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Canadian_moderate Donating Member (599 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:18 AM
Original message
In the U.S. south, is Canadian a new racial slur?

In the U.S. south, is Canadian a new racial slur?


Graeme Hamilton, National Post
Published: Thursday, January 24, 2008
It was a routine e-mail from the boss sent to congratulate a junior prosecutor in Houston, Tex., who had won manslaughter convictions against an intoxicated driver.

"He convicted Mr. Sosa of a double intoxication manslaughter, got a weak jury to give him 12 years in each, and then convinced Judge Wallace to stack the sentences," Harris County assistant district attorney Mike Trent wrote in an office-wide memo. Then came the odd part: "He overcame a subversively good defence by Matt Hennessey that had some Canadians on the jury feeling sorry for the defendant and forced them to do the right thing."

The e-mail was sent in 2003 but came to light only this month as part of an unrelated controversy with his office, forcing Mr. Trent to defend himself against accusations of bigotry -- not because he offended the people of Canada, but because "Canadian" has apparently become a code word for blacks among American racists.

"There is a double meaning to that word and I didn't know it. I was horrified when I learned what it was, and I immediately addressed the issue with the people who brought it up," Mr. Trent told a local Fox News reporter in a recent interview.

"I'd never heard of Canadian being used as a term for a black person or for a racial slur," he said.

"If I had, I would never send that out in an office-wide e-mail that's going to go to people who are going to be offended if they recognize it as such. That would be crazy.... I'm not a racist. I'm not a bigot," Mr. Trent said.

Mark Vinson, who was a chief prosecutor in the Harris County office at the time, said he was puzzled by the reference to Canadians when he got the e-mail but was too busy to give it much thought. Then some colleagues informed him about the slang meaning of Canadian, and he felt crushed.

"So much has been accomplished in terms of equal opportunities, and the office had a super reputation," Mr. Vinson, who is black, told the National Post. "I just couldn't imagine someone in the office who would engage in that conduct."

He said he believes Mr. Trent's assurance that he had simply repeated a term used by the prosecutor on the case, Rob Freyer. Mr. Freyer did not return a message left yesterday.

"I know Mike. We laugh and talk about the Cowboys," Mr. Vinson said. "I truly don't believe that Mike knew what he was saying."

It is unusual that a seasoned attorney like Mr. Trent would not have wondered how a Harris County jury came to be stacked with Canadians. (There were no Canadians on the jury but there were some black members.) "The only way that there could have been Canadians on the jury, was if they were born in Canada and then became U.S. citizens, and then became citizens of the county in which the case was tried," Mr. Vinson noted.

Mr. Trent told Fox News that was not out of the question. "It would not be impossible or unusual for people from other countries to be on our juries," he said. "That's what I was told, and I took it as the literal meaning."

The bigger mystery is how "Canadian" came to be code for black. An online directory of racial slurs defines Canadian as a "masked replacement" for black.

Last August, a blogger in Cincinnati going by the name CincyBlurg reported that a black friend from the southeastern U.S. had recently discovered that she was being called a Canadian. "She told me a story of when she was working in a shop in the South and she overheard some of her customers complaining that they were always waited on by a Canadian at that place. She didn't understand what they were talking about and assumed they must be talking about someone else," the blogger wrote.

"After this happened several times with different patrons, she mentioned it to one of her co-workers. He told her that ‘Canadian' was the new derogatory term that racist Southerners were using to describe persons they would have previously referred to "

A similar case in Kansas City was reported last year on a Listserv, or electronic mailing list, used by linguistics experts. A University of Kansas linguist said that a waitress friend reported that "fellow workers used to use a name for inner-city families that were known to not leave a tip: Canadians. ‘Hey, we have a table of Canadians.... They're all yours.' "

Stefan Dollinger, a postdoctoral fellow in linguistics at University of British Columbia and director of the university's Canadian English lab, speculated that the slur reflects a sense of Canadians as the other.

"This ‘code' word, is the replacement of a no-longer tolerated label for one outsider group, with, from the U.S. view, another outsider group: Canadians. It could have been terms for Mexicans, Latinos etc. but this would have been too obvious," he said. "What's left? Right, the guys to the north."

National Post

In the U.S. south, is Canadian a new racial slur?

