Ken Burns' Nat Parks - I Just Can't Get Past The Burnsisms

[stopbush]

Tuned into this last night and within 10 minutes I was so annoyed by the pan in, pan out, scan left, scan right camera work on a bunch of still pictures, the twangy-voiced narrator and the "down home" music in the background that I surfed away faster than you can say, "there's gold in them thar document'ries!"

I understand that there are few options available when you're basically trying to add a sense of animation to a bunch of old public domain photographs. But is it too much to ask Burns to try something different that what he always does? It's as annoying as Spielberg overusing the rising camera angle as people walk towards the lens that gets featured in every single one of his movies.

At this point, Burns' work is bordering on the unimaginative and hackneyed. I wanted to watch this series, but I'm just too put off by the Burnsisms to do so. Any suggestions?

Flame away.

[virgogal]

1. Suggestion? Don't watch it.

[stopbush]

4. At this point, your suggestion is the one I'm going with.

[TwilightGardener]

2. Eh, I'm not that critical. I think the music is great, actually--love bluegrass

and roots music. The only thing that annoys me is when they interview anyone other than historians or those involved in the parks. I don't care what some woo-woo poet-wannabe writer thinks.

[Orsino]

3. There should have been more sex.

And would it kill him to put in a car chase? Wait, how about if instead of a national park it's a nuclear power plant?

In all seriousness, though, I'm not sure I know how to spice up a collection of old photos (and music), either.

[stopbush]

11. I admit that I haven't watched but 10 minutes, 10 minutes I didn't

find all that promising.

Maybe he shows lots of present-day video footage elsewhere in the series. Why not use that for the majority and mix in a few historic stills here and there?

I can see being wedded to old photos when you're doing the Civil War - what else can one use? But the national parks are still here and are living, breathing entities.

Relying on the old photos yet again seems uncreative to me.

As far as suggestions, I was hoping someone would chime in that the series wasn't a rerun of Burns SOP, and that I should give it another shot.

[Orsino]

18. Ah. I guess it makes a kind of sense for the series to start with old photos...

...but I would also be heartened by recent footage showing the beauty that remains.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

24. Not to criticize people who criticize documentaries they have not watched...

But it's a historical documentary, told in roughly chronological order, on the formation of the parks.

So far they're up to 1915.

:shrug:

[ChimpersMcSmirkers]

26. Definitely needed more headshots and splattering blood as well.

I understand the OP's POV though. Burn's can get a little pedantic.

[Ineeda]

5. Peter Coyote is the narrator. Other voices for historical quotes. n/t

[NRaleighLiberal]

6. I have to agree with you. I find his works, deep, scholarly, but not particularly compelling.

Though I think in principle they are well researched and well presented - just a matter of taste and mood (as in I need to be in the right mood to watch them). Of all of them, I enjoyed parts of Jazz the most - but even then, lots of repetition and some glaring omissions.

Still I love what he does - as I say, in principle - and think it is extremely valuable.

[KoKo]

30. Yes...it's a matter of "Taste and Mood." Well said. Good for those who want to watch

but less satisfying for many of us who have seen other stuff through the years. I'm glad he's trying...but can't get over what he misses.

[valerief]

7. Aren't National Parks places where gun owners hang out and shoot things? nt

[WorseBeforeBetter]

22. Isn't that February 2010?

Yee-haw.

[kestrel91316]

8. My only question - did they have any photos of Great Basin National Park?

And if so, were my uncle or grandfather or other relatives in any of them, lol?

Guess I will have to get the video and find out for myself.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

9. it needs more nude interpretive dance and anime gore sequences.

[Joe Fields]

10. you must be young.

I know of few documentarians as gifted as Ken Burns. I guess my attention span is just a might longer.

[stopbush]

13. I just turned 55. How old are you and your attention span?

[TankLV]

62. My span is the same lenght, but it stares at the floor alot more now in the mornings

instead of looking up at me...

it's what happens as you reach 56/57...

sigh...

[Tansy_Gold]

12. I got permanently turned off Burns

when I found errors in his baseball documentary years ago. Everyone told me I couldn't possibly be finding errors, that it must be MY error, because after all, Ken Burns is. . . .Ken Burns.

Turned out, of course, that there WERE errors. Lots of 'em.

[stopbush]

19. I happen to own the Baseball series on VHS tapes, as well as

the huge booklet that was sold along with it.

I watched the whole thing on TV and loved it, bought the tapes...and have never watched them. At the time, I was buying it for my son, who was only a year or so old when it aired. I wanted to have it for him to watch when he grew up.

Now, the VCR player doesn't work so well, and I'll be damned if I'm going to drop another $100 for the DVDs.

[KoKo]

39. Get someone to transfer the tapes to DVD. My SIL does it..because he has

a DVD/VHS transfer recorder. It wasn't expensive and there are folks who will do it cheap he says, if you don't have a relative who can copy the tapes to DVD.

It's worth it...if you bought it for your son to watch when he got older.

[KoKo]

31. He leaves out Howard Zinn...but then he's appealing to RW Audience of Oldsters who

are Big PBS supporters and want to see something that gives them a reason to "hang on."

I'm an Oldster on DU...but I'm not one of them. But, don't want to trash the loyal PBS Supporters who thrive on this stuff.

[stray cat]

14. You have an opinion why flame? We surely don't all like the same shows.

[elocs]

15. It is pretty much like Burns' Civil War series only insert National Parks instead.

His documentaries have become pretty standard and predictable. It was interesting, but not compelling enough for me to watch an entire show. I would have liked to see more HD footage of our national parks and less of old, albeit historical photos. The series is certainly one I would never buy on Blu-ray dvd or even go out of my way to watch again if anything else were on.

[KoKo]

32. Burns needs to ditch the "piano tinkling music" and get rid of his "canned" dialogue to appeal

to younger viewers. I'm old...but want to hear "young" views of nuance and some Lefty Stuff thrown in..to keep MY interest..as an older inquisitive who isn't in the nursing home...yet..and on Heavy Meds and tell my son or daughter to DONATE...and they figure it comes out of their ESTATE...so they just never get around to that donation. :-(

[TankLV]

63. Hint:: Then YOU do one!!! If you don't like Ken's DON'T WATCH!!!

[proud patriot]

16. I really like his documentaries and the style he uses

:shrug:

[Jane Austin]

17. My suggestion?

Take the Bach Flower Remedy Impatiens to help you become more tolerant of other people's offerings.

I love Ken Burns's work and the way he weaves these great stories together, but I guess if you're a film maker you might focus on his techniques.

Now I have the a similar problem with Tom Clancy novels. "Give my love to Mary" just doesn't strike me as something one general says to another every time they speak during an existential crisis for the country.

So I don't read him any more.

Likewise for Ken Follett who can't seem to write a novel without some poor woman's nipples getting pinched - hard (and repeatedly) and irrespective of the century he's writing about.

I guess that's his idea of foreplay through the ages. It's my idea of abuse.

[stopbush]

21. Leave it to Jane Austen to criticize other writers.

What have YOU written lately? Last I looked, you've been dead for almost 200 years.

Oh, wait...you're Austin, not Austen.

Never mind...

[Jane Austin]

47. Hee hee. . . . . n/t

[KoKo]

33. I have to agree even though I'm trashing Ken Burns with my posts on this thread..

I just always think he could DO BETTER. I forget sometimes that there are folks who didn't grow up like I did before Reagan...and so many have never seen anything like what Ken Burns does. So...they aren't cynical like me.

I hope that his work inspires new generations! I just wish his work was better...but then PBS probably edited all the good stuff out...and what we end up with is what most folks can deal with in a WEEK LONG VIEW!

I wish he and PBS had made it Once a Week like the old "Masterpiece Theater" so we could digest it all rather than a "Full Week Marathon." It all gets to be a bit much compressed in a week to absorb.

[Jane Austin]

48. I sure agree with that!

It's a lot to absorb in one week and begins to feel like a chore - no matter how wonderful the content.

[triple point]

20. I enjoy the smattering of beautiful pictures, but the intervening monotonous commentary

is just, uh, boring. And there's a lot of it.

[blue sky at night]

23. i couldn't disagree with you more......

they spent Five Years shooting the thing and you piss all over it only 2 minutes in...what the fuck do you do that puts you up on such a high horse? Maybe shoot with a disposable camera and send it to the out lab at walmart?...got a digital camera yet? And how are YOUR editing skills, ever tried making a movie?....get off it and go watch something else, oh, and never mind the underlying message in the piece.

What to do with a still image in a moving medium....hmmmmmm?

[mitchum]

25. Due to the subject, he should have gotten Yogi Bear to narrate it

He does have his shtick down, doesn't he?

[TheCowsCameHome]

27. Go watch a video of Wal-Marts and cheesy souvenir shops being built

on these national treasures and you'll thank Ken Burns for what he does.

[chollybocker]

28. I agree, stopbush.

Burns' redundant style has become grating and clichéed, despite the terrific subject matter.

[KoKo]

29. Sad to say..after the BIG HYPE...it's kind of repetative and boring...

but then that cheesy piano music in background has always sort of "done it" for his spectaculars on PBS for me.

I think there's some good stuff there if you are NEW to what "was America." I don't want to diss it ...but just saying ..it was old to me. But, then I grew up in a different time...so what's "Old" to me..is "New" to others.

ENJOY! We have so little out there that for newbies it's good to see SOMETHING!

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

34. I like the folksy guitar music and the twangy accents

I know it's more of the same style, but I like the previous style. No flames here, however, as I perfectly understand your point of view and I know that not all things appeal to everyone. I do find repetitiousness in this particular documentary on the National Parks, where we seem to see the same stills of Yosemite night after night. And Burns has a strong point-of-view, favoring conservation and slanting the documentary by not presenting much of the pro-business argument. He constantly evokes the notion that the parks were a good idea. That however is something I'm fine with, because I'm very conservation-minded and also consider men like Muir to be national heros (as does Burns, apparently). Most documentaries are slanted towards the filmmaker's point-of-view, leaving in facts that favor that slant and leaving out facts that disfavor it, so that doesn't bother me either.

[KoKo]

38. True...but we need to remember PBS was trashed after Reagan, Clinton had the RW attacks and Obama

hasn't had time to get into why PBS went to the Dark Side. I imagine Ken Burns had to get money from funders who are with the BushBots...although some say they lean towards the middle. He had to be careful how he presented this Documentary. He had to present it to get Americans into the National Parks while not going against the "Powers that Be" too hard.

It was probably an effort to get Tourism in America that would thrill the "Chambers of Commerce" and satisfy the needs of those Funders who like to think they are Environmentalists or Whatever who are considred to the Left of Pat Buchanan.

He probably did the best he could with what he was faced with...but for many of us..it comes off as boring and repetitive. :-(

[Krakowiak]

35. Not a fan of Burns, would much rather see the BBC/Attenborough style for our Nat. Parks

Just returned from Glacier yesterday, so I will check it out anyway, but previous experiences with Burns have not built up my expectations for this.

[Ikonoklast]

36. Two of my favorite 'Burnsisms'...

"Excellent!", and "Smithers, release the hounds!"

[Touchdown]

37. It's so hackneyed that iPhoto has a "Ken Burns effect" in the slideshow options.

It pans in & out, to and fro. The moving camera work is also not Burns' forte either. Cinematography is quite pedestrian compared to what Discovery Channel, BBC, and what that New Disney Earth DVD has made.

It is an interesting story though, at least to me. I think of it as an audiobook with a slideshow... well, isn't that really what it is?

[NuttyFluffers]

40. if only there's more pizazz, like strobe lights and booty shakin'...

and an actor standing in the middle of a field, arms out, looking up to the sky and silently pleading, "Give me an Oscar!" i want the tried and true reinvented every other season -- the wheel's old, give me the oval, or carotid! wow me!

[blue sky at night]

41. ha!

how telling is that you got NOT one rec! HA!

[stopbush]

43. Assuming that recs denote the best threads

is like assuming awards always go to the best movies/actors.

Boy, you're easily pleased. I'm guessing you're a cheap drunk, too. Maybe half a beer or less before the "ha"s start flying with you.

[blue sky at night]

49. how is it you are so smart?

you know all about me don't you.....oh, and by the way, you forgot to answer any of my questions....guess you can't be bothered, only able to name call! HA!

[stopbush]

54. I didn't notice that you had asked any questions.

[blue sky at night]

55. thats because you are too busy to read

replys to your own thread...look it up.

[Liberal In Texas]

42. We used to have a saying in the TV biz: "If it's worth doing...

It's worth overdoing."

Of course it was being sarcastic about anyone who overused SFX or in news to beat a story to death (which is commonplace these days.)

[Retrograde]

44. It's very deliberately paced

The narrator speaks....very....slowly....and....deliberately...as....if....the....audience....might....miss....the...awesomeness - you get the drift. It took a long time to make, by gum, it's going to take a long time to watch. I do like the old pictures of places I've been, but he could pick up the pace a bit. After 3 hours it's still on TR - do we really need to hear about every one of his campouts?


Burns is in a rut, though. I think he's losing the opportunity to show before/after pictures of the same location. A few month ago the local PBS channel had a show called Paving the Way, about a car journey to the western national parks in the early 20th century: it covered a lot of the same territory in the same way, but didn't seem to drag as much.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

45. The Discovery and History Channel docs do re-enactments.

I don't think any of Ken or Ric Burns' documentaries use reenactments.

So that's probably one reason why it seems boring. I have liked most of their stuff. I didn't watch the one about baseball, because I don't give a shit about sports, pro or amateur; and I tried to watch Jazz but it was way too repetitive.

I guess I liked the one about Frank Lloyd Wright and the one about Susan B. Anthony and Elizabeth Cady Stanton, "Not For Ourselves Alone", the best.

In Cosmos, Sagan used reenactments of Johannes Kepler when he was both young & old, and Tycho Brahe's parties.

[Swamp Rat]

46. I'd rather look at Ansel Adams photos and listen to Felix Mendelssohn

[peekaloo]

50. "Release the Hounds" and "Exxxcellent" are my favorite Burnsisms.

:spank:

couldn't resist

I enjoyed the first 2 hours but repeated attempts to watch subsequent episodes have failed. It's just not grabbing me (and you may have articulated the reason).

[Jakes Progress]

51. I guess some are just way too cool for school.

So above and beyond the common folk.

I have enjoyed the series from the standpoint of Burns work. My complaint is to my local PBS station. They are so hip and so cool that they leave their huge logo emblazoned on the screen for the whole series.

So while the program talks about the crude idiots who write their names on the walls of the Grand Canyon or carve their initials into the redwoods, KERA displays both hubris and hutzpah by doing the same thing electronically, marring the beautiful shots of Half Dome and Denali. What could have been a fund raiser for them just irritates more every minute of the series.

[Arkansas Granny]

52. I'll admit that it's pure Ken Burns, but I'm enjoying every minute of it.

[WI_DEM]

53. Boy, we must be watching different shows (or have different tastes) because I think it's been great

[KoKo]

56. Not saying it isn't GREAT for many DU'ers..just that we saw better stuff years ago.

Ken Burns "Unleashed" would have been a better Series under Clinton or Carter. Just saying.

[dysfunctional press]

57. i had the exact same experience with it.

next...?

[KoKo]

58. We might find it a bigger deal when Fascist America is the only stuff we are "allowed to see."

Meaning when they confiscate all the backlog of wonderful films on John Muir and the rest who have already had Documentaries out their on them...and the only thing one can get to show their children about AMERICA will be "KEN BURNS...and his TINKLY PIANO..as the Authority."

I would hate to see that backlog of Documentaries in the dust bin...and archived (not to be shown) end up on the "DELETE BUTTON." But...I think it really could be so...that it could happen in favor of Burns stuff.

[Ron Green]

59. I agree with you. It's emotionally manipulative in the same way Spielberg

is in his movies (I'm of the opinion his last good one was Jaws.) I'm keenly interested in the material: The history of the parks and the Park Service, the personalities involved, the chronology of the addition of new parks. I just can't stand the smarminess. We're now going to buy a book on the history of the National Parks, but it probably won't be the companion to this series.

[GCP]

60. He's got to be the most boring documentary maker ever

I really don't know how he's got so popular.

[KoKo]

61. Ken Burns & Co. don't have any other competition given the McCorporate Media Control these days.

That anything gets out...including his somewhat boring series..is a Miracle.

We should have more and better. But his is what he could get funding for. We need to be grateful for small favors? :shrug:

[XOKCowboy]

64. Let me guess. You work with film/video....

It's like me when I go to concerts. I'm not listening to the music, I'm checking out how the stage is built, what equipment they're using, the lighting cues, the projection screens, etc.

I'm glad I don't have those distractions. I've enjoyed the series because I have a long history with our national parks. I've learned a lot from the series. Now Civil War? Couldn't watch it for many of the reasons you state.

[KoKo]

66. For those who aren't as critical as many of us..National Parks might get a boost in visitorship

during this Great Depression II. So...if nothing else he's focused attention to those treasures. Instead of Disneland...do a local National Park.

We did it with our kids with the ones on the East Coast and others in family did the West Coast.

Maybe the music and lack of creativity will turn off those of us who remember better stuff...but turn on those who've never seen our treasures before and encourage them to go...take the road trip and get out there and see what good..government can do if we push preservation over destruction. :shrug:

[spanone]

65. mr burns is the best and his technique is exquistie, but not for everyone, i guess.

[Zomby Woof]

67. I love it

I am a National Parks junkie, and I admire Burns's craftmanship. Are his films perfect? Of course not. I could nitpick something in all of them, in form or content. But I'd rather absorb the lessons and appreciate the overall message and effort. His virtues far outweigh his flaws, and that his low-key formula is good enough in the Age of Yelling Pundits, "Reality TV" Neuroses, and Quirky Dramedies.

Shelton Johnson is as earnest, eloquent, and sincere of a spokesperson as the NPS could ask for - he is the Shelby Foote of this film.

"National Parks: America's Best Idea" is one "Reality TV" show I can get behind.