The Democrats are doing an amazing job. We are turning the tables on Rove.

[Dark]

No, seriously. They are.

I was like many Democrats are now: disillusioned, disappointed, discombobulated and distressed. But I realized something. We are turning the tables on Rove.

No, seriously. We are.

Look at the recent issues in Congress. Stem Cell Research. Curbing Gas Price Hikes. The Minimum Wage Bill. The Attorney Scandal.

Yes, they did fail to end the Iraq war. But to those who say "IMPEACH CHIMPY!!!!111!", I say this:




Impeachment is off the table. Not because Nancy Pelosi said so, but because, numerically, we can't acheive it.

But that was the start of the Dems' plan. They knew they couldn't impeach W. They don't have the votes.

Instead, the Dems focused on destroying the Republicans' base. Each of the issues I mentioned are ones the vast majority of Americans agree with the Dems on.

AND ISSUES PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH HAS EMPHATICALLY OPPOSED.

Gee, that's strange.

Notice how gay marriage, abortion and religion have disappeared from the stage?

... but ... but ... what about immigration?

Ok, immigration. A subject you should know appeals to SOME liberal bases and revolts OTHER liberal bases.

But, and here's just my thoughts, maybe the Dems are, I don't know, SPENDING SOME POLITICAL CAPITAL.

You know, the kind George W. Bush (falsely) claimed he had after the 2004 election.

But, and this is important,

SOME LIBERALS FAVOR THIS,

and some oppose it.

But, Bush shares the "credit" for this decision too.

For conservatives?

THEY'RE ALL AGAINST IT.
Excluding the (tiny) minority of the rich, the Republicans HATE THE IDEA OF ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS.

Hell, they're the reason the bill failed

The Conservative base is abandoning Bush because the Democrats keep throwing good bills at George W. Bush that make him look bad.

Now, here's my idea:

MAYBE, just maybe, the Dems are intelligent enough to count.

And therefore they're able to count high enough that they, unlike the majority of their base,

REALIZE THAT IMPEACHMENT IS IMPOSSIBLE AT THIS POINT

Maybe, they're trying to do some good on issues they know they have a chance with, like STEM CELLS, which the vast majority of Americans support,

AND in the process make more and more republicans abandon the President.

AND, make a lot of Republicans more comfortable with compromises.

and,

now here's the kicker,

GARNER ENOUGH VOTES TO OVERRIDE HIS VETO, END THE WAR, AND IMPEACH PRESIDENT SHIT-FOR-BRAINS!

Just a thought ...

[Gregorian]

1. And maybe they want to start impeachment with Gonzales first.

I've also had the same thought tonight. Maybe they're biding their time until the prognosis of a conviction is more realistic. It's a very sad thought. But maybe the only way to accomplish the goal.

[Dark]

8. It's not necesarily a bad thought.

Would you rather we strike soon, a score a flesh wound,

or a definite strike, indicting the lot of them?

i think the dems are making sure their case is infallible.

[tridim]

2. We have the WH by their collective balls.

Squeezing.. Squeezing.. Squeeeeeezing..

Bush, Rove and The Dick just might call it quits before the pain gets too intense.

The Cheney WH without power? Inconceivable!

[Dark]

10. We are much better off than people think, esp on DU n/t

[pat_k]

29. As long as the massive power of the American presidency. . .

. . . is allowed to stay in the hands of proven outlaws, the outlaws have free reign.

It is irrational to think that anything short of impeachment can stop men who torture and illegally spy in plain sight. Who openly corrupt our justice department to steal our elections. Who abuse signing statements to nullify the laws we pass. Who violate our laws at whim "to protect us.

Bush and Cheney will abuse the power of the American presidency to advance the agenda of their fascist faction until they are forced to out.

The only REAL fight is the fight to impeach and remove.

All other "fights" are a sham.

The American people can tell the difference. Their disdain is reflected in the polls.

[On the Road]

3. I Had Been in Favor of Impeaching Gonzalez

but as long as they can't even get a nonbinding confidence measure through, impeachment is a waste. *IF* they can get enough goods to any of them to flip half the Republicans, *THEN* it's full speed ahead.

If that seems impossible? It worked with Nixon. And Bush has a lot more dirt to uncover.

