Navy: Speed of tanker sucked sub up to surface (I am calling cover-up on this one)

[TomInTib]

By JACK DORSEY, The Virginian-Pilot
© January 10, 2007

NORFOLK - The submarine Newport News was submerged and leaving the Persian Gulf when a mammoth Japanese oil tanker passed overhead at a high speed, creating a sucking effect that made the sub rise and hit the ship, the Navy said Tuesday.

That is the preliminary finding of Monday's collision between the Norfolk-based submarine and the Mogamigawa, a 1,100-foot-long merchant ship displacing 300,000 tons.

Both were southbound, crossing the busy and narrow Strait of Hormuz while heading into the Arabian Sea.

"As the ship passed over the sub, it ended up sucking the submarine into it," said Lt. Cmdr. Chris Loundermon, a spokesman for Submarine Force in Norfolk.

"It is a principle called the venturi effect," he said.


I say this is a cover-up. If the Newport News was that close-in to the wake of the Mogamigawa, then the sub was using the tanker for cover against detection.
Bad seamanship, mates.

http://content.hamptonroads.com/story.cfm?story=117352&ran=77484&tref=po

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

1. EggsAckly.

That sub was close in on the tanker's wake, trying to evade Iranian radar and sonar, as it transited the straits.

What kind of sub is the Newport News? Boomer, fast attack or specops?

On edit: LA-Class. Fast attack.

[Shipwack]

5. Fast attack...

Though all fast attacks can carry spec op teams, some do it more often than others...

[MADem]

7. They say 'fast attack, no slack' but they should have left some, eh? NT

[YDogg]

6. link about sub

http://www.csg2.navy.mil/Newport%20News/newportnews.htm

[YDogg]

2. so now we know what bush suffers from; the venturi effect.

[NNN0LHI]

3. Couldn't it have been both using the tanker as cover and got sucked up?

I mean one doesn't cancel out the other does it?

Don

[TomInTib]

14. Sure, that's exactly what happened.

Major screwup.

There are all manner of formula and protocol regarding this.
There are many factors involved, but I am simply stating that this was no mere 'collision'.
And the USN is covering it up.

Notice how this was barely a blip on MSM?

[MADem]

4. Depends on how close they were cutting it. But I do agree with the bad seamanship business.

Someone was inattentive.


It reads like just a minor fender bender, though. If the vessel had major damage, she would be taken under tow or do surface ops all the way to repair.

Damage to the Norfolk-based Newport News appears to be confined to the bow, he said. The sail, or mast, and the sub's nuclear reactor were unharmed, he said.

Aand ahl said he could not discuss details such as the speed or depth of the submarine at the time of the impact.

Aandahl emphasized that the Newport News was not surfacing at the time, as was reported earlier by CNN.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

10. The captain of that boat...

Is now pondering the phrase "career-limiting move".

Fender-benders in naval sea-going vehicles are not generally glossed over.

[MADem]

13. What's the phrase...he's reached his terminal rank.

That's 0-5, he'll go ride a desk if he hasn't hit twenty, and go home.

Unless there's a HUGE factor in mitigation, like, say, he's one of the CNO's favorite for some reason, or he's married to SUBLANT's ugly daughter.

It's a bummer when that kind of stuff happens. And it is even worse when it isn't something the skipper or crew could control. But he takes the hit, no matter what. The article says nothing about relief for cause, but it's early days, yet...and the full investigation hasn't even begun.

[Deep13]

8. Is that even possible?

:shrug:

[TomInTib]

16. Completely

This is the maritime equivalent of a rear-end collision in a car.

Picture "drafting" in a race car and the tailing car gets too close and is sucked in by the thinner air behind the lead car.

[SoCalDem]

9. Shades of the Ehimi Maru... n/t

[Shipwack]

11. Not to be mean, but I think you watch too many Hollywood movies...

There really isn't a lot of maneuvering room in that area, nor depth for a submarine to use. I find the story highly believable as is without any sort of "clandestine spec-ops against Iran" speculation...

Not that this excuses the ship... I get the feeling that whichever officer was on watch at the time made a poor choice in either positioning, timing, ships status, or depth. This is most likely the captain, but it could have been a more junior officer to screw up the initial positioning/conditioning...

[TomInTib]

15. I haven't watched a movie in 20 years.

And I do not read novels, either.

But I was/am SO (SEAL) and I have been subbed in for ops.

While I am not saying that this was any SO, I am saying that this was a major screw-up while trying to evade detection.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

12. Yeah, I got yer "sucking sound" right here, Admiral!

I'd first believe the tanker could displace enough water to push the sub to the bottom. Where does tne "pull" force come from?

I call bullshit. Venturi effect my ass.

[Ezlivin]

17. Wrong.

My boat was nearly T-boned by a Soviet destroyer. We had just come to PD and the OD was doing a quick 360° scan when the periscope broke the surface. He saw the foam splattered bow of a Soviet destroyer heading straight toward us and ordered an emergency dive. The damned destroyer came so close to us that we could hear the screws overhead.

But we weren't sucked up or moved at all by its passage.

The story for SSN Newport News is simple: It was shadowing another ship to hide its own noise.

[TomInTib]

18. You are correct on one count and mistaken on another

The sub was definitely shadowing.

But a destroyer doesn't displace 300,000 tons. The venturi effect is exponential.

That is a 43:1 displacement difference ratio.

And that is huge.

[Ezlivin]

19. But it was a BIG Soviet destroyer

:)

Don't tell a submariner that a ship about to split it in two isn't big. Have you had a look at a ship bearing down on you through a 'scope? :o

It does seem that SSN Newport News was too damned close to the tanker, though. It could have shadowed at a distance of a hundred yards and I would think that the noise generated from dirty, banged up and possibly cavitating screws would scrub any noise the boat would have made. Considering it was a LA-Class boat it should have been pretty "silent."

You've got the watch. I'm heading topside...

[originalpckelly]

20. Who knew tankers gave blow jobs?

EEEEEEEEW!