Just saw on CNN ticker tape that the info that Libby leaked DID NOT

[helderheid]

contain Plame's name.

[DoYouEverWonder]

1. To everything

spin, spin, spin....

[htuttle]

2. "Technically."

:rofl:

[Tempest]

3. What the info DID say

Was that a plan would be initiated to discredit Joe Wilson.

The leaking of Plame's name was part of that plan.

Fitzgerald was given ammunition to prove a conspiracy, which is much worse.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

11. And, the conspiracy includes our Fearless AWOL Leader. LOL!! :-))

[Tempest]

15. Yup, goes all the way to the top

Bush makes Nixon look like a saint.

[ladjf]

31. By comparison, Nixon was a petty shop lifter.

[TahitiNut]

26. (Hiya, Temp!) Yep. It's spelled RICO.

Racketeering In Corrupt Organizations. It's the conspiracy that's NOT a theory and if the case qualifies as a RICO case then both the statute of limitations no longer offers protection ("on-going criminal enterprise") and the rules of evidence acquisition become more powerful from a prosecutorial standpoint. This is why the 'obstruction' indictments (and possible 'conspiracy' indictments) are so important - Libby and company have nowhere easy to hide. The WHIG is key to this, and it's been obvious.


To other DUers: It's Tempest you can blame for me being here. He tattled on DU in late 2001. :evilgrin:

[Tempest]

35. Now if we can only get the Dems to push it

But I wouldn't count on it, especially after what we saw happened when Feingold tried for censure.


"It's Tempest you can blame for me being here. He tattled on DU in late 2001."

So that's why no one talks to me anymore. ;)

[Media_Lies_Daily]

4. Do you believe that?

[Debi]

5. Just the letters that spelling her name....right????

:shrug:

[unblock]

6. "joe wilson's wife. valerie rhymes-with-flame.

neener neener, didn't say her name, can't catch me!"

[helderheid]

8. LOL

[Just Me]

24. ROTFLMAO!!!!

:rofl:

The RRRRRRats are in a corner. la la lala la

DAYUM,...I do believe I FFEEELLLL the pendulum swinging, the tide turning, the storm brewin.

:rofl:

They. are. fucked!!!!

[LSK]

7. recycled spin from last year

Cant they find something new???

[Guaranteed]

9. That's not necessarily true. First, we're just talking about what the

court documents say. THEY do not mention Plame's name. That doesn't mean that Plame's name leak wasn't authorized. In fact, her name was central to the idea that they were deliberately leaking, that Wilson's report was biased.

HOWEVER, this PARTICULAR leak in which Plame's name was disclosed WAS authorized by Bush. Her name was disclosed as a RESULT of Bush's authorization, whether he specifically authorized it or not.

In any case, from Leopold's article, it looks like there is a WHOLE lot more to this story that is coming out. It looks like there was a conspiracy.

[H2O Man]

The NIE

and Plame's identity are distinct. One can read pages 27-28 of Fitzgerald's document, and see the error that some folks are making in assuming otherwise. The truth is significant enough, for what it is.

[Emit]

21. I'm not sure I follow, H2O Man.

I'm coming in late to this news, so haven't read all the pertinent threads/articles yet. Can you clarify your comment, please. Thanks so much.

[H2O Man]

28. Sure.

Bush told Cheney to release the NIE information gathered through the OSP about the tubes they claimed were for WMD production. He did not, so far as is reported by Fitzgerald in his document #80, say anything that indicates he wanted Plame's identity released. In fact, on pages 27-28, Fitzgerald is very clear in saying Bush was unaware that Libby had exposed Plame:

"During this time, while the President was unaware of the role that the Vice President's Chief of Staff and National Security Adviser had in fact played in disclosing Ms. Wilson's CIA employment, defendant implored White House officials to have a public statement issued exonerating him."

It would take a tortured interpretation to twist that into Bush okaying the exposing of Plame, based on Fitzgerald's document. Sadly, some people continue to do just that.

The truth about this document is significant enough in it's own right. It needed be stretched.

More, an interesting report by Jason Leopold this afternoon suggests that there is evidence, distinct from the Fitzgerald document, that shows Bush became aware of the truth, and may have misrepresented this when meeting with Fitzgerald. I'm convinced that his reporting is accurate. But it is worth our while to be accurate in our examination of what today's news says and means.

Today is one of those days that has "Watergate" significance.

