to avoid an accident. I didn't even process that he was close until after I was out of harm's way.

I should add -- I'm finally getting over an ear infection and my hearing in my left ear is not 100%, so I didn't hear him coming, either.

So, any tips (other than look both ways, pedal like hell, and wait until I can hear again to ride in traffic)?

Sigh...it was a good post-illness ride, too, until that. We found a narrow unpaved trail by the Milwaukee River and ended up doing 3-4 miles off-road (which was something neither of us had done before).
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prolesunited Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-26-05 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
1. I try to stay off roads as much as possible
Lucky for me, there's a trail not far from my house and plenty of options if I want to put my bike in the car. Even if you're doing everything right, some drivers are assholes and believe if you're on a bike that you deserve to be hit if you don't get out of their way fast enough.

You are wearing a helmet, right?

See if you can find anything through these links:
http://www.wisconline.com/attractions/biketrails.html

http://www.onmilwaukee.com/visitors/articles/5rides.html

http://www.traillink.com/
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eyesroll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-26-05 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Yep, wearing a helmet.
I don't often street ride for the heck of it, and there are good trails just a few blocks from here, but I'm trying not to drive everywhere, either. Unfortunately, while Milwaukee is a good recreational riding city, it's terrible for bike commuters.

I rode to the library today (downtown! In rush hour!), and that went well. Only one true "oh, shit" moment, and that was just my, shall we say, beginner skills over a brick road, and not due to external factors.

Thanks. :hi:
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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-26-05 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
3. Get a light.
When studies on done on bicycle-Auto Accident the leading causes tend to be the following:

1. A car opening its door in front of a Cyclist (Best avoided by biking at least a door length away from any parked car to avoid this type of accident.

2. Turning of the car into or out of a side road while the cyclist is biking on the main road. Best minimized by having a light on your bike so the idiots drivers can see you. Starting int he 1970s Motorcycles were designed to have their lights on ALL OF THE TIME for auto drivers were NOT seeing them either. Thus I recommend a HUB generator and keep it on all of the time.

I use a generator light thus my light is on all the time. If you decide to opt for a generator light make sure you get a high end one, the cheap ones are NOT worth it, while the high end ARE worth it.

I use the Schmidt SON out of Germany, expensive but worth it. The US Dealer is (I use it in combination with Schmidt's LED headlight):
http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/lightingsystems.htm

If you can not afford a Schmidt Hub try the Schimano hubs sold by:
http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/lighting/shimano.html
(If the web site looks a lot like Peter White's, you are correct, Sheldon Brown admits he stole most of it from Peter White, while the Schimano generator is made in Japan as a rule your still have to use a German made light with it).

SRAM has a i-light hub generator, but I do not know of anyone selling it on the net.



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loveable liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-27-05 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
4. get off your bike and walk.
If I dont know, then I dont go. I walk across railroad tracks and busy intersections. I've stood at an intersection for 5 minutes waiting to cross. Its just not worth it and it'll giver yer kiester and yer feet a break. In Minnesota, its the law: pedestrians have the right of way regardless of where they are on the street. That doesnt stop cars tho so we still have to use common sense.
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-28-05 05:38 PM
Response to Original message
5. I'm going to differ with most of the advice offered so far...
Edited on Sun Aug-28-05 05:44 PM by mike_c
...like don't ride in traffic, get off and walk, and so on. One thing that your post doesn't make clear-- was that a legal U-turn, i.e. at an intersection, with a green light? My advice is that the absolute best way to avoid collisions with automobiles is to act like one yourself, and in particular, obey all traffic laws just like automobile drivers. If you're riding legally, command your space. Don't let autos force you into unsafe circumstances. For example, if you're riding on the right margin and approaching a left turn, signal and pull out to the middle of the lane from which you turn left, well in advance of the turn. DO NOT BE TIMID ABOUT IT, and do not "defer" to auto traffic except to yield the legal right of way. Signal, then pull in front of them, forcing them to respect your right to the road.

Some drivers react badly to that by blowing their horns, etc. Ignore them. OCCUPY THE SPACE that you are entitled to as a vehicle on the road. The most common reasons that riders are injured in traffic are trying to maneuver in traffic from marginalized positions and riding as though they were pedestrians rather than vehicles.

Another example: ride to the right only as far as is safe. If you're in a traffic situation where drivers squeezing by on your left compromise your safety, ride far enough out in into the right lane to prevent them from squeezing by. If they want to pass, make sure they have to do so legally, i.e. by pulling into the left lane on or into the oncoming lane at a broken yellow line.

Ride DEFENSIVELY, but ASSERTIVELY. Ride LEGALLY-- stop at stop signs, for example, and pull into the lane if necessary to prevent cars from crowding you on the left at the stop.
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dean_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-29-05 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. That's good advice.
The key is to be assertive, and to also be in control of your bike. If drivers see you looking like you're confident and know what you're doing, and not weaving all over the place, etc. they are a lot more likely to respect your space. Sometimes that confidence just comes with practice riding on busy roads though, it took some time for me to get used to it.

Lights are a good idea too, but they're not a 100 percent guarantee either: At nights, I ride with a bright flashing headlight, a flashing tailight on my seat stem, and a flashing tailight. I'm so bright I would think I would cause seizures in most drivers, but you'd be surprised how many of 'em still put out in front of me anyway.

I wouldn't suggest walking your bike across a busy intersection: it just means you're in the road longer, dragging a bike alongside you no less, and you could trip or slip or any number of things. You're much more exposed that way than if you just rode across.
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-29-05 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
6. Effective Cycling
Edited on Mon Aug-29-05 01:03 PM by TheBorealAvenger
A friend of mine had referred me to a cycling thesis years ago on techniques to establish a presence, be seen, and ride safely. Here is what my friend wrote to me:

Effective Cycling is from the book by the same name by John Forrester http://www.johnforester.com

The book isn't great reading, but is informative.

