Saudi Ambassador's Sudden Departure - Signals Dangerous Uncertainty

[leveymg]

There's an interesting, and possibly frightening development in U.S.-Saudi relations. A discussion about this has going on at DU this morning about news in The Washington Post that Saudi Ambassador Prince Turki al-Faisal has suddenly, and unexpectedly quit his post in Washington. http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2649199

This report may be alarming because of what happened shortly after Prince al-Turki's last unexpected resignation. The Prince had been head of Saudi external intelligence for 24 years when he suddenly left his post on September 4, 2001. The Times of London has reported that Prince al-Turki was the long-time Saudi intelligence contact with Osama bin Laden.

The Post article this morning says that al-Turki privately announced his departure yesterday to Secretary of State Rice and flew back to Riyadh: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/11/AR2006121101333.html?nav=hcmoduletmv

Saudi Ambassador Abruptly Resigns, Leaves Washington

By Robin Wright
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, December 12, 2006; Page A23

Prince Turki al-Faisal, Saudi Arabia's ambassador to the United States, flew out of Washington yesterday after informing Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and his staff that he would be leaving the post after only 15 months on the job, according to U.S. officials and foreign envoys. There has been no formal announcement from the kingdom.

The abrupt departure is particularly striking because his predecessor, Prince Bandar bin Sultan, spent 22 years on the job. The Saudi ambassador is one of the most influential diplomatic positions in Washington and is arguably the most important overseas post for the oil-rich desert kingdom.

Turki, a long-serving former intelligence chief, told his staff yesterday afternoon that he wanted to spend more time with his family, according to Arab diplomats. Colleagues said they were shocked at the decision.

The exit -- without the fanfare, parties and tributes that normally accompany a leading envoy's departure, much less a public statement -- comes as his brother, Prince Saud al-Faisal, the highly influential Saudi foreign minister, is ailing.

SNIP


The circumstances of al-Turkey's resignation as head of Saudi intelligence on 09/04/2001 has been little reported. However, it was noted here at DU three years ago:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/articles/03/03/01_crimes.html

On September 4, The Saudi Gov't announced that Prince Turki's departure was "by his own request" . Prince Turki had been head of Saudi foreign intelligence for 24 years, and had just been reappointed on May 24 to a new 4-year term. By an interesting coincidence, this same day Prince Turki's "resignation" was announced, Robert Mueller was sworn in as FBI Director, and Pakistani ISI Chief Gen. Ahmed arrived in the US for consultations with the CIA, Pentagon and DIA during the following week. This chain of events squares with Senator Graham's observation that the true facts behind the 9/11 "intelligence failure" involve "a couple of foreign intelligence agencies", and these facts may become public in 50 years when the national archive records are finally opened.

Al-Turkey's hasty departure can be taken a couple of ways. Based on history, it doesn't require much imagination to see how it may seem threatening. On the other hand, it seems more likely to signal that Prince al-Turki, who is among the most hawkish members of the Saudi regime regarding armed support for the Sunnis in Iraq, has lost in a struggle for control over U.S. policy.

One hopes Turki's resignation as Saudi Ambassador in Washington may signal that his half-brother, Crown Prince Abdullah (who inherited rule over Saudi Arabia after the death last year of King Faud), has agreed to attempts to reach a negotiated accomodation with Iran and Iraqi Shi'a allies, that would spare a sharp escalation of the mounting civil war. That would be consistent with the expressed agenda of the Iraq Study Group (ISG), which favors a regional settlement and talks with Tehran and Damascus.

The latter interpretation may be supported by a meeting last week between Bush and Iraqi Shi'a leader, Abdul Aziz al-Hakim. NPR commented last week that meeting had alarmed the Saudis. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6573771

Saudis Nervously Watch al-Hakim's U.S. Visit
by Debbie Elliott

All Things Considered, December 3, 2006 · Abdul-Aziz al-Hakim's visit to Washington, D.C., may raise concerns for one of Iraq's neighbors, Saudi Arabia. Analyst Youssef Ibrahim talks with Debbie Elliott about what some are calling a proxy war between Saudi Arabia and Iran that is currently playing out on Iraqi soil.

However, if the Saudis were to take a hard-line position, these events imply an ominous and dangerous turn of events. The Saudis reportedly possess a number of radiological "dirty bombs", and warnings have circulated for years about the threat they potentally pose to the U.S.

A serious split within the ruling Saudi family also presents a dangerous destabilization of the situation in the Middle East and Persian Gulf.

The situation bears close examination. The mass media, so far, has barely scratched the surface of this one.

