MTP -- Dodd and Hagel were on fire! They had their arguments DOWN!

[scarletwoman]

It was awesome!

I usually work Sundays, so it's quite rare that I'm home to watch the Sunday morning network talking head pundit shows. Also, not having cable/satellite, my usual television punditry exposure is limited to the Network evening news shows and the PBS News Hour.

Unfortunately, not being in the habit of watching TV on Sunday morning, I almost forgot to check out Meet the Press et al, so I tuned in late. My first stop was to listen to Steven Hadley lying through his teeth to the lovely and talented George Stephanopolis on ABC, about 10 minutes in.

Well, that was pretty unbearable, so I switched to NBC -- and Wow, Tim Russert has really gotten MUCH more rotund than I remember him being!

(ahem) What I caught was (happily) the beginning of a panel discussion on the merits or lack thereof in the chimperor's "New Plan for Iraq"; with Senators Chris Dodd(D) and Chuck Hagel(R) on the "anti-" side, and (surprise! surprise!) Joe Lieberman(?) and some-guy-I-never-heard-of-before(R) (Lynch or something? from Texas, maybe?) on the "pro" side.

Dodd and Hagel were truly on their game. They had their arguments down, they had supporting citations, they had an admirable grasp of the facts, they offered clear common-sense alternative strategies, and they spoke boldly without stumble or stammer and with genuine fire. I was VERY impressed.

Lieberman, of course, was a very fountain of vomitous bushite "War on Terror" canards -- climaxing with a flourish of the 9/11 bloody shirt worthy of a fan dancer.

I loathe his voice. I loathe his words, too -- but it is the timbre and tone of his voice -- the weepy, whiny nasality of it -- that drives me to fantasies of violence. ("Just SHUT UP, Joe, you seeping pustule on the butt of humanity, just SHUT UP!" *SLAP*)

The Republican Guy was just a less annoyingly voiced echo.

But, Dodd and Hagel! That was beautiful to watch! And Tim didn't get in the way of their making their points, either.

Hopefully, a transcript will go up eventually -- I'm no good as play-by-reporter, sorry. I just wanted to post my huzzah to those two for doing a sterling job of making the anti-surge case. If I weren't such a cynic, I'd almost feel heartened by what I saw. ;-)

sw

P.S. That particular MTP discussion having conclued, I flipped over to see what was shaking on CBS, and there was the lovely and talented Senator Obama, stuttering and stammering and temporizing and triangulating his way through basically the same question. It was embarrassing to watch after the fire and intelligence of Dodd and Hagel. Sorry, Obama fans, I see the charm, but I don't see the substance or the street cred.

[Roxy66]

1. How would have thunk...we'd be cheering on Hagel

But Leiberman is an opportunistic hack!!!

[Ezlivin]

3. It's because we cheer the truth - regardless of who says it

And the NeoCons can't do that.

[Minnesota_Lib]

25. Ahmen

[MadMaddie]

2. Well I appreciate your play by play...not bad..

And I can't stand Lieberwhore either.

[capi888]

4. Posted on DU political thread...here is Hagels words

repost:

Hagel takes Leiberman to task...watch it. Joe is sucking his lips. I can't stand him...
Hagel said, after JL uttered, that the people that are against the war are abdicating defeat! Hagel said, I am not, nor any member of Congress is abdicating defeat, thats rediculous and I am offended that any responsible member of Congress would even sugest such a thing!!!! Joe sat their with the look of egg on his face..LOL...Hagel was angry, and said more.....you have to listen..and look at Joes mug...LOL

[bluewave]

8. Wow

Hagel rips LIEberman a new a**hole. I'll be monitoring Youtube for the video. :)

[Beaverhausen]

18. There were two such smackdowns- the other about children

Hagel reminding Lieberdweeb that everyone is worried about their children and grandchildren and to suggest otherwise was offensive. Hagel was great.

I knew some of the smarter republicans would finally see the light.

[scarletwoman]

9. Thank you. I do wish I were better at writing this stuff down on the fly, but I'm too busy

listening when it's going down.

sw

[pacalo]

5. I've been an admirer of Christopher Dodd for many years.

He has good common sense, expresses himself well -- just all around decent, intelligent man.

You expressed how I feel about listening to Lieberman: weepy, whiny nasal tone. Add "know-it-all" to that.

Excellent post! I'm looking forward to watching MTP later on tonight. Did you know that MTP is shown on Sunday nights on CNBC or MSNBC for those who miss the morning broadcast? Check your local listings. :)

[CrazyOrangeCat]

6. I enjoyed your post.

You can play-by-play any day of the week.

And yes, Joementum, that cloying little irrelevant twit, is a "seeping pustule on the butt of humanity."

Nicely done.

[scarletwoman]

10. Thank you! And I love "cloying little irrelevant twit" !

:D

sw

[leftchick]

7. lol!

sorry but I don't even see the obama "charm". never have. :shrug:


Thank you for the recap sw!