Has anyone else read this story. I also read a similar article in last Saturday's Toronto Star.
Is term 'Canadian' used as racist word?
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Doctor Cynic Donating Member (965 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
1. Maybe we should start using "Crawfordian" as a slur too. n/t
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NC_Nurse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
2. Not around here.
I've never heard that. I think it's bullshit.
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Alcibiades Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #2
43. Google it
Apparently, it's real, and no, I've never heard it here in Durham, either. I don't imagine we know the sort of people who would use this sort of coded racism. Absolutely bizarre.
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melody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
3. "Yank" and "Cowboy" have always been slurs in some other countries
Edited on Fri Feb-01-08 11:37 AM by melody
Unfortunately, we have ignorant morons, too.
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Canadian_moderate Donating Member (599 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:45 AM
Original message
Yes, Canada certainly has them too
Edited on Fri Feb-01-08 12:30 PM by Canadian_moderate
My wife is American and she has to bite her lip quite often as people spout off about Americans.

I tend to call them up on it and make them feel like idiots. People do love to generalize about Americans.

That said, I have heard from some Americans that they have heard the word "Canadians" used as code for African-Americans, Mexicans or anyone else they don't like. In general, I thought the South was a little more blatant and that people would be less likely to hide behind code words.
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melody Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
15. I suspect what they are hearing is a small group of loud-mouthed idiots
Some of the members of my Texas family among them.

But it's nothing widespread by any means ... and they probably think they're being funny.
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Duke Newcombe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
4. Personally, I blame Canada. n/t
Duke
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ConcernedCanuk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #4
27. "Personally, I blame Canada." - umm, that be the land, the government or the people?
.
.
.

simple question.

Have you ever lived in or visited Canada?

I have visited AND lived in the United states.

Dozens of visits to New York, New Hampshire, Vermont and the rest of the Eastern states, plus criss-crossed the country as well as living in San Diego for over a year.

Mind you, this was all before the US decided it would just make war(openly) wherever it wanted, like Afghanistan and Iraq.

The day I saw the first bombing of Iraq in te shock and awe thingy, I decided I would never cross our border again, and forgo my lifelong plan to retire in the US.

Nothing has come close to changing my mind about returning to the US.

Your comment supports my decision.
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AngryAmish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 03:02 PM
Response to Reply #27
33. All of the above
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Duke Newcombe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #27
35. It was a joke from "South Park", my friend...
...but, since you won't return...can I have your "Stimulus" rebate? :)

Duke
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
5. I've heard it before in NE USA and I understand there to be an element of wry humor to the choice
Edited on Fri Feb-01-08 11:44 AM by JVS
It plays on the fact that Canadians are able to almost effortlessly assimilate to US culture. Canadians are so similar to Anglo-Americans that a racist intolerance of Canadians would be unimaginable to the point of humorous (See South Park movie with Kyle's mom's "You canadians are all the same with your flappy heads..." )
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goodgd_yall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #5
21. Yes, I was thinking of South Park
I don't know if its use might be increased because of the show, but I could see where it might. But you're right on the interpretation. See my post below, though. I've heard it used another way.
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melm00se Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:45 AM
Original message
the title to the article
in and of itself is offensive: it sounds like all southerners are racist.
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Island Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
6. I've lived in the South all of my life
and I've never heard this. I call bullshit, but then again, the South covers lot of territory so who knows. The only Canadians I've ever heard anyone complain about are the real ones (you know, the kind who wear Speedos at the beach in March.)
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supernova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
7. I've never heard of this
and I grew up in the South.

There is no big, coordinated push to be putting the hate on Canadians. Leastways, not in NC. A lot of Canucks vacation here because it's prettier and closer and cheaper than Florida. B-) :P

What the Canadians do have a problem with, is one nutjob from Texas (where else? )

I like Canada quite a lot. And Canadians.
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Canadian_moderate Donating Member (599 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. It's not aimed at Canadians
The articles claims that the word "Canadian" is used as code for any ethnic group they dislike.

Personally, and as a Canadian, I have never felt discriminated against in the USA. I think this may be a fairly isolated incident, but then again, I have heard from people who have confirmed the use of this code word.
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supernova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Again, that's not
something I've heard.

And I'm a pretty astute student of changes in word usage.

The slur of choice around here is still "lib'rul"

Someone upthread said they thought that heard that usage in Michigan, which is possible since the border is so porous there. I still say it's that one whackjob in TX who should have to apologize to y'all.
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OneGrassRoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #11
19. I don't know....see my post #18...
I've experience various right-wingers use the term "Canadian" as they would "French" - i.e., liberal, dumbass, MFers.

Of course, I love Canadians, and the French, AND especially French Canadians, so I really piss everyone off.