[Buzz Clik]

1. The Saudis definitely are demanding a reaction.

When someone starts pulling your short hairs, you have few options: do what they want you to do or make a violent attempt to break their grip.

Guess what's in our future with the Bush family at the helm?

[Junkdrawer]

2. Double Proxy war???

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2903159

[Junkdrawer]

21. I see it this way...

If the NeoCons had their way, they would get themselves a Sunni strong-man just like Saddam, only more, well, controllable. And, just like Saddam, said Sunni strong-man could then massacre as many Shia as necessary to put the population back in submission.

Problem is that the rest of the world, especially Iran, Russia and China, won't sit by and let that happen.

So...perhaps the NeoCons could get the Saudis to funnel weapons to the Sunnis and put in place an Iraqi ruler hand picked by the Royal Family. All the while Bush could feign breaking diplomatic relations with the Saudis.

[iconoclastic cat]

3. Could you go post this at Daily Kos?

The news has not hit over there yet, and your analysis is quite good. I think it should be spread around.

[solara]

4. k&r

[TacticalPeek]

5. K&R

:kick:

[seemslikeadream]

6. War

one way or another

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2856177

[stop the bleeding]

13. the possibility of this makes

me very nervous, especially when you take into account the build up of forces, it is not like they are doing "exercises"

I don't think we, America or the world can take another war in that region.

thanks for staying on top of things

[OregonBlue]

7. Where are Bush and Cheney? Where's the Israeli ambassador?

When are they leaving town? Should we be worried?

[ChairmanAgnostic]

8. I'd ask where little miss condi-cakes was, except she would only make things

worse. far worse. The anti-midas girl herself.

[SoCalDem]

9. Condi's probably at a fitting..or shoe shopping

Surely she cannot be bothered with world affairs..

[ChairmanAgnostic]

10. she probably doesn't understand the impact.

No, not probably, she canot fathom what she and her boy have done to this world.

[lutefisk]

18. This could be her defining moment- setting her up for 2008 run

Sure, she's incompetent and overpromoted by her bosses and handlers, but if they play it right she could be the Republican candidate in 2008. Yes, her reverse Midas touch is second only to Junior's, but that won't be the official corporate media take on her over the next two years.

[NEOBuckeye]

30. I seriously doubt it.

The GOP is still very much dominated by women haters and racists. That's two strikes Condi has against her. Working for Bush is the third, so she's out.

[majorjohn]

32. I feel like puking everytime someone mentions her

:puke:condi

[Sinistrous]

11. Hmmm... The last time he bailed was exactly

seven days before September 11, 2001.

I wonder if December 19, 2006 will be another day of infmy.

Sinistrous

[nam78_two]

12. K&R.nt

[Strelnikov_]

14. "He Who Can Destroy A Thing, Can Control A Thing"

Without the Saudi's accepting/holding petrodollars, the US economy is screwed.

Without the Saudi's willing to maintain close to their current levels of petroleum production, the US economy is screwed.

If the Saudi's, as a result of a GOP Reich petrograb, decide to detonate the radiological "dirty bombs" they reportedly have mined their facilities with, the US and Western economies will collapse.


For all their many shortcomings, the Saudi's have provided some semblance of stability in the world oil market. If, through either a falling out with the US or open conflict with the one indigenous Gulf power (Iran), this stability is lost, the US economy, at a minimum, is screwed.

If the Saudi petroleum reserves are lost along with the balance of the Gulf reserves (if Saudi is gone, it is all probably gone), we have Petrocollapse.


Kinda like Dune, isn't it. "The Spice Must Flow".

[DemReadingDU]

15. eyes open, watching to see what develops

K&R

[leftchick]

16. and then there is this....

:scared:

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2006%5C12%5C12%5Cstory_12-12-2006_pg4_8

Saudi clerics seek help for Iraqi Sunnis

RIYADH: A group of prominent Saudi clerics have called on Sunni Muslims around the world to mobilise against Shiites in Iraq, although a statement they issued fell short of calling for a jihad, or holy war.

The statement appearing on Saudi Islamist Web sites on Monday said Sunni Muslims were being murdered and marginalised by Shiites, backed by Iran, and the US-led forces.

Saudi Arabia, a bastion of Sunni Islam, backs the Shiite-dominated government of Nuri al-Maliki largely because it fears that sectarian violence between Sunnis and Shiites could lead to the break-up of its northern neighbour and spill over its borders.

“We direct this message to all concerned about Shiites in the world: the murder, torture and displacement of Sunnis ... is an outrage. We don’t think you would accept to be treated like this,” said the statement, dated Dec 7.

“Muslims must stand directly with our Sunni brothers in Iraq and support them by all appropriate, well-studied means ... Muslims generally should be made aware of the danger of the Shiites,” it said.

[KoKo]

17. After thinking about this awhile....I wonder if

this isn't the Neo-Con plan. To disrupt the whole area. Yet, what about the Saudi and UAI's business interests in the US. Some of them are probably helping prop up our government and stock market...even our Real Estate.

The Neo-Cons are crazy and don't know what they are doing...so could this be their last grab to try to "re-align" the ME? Destablize and then Bush and Blair bring the bombs in? We don't have enough troops but Austrailia has always been happy to help and Blair might still be able to give a supply? This sounds crazy ....and I'm probably way off thinking this but something is going on and we know that Baker was trying to get the Iraqi debt forgiven plus trying to knock head over there to do something about Iraq to save the Chimp's butt. Did he make some bizarre deal with some faction of the Saudi's that has caused a problem or split? :shrug:

[calimary]

31. You may be onto something. They have extolled the virtues of

"creative destruction."

And don't forget Baker's own connections to the Saudis - not only as a longtime tag-along to reagan and bush 1. His firm represents them against the 9/11 families. Great American, wouldn't you say? Who knows, maybe bush 2 will finally be HIS undoing also. Little george fucks up everything he touches. Why would Baker be immune?

[spanone]

19. We'll never know what 'diplomacy' went on between the King & the Dick.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

22. Dick, Mr. Vice president? Bend over while

junior prince #17 applies the Saudi spanking board.

Now, go kneel in the corner on the hard lentils until we tell you you can go.

[KoKo]

20. Are the United Arab Emerites and our allies in Quatar and Kuwait all Shia?

(excuse my ignorance on this) I was just trying to figure out who they would align themselves with if Bush has stirred up trouble with one of the Saudi factions.

[leftchick]

24. Shia are only 10-15% of Muslim Population worldwide

http://pewresearch.org/obdeck/?ObDeckID=44

Which would mean most of our "allies" are likely Sunni.

[aquart]

37. And even though Iran is Shia, Iranians are not Arab Shia.

Iranians will inform you they are Persian. Their language is indoeuropean, not semitic. They think Arabs are scum. So a Shia alliance between Iran and the Iraqi Shia is temporary at best, because the Iraqis will not end up feeling loved.

It's just one other thing to consider.

In fact, my guess is that the best way to destroy the Shia alliance between Iranians and Iraqis is to remove the United States from the equation. Right now, they are all united in hating us. Once we're gone, they'll return to hating the people they've always hated: each other. The Sunni. The Kurds. Israel.

[majorjohn]

33. The governments of those countries are all Sunni

Yet, there are some Shia in all of those countries.

As a matter of fact, it was said that when Saddam invaded Kuwait, almost all the Kuwaitis, especially the members of the ruling family, fled to other countries, except the Shia remained to fight the Iraqi soldiers.

[formercia]

23. I wonder where he was in 1981? n/t

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

25. A convenient reason to send more troops and prolong the war.

"Well, if we don't stay, the Saudis and Iranians will be fighting." I can hear it now.

[smoogatz]

26. The Saudis are VERY worried about an out-of-control, cross-border

civil war developing in Iraq, that could ignite Sunni vs Shi'a hostilities inside Saudi Arabia. The LAST thing they need to deal with is an Iranian-funded, armed Shi'ite insurrection, let alone direct military conflict with Iran. When a diplomat departs abruptly, typically one of two things has happened: either he/she has been caught red-handed, committing flagrant acts of espionage (nominally friendly relations between the US and SA would, in this case, prevent the expulsion of said diplomat by the US government), OR the diplomat feels that he is no longer able to effectively represent his country's interests--either he's been compromised in some way (embarrassing photos in the hands of the CIA, say), or undercut by his own government, or he's just not able to get his point across to his foreign hosts. That said, I'm glad MLA isn't in DC this year...

[redacted]

28. Agreed and well said. And I have to chuckle at the other comments re:

maybe this is how the Bushies planned it - or - maybe the Saudi's will do XYZ to us.

1. the Saudi's need us and our economic growth just as much as we need their oil

2. do you really think bushco is competent enough to intentionally cause this big of a disaster. Mais non, this is pure incompetence that could only come from the cynical idealism held deeply in the belief system of gwbush. From that standpoint you could say it was fated, but certainly not planned.