The Bike Ed program that the League of American Bicyclists offers is based on Effective Cycling. It used to go by that name until John withdrew his permission to use it because they were not meeting his course requirements. LAB does use his book for the course.

The book "Street Smarts" by John Allen is published by ODOT and is quite good. It should be available free at bike shops. The Ohio version adds a section of Ohio laws to the front of the book. The original version of the book, published by Rodale, is available at John's web site in pdf http://www.bikexprt.com
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Longhorn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-29-05 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. I took the LAB Road I course
and found it very helpful. It was about four hours of classroom and then about six hours of hands-on experience, such as changing a tire, practicing accident avoidance techniques, and riding around in downtown Austin. I highly recommend it!
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welshTerrier2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-15-05 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #6
14. Effective Cycling
i didn't take the course but did read the book ... it taught me everything i know about riding safely ... is the book still available?? ... i thought it was out of print at one time ... maybe that's changed ...

Forrester does much more than just telling you what to do; he explains why it's the safest way to do it ...

thanks for the tip on "Street Smarts" ... i'll have to check that one out ...
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Fovea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-12-05 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
9. In addition
Consider either a helmet mounted, or eyeglass mounted mirror.
I find that seeing what is coming up behind you makes a lot of difference.

I also have an Air Zounds horn, which garners a lot of respect, and gets me into fewer altercations than yelling '&(#Q^(&!!!!' at them.

My girlfriend says I dress in 'variations on a theme of hi-vis,' but I like bright colors anyway, so no foul.

When I was a kid, there was this school movie called 'Drive your Bike.'
While it has not kept me from all trouble, just the title is a distillation of what works.

BTW, while I am a vehicular cyclist, I am not a big Forester fan.
The LAB stuff takes the better part of his philosophy, and leaves most of the dross.
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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-05 09:48 AM
Response to Original message
10. I am buying a xenon strobe light--much brighter than anything with leds
http://www.southwestpublicsafety.com/ligbasbikstr.html
A comprehensive description: http://nordicgroup.us/s78/taillights.html

This baby can cut through the fog and throw enough light that reflections of the strobe can be seen even before a motorist is in sight of the bike. I will let you know how it works out when it comes in the mail.
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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-05 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Design to prevent the Least likely bike-Auto type of Accident.
Roughly only 7% of all bike-Car accidents are preventable by a taillight. This is way most states only require headlights, taillights rarely prevent bike-Automobile accidents.

http://www.johnforester.com/
http://www.smartmotorist.com/bic/bic.htm
http://www.kenkifer.com/bikepages/health/risks.htm
http://www.johnforester.com/NatSafCouncil/NSC.htm

From the CPSC:
http://www.johnforester.com/Articles/Lights/BMA&CPSC.htm



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Kolesar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-05 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. I think it's related to "motorists failure to yield" &"no lights at night"
Let me have a little fun, I get to look like a snowplow. In my observations, there are many lighting conditions where the led lamps barely get the cyclist more visibility. I have been startled by more than a few cyclists I came up upon who had weak rear lighting.
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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-05 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. The problem is that reality and perception are two different things.
The perception is that oncoming Auto traffic is what is the most dangerous, while the reality it is cross traffic, turning traffic and oncoming traffic. A headlight is the BEST way to reduce accidents from THOSE Causes.

In fact in recent years (i.e. post-1990) there has been a movement to "Traffic Calming" construction instead of rebuilding roads to permit traffic to go as fast as possible. Most such "Traffic Calming" is to make the appearance of the road narrower so that people naturally slow down. Another method is to install "Roundabouts" that force people to slow down as their turn around the "Roundabouts".

Thus the main reason people FEAR Passing Automobiles is as the car passes them, they can see the Car pas them and this happens car after car. This is true of the Automobile drivers also, as the Automobile pass a car most slow down FOR FEAR OF HITTING THE BICYCLIST. This slow down is the main reason bicycles rarely get hit from the rear.

On the other hand the real dangers one never see, the oncoming car, the Turning Car or the car pulling out from a side street (Or from its park position along the road). People do NOT see these dangers and thus do not prepare for them. Perception overrules reality given how ofter cars pass bicyclist.

Thus when I drive a Car I have passed bicyclist but I have been more "Surprised" by cars I failed to pick up do to dim (or no) tail-lights than Bicyclists. I never hit either but I have had cars try to run me over as the cross the road to park their car.

For more on Traffic Calming see:
http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/environment/tcalm/
http://www.dot.state.ga.us/dot/plan-prog/planning/projects/bicycle/ped_facilities_guide/8_traffic_calming.pdf#search='Traffic%20Calming'
http://www.bikeplan.com/calm.htm
http://www.usroads.com/journals/rmej/9801/rm980102.htm
http://www.ite.org/library/IntersectionSafety/roundabouts.pdf#search='Roundabouts'

On "Round abouts", basically scientifically designed Traffic Circle that permit higher traffic volumes than any other type of intersection (Through at slower speeds than old fashion Traffic Circles):
http://www.tfhrc.gov/pubrds/fall95/p95a41.htm
http://www.roundabouts.net/roundabouts.html
http://www.alaskaroundabouts.com/mythfact2.html

General Transportation Information:
Transportation Research Board: http://trb.org/

Federal Highway Administration: http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/

National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA): http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/

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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-17-05 04:51 PM
Response to Original message
15. get a Mirror that clamps on the helmet.. bigger one, not the dime size
got to get that strobe too it is essential
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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-17-05 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
16. How about $5 a gallon Gasoline tax???
It would reduce auto traffic making it safer for bicycles.
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