:toast:
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TCJ70 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:00 PM
Response to Original message
9. People from Canadia are their own race now?
News to me...
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Duke Newcombe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. Of course...here the declaration...
...of their unique identity...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pXtVrDPhHBg


Duke
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Canadian_moderate Donating Member (599 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Pretty sad, isn't it...
According to some Canadians, being a Canadian is being different from Americans.

I think there's more to it than that, but that doesn't sell beer.
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 03:04 PM
Response to Reply #16
34. Oh yeah
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fudge stripe cookays Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #9
38. News to me...
that there's someplace called Canadia. :shrug:
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Sugar Smack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. *snort* YOU just stop it!!!!
:rofl: OMG :rofl: :loveya:
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johnaries Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
10. No.
I have no idea where this came from, but I have lived in Nashville TN all my life and have traveled all over the South. This article is total BS. I'll admit I've heard my share of bigotry (although not as much as many non-Southerners seem to think) but they never use "c ode words", they just lower their voices.
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supernova Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Totally agree
Southerners are fairly upfront about their biases. No euphamisms around here.
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Canadian_moderate Donating Member (599 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. They are government officials after all
They can't be that open about it.

Regardless, this article is not about Canadians being discriminated against. It's about the word Canadian being used to slur Mexcan-Americans and African-Americans, among others.
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Rob H. Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
14. I've lived in Memphis for 18 years and have never heard that
used as a racial slur. Not saying it doesn't happen, but most of the time I've heard people use racial slurs, they just use 'em, they don't dress 'em up with any fancy "code words."
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OneGrassRoot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
18. I'm too mad about the Montel thing to read through this again, but Canadian...
in my experience in the last few years (being surrounded with right-wing types ALL OVER THE US, not just the South), is synonmyous with "liberal tree-hugger, do-gooder."

This was really brought home when four years ago I started dating a French-Canadian...well, my right-wing family nearly had a STROKE. Canadian is bad enough (so I learned...I truly was surprised and clueless about this), but FRENCH Canadian.

Well....the only thing that would have made it worse was if he WOULD have been a black French-Canadian.

Oy.
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goodgd_yall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
20. It is used as a code
I don't know if it's restricted to a particular group. But an acquaintance used it when talking to me and it was a question about someone's sexual preference. "Do you think she's Canadian?"
I took it literally, "No, she's from Minnesota." Then after a pause I knew what she meant.
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last_texas_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
22. I've heard it
A couple of my friends who worked in restaurants during college would talk about its use among the waiters to complain about black customers without others being able to know what they were talking about. This was in Houston and Beaumont, TX, three or four years ago, so I guess it's been around a while. I think it was done mostly because they thought they were getting away with something and thought they were being "clever." It's pretty idiotic.
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walnutpie Donating Member (117 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:33 PM
Response to Original message
23. I've never heard it used as a replacement or slur
But, I can say that after 4 years in the restaurant business, wait staff, including black wait staff, will come up with some very creative ways to dump parties of black patrons into other sections.

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NOLALady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. Why?
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walnutpie Donating Member (117 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. Well...
In the restaurant business, blacks have a reputation for being demanding customers who do not tip well. Having worked in several restaurants in the NYC area, I have seen near universal avoidance by wait staff.
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NOLALady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 04:26 PM
Response to Reply #30
37. I didn't know that.
I imagine the tip thing would have something to do with the income level.

I cannot generalize, but most of the blacks in this area are anything but demanding. In fact, they are usually quite polite. Manners and politeness are expected in this part of the South.

On a personal level, I didn't find any difference in the attitudes/manners of New Yorkers (blacks and whites).
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NOLALady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:50 PM
Response to Original message
24. I have not heard anyone use that term in this area of the
South as a racial slur.
But, many Louisiana blacks are also descendants of French Canadians. First it was the n word. Now it's the C word. We can't seem to get a break.
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LizW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
26. What a strange story
Would the guy really send an e-mail that referred to Canadians on the jury (when there weren't any) if it was not some kind of code? Sounds like he's lying, to me. But if it was code and he knew it, WHY would he send such a thing to the whole office? Then he's just stupid.

I have lived in Alabama all my life and I've never heard that word used as a coded slur, but people don't say slurs in front of me much.
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yardwork Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
28. I've never heard this here in NC but then again, I avoid people I know to be bigots.
I had an acquaintance who used code words to describe black people. She is from Dallas. I dropped her when I heard her doing this. Later I found out that's she's homophobic. It didn't surprise me. Bigots tend to be bigoted across the board. I'm sure she's planning to vote for a Republican. She would never consider voting for a woman or a black person for president.
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NeedleCast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
29. Its not even a real country, is it?
How can you hold a bias against something that doesn't exist?

