Grover Fucking Norquist

[WilliamPitt]

“My goal is to cut government in half in twenty-five years, to get it down to the size where we can drown it in the bathtub.”

“Every time you cut programs, you take away a person who has a vested interest in high taxes and you put him on the tax rolls and make him a taxpayer. A farmer on subsidies is part welfare bum, whereas a free-market farmer is a small businessman with a gun.”

“A vote in the state legislature to allow a local government to impose a higher tax is not opposing tax increases. This isn't higher-level math.”

“Every worker who doesn't join a union is another worker who doesn't pay $500 a year to organized labor's political machine.”

“Hurricane Katrina has set off a revolt in the Republican constituency, so I believe Bush will need to find spending restraints and the country will focus on that in 2006 and 2008.”

“Publicly, Republicans stood by their embattled colleague Wednesday. Privately, some began to talk of a post-DeLay era. Either way, they were hopeful that, whatever happened with the legal troubles, DeLay had institutionalized his fundraising and vote-whipping prowess so much that it would outlive him. He is a conviction politician like Ronald Reagan; he's also been a party builder ... DeLay always kept his eye on building party and the movement, and that's rare.”

“If you could clone Karl (Rove) and bring in someone who had his talent and instincts, but not the relationship with Bush, it would be 50-60% as good.”

...remember who you're dealing with here before you snuggle up to him...

[BlooInBloo]

1. They don't care who they snuggle up with. As long as it's against Obama, it's all good with them.

[babylonsister]

5. I think you've got it! nt

[blondeatlast]

12. Yup. nt

[Kahuna]

47. +1 nt

[Bobbie Jo]

55. +2

:eyes:

[AspenRose]

57. I would like to give some here the benefit of the doubt

but for others, based on past commentary, it's all too obvious that this is the case.

[MH1]

64. P U M A. 'nuff said.

[Maru Kitteh]

84. Bingo

[Sarah Ibarruri]

2. Am I the only one who is aware that this f-head is a sociopath?

Or does anyone else join me in this belief?

[KittyWampus]

8. Yes, I'd add the factoid that Norquist channeled money to KEEP Apartheid in South Africa going

He has an agenda and he's been all too effective in the past.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

21. How come bad things never happen to garbage like Norquist and Cheney? nt

[Warpy]

30. Well, bad things are happening to Cheney

He looks like he's in end stage congestive heart failure. That means he's a cardiac cripple, unable to walk more than a few steps at a time, gasping for every breath he takes.

Instead of giving him compassion for other sick folks, it's just making him meaner.

I doubt he'll live long enough to see the inside of a prison cell, but he will never have a second's peace, always looking around to see if he's been charged with his crimes.

Imagine him on his deathbed, everything slipping away but the horrible knowledge that all his scheming and grasping were for nothing. I'm afraid that's the only justice he will ever face. It's a terrible justice, but it gives little satisfaction to all the people he's harmed.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

36. What an evil, evil piece of crap that man has been.

Let me tell you, I'm a softie when it comes to people being sick. I practically fall apart, cry, run around getting everything I can, try to fix things...

But with this evil freak, Cheney? Well, it's reeeeally hard for me to feel sorry for him. Reeeeal hard.

[Warpy]

40. Would you rather see him or be him?

Thought so.

That's the beginning of compassion for someone so wounded, so limited as to be pure evil.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

43. You're right. It'd be terrifying to be such a shithead nt

[Gman]

42. That sorry bastard better not escape justice by dying a coward

history will not remember him kindly in the least.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

44. That's too bad

I was hoping that he runs in 2012. Some guy in Newsweek thinks it's a great idea for the GOP!

:eyes:

[malaise]

53. Yes in the end he will know that it was all for nothing

and that evil war criminal in in horrific pain 24/7.

[barbtries]

3. is someone snuggling up to grover norquist?

i'm confused. is there a news item attached to these quotes? thank you.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

10. Jane Hamsher, an alleged liberal. Quite a bit of controversy about this.

They got together to push for an investigation of Rahm Emanuel. Personally, I don't think anybody should associate with Grover Norquist for any reason.

[barbtries]

23. ok, thanks

i will check the links. i agree with you. ugh.

[WhiteTara]

38. agreed. Jane is coming up with fleas. n/t

[KharmaTrain]

11. Just Follow The Links...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7324454

[barbtries]

33. thank you

[WeDidIt]

17. Jane Hamsher and Cenk Uygar are. n/t

[spiritual_gunfighter]

56. If we continue to throw liberals under the bus

there will be none of us left. Except you of course.