:)

[scarletwoman]

11. Oh, c'mon. You know he's cute. And he's quite eloquent when he talks about himself.

;-)

sw
:hi:

[leftchick]

12. you are killing me sw

:rofl:

[Blue_In_AK]

20. Sadly, I'm there with you on that one...

I keep trying to like the guy and be enthusiastic, but I still haven't been able to grab onto anything of substance. :shrug:

[scarletwoman]

26. It's easy for me. I have no questions for which he is the answer.

:evilgrin:

sw

[leftchick]

31. it is all media hype

there is nothing to him. Now Kucinich, who actually has plans for Iraq and everything else, who never waivers, who wants to bring the troops, home is NEVER mentioned as a contender. The US media totally ignores him. As usual the M$M will drive the discussion and with the help of the DLC, who are always on TV, pick our candidate for us.

:(

[scarletwoman]

35. Well, we just keep pushing back. There's more of us dirty hippies on the internet

than there are of them. As long as we keep countering their narrative -- even if it's just among ourselves -- it DOES have ripple effects into the wider world.

As usual, the M$M will drive the discussion and with the help of the DLC, who are always on TV, pick our candidate for us.

It's not that this won't happen again, but we CAN make it harder for them, just by paying attention and sharing our genuine observations. And they'll know we're on to them.

sw

[Blue_In_AK]

37. Dirty hippie and proud - checking in. :-)

(Well, actually, not so dirty anymore, but still a hippie.)

[scarletwoman]

42. LOL. I'm not so dirty either -- just showered last night, in fact.

Hippie til I die, though. :hippie:

sw
:hi:

[tblue37]

48. He reminds me of Hillary. They are both triangulating their little

hearts out, trying to be all things to all people, because their ambiton is the only thing that drives them--not principle.

[scarletwoman]

49. Yup. That's just how I see it. (nt)

[Peace Patriot]

13. Christopher Dodd was a chief architect of the "Help America Vote For Bush

Act" of 2002, in collusion with the biggest crooks in the Anthrax Congress, Tom Delay and Bob Ney. This was the coup by which 2 rightwing Bushite electronic voting corporations gained control of our election results, with the fast-tracking of electronic voting systems run on TRADE SECRET, PROPRIETARY programming code, with virtually no audit/recount controls. And they are...

DIEBOLD: Until recently, headed by Wally O'Dell, a Bush-Cheney campaign chair and major fundraiser (a Bush "Pioneer," right up there with Ken Lay), who promised in writing to "deliver Ohio's electoral votes to Bush-Cheney in 2004"; and

ES&S: A spinoff of Diebold (similar computer architecture), initially funded by rightwing billionaire Howard Ahmanson, who also gave one million dollars to the extremist 'christian' Chalcedon Foundation (which touts the death penalty for homosexuals, among other things). Diebold and ES&S have an incestuous relationship; until recently, they were run by two brothers, Bob and Tod Urosevich.

These are the people who "counted" 80% of the nation's votes in 2004, under a veil of corporate secrecy--thanks in large part to Christopher Dodd.

Chuck Hagel gained power by being voted into office by his own electronic voting company, the predecessor to ES&S.

------------------------

In my first vote for president, in 1964, I voted for the "peace candidate"--LBJ. That's how he was sold to us--the "peace candidate." What I got for that vote was upwards of 2 million people slaughtered in Southeast Asia.

Lesson: Beware of Democrats bearing peace.

This lesson is more apt for Christopher Dodd than for any other Democrat who voted to give away Congress' war powers to George Bush. Dodd helped to keep Bush in power in the most non-transparent election ever held--an election worthy of Stalin--in which the votes could not be recounted, because no state was required to do an audit of the new, unreliable, insecure and extremely insider hackable electronic voting systems, owned and controlled by Bushites.

What Christopher Dodd did--in colluding with Delay and Ney on this non-transparent, Bushite-controlled election system--may well have been the end of American democracy. If you want to praise this snake in the grass for his smooth talk on Iraq now, that is your right, but please do it in full knowledge of what this man did to our country.

The non-transparent Diebold/ES&S vote counting in 2004 is more than likely responsible for the continued war, for all the deaths that have occurred since then, and for Bush/Cheney's tyrannical power to widen the war into Iran--and for our inability to stop them. Of the whole song and dance that our Democratic leaders are doing about the "surge" (some more sincerely than others, and some more legitimately elected than others), this one--Dodd's--makes me sick to my stomach, because I think he is the War Profiteers' stealth candidate. I think he is LBJ.

[Nabia2004]

16. thank you, we must not forget who these people are - nt

[dwahzon]

23. I'm no expert

on the passage of HAVA or all the particulars about Chris Dodd's support of it. But I do recall reading sometime back that his strong support stemmed from a close relative who is significantly disabled. The electronic voting solution allowed this person to participate without having the ballot read to them and marked by a third party.