In all seriousness though, I don't think it's used in a derogatory way. I hear it in jest from time to time. I have a Canadian co-worker and we rib each other a lot, but it's all good natured. I've never heard it used as a slur.
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Aristus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 02:54 PM
Response to Original message
31. In the excellent satirical film "C.S.A., The Confederate States of America", which
postulates an America if the Confederacy had won the Civil War, "Canadian" is used as a slur against everything the Confederates hate. They're called "Red Canadians", "Liberal Canadians", and so on.

Great film; you should see it.
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AspenRose Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #31
46. That's probably where the inspiration came from
Even though the movie is satire, they probably saw it and said "hey, that'll work!" :eyes:
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class2068 Donating Member (72 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 02:59 PM
Response to Original message
32. I'm sorry...
This is simply psychotic. Why are such things posted here?
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Sugar Smack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #32
42. HEY! Welcome to DU!
:hi:
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Monk06 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 04:00 PM
Response to Original message
36. Personally. I'm proud that the US is about to elect its first Canadian President.
:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:
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pbca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #36
47. That would have been Gravel
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Sugar Smack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 04:53 PM
Response to Original message
40. I've lived in the US South all my life and
I really don't know where this shit's coming from, or why it even has to be an issue.
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Alcibiades Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. It comes from the same place it's always come from-ignorance
Only the n-word isn't something folks like attorneys can say anoymore, so they had to come up with something. This is so incredibly stupid, it fits perfectly.

No, I've never heard it either, it's new. It does give us a new way to sort this type of jackass out.
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Bridget Burke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 04:55 PM
Response to Original message
41. This story is a side-effect of a big Houston/Harris County scandal...
Involving Chuck Rosenthal, the (Republican) DA. www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/side/5453940.html

To those who pay scant attention to the workings of the Harris County District Attorney's Office, the fact that Chuck Rosenthal's official computer contained dozens of dubious or inappropriate e-mails seems a shocking lapse of discretion, especially for one of the county's top elected officials....

Given the content of some of Rosenthal's recently publicized e-mails — which included questionable campaign communications that are being investigated by the Texas attorney general, repeated love notes to his secretary, racial jokes and images, and sexually explicit video clips — the question is more pertinent than ever.

Rosenthal could not be reached for comment, but over the past few weeks he has said he was sorry for causing pain to others with his personal e-mails and that he regretted some of what he had said. But he insisted he had not done anything that should cost him his job, and he accused Republican Party leaders who wanted to replace him of being "Chicken Littles" for believing voters would hold his indiscretions against him.


Yup. The local Republicans have been thrown into an uproar! Lots of fun to watch them squirm.

Here's a local report on the "Canadian" story. www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/falkenberg/5480917.html

It's one e-mail, only about 100 words, sent in 2003. But it had achieved near-urban legend status in some corners before being unearthed recently and leaked to a few members of the media.

The document — yet another gem from the Harris County District Attorney's Office's treasure trove of embarrassing and inappropriate correspondence — is being debated on local lawyer listservs, blogs and in secret meetings.

Earlier this week, it was announced that the mysterious missive may be a topic of questioning in Chuck Rosenthal's contempt hearing next week — even though it has nothing to do with the DA's deletion of thousands of subpoenaed e-mails.

Instead, the e-mail involves another unlikely topic — Canadians. And not the hockey-playing, Molson-gulping, health insurance-having kind, either.


It may be that, in the DA's office, they're using "Canadian" as a code word for "Other Minority." ("Gotta be 'politically correct'--ho! ho!")

But, in Texas, at least--I'm pretty sure most racists are using the Old Traditional Words.

Canada--it's not really about YOU!


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-..__... Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-01-08 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
45. Urban Dictionary has 33 entries for "Canadian".
7 have a racial meaning...

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=canadian&page=1

Not that the input on that site is authoritative or reputable; I mean, there's also this entry/definition...

"A sex act which involves fingering a woman who is clothed or partially clothed, in a semi-public place, without drawing attention. The term refers to the way a Canadian is usually invisible or inconspicuous in a crowd. The term is used in the same way as "greek."

"So he took me to see the new Superman movie last night, and halfway through, he went all Canadian on me. Yeah, right there! He just reached under my skirt and pulled my panties aside!"
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