[MH1]

65. So why is Hamsher throwing liberals under the bus by cozying up with Norquist?

[blondeatlast]

4. The ratfucker damn near got his wish with Hurricane Katrina.

Thanks for lending your knowledge and DU notoriety--it can't be repeated enough what an evil little ratfucker he is.

[mcablue]

6. Another "Let's not talk about Rahm's Freddie Mac job" thread

Here you can discuss all the bad things Norquist has advocated, except for the merits of his (and Jane Hamsher's) accusations against Rahm Emanuel.

[WeDidIt]

9. Bogus bullshit allegations from Jane Hamsher

are meaningless.

She has jumped off the cliff, are you following her?

[ProSense]

16. What's the point

Emboldening the RW?

Their script goes something like this: ACORN, Fannie, and Freddie worked with the Democratic Congress to pressure banks to lend to "risky" borrowers, using the Community Reinvestment Act as their leverage.

The RW's attempt to blame CRA for the mortgage crisis is despicable

[babylonsister]

18. Did you not read any links provided to you in the previous thread, or

are you just being willfully ignorant?

[BeyondGeography]

22. So you're on board with Hamsher's Norquist MSM troll-feeding joint venture?

:dunce:

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

32. It always makes sense to consider Norquist's motives. And you can be sure they are not good.

And Jane Hamsher should remember that when you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas. No offense to dogs; I'd classify Norquist as more of the jackal species.

I don't care for Rahm Emanuel and I would be happy to see him replaced. However, the Freddie Mac situation has already been investigated, and it seems to me that Hamsher's motives may be suspect. You can be sure Norquist's are just plain bad.

[Jazzgirl]

34. Will is talking about what a ratfucker Norquist is.

It doesn't matter if Rahm is an asshole too. The fact that she teamed up with Norquist when there were other more credible (and Grover is not credible) people to collaborate with makes me question her judgment.

[NYC Liberal]

60. Fuck Norquist, I support Rahm Emmanuel.

Go ally yourself and support right-wing conservatives all you want.

[WeDidIt]

7. Jane Hamsher's ego was bruised, so destroying Obama is all that matters now

and her Firebaggers will follow her into the gates of Hell.

[Frances]

19. I deleted Firedoglake

from my list of sites to visit.

I think the Firebaggers have gotten so emotional that they aren't thinking straight.

[KharmaTrain]

25. Single Issue Myopia

I was an early FDL reader...back in the days of Scotter Libby. I had my fill during last year's primaries when the focus went from keeping their eyes on GOOP corruption and abuses to picking favorites and fights on this side of the tracks.

Jane's anger about healthcare seems to have driven her into a rage that is very self-destructive. A blogger's best asset is to generate discussion, when one goes into massive advocacy, they risk losing support and credibility and turning petty and vindictive. Sad to see this happen.

[madrchsod]

13. he`s a grifter who pissed off a few republicans in my little town

he`s real good at taking other people`s money for his own welfare and sticking them with the bill.

[rurallib]

14. speaking of farmers on subsidies - Chuck Grassley

http://farm.ewg.org/farm/addrsearch.php?s=yup&stab=US&city=&c=See+Recipients&zip=&last=grassley&first=&fullname=
the first three are chuck's son, chuck, chuck's grandson.

[Kingofalldems]

15. It's like when Joe Lieberman teamed up with William Bennett--

At least we thought it was odd at the time.

[mcablue]

20. And Dean. He wants to destroy Obama as well n/t

[WilliamPitt]

24. What the fuck are you talking about?

Jesus.

[ProSense]

26. Dean teamed up with Norquist?

Also, Dean isn't advocating killing the bill. Sorry to disappoint you.

[Berry Cool]

27. What proof do you have that Dean wants to destroy Obama?

That being said, as unhappy as I am about the health care reform situation, I would no sooner team up with Grover Norquist than I would with a grizzly bear and think I was going to come out ahead because of it.

[WeDidIt]

28. Dean supports the Senate Bill

or did you miss that?

[babylonsister]

29. You'd better watch it; you don't want to blow your cover. nt

[Jazzgirl]

35. They blew their cover a couple of messages ago.

n/t

[berni_mccoy]

51. So true.

[HughMoran]

71. Been trying to point this out for a week now

I'm never wrong about these things.

Never.

[tranche]

59. There's no way you last another month.

[ima_sinnic]

85. now theirs uh reel intellugant posst!

