It is time to admit that pro life Democrats

[dsc]

are better than pro choice Republicans. At most 2 Republicans will wind up opposing Alito (Chaffee and Snowe). Those are the only two who haven't decided yet. At best they will have broken 3 to 2 in favor of Alito.

Conversely only one Democrat who has announced he will vote to confirm Alito is pro life. One pro life Democrat has already announced his opposition. It still may break badly but the jury is out. My point is that the supposedly pro choice Republicans are folding like cheap tents. How would a pro life Democrat be worse than say Specter or Collins both of whom are voting for Alito?

[rucky]

1. oh yeah, Reid is pro-life and pro-filibuster.

if the abortion issue doesn't do it for you, the executive & corporate power should.

[mike_c]

2. pro choice republicans see themselves as having good political cover...

...in that confirming Alito is republican vs democrat, conservative vs liberal, us against them-- staying with the herd gives them cover.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

3. Correction. Not pro-life, it's anti-choice. eom

[seabeyond]

5. i see you had posted ahead of me. bothers me too

cant stand the pro life label. not true at all, as life doesnt seem priority in so much of the repug decisions

[FreedomAngel82]

18. Well with me personally

I am both pro-life and pro-choice. I'm pro-life in the policies I believe in that make life such as a good economy, national security (real national security), health care, better environment, better public education and opportunities for all etc. I'm pro-choice because I know that I only have choice over my own self. Jimmy Carter talks about this whole deal in his book "Our Endangered Values." It's a great book and he talks about his stance on the issue of abortion. He tells how he's for Roe v Wade and thinks we should try to reduce abortion in other means such as the economy and having it better for everyone.

[Mme. Defarge]

11. I hold this truth to be self evident

that life begins at conception. EMO.

[TheWraith]

13. Then you have to call yourself pro-abortion.

If you insist on getting to frame the other side's agenda, you should probably extend the same offer to them.

Me, I'm fine with pro-life/pro-choice. Pointless jingoistic name games aren't the real, relevant issue.

[BlueIris]

21. No, SHE DOESN'T, actually.

"If you insist on getting to frame the other side's agenda,"

At least you have the stones to admit that the other side HAS an agenda, which is more than I can say for most people who appear to irrationally sympathize with politicians and misogynists actively trying to legitimize judging, controlling and obstructing the personal, private medical decisions of women.

"you should probably extend the same offer to them."

If the other side had a valid, humane perspective, maybe. Which they don't. If an "other side" wanted to characterize taking away the human rights of, say...those of a non-white skin color, as merely "pro-white," would it be unfair to call them what they are--oppressors--would anyone be snottily and condescendingly telling activists to "be fair" to the bigots? I doubt it. It is, of course, less socially acceptable, to oppress on the basis of ethnicity than on the basis of sex.

"Me, I'm fine with pro-life/pro-choice."

Your post says a lot about you and your agendas, I hope you realize. Namely, the fact that you clearly don't understand what the word "choice" means. And that you find it acceptable to simply tell other voting adults what to do, think and say, because you feel like it. And that because you like a term which validates the perspectives of those who find it acceptable to obstruct a citizen's human rights simply because she has a uterus, everyone else should, too.

"Pointless jingoistic name games aren't the real, relevant issue."

Sad. Only a person with a tragically limited grasp on that issue, or the ways in which that "other side" has been able to effect its sick, liberty-destroying, woman-killing oppression, would post that.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

24. Pro-choice is not pro-abortion. It is for allowing for one's personal

choice.

[TahitiNut]

25. "jingoistic"??? I see the problem here. Language isn't your forte.

jin·go·ism n.
Extreme nationalism characterized especially by a belligerent foreign policy; chauvinistic patriotism.



Now, I must admit that I liken a woman's sovereign choice regarding her own pregnancy to the sovereignty another nation has regarding its own laws, but I doubt you're speaking metaphorically.

[seabeyond]

4. favor dsc. can you not call it pro life. how about anti choice.

i cant stand pro life. i am pro life. it isnt about life. it is about being for choice or against choice.

