Just a reminder. Serious mental illness is a heartbreaking disease

[cali]

not a punch line.

[ogneopasno]

1. You wouldn't think that looking at all the Nadya Suleman threads.

You could replace her name with scores of others, of course, including the latest one of the guy who cut off his own hand.

[cali]

2. Nadya Suleman is lilkely not what most shrinks

would label as someone with a persistent, serious mental illness. She is not psychotic.

[opihimoimoi]

3. W Bush is......

[obiwan]

15. George W. Bush is a sociopath.

[ogneopasno]

4. No, not psychotic. But I think she does have mental issues.

[EFerrari]

5. We don't know that. n/t

[blogslut]

6. No

But it's quite likely that she suffers from a combination of personality disorders - which can be just as heartbreaking and just as permanent. People with PD can live an entire life of self-medication, broken relationships, lost jobs and never get the help they need because they're never diagnosed.

[EFerrari]

18. People with PDs also have psychotic episodes. They just cover them better.

And so, are less likely to be taken seriously, I guess. :(

[Pithlet]

22. As if people have been making that distinction. n/t

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sohndrsmith]

8. You're right. It's not a punch line, but it is a stigma... which I

find inexplicable and intolerable.

Example:

Person 1 and Person 2 have the same/equivalent disorder or mental illness. One of them looks for help, one does not:


Person 1 - has the awareness to realize they aren't handling things well, and do the right thing: seek help to solve a problem.
Person 2 - cannot recognize they aren't handling things well, and cope in various ways, but they find the idea of seeking help as
absurd.

Person 1 - is labeled and judged because there is a paper trail proving "mental or emotional problems". If they go to court for any
issue from divorce to being seriously injured in an accident or witness/victim of a crime, etc. they are likely to be
dismissed, discounted and doubted (at best).
Person 2 - is not labeled or judged. If they go to court for any of the above reasons, they are treated with respect, their statements
viewed as credible (even if they lie - and those lies can be proven).

Person 1 - seeking medical treatment that cannot immediately be explained or identified - is likely to have the symptoms diagnosed
as being "all in their head", imaginary or just not taken as seriously, which can lead to dangerous and devastating results.
Person 2 - seeking medical treatment is taken seriously and receives adequate medical care.

The stigma we impose on people who seek help or acknowledge any mental "nonconformity" is, well, insane. It's very hurtful and very wrong...

[rrneck]

9. You said a mouth full.

The health care problems in this country reach well into the population of people who suffer from all sorts and kinds of illnesses that are difficult to recognize, diagnose and treat, but leave them members of the walking wounded nonetheless.

[Naturyl]

10. You are so right. The craziest people I know...

...Are the same ones who would *never* consider getting treatment.

Meanwhile, because i have sought treatment, those SAME people use it against me, to discredit my arguments.

[sohndrsmith]

11. It's a frightening thing to realize, isn't it? What is so tragic (on top of

the hell people go through for the rest of their lives having the burden of the stigma) is that people who really need help, want help, and know they need help - won't seek it out because of the very real fear they will be labeled and discredited, affecting every aspect of their lives. And the worst part about it is....

They're right... the stigma can potentially do far more damage than the original disorder.

[Naturyl]

13. As soon as you get a diagnosis, there are some people who...

...will NEVER let you forget it. Anytime there is an argument or disagreement, your view will be dismissed as follows - "you're only saying that because you have <insert diagnosis here>." Suddenly you are not capable of having a legitimate opinion about anything. Whatever your opponents don't like is blamed on the diagnosis.

I admire anyone who needs help and seeks it, because it really does involve a lifelong cost.

[sohndrsmith]

19. You're right. But it is largely an "invisible" prejudice. Had I not

seen it or experienced it personally - I would have not realized the extent of the problem.

I was raised by a teacher and a child psychologist. Psychology and psychological issues were always part of the discussions. My parents psychology textbooks dominated the bookshelves. I thought of mental issues as just another facet of life - worthy of care, treatment, empathy... the study and help of which was basically a calling - and a worthy one at that.

Little did I know that the vast majority of people I would run into later in life would have such a different view. Even therapists (so-called).

I cringe when I hear politicians or doctors (or anyone) recommend "programs" or "therapy" for those who are suffering, because when that line is crossed, a detrimental, permanent change occurs, I'm not even convinced that therapy or other psych treatments are useful or helpful or curative. I do know that they cause an enormous shift in an individual's life - permanently.

Such a healing, giving practice should not be burdened with such collateral damage - yet those with good intentions don't seem to get that it is... and it's just a tragic situation on every level.

[Withywindle]

12. Yup.

I'd add another scenario. A friend of mine got laid off a year ago. She has a lot of the same issues I do - serious depression and anxiety. Nothing that needs institutionalization but definitely enough to impair functioning if untreated - and she's been seeing a therapist for years. Well, when she applied for insurance to various companies to try to get some kind of health coverage, no matter how exorbitant for catastrophic only, they all turned her down. Reason? She was honest about seeing a therapist. Her therapist said, "Oh, honey, I wish you'd asked me first. I'd have told you you should NEVER admit to that."

Also, mental illness is a cruel and toxic way of forcing the very people least capable of fighting for themselves to do so. Most people I know with mental illnesses of various stripes are absolutely terrified of paperwork, being judged, crowded offices and long waits, asking for help in any form, being confined, you name it - all the things that this system LOVES to put them through. I know depressives, bipolars, schizophrenics, etcetera, who would literally rather stick their hands in a tank of venomous snakes than go to an interview with the purpose of JUDGING their WORTHINESS to receive life-saving help. And really, who can blame them?

[Naturyl]

14. You hit the nail on the head there.

It brings to mind the waiting room at the local "mental health center" - always totally crowded with chairs no more than an inch apart. Does it ever occur to them that people with "issues" might be really put off by an environment like that? Apparently not - or they don't care.

[Withywindle]

16. No, I don't think they do care.

And honestly - aren't most local "mental health centers" that don't cater to the upper-class so underfunded and understaffed that one might understand how the very-human staff might want to weed down their workload? I can't blame the individuals. But it all feeds into the problem of how most of us with mental illnesses--if our issues are mild enough that we are even able to recognize that we need help in the first place, which is not the case for the most desperately ill--already carry around such a deeply ingrained mental script of "we're not worth it" that no pep talk can over come, we're certainly not capable of being our own advocates against a hostile, overloaded, deeply miserly system.

[mykpart]

17. There is no such thing as mentally ill or mentally healthy.

There is only diagnosed and undiagnosed. And when someone spends time in a mental institution, they are certified as sane when they are discharged. That's better than most "normal" people can do! I don't mean to be flippant, but if you have a chronic disease which you are treated for, you're probably healthier than the people who don't know they are sick.

[Smith_3]

20. Oh, yes there is.

If you have ever experienced schizophrenia and were cured from it, then we can talk. Tell me then that you don't feel the difference.

[Djinn]

21. what?

"And when someone spends time in a mental institution, they are certified as sane when they are discharged"

where on earth did you get that idea? People are not certified sane or insane in any case but no-one, least of the psych profession assumes that leaving hospital means your schizophrenia or whatever has gone away