Some opinion from TPM that makes sense. Odom, Hillary, et al.

[Dr.Phool]

Some of this makes some sense, and Hillary might have it right on this

(Disclaimer: I dislike Hillary for a multitude of reasons)

It makes sense politically, and it still doesn't excuse their pre-war votes, but, lets concentrate on a solution.

From TPM:

Failure is a tough sell. Odom admits that, but he does not fully understand the implications. The Democrats in Congress are not especially stupid, but they are necessarily anxious about withdrawal, because they are sensibly fearful of being blamed by the Republicans for “losing Iraq”.

The worst kinds of Republicans control almost the whole news Media. The punditocrisy has backed this stupid war completely. The narrative, which will be fed to the American People, by this propaganda machine will not be favorable to a Democratic Congress.

(snip)

The critical work of the Congress in the next 6 months is to build the narrative, which places the responsibility for the course of the Iraq War on its conduct. The narrative, favored by the self-destructive left, of a war that was doomed from the outset, is welcomed by the Right, which wishes to gloss over the corruption, malfeasance and incompetence. I am no fan of Hillary's (or Kerry's) conspicuous calculation, but Hillary is right to remind Democratic Primary voters that the mistakes in Iraq belong to Bush. Squabbling over which Democrats have uttered mea culpas on their support for the Iraq War at the outset does not build a political majority. Focusing attention on Bush's conduct of the war, and how the conduct of the war has contributed to the hopelessness of the current situation -- there Bush's responsibility is unambiguous and unshared.

(snip)

The story of how Bush conducted the war, and how that conduct led to the on-going fiasco and catastrophe, which is Iraq, is the story ALL Democrats should be telling, over and over, until nothing else can be heard in this country, and the U.S. gets out, out, out.

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/012391.php


And the link to Odoms op-ed

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/09/AR2007020901917_pf.html

[The Count]

1. The war won't look any more necessary in 2008 than it was in 2003

That assertion is also one that will stand the test of time.

[pocoloco]

2. "the mistakes in Iraq belong to Bush"

the repugs, and to his democrat enablers!

[Dr.Phool]

4. Last week, I finished reading "Imperial Life in the Emerald City",

And I'll finish "State of Denial" this evening.

We can still blame a lot of Dems for their vote for the war. It was an act of political cowardice. But, in reading those 2 books alone, it's pretty obvious where the colossal cluster-fuck of the occupation occured.

Bush, Cheney, double for Rumsfeld and Rice and Bremer. And it appears that the most evil war criminal in American history had a big hand in it too. Henry Kissinger.

In 2003, and early 2004 I was a Deniac. After the primaries I worked my ass off for Kerry. So far in this cycle, I can't see anyone I'd devote that kind of effort to. I'll vote for the Dem. But I'd rather have a nominee that I can work for.

[AlGore-08.com]

3. It's a false choice that either we have to say the war was a mistake or see the corruption etc

That we can't say both the war was a mistake and the Bush admin has made it worse with their incompetence, graft and cronyism.

It's easy, it's not confusing, it's a stronger message.

People are afraid to embrace it because so many in office, so many in the MSM and regular folks supported the war at the beginning. But we shouldn't refuse to speak the truth because the truth makes some of us - - grassroots Dems as well as office holders - - look bad.

[TahitiNut]

5. It wasn't a 'mistake' - it was a cold, calculating fraud and a war crime.

Those who went along with it were either complicit, fools, or cowards. Millions of Americans and people all over the world KNEW that the 'case' was a fraud ... a devil's brew of half-truths and outright lies. Above and beyond even the fraudulence, even that 'case' did NOT call for an immediate invasion and occupation. No way. No how.

Like Afghanistan, there were alternatives that didn't guarantee hundreds or thousands of lives wasted to achieve dubious objectives. In no way were the invasions and occupations of two sovereign nations connected in a planned and reliable way to the achievement of the purported objectives. The outcome we're seeing was almost absolutely certain. The only interests served have been those of the war profiteers - who got an extra bonus of obscene profit without taxation. Never before in this country's history has a fraud been more blatant of obscene at the highest levels of our government.

The utter fiction that "it could have been done better" is compounding the lie. It's bullshit. There has NEVER been a way this invasion and occupation would have ever achieved the purported objectives - since (1) the objectives were frauds and (2) multi-factional civil war and destabilization (i.e. chaos) in the region were absolutely guaranteed.