[Dark]

14. Exactly. This Congress still has fourteen months before the next election.

There's a lot more dirt to uncover

:evilgrin:

THERE IS HOPE!!!

[WilliamPitt]

4. Ted Kennedy is why immigration is an open issue right now.

His push for legislation on immigration has detonated a whole bunch of buried bombs within the GOP coalition.

===

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/060707R.shtml

Double, Double, Toil and Trouble
By William Rivers Pitt
t r u t h o u t | Columnist

Thursday 07 June 2007

(snip)

On the home front, the GOP is dealing with a potentially catastrophic rift within its coalition over how to deal with illegal immigration. The roots of this dilemma are found within the coalition's basic formulation.

On one side are the movement conservatives, the Evangelical activists, the anti-choice single-issue voters who can be depended on to vote en masse for any national Republican candidate who says the right things about fetuses and Jesus. These people amount to roughly 25 percent of the electorate that actually votes, making them the single most dependable voting bloc in Republican politics.

On the other side are the big-money GOP supporters, the captains of industry who write the campaign checks and generally, if anonymously, control most everything in the country. The movement conservatives get a lot of lip service from the GOP, but the check-writers are the most important constituency of the party.

Therein lies the problem. The current crop of right-wing GOP leaders owe their power to the straddle they've managed to maintain since the Reagan days; by keeping one foot firmly planted in both of these groups, the GOP has been able to exploit the movement base's dedicated activism (without actually doing much of anything to fulfill their desires) while making sure the big-money boys get pretty much whatever they ask for.

The movement faction hasn't quite realized the degree to which they are considered useful-idiot cannon fodder by GOP officeholders and the check-writing faction. Whenever the GOP needs to divide public sentiment or distract public attention, the movement people get deployed to scream about gay rights, the Ten Commandments, snowflake babies, or whatever happens to be available at the moment. By mouthing platitudes about these issues, the party fools the movement faction into thinking the party actually cares about them.

But now, there is this immigration debate, which threatens to rip the scales from the eyes of the movement faction. Battalions of GOP politicians have made careers out of spitting venom at illegal immigrants to gain support from the movement base. Simultaneously, however, those same politicians have been accepting gigantic campaign checks from the big-money faction, who absolutely depend on easy access to the dirt-cheap pool of slave labor availed to them by the existence of millions of undocumented immigrants within the US.

The problem for the GOP politicians, of course, is that their movement-faction constituents have bought into their demagoguery about illegal immigration to such a degree that, today, this issue is second only to abortion on their list of Hated Things. The issue has birthed a seething anger within the movement faction aimed at illegal immigrants in general, but now aimed also at any GOP politician who stands for anything besides mass deportations.

But there are all those checks to consider, right?

The money faction didn't spend all those precious ducats buying GOP politicians by the gross, only to have their pet politicos go and legislate that huge pool of cheap labor back across the border. This creates an unsolvable conundrum for the GOP. The movement faction wants border fences and draconian deportations, the money faction wants cheap labor to boost profits, and no conceivable legislative offering can untie this Gordian knot.

Satisfying one faction absolutely means betraying the other. If the GOP pushes for a hard-core immigration bill to satisfy the movement faction, the check-writers will be screwed and may retaliate harshly. If they choose to satisfy the money faction, the movement faction will quite literally detonate, and could decide to stay home when the '08 elections come around.

...more...

[patrice]

6. Aren't at least some of "the check writers" hedging their bet

with Hillary?

[Dark]

13. Exactly.

The Dems are now in a position to EXPOSE these abuses,

but not punish those abuses.

They have to rely on the media and the public to remember these.

Not the best strategy, I know.

But by bringing these scandals to light,

they may pave the way for acceptance of invvestigations of more ... "conspiracy theory" ideas.

Once again, just sayin' ...

[WilliamPitt]

22. Or...

They've made the following political calculation:

1. Dithering around with immigration without solving anything exacerbates huge rifs in the GOP coalition by keeping it a live, public issue;

2. This sucks for anyone affected in the short term, but in the long term, a crippled GOP makes real, true, actual and effective legislation for this far more likely to happen within the next two years.

