Is eating our own part of a winning strategy in 08?

[RiverStone]

QUESTION: How many DUers have shifted their vote because of something you read from another DUer?

My guess is what ever the number, it would be a handful representing a minority of folks here. With all the emotional and intelligent ranting and bantering about, I doubt many Hillary supporters have changed their vote because of me or my argument. Just as no one has budged me an inch on supporting Dennis Kucinich (as the ONLY declared Dem for Pres who truly represents our Party's ideals). Al Gore would trump even Dennis - he just has to run first.

We spend all this energy spouting our reasons why MY candidate has his/her shit together and yours does not. Though in the end DU friends - we are arguing with the GOOD GUYs! The real folks that need to hear why they should not vote for Hillary (for example) don't frequent DU. They don't live in the blogoshere the way we do.

My point here is when the dust settles, we want a platform at the convention that represents true progressive issues and ideals. We want a victory in 08 that ensures NOT another war mongering back-wards puke ends up in the White House. Would we be better to use all this passionate argumentation energy and direct to the complicit DEMS on The Hill that bent over and took it 92-3 for Shrub on his fucked up war, or voted inexplicably for Kyle-Lieberman?

I'm not suggesting we bail on the primary debate, I'm simply wondering if after all the posts (mine including) on this candidate vs that candidate --- how many people out there will have changed their vote? What, maybe a handful of already friendly DUers? If we could harness even half the energy we all collective aim at each other and fire it toward our complicit Congress and Senate OUT THERE, fire it toward the anti-war Dems who bailed on their 06 promises, fire it TOGETHER as a big voting block, then maybe we could influence in our own way the Party Platform for the convention. I'm proposing an organized shift in strategy. Fire the rage to the movers and shakers who are sitting on their ass, not at each other.

What do you think?




peace~:)
RiverStone

[ShortnFiery]

1. The DLC wing of our Democratic Party has systematically pushed LIBERALS under the bus.

I don't support "Corporations First and Always" Democrats (DLCers) PERIOD! :shrug:

[Totally Committed]

3. Thank you. 'Nuff said.

I was just thinking the same thing.

You said it better.

TC

[ShortnFiery]

7. You're very kind TC.

Have a good evening. :hi:

[Totally Committed]

10. You, too, sweetie!

:hi:

TC

[RiverStone]

12. Maybe, but where can your rage produce the most change?

I understand you not wanting to pull the level for the bedfellows of the DLC/Corporate/MSM alliance.

I get that!

Though I'm simply saying ShortnFiery that here, in this corner of the universe called DU - your wise words are going to make far less difference than if we collectively aim then OUT THERE. Even if you could change the minds of a few Hillary supporters, what about the totally wacko behavior of Dems on The Hill recently?

It is the minds of the fence sitting Independent voters who have not even heard of DU that we need to influence. Most of us get it to some degree. How do we reach them OUT THERE?

I suggest that we are wasting precious energy shouting at each other (Rove would dig that) where we would be better served directing it at the fascist regime and his minions of Rudy, Fred, Mitt, and John. We need to change the direction of anyone voting for those lock-steppers! That where the bulk of our energy should go ---- with a lot of help from our friends!

Just problem solving here....:)

[WilliamPitt]

2. *koff*

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1983812&mesg_id=1983812

[ShortnFiery]

5. Yes, like the DLC, ignore those to the left of center in favor of recruiting moderate republicans.

:eyes:

[WilliamPitt]

11. Heh

I'm the DLC now, eh?

Did you hit your head or something? Seriously...

[ShortnFiery]

20. No, you're an apparent enabler of the DLC. But that's cool - you write so well.

;)

[Mythsaje]

4. There are quite a few Dems

(even here) who remain undecided. While we hear a lot of "your 'bashing' of this candidate makes me want to vote for him/her' I tend to think that's a pile of smelly crap. In the end people are going to come down on the side of the candidate THEY feel represents their interests and stances the most. Now while I tend to agree with DK on many issues, I'm also a pragmatist. In a vote that's clearly hotly contested in some regions of the country, I'm going to put my inconsiderable weight behind a candidate I believe in and one I think has a chance of actually winning the Primary. In my book, that isn't Kucinich.

:shrug:

[RiverStone]

17. to over simplify...

While we are debating the merits of mine vs yours the Democrats on The Hill have virtually packed up and left town, for I barely recognize them anymore based on how they have voted recently.

Would we be better served to use our collective "considerable weight" reminding them of the promises they made in 06? It just seems there comes a point where the BIG picture supersedes the smaller ones. The real enemy is out there, not in here.

Am I making sense....or not? :shrug:



peace~

[Mythsaje]

18. I don't think they're paying us any attention whatsoever...

They've gotten really facile with the excuses though. They might not be able to fool US, but they can still fool SOME of the people with them.

As I said on another post the other day...what we need to do is do the same thing to the Democratic Party that the religious right assholes did to the Repugs. Infiltrating from the bottom up. Take what we can get for now and build a more progressive grass-roots party over the long haul. I'm not sure we have another option.

[supernova]

6. No, but it's a great DU keep GD and GDP busy strategy

[Deep13]

8. I think the dispute is largely over what constitutes "our own." nt

[RiverStone]

15. With the exception of Loserman and a handful of Blue Dog Dems...

Mostly everyone else is our "own". That is, more Dem than rethug at heart anyway.

Lots of disappointment with our own recently, no doubt there.

But in the end, we still are Democratic something eh?

The day our party shifts too far right to house us, is the day we need to move on.

For now and I hope longer, I'm a Democrat and have a commitment to voting DEM in 08. I'm just looking at different games plans to ensure a victory a year from November.



peace~

[Froward69]

9. Dialouge and debate would be a

nice change. instead of; my candidate leads in the polls therefore they are correct.

[RiverStone]

16. I just think we ALL have more common ground then not...

But wrestling is more fun! :banghead:

[Frances]

13. Does anyone else remember the tenor of the posts about

various candidates leading up to the 2004 primary?

[saracat]

14. Some of the supporters of an "alleged" front runner have

affected my vote.I was definitely prepared to vote for the Democratic nominee no matter who it was until I experienced the arrogance and downright nastiness of some. The responses seemed reflective of what I perceived as that candidates complete lack of empathy for others. It left me with such a distaste that if a that candidate is nominated, I do not believe I can vote for them and I am a life long Dem.I will say that the nastiness is not the single reason for my change of heart but it underscored my suspicions and reinforced my distaste for arrogance and politicization of peoples lives.

[RiverStone]

19. Time will tell...

I understand and see what you see.

But as I think I shared in another thread somewhere, the prick on the rethug side of the isle in 08 may be so abhorrent in your eyes, that it will drive you to vote for "that candidate".

It may depend on what is at stake and what you have to lose (by not voting at all).

Of course, it's your vote to lose or use. Your one VOTE means something - it means a lot.



peace~