Can anyone here read Latin? I have a

[shraby]

passage at the bottom of this page I need translated for researchers.
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I plan to put the translation on the transcription of the page. I thank anyone who can read it for me.

[pitohui]

1. i cannot even read handwriting anymore

if you print out the whatever i can give it a try!

[shraby]

4. Here it is, as close as I can read it

Episcopers diseit Barbaram Gauche quamvis separatim alvire seeo viventem (quai vir nimis violenter agebat) sacramenta recipere fosse

It's from an old church record probably written by an older priest so the Latin would be an old version.

[tabatha]

6. I looked at it closer, and read this:

Episcopus discit Barbaram Gauche quamvis separatius alviro suo viventeus
(quia vir nimis violentor agelut) sacramenta recipere fosse

Also, it looks like something somewhere between Italian and Latin.

[Mrs. Overall]

7. No, it's Latin, not Italian. My Latin is rusty, but I'm trying to translate....

I may or may not be able to, but it's a fun challenge.

[tabatha]

19. Yes, it is latin - I looked up all the words, see below.

[eShirl]

9. this looks more like correct Latin

I'd ask the people on the textkit.com Latin forum

[Lydia Leftcoast]

11. Based on my knowledge of choir motet Latin, I think it says:

"The bishop said that Barbara Gauche, who lives separated from her husband (something something) can receive the sacrament."

Or something to that effect.

The first two words are "Episcopus dixit..."

[shraby]

12. Thank you. It would be important back then

for her to be able to receive the sacrament even though she and her husband were separated..apparently because of
his violent nature. Thanks also for that second word..it's not too clear to read.

[pinto]

35. Nice translation. It's always awkward to get it colloquial. It's 'discit', though. The bishop found.

Seems to be a ruling.

[Bluebear]

8. A left Episcopal should live separately from violent old bats, Bob Fosse's recipes were a sacrament?

I knew I should have taken latin.

[shraby]

10. You're good!

My guess is it has something to do with them separating because he was violent, but would like a more exact translation for any researcher that may need this for their family tree information.

[pinto]

34. LOL.

[pinto]

38. I read it backwards...

:hide:

Paul is dead.

[MonkeyFunk]

14. unlike that modern latin?

:D

[Muttocracy]

20. well, I've forgotten a lot of Latin by now but pulled out my Latin dictionary

here's a start. The adverbs are easy to translate as separate words (endings don't change) but hard to put into English sentence. Maybe someone else can take it from here and figure it out (I'm off to bed).

Changed a few letters to match Latin words or spelling patterns I remembered - see if they're plausible from the handwriting:

Episcopers discit Barbaram Gauche quamvis separatim a viro suo viventem (quia vir nimis violenter agebat) sacramenta recipere posse

My overall guess - The Bishop learns a savage lack of grace although living alone he was trying to accept sacred oaths?!

Breaking into phrases

Episcopers discit Barbaram Gauche
The Bishop learns a savage/foreign lack of grace

Using the English word episcopal = bishop
Gauche - is that French? http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/gauche - lack of grace?

quamvis = so much or although

separatim = separately

a viro suo
from a man himself

viventem = living (present participle of vivere to live? - should be modifying an object?)

quia vir nimis violenter agebat
because the man was trying/starting furiously

quia = because
vir = man (subject)
nimis = very much
violenter = violently
agebat = he/she was setting in motion/ driving / engaging


sacramenta recipere posse
to be able to receive/accept/hold back oaths


Or could be something about a Bishop trying really hard not to swear??!!

[Muttocracy]

21. OK, I'm totally off by starting with Barbarian rather than Barbara!

:rofl:

[Muttocracy]

2. I also need it typed out- can't make it out on my screen except vir = man

[Muttocracy]

3. also, can you give any context? not to bias it, but the Latin of the Roman Republic

may differ a bit from Latin in medieval or Catholic church documents maybe?

[shraby]

5. See post 4.

[Mrs. Overall]

13. Here's my translation:

The Bishop has ruled that Barbara Gauche, although she is living separately from her husband, (because he is excessively violent) is able to receive the sacraments.

[shraby]

15. We have a winner! I have a lady transcribing the

pages for me and when she gets to that one, I have her covered. I'll add the translation to the transcription. Thank you so much for helping me out..I knew I could count on du'ers. :bounce: :thumbsup: :woohoo:

[Mrs. Overall]

18. You're welcome! It's not often I can grab my old Latin books off the shelf

and actually translate something. This is Church Latin, which is much easier to translate than Classical Latin.

Good luck with this project!

[shraby]

24. I've been putting genealogical material online for the

county I live in for over 10 years..ch. records, census records, tombstone transcriptions, tombstone photos, people photos, wedding photos, business photos, newspaper articles, obituaries, biographies, casualties from all the wars, you name it, I've got it online for researchers. This 1906 church census was sent to me a day ago so I thought I'd put the scans of them online so they can see it now and not have to wait for transcriptions. I really appreciate the help you gave. My site is at:
<http://www.2manitowoc.com> The most extensive county site in the United States.

[Mrs. Overall]

28. Wow, this is a great site! I've done quite a bit of genealogical research

for my family and I wish that some of the areas that my family is from had local websites like this. You have included so much information for researchers! Your site reminds me just how great the Internet can be. Wonderful work!

[Muttocracy]

25. good job

My strictly classical Latin training failed me miserably!

[Mrs. Overall]

26. I started with "barbarian" too until I looked at the English text

and finally realized it was a name!

[Muttocracy]

27. I guess my brain was stuck on Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres or however it starts. nt

[Mrs. Overall]

29. My favorite Latin phrase: Semper Ubi Sub Ubi

Always where under where!

[pinto]

30. Gallia in tres partes divisa est. (They always put the damn verb at the end...)

:eyes:

[Muttocracy]

40. usually yeah, but not for the start of Caesar's book

http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext?doc=Perseus:text:1999.02.0002:book=1:chapter=1

[islandmkl]

16. i believe you are correct...

and i have a headache from trying to translate and make sense....

good going...

[Muttocracy]

23. I share your headache!

[tabatha]

17. I looked up all the separate words

Episcopus discit Barbaram Gauche quamvis separatius alvaro suo viventis
(quia vir nimis violentor agelat) sacramenta recipere fosse

episcopus=bishop
discit=learn
quamvis = adv/conj, ever so much, however much, although, as much as you like
separatius = less closely.
alviro =
(alvaro = attempt to disarm accidentally causes opponent’s death. )
suo = to stitch, join
viventis = living / viventius = (Saint Viventius?)
quia = because
vir = fellow, man, hero, man of courage
nimis = adv. too much, overmuch, excessively
violentor = abusive
agelat = is probably from the verb agere
"6. l,iii'!;!, agere. " Gave loose to joy," i. e. agelat lacta negotia, equivalent in fact to laeta erat. The term gaudium denotes properly the feeling of joy, or joy of a comparatively moderate kind. Lactitia refers to the expression of joy, by words and gestures, and hence is much stronger in meaning than gaudium. A similar difference exists between gaudcre and laetari."
sacramenta = sacraments
recipere = to receive
fosse = possibly "were", Se Eu Fosse Voce (If I were you)

[pinto]

22. Roughly -

The bishop has found that Barbara Gauche, although separated from one joined in life (a man overly violent) may receive the sacrament.

i.e., it's a finding that the woman may participate in church 'though separated from her husband, due to his abuse. As far as I can read.

[pinto]

31. on follow up, it's probably more accurate that

The bishop has found that Barbara Gauche, although separated from one joined in life (a man overly violent) is to be buried and will receive the sacrament.

Looks maybe to be a post mortem finding, that the woman could have a Catholic burial, 'though separated. fosse is inter, in a sense. I skimmed over that at first after recipere - receive. Both forms are a directive from the bishop.

[Mrs. Overall]

32. I'm curious where you are seeing the idea of "burial"--

(in case I've missed something). I translated the last section "sacramenta recipere posse" as "able to receive the sacraments." Sacramenta is plural, sacramentum is singular. I'm just wondering how burial literally fits in.

Plus, it's just really fun to have such a nerdy Latin thread!

[pinto]

33. That's how I read it at first, as well. And that makes sense. Then saw that it was fosse (?)

And that's bury. So I guessed buried with the sacraments.

[Hardrada]

37. Innocentius Tertius ex Ecclesia Romanum in quo modo

Latine regnum Angliae haereticus esse dixit. (I love that stuff and wish I had time to go through my old Ecclesiastical Latin text again).

[trackfan]

36. Here is my take:

Episcopus discit Barbaram Gauche quamvis separatim a viro suo viventem (quia vir nimis violenter agebat) sacramenta recipere posse

The bishop learned Barbara Gauche could recieve the sacraments even though she was living separately from her husband (because of his violent behavior).

[pinto]

39. Good one.

[Muttocracy]

41. Thanks for this thread. Looks like several of us had fun with this.

I've been trying to get rid of stuff and my Latin dictionaries and textbooks were something where I thought, why hang on to these? It didn't end up being useful for me to have them as I was no help compared to others here, but it was a fun puzzle, so perhaps I should keep them for entertainment! :) I also happen to think Latin is a beautiful language, and I miss it. For practical reasons I wish I had learned Spanish though.

[shraby]

42. Going through the pages I have, there are a couple more

tidbits that will need translated. You guys were great! I'll put them on this forum in a couple of days.