I can tell you read a lot and really know what's going on. :eyes:

[blondeatlast]

89. That's an idiotic statement. nt

[Jazzgirl]

31. I seriously don't understand what the hell Jane was thinking

when she teamed up with this dickhead. She couldn't have been thinking, at least not clearly. Of all people to write a letter with he is one that is against everything else she stands for. Why would she do that?

[haele]

50. Publicity -Perhaps she thinks she can use him?

But before I would be "bipartisan" with someone, I'd look up their actions way past whatever they may have said that pleased me a year ago. It's like teaming up with Al Capone to take down Dillinger.
Even with just a cursory trip down google memory lane, it's evident that he's a think-tank and corporate Mafioso.
To further use the popular references - where Emmanuel may be an corporatist "enforcer" and occasional "Consigliari" - and should he be found guilty of malfeasance during his corporate activities, taken down - Norquist is a Don with minions willing to take the fall for him.
Norquist always seems to be "apart" from the shenanigans, but that's just because he and his high level fellow travelers have set himself up as a successful and lucrative "Conservative Strategist" and can insure there's just enough degree of secrecy and separation to keep him out of the courts while his enforcers like Abrahamoff end up in jail. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised at all to find some link between Rahm and Grover in the past, just from some little project that they both had an interest in - and Grover would be willing to use that link to take Rahm down now that he's not playing Grover's game anymore.

Norquist has never, ever been a "we are the world" type, he's firmly in the "this is my world, you're either with me or against me" camp. If you get involved with his game, his strategy has always been to either insure you're firmly on his side all the way, and once you're no longer useful to him, you're gone, preferably by political suicide.
The man is a grade-A Venomous Snake. And he will always do what snakes like him do, no matter how nice you might think it would be to travel with him "just this once".

- I have been hearing this meme concerning allying with Norquist - we could have never beaten Hitler without Stalin. Well, having actually read history rather than watching the Hitler Channel, I beg to differ. It would have taken longer - another year or so at least - but we could have beaten Hitler.

Stalin's actual impact on the Western front was primarily at the end of the war and had to deal with propaganda value influencing an earlier surrender than actual troops or treaties. Hitler was beating himself against the Soviet Empire; whether or not it Lenin, Stalin, or even Tzar Nicholas (or Mikael, his brother) was in power, the fact that Hitler attacked the Soviet Union to push for a "secure Eastern front" before he had the Western Front secured was what ultimately doomed him, not Stalin. Stalin's actions have pretty much historically proved that he would not have done much of anything to help the Allies, no matter what treaties may have been in place, unless he was attacked from outside forces.

My advice would be to drop Norquist like the venomous Snake he is, don't use him, don't give him any credibility. Go after Rahm with fellow Progressives or at most "moderates"; the weaker conservatives who have a track record of being bi-partisan without fucking their new friends as soon as the alliance ends.

It's like making a deal with the Devil; unless you really are that good, don't even think about it.
The power every person has given the Devil over them is because they're convinced that he's wouldn't mind helping them "just this once" while he's really intent on just getting what he wants and using his new "friend" to get it.

Haele

[treestar]

37. Politics makes strange bedfellows

This case seems to be a perfect illustration of that old saying.

They agree on this one issue, but nothing else.

[TwilightGardener]

45. Jane isn't "politics"--she's simply one angry, bitter person who wants to lash out at Obama.

Grover is politics. And he, and the rest of the GOP, are laughing at the firebaggers who are so easy to sway.

[treestar]

49. Agree. The Republican mentality would be to use her and laugh at her

They think they are so clever.

[berni_mccoy]

39. Jane's LAME Excuse for Joining Forces With Norquist:"Everyone Else is Doing It"

Seriously, she's gone totally nuts. Firebagger nuts.

http://firedoglake.com/2009/12/23/why-i-reached-out-to-grover-norquist-on-fanniefreddie/

And in her excuse she attacks another blogger for calling her out on this.

[laughingliberal]

41. No doubt he is a class A right wing supply sider and a snake. But here was his position on Bush'

FISA violations, the same position, I would hope, that all Democrats held:


Grover Norquist, a principal organizer of the conservative movement who is close to the Bush White House and usually supports its policies, says, "If you interpret the Constitution's saying that the president is commander in chief to mean that the president can do anything he wants and can ignore the laws you don't have a constitution: you have a king." He adds, "They're not trying to change the law; they're saying that they're above the law and in the case of the NSA wiretaps they break it.

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/19092

So, is it always required we ignore the message if the messenger is a right wing hack? He is a right wing, supply side, anti-government asshole but I'm doubtful any of us changed our position on the FISA violations just because Norquist was in agreement with us on it. If would like an answer to the questions the letter he cosigned with Hamsher raised one way or another. I would especially like answers in light of the Christmas Eve announcement about lifting the caps on the funds for Freddi and Fannie.