Please note that I agree with paper-trail all the way but the person above has not been entirely forthcoming on Dodd's reasons for support. I think that we can all agree that considerations for the differently-abled should be part of the voting process.

That said, I don't think that Dodd should have been as rigid as he was on the electronic voting issue and I know that there is a group here in CT that's continuing to actively work on educating Dodd on this.

[scarletwoman]

24. Your point is taken. At the same time, please notice that I confined my praise of

Dodd and Hagel very specifically to their performance on MTP this morning, and nothing else. Their presidential aspirations -- which didn't even occur to me until you brought it up -- are irrelevent to me since neither of them are people whom I could ever imagine voting for.

Whatever else they have done in their careers -- and of course it's sleazy and sordid, much like nearly all bigshot politicos -- this morning they did us a genuine service by speaking eloquently in support of a position we agree with.

Giving approval to a single performance does not carry with it a blanket amnesty for all past sins, nor does it imply any endorsement beyond the moment.

sw

[knowledgeispwr]

34. Well said. n/t

[Alamom]

14. Thanks for posting, I wish I had watched. K &R. n/t

[Beaverhausen]

22. Meet The Press gets rerun at some point today - or tonight

check your local listings! :hi:

[BlackVelvet04]

15. Did either of them mention

that as the U.S. steps up its presence in Iraq, allies are pulling out?

According to an AP article in my local paper the Italians have left, the Slovaks are about to, Britain wants to start getting out as do Danes and South Koreans.

I can't find this article on line for some reason.

[Jennicut]

17. At least we have one decent intelligent senator here in CT

I am happy to see Dodd standing up against Joe's madness. I really detest Joe, I refuse to recognize him as my senator. Bush has led us down this path to destruction and Joe is just egging him on and defending him. Its ridiculous. Nice to see a Republican stand up to Bush without fear. Keep taking it to him, Hagel!

[Tinksrival]

19. Great post scarletwomen

I enjoyed your play-by-play!

[MissWaverly]

21. I too thought Lieberman was spouting per Rove

I care about my children and grandchildren and anyone who doesn't support this president
1000% is an uncaring slob that doesn't - that was the frame, Hagel fired back that he
found his statements offensive. Bush strategy has ALWAYS been the personal attack, it's
how he was elected in a rigged election in 2004 with NO PLAN for Iraq. I am so glad that others are standing up and saying nobody wants defeat but sending in 20,000 more troops is not going to negotiate a peaceful end to the sectarian violence in Iraq.

[OregonBlue]

27. I also listened to Obama and heard nothing but obfuscation and avoidance.

Hey, he's good looking but where was the substance when it came to the hard questions? Very disappointed!!

[NightOwwl]

28. Excellent play-by-play.

Your description of Lieberman's appearance (especially loved the "fountain of vomitous bullshit") is right on the mark. Don'tcha just know he must have been the most hated kid in school when he was growing up.

[scarletwoman]

29. Thank you. Lieberman inspires the poet in me...

:7

sw

[KoKo]

30. Great Report and Observations! Thanks!

I watched it and had your same reaction. Please someone get the "hook" and pull Lieberman off the Stage! He get's more and more disgusting and whiney every time I see him.

Hagel and Dodd really were fantastic. I missed Obama but saw Kerry on CNN with Wolf Blitzer and talk about stammering and stuttering :eyes: I couldn't make sense of what he was saying.

[scarletwoman]

32. Glad to know you saw it too!

No cable, therefore no Kerry -- no great loss, apparently. Too bad.

Always good to hear from another Lieberman unfan.

sw
:hi:

[Inuca]

33. The guy you never heard of was...

... the abominable Kyl from Arizona.

[scarletwoman]

36. Thank you. My apologies to Texas -- and what the hell is wrong with Arizonans?

This guy AND McCain? Good grief!

sw

[Inuca]

44. Texas is not faring any better

Abominable as Kyl is, I think he pales in comparison to Cornyn.

[scarletwoman]

45. Yes, but it's only fair that we give credit to the proper state as to which vile bastard

belongs to whom. ;-)

sw

[Swamp Rat]

38. k&r for the truth...

no matter who says it.

[CatWoman]

40. Swampy!!!

where ya at????

congrats on The Saints win last night!! :hi:

[Swamp Rat]

41. Way'at dawlin'!

:hug:

Who dat say dey gonna beat dem Saints?! WHO DAT?!!

GEAUX SAINTS!!!!

[scarletwoman]

43. Merci! What you said! Get that truth out there! (nt)

[tabatha]

39. For Chuck Hagel, check

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/01/14/chuck-hagel-smacks-lieberman/

[notadmblnd]

46. It's up at Crooks and liars

http://www.crooksandliars.com/

[goforit]

47. William Crystal and Lieberman have that pathetic whining voice,yet very leathal

Snakes in the brush!