Last night on the History Channel they had a show about dams.

[ColbertWatcher]

They covered the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Cooley_Dam#Background">Grand Cooley Dam and even did a bit about the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennessee_Valley_Authority#1930s">TVA.

The show talked about how big they were and how many people worked on them and how much electricity they generated.

All http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Works_Administration">during the Great Depression.

I mention this because it was just another reminder of how wrong the GOPers are about everything.

[1]

1. the history channel? heh. ok...

[ColbertWatcher]

5. Yeah, it was an episode of "Modern Marvels." n/t

[-..__...]

2. If they built it today...

it would be using an illegal alien work crew, the engineers would be here on H1B visas, the materials would be imported from China, the project would be completed at 3 times the original estimated cost and 8-10 years overdue, a Congressional panel/investigation would take place to examine bidding and billing improprieties. 8-10 years after that, the dam would have to be shutdown due to critical flaws found in the construction materials and design.

[Thothmes]

4. Don't forget

that it would require 15 years of court fights before construction began because of the challenges in court by various interest groups.

[ColbertWatcher]

6. Or, the entire contract would be given to Halliburton. n/t

[Thothmes]

3. Could not have been to wrong about everything

The engineering for the Grand Coulee Dam construction was accomplished under the Hoover Administration. Also ever hear of Hoover Dam? Its construction began in 1931. Several of the dams that are in the TVA system were built by private companies before the creation of the TVA. The were bought by the TVA. Several Dams in the TVA system were started/completed during the thirties as part of the New Deal. Several dams in the TVA system were built in the 1940s as part of the war effort.

[1]

7. the hoover dam...

that little wonder could not be constructed today. the environmental impact would not be allowed in this modern world. let alone the 100+ dudes that died during its construction. those lawsuits today would have wrecked the project.

ah, for such simple times as the 1930's...

[ThomWV]

8. About your final comment ...

"Several dams in the TVA system were built in the 1940s as part of the war effort."

Just something to mentally file away, about 10% of all the electricity produced in this country during the second world war was consumed in the manufactur of the first atomic weapons.

[Thothmes]

17. The TVA dams and Grand Coulee

were needed to produce electricity to support the smeltering of aluminium in the quanitites to support the war.

[ColbertWatcher]

9. Not only have I heard of Hoover Dam, but I remember when it was called Boulder Dam.

And yes, the design of a project as big as a dam takes years.

Nevertheless, the actual construction of it could have been delayed if FDR was afraid of spending federal money during a depression.

He wasn't, he did and Coolee and other Public Works Admin projects were built during the Depression to provide jobs and infrastructure.

Another important point that seems to elude the can't-see-past-their-hate-GOP: a vast majority of those projects are still up and running today.

What GOPers call spending was not simply spending, but investing.

[doc03]

10. I like to remind my Republican friends

about that. I ask them if they like to go fishing, hunting, camping or boating around any of the lakes in the area, and remind them they were built during the Great Depression by FDR's public works projects. Most of Ohio's lakes, parks and recreation areas were built back in the 30's and 40's. Many of the people in this area still get their electricity from the REA, another of FDR's projects. Ask them if they are going to sign up for SS and Medicare. Then ask them for an example of any progress made in this country under a Republican Administration. The only thing I can think of was the Interstate Highway system but today Ike couldn't get elected he wouldn't be conservative enough. I wonder how the vote went on that one, I wouldn't be surprised if he got it passed by a Democratic vote anyway. I believe the way he got it through was calling it a National Security project.

[1]

11. the interstate highway system...

another project, like the aforementioned dams, that could not be constructed today.

(and many would argue that this would be a good thing)

the environmental impact would not be allowed.



the 30's, 40's and 50's were the times to get shit done. those things are not allowed now...

[doc03]

12. A company is trying to construct a hydroelectric

generator at a nearby dam on the Ohio river, they have been tied up for years trying to get EPA and Corps of Engineer permits. Same goes for another company that is trying to build an amusement park in the area, they have been tied up for at least 3 years waiting on permits. They expect the thing to create 3000 jobs if they ever get it built.

[Bandit]

13. I call bs on your argument

Many things are being built today, new roads are created and buildings are built. Yes there are environmental impact statements that need to be accomplished before any project can go forward but most projects do indeed go forward unless there is really a strong argument for them not.. Are you suggesting we should not have environmental impact statements before any new construction? There is a huge new tunnel being built at the moment between New York and New Jersey Huge Project...:shrug:

[ThomWV]

14. Bandit - something you should know, not a biggie, but important in its own way

Not arguing with your sentiment, I agree with you more or less completely. The thing I wanted to point out to you was one sort of misstatement in your post that is nothing big but can be a mighty big consideration in some similar discussions.

See where you said "Yes there are environmental impact statements that need to be accomplished before any project can go forward ..."? Well, that's not exactly true and the reason its not a universal truth is that Environmental Impact Studies (EIS) are only required if there is Federal funding involved and if so that a determination has been made that none of the existing exemptions to doing one exists. Doesn't matter which Agency is spending the money but it only applies to the Government spending; however it is not proportional, its all or nothing. So you or I could go out and build a dam (presuming we obeyed all other laws) and never have to even think about having an EIS done, so could my town, country, or state government - no EIS required at all. But let them, or me, take one dime of Federal money to help us with our project and then the whole ball of wax falls under the National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA).

Oh, NEPA became law January 1, 1970. I don't know this to be true but it always seemed to me that while the law existed nearly 40 years ago there was no active enforcement of it until Clinton came to the White House.

[ColbertWatcher]

15. "those things are not allowed now" We can do things today, we'll just do them differently. n/t

[NightWatcher]

16. Dam the Politicians, Not the Rivers

A great old bumpersticker I used to have.