I'm with the O man on this one.

[ourbluenation]

Obama's support for the execution of child rapists wasn't invented for the presidential election; it dates back to The Audacity of Hope, where he wrote:

"While the evidence tells me that the death penalty does little to deter crime, I believe there are some crimes--mass murder, the rape and murder of a child--so heinous, so beyond the pale, that the community is justified in expressing the full measure of its outrage by meting out the ultimate punishment."

His longstanding opinion on the death penalty is a particularly nuanced one. He has opposed expanding the death penalty to include gang activity, for example, on the grounds that it would disproportionately punish men of color, but he supports the execution of especially egregious murderers who are clearly guilty.

http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_plank/archive/2008/06/26/in-support-of-obama-s-death-penatly-stand.aspx

[IndianaJones]

1. he's right. nt.

[Fredda Weinberg]

2. That's "the rape and murder of a child" not or ... are you sure you know

your position and your candidate's?

[Deja Q]

3. No argument here.

[bowens43]

4. capital punishment is NEVER ethical.

[ourbluenation]

9. you left out this part...

in my opinion.

[gcomeau]

21. Capitol punishment when there is rational doubt of guilt is never ethical.

If however you are absolutely certain of guilt, and the crime is sufficiently severe, then it absolutely is ethical to employ capitol punishment IMO. My own objection to the practice is that the standards for establishing guilt in the current justice systems are too lax for a justifiable application of the death penalty. Beyond a reasonable doubt works for penalties that you can later reverse, you have to be completely beyond rational doubt if you're going to put execution on the table. Like 30 eye witnesses, live video, fingerprint and DNA confirmation and a signed confession "beyond a doubt".

If you CAN establish that for pretty much any deliberate premeditated murder however I have absolutely ZERO qualms about applying the death penalty. You have an inviolable right to continue living your life right up until the moment you make the decision to refuse to grant that same right to another and then act to deprive them of it. After you cross that line, then screw you, you're out of the club.

[Bluebear]

5. "the rape AND murder of a child"

His agreement with the dissenters on the Supreme Court was for child rape. The death penalty is not progressive.

[ourbluenation]

6. You're avatar is on my key chain. Anyways, I'm more centrist on a couple of things...

dp being one of them.

[Bluebear]

8. No problem. Just my opinion.

[Minnesota Raindog]

16. The death penalty isn't centrist either

It's fucking barbaric. Virtually every other civilized nation has done away with it. Obama's position is wrong.

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

7. I agree with him 100% on this.

There are crimes that are horrible enough to justify the death penalty.

[IndianaJones]

11. most Americans agree with him. nt.

[Bluebear]

13. Majority rule should not decide ethics, however.

[IndianaJones]

17. I can agree. nt.

[WillParkinson]

10. Who are clearly guilty...

Yeah, all those people on death row who have been found innocent would probably agree with that.

[stillcool]

12. It would be great

if we would do something to address the spread of diseased minds that are corroding our society, but short of that let's kill everyone.

[durrrty libby]

14. Sure it's right if you want to be in the barbaric company

of China, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Iran

They love killing their citizens too. Go Progressives...We Rock

[Bluebear]

15. :nodding:

[ourbluenation]

19. unofficially we already live in a barbaric country in many ways. n/t

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

20. So you want to make it official?

:shrug:

[ReadTomPaine]

18. If you want someone to die for what they've done, don't be a coward and hide behind the state

Kill them yourself and face the consequences. Don't empower the state with your savagery or barbarism. Take responsibility for your own actions and beliefs and pull the trigger if you have the guts and then go on trial for your crime and explain yourself to your peers.

That's the price for vengeance. And it is vengeance, not justice.

[EFerrari]

22. I don't think killing people is an appropriate expression of outrage. n/t

[TreasonousBastard]

23. And I'm not with him. So...

what do we do now?

[ourbluenation]

24. that's up to you. I'm voting for him. n/t

[TreasonousBastard]

25. OK-- I'm voting for him too. It's the DP thing that...

bothers me.

But, I don't expect to agree with everything the person I vote for says.