[Emit]

33. Thanks ever so much! n/t

[BelgianMadCow]

34. Thank you indeed! This should be an OP

as a lot of DUers have that misconception. I've seen the distinction before made by you but this time you outlined it sharper.

[LSparkle]

10. This is worse

He SELECTIVELY leaked info that supported the case for war to Judy Miller (MAJOR pro-war mouthpiece), while CONVENIENTLY failing to mention that there was also intel that did NOT support it. Not only was it manipulation of the public, but after all this talk about "9/11 changed everything," why on earth would these goons leak classified intel about something as serious as going to war? THEY are the ones with the faulty "pre-9/11 mindset."

[Bucky]

12. Tomayto, Tomahto

The president authorized leaks of classified information. It's a crime. What's next?

[baldguy]

20. b...b...but....we're AT WAR.... WITH BLOODTHIRSTY GODLESS TERRA-ISTS!!!!!!

The pResident can do anything he wants to protect the Fatherl ... er, um the Homeland!

[in_cog_ni_to]

22. It's not a crime for the Idiot and Cheney to leak classified info.

The report I saw said the prez and vp are the only ones who can legally leak classified info, BUT what MOST presidents do is contact intelligence agencies to make sure what they leak will not compromise important agents or investigations. Of course the assholes in THIS regime did no such thing. Why is that?

Classified INFORMATION should be different than exposing a CIA UNDERCOVER AGENT. Isn't that TREASON?

[mandyky]

13. I think Rove is the one who actually said her name

Libby leaks info to Novak, saying Wilson's wife got him the gig. Novak thinks about it a bit and then asks Rove what Wilson's wife does...

[helderheid]

14. and why the hell wasn't Novak convicted? Why is he walking around?

[H2O Man]

16. He didn't break the law.

As a rule, people need to break a law to be convicted.

[helderheid]

19. I thought his publishing that info WAS breaking the law by publically

outing Plame. :shrug:

[H2O Man]

23. The crime

that was originally investigated was the sharing of the covert agent's identity. The senior administration officials who shared it with journalists potentially broke the law. Thus, it makes absolutely no difference if they shared it with a journalist like Novak who reported it, or Miller, who did not. The crime is the outing of the agent by those with knowledge of her classified status -- meaning they had the authority to know it -- and not in the journalist writing that the official told them.

[benburch]

17. I think he is cooperating with the prosecutor. nt

[H2O Man]

29. Yes.

He cooperated.

[KAZ]

18. He sung.

I shook his hand in 1990. I know grease when I feel it.

[0007]

27. Did he flash 85% of his false teeth?

[applegrove]

25. Yep. It was again - other info of WMD and assessments. Again Libby

is trying to create context for his actions. Context that stuff was declasified and leaked legally by Bush/Cheney. To back up his claim that his leaks on Plame were just "???".

Though with all the tapes coming back on air of Bush saying "I don't like leakers"... or whatever those old video tapes say.. it does show Bush as a hypo.

[Garbo 2004]

30. Libby said he was authorized to leak NIE info, not Plame. That was his

purpose, he said, in meeting Judy Miller on July 8: to provide classified info on Iraq. It's his cover story. He claimed he didn't know or forgot that he knew Plame's identity when he met with Judy so he couldn't have leaked it.

Libby couldn't testify that he was authorized to leak Plame's identity when at the same time he denied knowing her identity and denied leaking it.

The media got the headlines wrong about what Libby actually testified to based on Fitz's court filing, which is one reason why they're dialing back on the story. (Plus I bet they got some quick phone calls too, LOL.)

One can reasonably assume that Libby was authorized at some level to leak everything. But that's not his testimony. He tied himself up with his own lies.

Unfortunately for Scoots, Judy got tired of the slammer and testified that not only did Libby told her about Wilson's wife on July 8 but also at a previously undisclosed meeting they had on June 23.

[H2O Man]

32. Yep.

Exactly right. I think this will have people looking closer at who may have been in on the plan to leak Ms. Wilson's name. VP Cheney is in trouble.

The truth as reported, of course, is extremely damaging for Bush.

[Alamom]

36. To all who remember "Watergate".......does this feel like Aug. '74

We didn't have 24 hour news then and no "internets". We waited on the evening news everyday to find out what was happening. I never believed Nixon would go down. (I was young) I thought somone would fix the mess then. They didn't.

Can they fix this or do you all think we'll see "IT" again?

Best Guess ? :think: