Stand Up For The Constitution: Burn A Flag. A Modest Proposal

[cali]

If the sublimely absurd amendment to the constitution about flag desecration passes, I suggest we designate a day for flag burning; making it clear that this is an action of mourning for the 1st Amendment.

Personally, I can't imagine a more basic expression of political speech than burning the flag. It may be political speech that offends many people, but such is the nature of political speech.

[Dark]

1. I've never seen a purpose behind buring the flag. There are so many

more eloquent and sophisticated ways of expressing your opinions.

[cali]

2. That's not my point.

I've never burned a flag, but I consider the flag as a symbol of the Constitution, and it's richly ironic to protect a symbol while desecrating the bill of rights. In addition, I disagree that burning the flag isn't a powerful statement.

[Dark]

4. I didn't say it wasn't powerful, just putrid.

If someone burns the flag, I immediately tune out whatever they are saying. If the only way they feel they can communicate their message is through the destruction of a symbol of our country, I don't care what they have to say. They're idiots.

Even a remotely intelligent person can find a more refined way to present their views than simply burining something.

[cali]

5. Ah yes, that convincing argument;

if you don't agree with me, you must be stupid. Let me ask, do you support amending the Constitution to "protect" the flag? Do you realize that by doing so, there will be an increase in flag "desecration"; that people like me, who have never burned the flag will do so in opposition to what they see as the desecration of the Constitution. This is such a stupid, political, counterproductive move.

[no_hypocrisy]

3. I'm doing a theme-and-variation of desecration of "The Flag":

I'm wearing my stars-and-stripes silk boxer shorts today for doing errands, sans pantaloons.

[tanyev]

6. How about burning flag themed commercialized crap?

Ties, boxer shorts (as noted above), paper plates & napkins, etc, etc.

[cali]

7. That's an interesting idea

Frankly, I've never been one who was terribly offended by the burning of the flag, but maybe it would be more effective to burn copies of the Constitution.

[no_hypocrisy]

8. One qualification: Burning the Constitution would be a necon gesture. n/t

[Rosemary2205]

9. Can I burn "flag" crap at a gay wedding?

I can't bring myself to burn an actual flag but those flag shirts, undies, hats etc - no problemo. -- I think doing it at a gay wedding would give it that something special though. :)

[Vidar]

13. Not bad at all.

[annabanana]

10. desecration?

(oops)






(Doesn't Congress have anything else to do?)

[WePurrsevere]

14. How about this really good one (& my fav to make the same point you are)

Burning the flag is no more a desecration then the above pictures besides what do people think the proper way to get rid of a flag that's worn out is? It's preferably BURNED: http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/flagetiq.html (btw - they have the above picture as an example of a violation in the news.. of course they also have an upside down one used in a protest as one as well and although I don't know what that protest is about I do feel that in some cases that could be an appropriate time to show "dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property"... it would depend on your opinion.)

[Strong Atheist]

11. The proposed constitutional amendment is a REALLY bad idea,

and I do not think your proposed reaction is a good idea either. It will turn people off, and make the amendment - makers look justified...

[OneBlueSky]

12. before you burn, make sure it's hanging upside down . . .

it's a universal distress signal . . . in this case for "my country is in crisis" . . .

[Warpy]

15. Few flags were burned at the height of the antiwar

movement in the 60s and 70s because it quickly became apparent what a total loser of a technique it was. It made enemies of the people in the country who react to symbols more than anything else, and every burned flag set the movement back many months. Every time people saw a peaceful protest, they imagined a flag in flames.

In fact, that's what this stupid amendment is about, the 60s and the backlash of comfortable people against protest, something that was responsible for Nixon's two terms and nearly every administration after them.

This amendment is another desperate attempt by the GOP to get something symbolic onto the ballot in November to bring out the same people they brought out in 2004 with their homophobic ballot initiatives. It's a craven and disgusting political move and it just might work.

Going out and burning flags for any reason is a counterproductive move. Whatever point the arsonist is trying to make will be completely rejected.

[Peace Patriot]

16. SOAK THE FLAG!

I have this idea for the flag-burning amendment nonsense (really, could there be any greater farce than these Bush "pod people" pretending to be patriotic? argh!)

Anyway, I don't have the tech graphics skills to do it, but I see it as a cartoon or poster--and it could also be implemented for real, as a 1st amendment street theater protest. If you want this idea, it is YOUR, gratis! Go for it!

---------

SOAK THE FLAG!


1. A cauldron of blood (fake or otherwise, if it's a real protest; just red coloring, of course, if it's a cartoon, etc.)

A hand dipping the flag into the cauldron of blood.

Words on the cauldron (like it's a labeled substance): "Blood of Iraqis, blood of Americans, blood of New Orleans..."


2. A cauldron of oil.

A hand dipping the flag in the cauldron of oil.

Words on cauldron: (oh, something like) "Price gougers, corporate oil wars"


3. A cauldron of brown mud.

A hand dipping the flag in the cauldron of mud.

Words on cauldron: (?) "The filth of our political system, secret electronic vote counting, lobbyists, no-bid contracts"


4. A cauldron of something icky and sort of yellowish-green (swirls of ick).

A hand dipping the flag in the cauldron of ick.

Words on the cauldron: (?) "Corporate pollution, toxics, depleted uranium, GMOs, fatty foods, dirty air, oil spills, global warming..."

(--maybe the hand is being eaten away, as the pollution eats up the flag)


5. A cauldron of pure clean crystal clear water

A hand dipping the dirty flag (stains of blood, oil, mud, pollution, Bush's face) in the cauldron of clear water.

Words on cauldron: "Clean it up! Dismantle the corporate beast. Seize their assets for the public good."

(also, image of "blue marble" earth on the cauldron--re "clean it up") (also, map image of U.S.)

-------------------------------

Logo or protest poster: "We don't need to burn the flag! We need to CLEAN the flag!"

-------------------------------

(Graphics bit: The bad hands, soaking the flag in blood, oil, etc., maybe should have an expensive watch on the wrist, or a diamond bracelet. Male, with a suitcoat cuff showing; female with long red or black painted fingernails. Both with big showy fraternity (Skull & Bones?) or diamond rings on fingers. Whatever.

:bounce:

[Peace Patriot]

19. Absurdity--obvious assault on the 1st Amendment...

I was looking at those pix upthread of people wearing flag clothing. What do you do with old clothing? Put it in the trash, it gets sent to the landfill. Or burn stuff you don't want in a backyard fire. Also, old flags are burned. So-o-o-o-o-o-o-o....

...what is the difference between burning clothing flags and old flags, and burning a flag in anger at unjust war? The ONLY difference is INTENT. A thought. Words. So, what is a court--trying to implement this horrdly stupid amendment--going to do? Scan your brain? Don't we have an Amendment--OUR FIRST!--against the government scanning your brain for traitorous thoughts? And what if you never mention the war in the protest? What if you have a sign that says, "I'm just burning this old blouse, or old flag to dispose of it"? They're going to hold you responsible for what everybody ELSE is saying at the protest? Or for what you might say ten minutes later ("No war!).

As I said: ABSURD!

There is NO WAY to distinguish INTENT. And the government CAN'T DO THAT. It can't convict you for a THOUGHT IN YOUR HEAD!

-----------------------

I have ALWAYS felt that anyone protesting criminal government policy should fly the flag proudly. Should OWN the flag! Antiwar protests should be a SEA OF FLAGS. OUR symbol. Symbol of the American Revolution. Symbol of the SOVEREIGNTY OF THE PEOPLE. Symbol of our forefathers' and foremothers' sacrifices to make us FREE! The flag = Us!

Don't let these dirtbags and thieves and murderers TAKE THE FLAG FROM YOU!

And any treatment of the flag as a protest symbol should very clever, and pointed at the heart of the fascists who would destroy our country. Flag-burning, like armed revolution, is outmoded. We must find a new way--and it will be through our cleverness and our superior understanding of the use of symbols. I like the idea of pink U.S. flags (gay rights), green U.S. flags (save the planet), and those flags that have corporate logos in place of the stars. THAT is pointed! Also, I DO like the idea of the upside down flag as a distress symbol. And THAT could be a GREAT antiwar march. Think of a hundred thousand people marching, each carrying a flag turned upside down. PICTURE IT! That would be an amazing protest. And a lot of the military people would dig it. They know what distress is!

:think: :patriot: :think:

[Lerkfish]

17. Instead, I propose burning copies of the Constitution

see if any cops arrest you. Republicans do it every day, after they defecate on it.

I think THAT would be a more fitting protest, and the irony might actually get through to some people.

[checkmate1947]

18. Stop the B/S!!!!!!

The more you'all talk like this the more you empower these
neo-cons to divert things from the real problems,,,,,

[Strong Atheist]

22. Welcome to D.U.!

:toast:

[dogday]

20. I don't like seeing the flag burned, but I stand on

the right that you have the right to do it... I could not participate in a flag burning but I recognize your right to do as much.....

Here is my small statement to those who wish to take away our rights....

[sinkingfeeling]

21. I'd rather see the flag burned then to see Smirk wearing it on his lapel.