[mzmolly]

25. Very good analysis, I do think the Dems should involve unions somehow in

if they can?

http://blog.aflcio.org/2007/03/23/legislation-strives-for-real-immigration-reform/

http://www.aflcio.org/aboutus/thisistheaflcio/ecouncil/ec0216200b.cfm

Undocumented workers have a right under the law to form and join unions, engage in collective bargaining and participate in other forms of "concerted activity" protected by the NLRA. A.F.L.C.I.O

I think if we can strengthen unions while we weaken Republicans we get two-fer, and we would not alienate some on the left who fear a weakening of the work force ala immigration. Get right on that huh? ;)

[Canuckistanian]

26. One problem with that

They always seem to be able to unite on these "little" issues like non-confidence motions or political appointments. How many GOP members said that Gonzo should resign? Yet, when voting time comes, they march in lock-step. Again.

They're remarkably good at preventing even minor Democratic victories.

So, unless that kind of solidarity is interfered with, they'll just continue doing the same thing.

[corkhead]

34. I wish I could recommend this post.

exactly right.:toast:

[Lasher]

36. Or in other words...

[patrice]

5. Howard Fineman was telling KO that the Republicans will lose it all

on the next round of appropriations, in September.

[Dark]

17. I could see it. Congress could have control of the gov't easily with its finances.

And by Sept.,let's hope, the changes will not be a surge.

[pacalo]

7. It's more than "having enough votes"! It's about holding them accountable, giving them the message

that their way of doing business is against the law & won't be tolerated. If there aren't enough votes to convict, at least we would have shown the world that the boy king & his band of thugs do not speak for the rest of us, particularly the founders of this country. That message alone is all the reason to put those thugs on trial. The Republican presidential candidates are already dusting their filthy shoes on the welcome mat: listening to them, it's clear that they plan to carry on in the boy king's tradition. If this administration isn't held to account, we can expect to see another BushCo.

To dream the impossible dream
To fight the unbeatable foe
To bear with unbearable sorrow
To run where the brave dare not go
To right the unrightable wrong
To love pure and chaste from afar
To try when your arms are too weary
To reach the unreachable star

This is my quest
To follow that star
No matter how hopeless
No matter how far

To fight for the right
Without question or pause
To be willing to march into Hell
For a heavenly cause

And I know if I'll only be true
To this glorious quest
That my heart will lie peaceful and calm
When I'm laid to my rest

And the world will be better for this
That one man, scorned and covered with scars
Still strove with his last ounce of courage
To reach the unreachable star

[Dark]

9. Would you rather we take a moralistic stance, or actually work toward ending the war? n/t

[Phredicles]

21. I call Bullshit - there is no work towards ending the war getting done.

[pacalo]

39. Why not do both? Each is as important as the other.

There's no reason to select one over the other; congresspeople are no strangers to multi-tasking.

[mmonk]

11. You don't need republican votes to impeach

or to de-authorize the war. Wish I could share you dream that they are doing all they can.

[Dark]

16. Yea, we could remove him from office with a 51-49 Senate maj. dependent on Lieberman. n/t

[Hippo_Tron]

24. Tim Johnson would have to speed up his recovery too

[Boo Boo]

12. The Dem controlled Congress has an approval rating lower than Bush.

Bush is a lame duck with persistently low approval numbers. He has nothing to lose, and plenty to gain. By obstructing the Dems, by punking them on Iraq the way he did, he makes them look weak and ineffective. I fail to see how that's good news.

Opinions will vary, I suppose, but here on Planet Boo Boo there's no way to put positive spin on "weak, and ineffective."

[Dark]

15. They are not weak and ineffective.

They have started to stand up to Bush.

The Attorney's scandal is only the beginning.

[Lasher]

35. Congressional Republicans are less popular than Democratic counterparts

I've seen a lot in the news lately about low approval ratings for the Democratic controlled Congress, with the implication that it is Democrats who are unpopular. It is seldom pointed out, however, that 45% have a favorable opinion of Democrats, while 37% say the same of the GOP. It just might be that it is Congressional Republicans who are dragging the overall approval down.

[freesqueeze]

18. hmmm. interesting concept.

But I still don't see any of this sticking to ol' turd blossom.

If you mean the whole idea of eternal GOP rule...yes...I think we can put that to rest...and finally get some rest ourselves.

[Dark]

19. We are using good issues and shifting the focus away from most divisive issues.

That, to me, is worth something.