[truebrit71]

7. No. It's about being Anti-Woman. End of story.

This has nothing to do with darling little babies and EVERYTHING to do with controlling women. I can think of no other issue where women are trying to legislate what a man can and cannot do with his body.

[Southsideirish]

15. But there is a dead baby in the end. You can't get away from that.

[seabeyond]

17. it isnt a baby it is a fetus. big difference. mama of two

never had an abortion, i dont like them. i know there is a difference between baby and fetus. just a fact. now they are calling the fetus a child. not a child either. it is a fetus.

[Baconfoot]

20. Yes you can. There's nothing to get away from.

Not all multicellular organisms are babies. (See Crickets)
Not all multicellular entities with human DNA are babies. (See Tissue Cultures)
Not all multicellular entities with human DNA and the potential to develop into a human being are human beings (See blastula, fetus etc.)
But some are (See babies).

[meow2u3]

23. The Christofascists oppose abortion choice for the wrong reasons

You're half right. For the christofascists, overturning Roe v. Wade has nothing to do with saving babies and everything to do with controlling women, as you put it. But some who want roe overturned do have the kid's life--and that of the women, who can make another choice besides abortion (such as open adoption), close to their hearts. Some are personally willing to adopt; others give up their kids for adoption and wouldn't even consider abortion. These are the ones who are seeking to build a safety net so the baby and mom can get a hand up.

The christofascists are the vilest hypocrites around. They claim to want to save babies--some of these foul creatures even shed crocodile tears for the baby until it's born--but then they refuse to resist the urge to play God and punish the poor kid along with the mother. Everybody knows the irresponsible father can do no wrong because she seduced him when she said no but he wouldn't take no for an answer. :sarcasm:

[dsc]

8. You get to call your position what you like

and I get to call my position what I like. I think that is only fair. I don't call you pro abortion nor do I condemn hypocracy among the many pro choicers who support the death penalty. I think in return I should be permitted to describe my position, which is both pro life in the case of fetuses and convicted murders what it is. Though I do appreciate being asked instead of ordered as often happens here. I am pro life and won't demean my position by calling it anti choice.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[seabeyond]

19. of course you can call it what you like. and it is offensive

you say you wont demean. but you demean in suggesting we are anti life. so there you have it. you are manipulating what you call it the same bush manipulates domestic spying to whatever he says.......

i asked. you say no. i cant go any further than that, but it is offensive.

i can respect your position. i didnt have a clue you were anti abortion or choice, from your post. maybe i didnt read it close enough. i do not like abortion either, ergo i dont have abortions. my position is simply, i cannot pin my religious and moral belief on another. it is all about choice for me.

[Joy Anne]

6. and in Pennsylvania

the anointed antichoice Democratic candidate has announced his support for Alito

[dsc]

9. which is disappointing

though unlike the pro chioce republicans we won't end up 100% in favor of Alito which I think is very likely to happen with the Republicans.

[KakistocracyHater]

12. It's about gutting women as people & forcing them to be animals/slaves

Stripped of all self-sovereignty, no self-determination, because it does not stop at abortion-the Republicans said so themselves when Harriet came up, no it's the whole female self-determination package. No right to use birth control pills (Griswold Vs Connecticut?), & I'm thinking no rights to the children after they are born, just like some fundamentalist Muslims.

[Southsideirish]

14. I like Marcy Captor. She is pro union, pro life and very down to earth.

She's paid her dues for many years in the Congress and I would like to see her as Gore's VP candidate in '08.

[FreedomAngel82]

16. Where it concerns that

is whether or not they will vote to overturn Roe v Wade. What they believe in their personal life could mean less to me, but as long as they protect that than I could care less with what they are.

[Charlie Brown]

22. I agree with you

I don't agree with pro-life Dems on some issues, but at least they'll support a higher minimum wage, worker's rights, and less war.

[JVS]

26. hmmm

:popcorn: