We really can't move on until Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, Wolfowitz etc. are prosecuted.

[arcadian]

Put them on trial, destroy the Patriot Act, reduce Defense spending, withdraw from Iraq/Afghanistan, shatter the intelligence agencies. The Federal government has zero credibility. Criminals must be held accountable.

[leftstreet]

1. I wanna see Obama burn the Patriot Act on live teevee

But that's just me.

[thunder rising]

2. Totally agree! We didn't prosecute them in the past and they just slithered under a rock

to wait for their next chance. We have to stop the rotation of the criminals in and out of office.

[HowHasItComeToThis]

27. THE REPUBLICANS ARE STEALTH PEOPLE

EXTERMINATE

[lsewpershad]

45. How true

If they are not prosecuted they will feel they can do it again with impunity

[Vincardog]

3. Error: You've already recommended that thread.

[waiting for hope]

4. Off to the GP with thee -

If I hear that we need to look forward one more time ....

:argh:

[WillieW]

5. Agree, but Obama does not want to go backward he wants to move forward.

[defendandprotect]

50. That's the point, you can't go forward based on lies --

you have to prosecute the lies, the torturers, in order to go forward.

Where have we succeeded in going except to hell by not holding those

responsible for Pres. Kennedy's assassination - and Iran-Contra - and the

whole CIA merry-go-round of coups and assassinations?

Also, you don't go "backward" to deal with crime -- you deal with it in present time.

Someone stole your car last week? The criminal is brought to justice in the future.

[DB1]

6. Totally agree. It is a lot easier to move forward without a * ball & chain on the constitution.

[lostnotforgotten]

7. Agreed - Until the Neocon And Fundie Ideologies Are Totally Discredited We Are Stuck

eom

[Old Codger]

8. That should be

A top priority of this administration just totally nullify that piece of drek ..

[Beam Me Up]

9. If we do, we do so at our peril. NO ONE IS SAFE so long as these traitors

are free. It sends the WRONG MESSAGE to would be traitors and tyrants of the future.

[mmonk]

10. I know I'm not.

[salguine]

11. A lot of these assholes came through the Nixon administration, and it's a fair bet

they wouldn't have been able to pull off the damage of the last eight years if they'd had the hammer come down on them the last time.

[santamargarita]

17. Well Said!

And I don't mean getting a slap on the wrist and turning into a right-wing talk show host, I mean either executed as convicted war criminals or life without parole - nothing short of that!

Then this country can move forward without fear of a Neocon repeat!

[defendandprotect]

51. As I reconsider the Nixon "win" . . . it becomes more doubtful -- !!!

The only way the right-wing comes to power is with political violence and stolen

elections -- and they certainly didn't begin in 2000 or 2004!

These election steals go back at least to the mid and late-1960's -- with the

coming of the large computers used by MSM to track election results.

And, then with gradual introduction of the electronic voting machines allowing them

to steal larger blocks of vote from greater distances.

http://www.constitution.org/vote/votescam__.htm

[Kablooie]

12. Hell, they can't even get Rove in to testify. They could NEVER prosecute ANYONE!

The Democrats remain, now and forever, weak, cowering toadies to the Bush administration.

[JackRiddler]

29. So it seems - but there is such a thing as critical mass.

With them out of power, something can come out. It's up to many thousands of us to keep the pressure.

[abq e streeter]

31. I wish I didn't agree with you--my only glimmer of hope is that its not "forever"

the party wasn't always "weak and cowering toadies" ( sure as hell is now) . I hope you're wrong about it being forever, but see scant evidence of that so far. I wonder if we'll ever know if its true spinelessness, a willing sellout/addiction to corporate money, or whether many of 'em have actually been specifically threatened ( "damn shame about them airplane crashes, anthrax letters and "suicides", ain't it?").

[dysfunctional press]

13. if that's truly the case, then we'll never be moving on...

because NONE of your demands are going to be met anytime soon, it would seem.

[elocs]

14. Whether we can or not we have to move on.

There are too many people in this country out of work (like me), who are losing their homes and are in dire economic straits not to move on. Justice doesn't taste so sweet with an empty belly and out on the street. I don't see Obama making a national address saying we cannot move on until Bushco is prosecuted. We will move on because we cannot afford not to.

[defendandprotect]

52. We can do more than walk and chew gum at the same time . . .

there is no reason why we can't prosecute criminals AND have jobs -- and deal

with the foreclosure crisis. In fact, we have these problems BECAUSE of these

criminals. Do you want more of these problems?

You can't build any thing worthwhile on a crumbling foundation.

[elocs]

54. It won't happen. Not now. Feel free to kick and scream all you like. It won't happen.

That's reality, accept it or not.

[defendandprotect]

61. Rather, it looks to me like those saying don't hold people accountable . ..

are the ones throwing the tantrums.

The call for justice has always been there and will always be there --

We have a Constitution which calls for the accountability of presidents with

impeachment.

We have a System of Justice (DOJ) based on everyone being held acountable for criminal behavior.

These criminals have not only violated common laws, they have done violence to

the Geneva Accords, to the FISA laws, to our Constitution. If we wish to continue

to say "no one is above the law" . . . if we ask elected officials to pledge to

uphold, defend and protect the Constitution, then we had best get busy.

[wroberts189]

15. We could also legislate some much more severe post-nixon style laws..

just a thought

But by all means to the Hague send the lot of them all. Especially little dick.

knr

[fascisthunter]

16. here's a kick. Thanks for Keeping it Real

[rhett o rick]

18. Can't agree more. k & r

[madokie]

19. Its as simple as that too

no if and or butts about it either. I want to see the fear in their eyes when they realize that what they've done is really not good for their futures outlook. I'm not sure any of them have fully come to that realization as of yet. It'll happen I'm convinced of it. There is too many People in this world who are demanding this to happen. I know I am at every chance I get, all my reps in government know how I feel and I'll keep reminding them until it happens and I think a couple of them know that about me too.

[BlooInBloo]

20. Actually, we can. It's not optimal, but we can.

Maybe *you* can't, however.

[lunatica]

21. Moving on as what is the question..

We can move on and we will, but as what? A Nation of Laws? No. A Constitutionally based Nation? No. Unless we rewrite our Constitution to eliminate some of its basic tenets, in which case we will only be moving on to a basically Unconstitutional government.

Then there's all that torture thing. The dismissal of civil rights. The denial of due process. The Presidential signing statements which give him dictatorial executive powers over our lives and over the lives of people in other countries, including the right to spy on us and to use the information against us without ever having to tell us why. And if you think that's just to catch terrorists, then you haven't been put on a no-fly list.

And then there's the right to assemble, and the right to speak out and question our government.

And that inconvenient right to vote in a clean election without worrying about major fraud, theft and illegal manipulation.

So we'll move on anyway because we have to. But as what?

[BlooInBloo]

23. (shrug) I already agreed it's better to prosecute...

I'm not sure what more you want.

[defendandprotect]

55. Correct . . . Consider that the Repugs have been working to knock out the Constitution since . . .

the Reagan/Bush days ---

And they say that after the assassination attempt on Reagan, Bush was essentially

the president.

Seems a model for what Cheney did --- of course, Shrub was already brain dead.

They just rented his body!

[liberalsince1968]

22. I agree. Obama can't sweep this under the run or it will diminish his presidency.

[ejpoeta]

24. what i don't understand is how people think we have any

moral standing when dealing with other countries when we have not prosecuted the people who tortured in our own country. we don't. we don't have any room to talk about anyone else if we are not willing to turn that in on ourselves when we find it done here.

[defendandprotect]

56. Also, these same people seem to think that only others will be harmed . . .

never ordinary citizens . . . !!!

The elite globalists continue to strike at the most vulnerable, but our turn

will come. The Middle Class is already being hacked at very successfully.

Shall we wait until we're actually "third world America" to cry for justice???

[snappyturtle]

25. YES! K&R nt

[southerncrone]

26. Could it be I'm falling in love w/you, arcadian!

Could not have said it more succinctly or better. :thumbsup:

We must realize that until our credibility with the rest of the world repaired, we cannot have decent foreign relations or foreign support for our actions. This is even more important now that we must rely on foriegn monies to support our financial woes.

[Royal Sloan 09]

28. K & R, That's the true, can't move-on until the mess is cleared up. eom

[yellerpup]

30. Needs doing.

And right away. K&R! :kick:

[barbtries]

32. it's time for greed to make room

for justice.

[Hotler]

33. Don't forget Poppy Bush, Just for grins.

[grantcart]

34. A small but important distinction

We don't prosecute people we prosecute crimes.


The crimes should be investigated and based on the evidence indictments secured from the grand jury people proscuted for the alleged crimes that they have committed.


Investigating people to find out what crime they may have committed is what Whitewater was about. Start with a completely irrelevent investment 20 years ago and end up with a completely irrelevent indiscretion in the White House.


Violations of the law should be investigated pertaining to specific violations of misuse of national security apparatus.


Lying to the people about war is an impeachable offense but not a criminal offense. Politically interring with national security agencies in the time of war is a criminal offense and they should start at the bottom with the operatives and build a case and flip people, just like any federal prosecution.

[AntiFascist]

35. K&R n/t

[rosesaylavee]

36. Agreed.

If the Rule of Law is to mean anything, these acts must be investigated and those found guilty need to be prosecuted. Not doing that on Nixon's and Reagan/Bush 1's crimes led us to Bush 2's crimes.

We can't afford to ignore this if we want this country to continue.

[RedCloud]

37. 100% agree!

Right on!

[williesgirl]

38. Just gave you a heart cause I couldn't agree w/you more! rec'd

[L. Coyote]

39. That, and we have to pay our way out of BONDAGE for decades!!

Let's see if I get it?

We gave the bankers several trillion and now pay them interest on it until out grandchildren die.

Yeah, that's bondage!

[Imagevision]

40. Obama prefers to look forward, however he claims no-one is above the law and

if the Bush gang broke some laws (putting it extremely mildly) "then those responsible should be held accountable". Pelosi stated last month, the president's approval wasn't necessary to begin an investigation into any wrong doing by the Bush administration - Mean while Cheney to change the serious subject matter says last week we should be expecting another terrorist attack in the future sometime. (Dick, hold your breath)

[CLANG]

41. We won't be moving forward, unfortunately. We're screwn.

[Imagevision]

42. In order to know where we're at? we need to know how we arrived...?

[pacalo]

43. Hearts for arcadian!

[caraher]

44. Investigate. Prosecute. Incarcerate.

All the way up and down the "chain of command."

No "just following orders" defense.

No "we can't criminalize bad policy." Torture is not a policy, it is a crime. They criminalized themselves by ordering barbaric criminal acts.

[pretzel4gore]

46. the pigmedia will not even consider it

and they determine who gets ass kissed or who gets ass kicked...

[defendandprotect]

62. And who is left watching pigmedia . . . ?????????????

[Stinky The Clown]

47. How right you are

[windoe]

48. I am with the 2/3 of Americans who feel this way.

To allow the rich and powerful to get away with the last 8 years will set a very dangerous precedent for future generations. America will lose face if we do not prosecute. Our Constitution will mean nothing.

I think Obama will allow a trial if Americans become loud and do not waver on this issue.

[defendandprotect]

63. Yes . .. and we've already tried that with JFK and the other assassinations . . .

MLK, RFK, Malcolm X -- and other scandals . . . Iran-Contra . . . October Surprise . .

S&L Theft and Embezzlements . . . BCCI . . and we can see that it has only moved us

closer to fascism.

[defendandprotect]

49. Agree . . . and down with Lee Hamilton the official cover-up operator . . !!

[leftofthedial]

53. something could go on without this,

but it wouldn't be America anymore.

[Kaleva]

57. I'm too busy bringing JFK's killers to justice.

Until that happens, we really can't move on.

[defendandprotect]

64. They're all the same people ---

establishment elites/international globalists/NAZIS ---

capitalists/corporatism/MIC -- and the hierarchies which shape decision making.

[rhett o rick]

58. k & r

[deaniac21]

59. This is definately the most pressing issue in the world today!

[IsItJustMe]

60. If you are not part of the solution, then you a part of the problem. To be honest about it, looking

ahead is not going to cut it.

[kwenu]

65. I think you might be stuck for a while then because its not at the top of the agenda.