[BikeWriter]

20. What? No one is tearing out their hair and heaping ashes on themselves?

Then, "Hold someone accountable today!"

[mzmolly]

23. I wish I could add this post to MY journal. But, since I can't I'd say

you need one Dark. :yourock:

[Senator]

27. Or ... Just Maybe, They're (Not) Doing What They've (Not) Done For Decades

And Rove and Co. are still chuckling at the oldest joke in DC:

"Gosh, for a minute there I thought they might actually DO something."

And watching in delight at their "amazing job" of building strategeric, dry-powder castles -- all ready to be blown away with the next political wind (or terrorist "attack").

And that the only thing that has changed is that the majority of their base has a "bottom up" way to finally express their disapproval.

You know, a "democratic" way.

Just another thought...

---

[pat_k]

28. "Don't have the votes" is crap

They promised us a REAL fight. They've delivered SHAME fights.

Americans can tell the difference between "fighting the good fight" and playing games.

The American people want Bush stopped. Now. Impeaching Bush and Cheney is the ONLY way to give us what we want. The fight to impeach and remove is the only fight that counts. They deliver that fight, whatever the outcome, they are delivering on their promise.

The price of continuing the pretense that something short of impeachment can stop the outlaws will be high. Reality is already smacking them in the face. Let's hope it wakes them up before their failure to impeach destroys them.

They believe they "have the votes" to vote out articles of impeachment. They are just refusing to do it.

If they finally stand up and send articles up to the Senate, we could see Bush and Cheney resign in a week. We may never find out whether or not they "had the votes" in the Senate. Republicans will be pulling out all the stops to escape being forced to defend the Pariah in Chief.

When specific charges are "on the table" -- charges Senators MUST pass judgment on (unless they escape by forcing Bush and Cheney to resign) -- the outcome is wide open. We have NO IDEA how many will be more than happy to "distance" themselves by tossing Bush and Cheney overboard or how many will be willing to stand and defend torture and the unitary authoritarian executive's "right" to render Congress powerless (i.e., nullify the laws they pass with the stroke of a pen; violate U.S. Code at whim; pick and choose the laws they enforce or ignore. . . they've done it all).

In politics the offense has the advantage. Accusing/impeaching forces the fascists into a defensive position.

The choice is simple.

They can fulfill their oath to "support and defend", break their bonds of complicity, AND reap enormous political rewards by demonstrating strength and commitment to principle.

Or

They can be derelict in their duty, continue to give Bush and Cheney cover, AND pay a high political price for their weakness and moral confusion.

[PADemD]

33. Amen

[malaise]

30. I agree with you 100%

Those of us who followed the Nixon saga know that this is no fast food happening. It's a long slow process and it is gathering momentum.

[Californian Dreamer]

31. One way to get the votes

Is to start investigations into some of their republicans in congress, who they, we and anyone who's been paying attention knows are criminals, and start getting them resigning, imprisoned, or otherwise thrown out of office. Some would be replaced with dems and some won't, but regardless you would see people starting to fall in line on both sides of the aisle.

[Rebellious Republican]

32. Well said, I just posted to another thread,"The wheels are coming off"

The corporate spin machine is working overtime to discourage and disenfranchise people.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1137797

[GeorgeGist]

37. We're history's actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.

The (White House)aide said that guys like me were "in what we call the reality-based community," which he defined as people who "believe that solutions emerge from your judicious study of discernible reality." I nodded and murmured something about enlightenment principles and empiricism. He cut me off. "That's not the way the world really works anymore," he continued. "We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you're studying that reality -- judiciously, as you will -- we'll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that's how things will sort out. We're history's actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do."

- As told to Ron Suskind , Summer 2002 http://www.ronsuskind.com/articles/000106.html

[ChairmanAgnostic]

38. let me be clear. B U L L S H I T ! ! ! ! ! ! !

most of these bills will NEVER EVER see a vote on the floor. These are pipe dreams of a few, smart, visionary Dems who understand what is wrong with our system of government, our admin, our country.

what are the chances that the leadership will bring up most of these?

hah. hahahahah. hahahahahahah.

[natrat]

40. bullshit--nothing actually gets done-just empty legislation and

even that doesn't get done-wtf is a no confidence vote--seriously, and that can't even get passed