[Old and In the Way]

36. The boy-king is destroying his father's legacy.

GHW Bush was the grand architect of the SA-Big Oil Policy that has benefited our economy (well, at least his friends) since the 80's. But the continued dependence on ME has been our national security achilles heel, too. George Sr. didn't topple Hussein because he was smart enough to see that that SA needed a secular buffer in Iraq to keep Iran at bay. Bush the Lesser wasn't smart enough to see the downside risks of knocking this buffer out. Not sure what his real motivation for starting this disaster was, but one result will be that the son of the architect that will burn down the family legacy. If it didn't have such negative consequences for the world, it would almost be a fitting and deserved end.

[amandabeech]

38. The current Saudi Foreign Minister, whose name I forget at this

late hour, is gravely ill.

Al-Turki is his brother and one of the leading candidates to move into the Foreign Minister slot.

The other possibility for the FM position is Bandar Bush, former Saudi ambassador to the U.S.

I have read that Turki and Bandar don't like each other very much.

The impending death of the FM and brother could explain the rapid departure of Turki.

[happydreams]

27. It's no biggie....

They are just making arrangements to all fly to Paraguay to their Saudi-Bushie retirement community.

~:tinfoilhat:

[me b zola]

29. k&r

[neuvocat]

34. Sorry to be so dense here

but what exactly is causing the rift? Is it the whole Bush-vs-Daddy thing?

[DrDebug]

35. Three years of catastrophic success

Once upon a time there was a Poppy who wanted to be more than just a simple spook, so he entered into a conspiracy to get rid off the sitting President. That worked out fine and Poppy moved into a position where he was often in a white house. He liked that house and wanted to live there some day. He met some guys in white dresses who wanted to keep their dictatorship in a sandbox far away. Poppy said "What can you do for me?" and the White Dress answered: "You scratch my back and I'll scratch your back" and they entered into a quid-pro-quo agreement. Quid-pro-quo is like an eye for an eye and will make the world blind, but Poppy didn't mind, because he only wanted to live in that white house.

Poppy had a son called DumbFuck. DumbFuck only knew how to party however he had a drinking buddy, Badh, who could used as keep both Poppy and the white dresses happy as they exchanged favors. DumbFuck did some business for the white dresses as well; even though it all failed, everybody could stuff their pockets, so they were all happy for all while.

Poppy finally managed to get into that white house and the white dresses helped him with a war in Fargoneistan which was a success, so next they asked whether he could help them with their evil neighbour, Satam. Poppy was really happy about Fargoneistan so he attacked Satam, however he did not want to get rid off Satam because his country was a hornet's nest.

When Poppy left the white house, he wanted his son DumbFuck to succeed him, however DumbFuck had no brain and nobody liked that plan. So he said "What if something terrible happens? How about having DumbFuck in that white house". Everybody liked that plan, so they planned for something terrible to happen. And DumbFuck then used it to hit the hornet's nest, because he thought that his father was a pussy for not invading.

The white dresses were happy at first, because they didn't have to think about Satam anymore, however Satam's country became worse and worse and DumbFuck and his soldiers could not handle it anymore, and nobody seemed to like DumbFuck either. They asked the man with the brain, Evil-Grin, to help them and do it their ways, but Evil-Grin refused, so the white dresses and DumbFuck are no longer friends, and they will do it there way.

And they lived happily ever after. Actually, they didn't it; They all blew each other to pieces...

[symbolman]

39. A lovely bedtime story

I wish someone could illustrate this, it's wonderfully written.. seems like we have to communicate with the joesixpack crowd with Parables and Fairy Stories anymore, this might work :)

Good one, loved reading it :)


One thing that I CAN tell you is that the Saudis are investing HEAVILY in the Hawaiian Islands (I know for a fact that they are ready to invest a half a trillion bucks) and other spots like Alaska, having bought the Aleyska Resort recently near Denali..

Don't think they'd want to loot our economy if they toss a half a trillion at it, though both spots are pretty isolated if you think about it.

I moved to Hawaii to get out here at the outer edges of the Bush "empire" just in case, figuring they won't blow up a bunch of rich people in resort Islands.

Want to avoid the Mainland for at least 5 years or so, if I get some real money I just might move to Amsterdam and eat bricks of hash for a few years til some of this shit shakes out :)

[jcv1]

40. My thoughts exactly...

The larger question of all this is who is poised to profit and who is going to lose if the whole shebang blows up? It's always about money and what is stirring in the markets to give a clue about this?

[RedEarth]

41. Yes it does.... in particular when you combine the Sunni clerics

in Saudi Arabia calling on Sunnis through out the middle east to support(stopped short of holy war) the Sunnis in Iraq. Then you have Saudi Arabia saying they will use force against the Shiites in Iraq if the US pulls out and massive killings of Sunnis take place.

There should be no doubt Pandora's Box has been opened in the Middle East.