NEW YORK � The government has handed its ATM card to beleaguered mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.

The Treasury Department said Thursday it removed the $400 billion financial cap on the money it will provide to keep the companies afloat. Already, taxpayers have shelled out $111 billion to the pair, and a senior Treasury official said losses are not expected to exceed the government's estimate this summer of $170 billion over 10 years.

Treasury Department officials said it will now use a flexible formula to ensure the two agencies can stand behind the billions of dollars in mortgage-backed securities they sell to investors. Under the formula, financial support would increase according to how much each firm loses in a quarter. The cap in place at the end of 2012 would apply thereafter.

By making the change before year-end, Treasury sidestepped the need for an OK from a bailout-weary Congress.

[live love laugh]

46. Anybody here who favors Norquist doesn't belong here. nt

[Miss Authoritiva]

48. And you know who said this? That's right.

First, we want to remove liberal personnel from the political process. Then we want to capture those positions of power and influence for conservatives. Stalin taught the importance of this principle. He was running the personnel department, while Trotsky was fighting the White Army. When push came to shove for control of the Soviet Union, Stalin won. His people were in place and Trotsky’s were not…. With this principle in mind, conservatives must do all they can to make sure that they get jobs in Washington.

Indeed, that is the conservative‘s conservative, Grover Norquist, the guy who absolutely adores Stalin and Lenin and absolutely detests government.

(Via)

[laughingliberal]

83. When Bobb Barr and Dick Armey went to work consulting for the ACLU because they opposed some of the

Bush policies, did we decide the ACLU was now a fascist, Republican organization for working with them on some issues?

[jgraz]

52. This is almost as bad as that time she campaigned for Joe Lieberman

Oh wait... that was Obama.

[bridgit]

54. We here in Calif are well aware of Norquist's corrosive effects - but fickle?

Thy name is FDL:

http://firedoglake.com/2007/10/25/12494

http://www.calitics.com/showDiary.do?diaryId=6653

http://crooksandliars.com/2008/01/15/why-arnold-schwarzeneggers-budget-is-grover-norquists-wet-dream

[azmouse]

58. K&R

[azmouse]

70. ....

[azmouse]

73. ,,,,,

[Capt_Nemo]

61. kick

[butterfly77]

62. Kick &Recommended..

[Capt_Nemo]

63. kick

[Capt_Nemo]

66. bump!

[Capt_Nemo]

67. kick

[FrenchieCat]

68. Remember who you're dealing with.......

yes, you are correct.
Makes my blood run cold.

[EFerrari]

69. Doesn't this work both ways, though?

I don't have an opinion on what Jane's doing because I've no effing clue what that might be.

But, if you take a gander at the people now populating the Obama administration, well, there is plenty of ugly there, too.

[Hekate]

80. If you seriously think there is anything equivalent to Norquist, Abramoff, and Ralph Reed....

... associated with the current administration, I beg to differ.

Hekate

[EFerrari]

88. I wasn't making an equivalency because I don't know as much as I should

about Rahm, about the financial guys although we'll be hearing more about Goldman Sachs, I'm sure. Mostly I was thinking about the ugly in the national security and military establishment, crooked as possible, and about the current guys on the Latin America desk that are turning a blind eye to ongoing repression---->murder in Honduras.

I hate Norquist -- remember, I live in CA, too. Reed is a grifter and Abramoff made the mistake of getting caught.

Also, this isn't an area of research I have any stomach for. I hope that's clear. But ignoring corruption and criminality on our side is not a winner because while we might want to, I promise you, the opposition will not.

[tandot]

72. K & R

[BrklynLiberal]

74. He is a perfect example of the lesson taught in the story of the Frog and The Scorpion.

The Scorpion and the Frog
One day, a scorpion looked around at the mountain where he lived and decided that he wanted a change. So he set out on a journey through the forests and hills. He climbed over rocks and under vines and kept going until he reached a river.

The river was wide and swift, and the scorpion stopped to reconsider the situation. He couldn't see any way across. So he ran upriver and then checked downriver, all the while thinking that he might have to turn back.

Suddenly, he saw a frog sitting in the rushes by the bank of the stream on the other side of the river. He decided to ask the frog for help getting across the stream.

"Hellooo Mr. Frog!" called the scorpion across the water, "Would you be so kind as to give me a ride on your back across the river?"

"Well now, Mr. Scorpion! How do I know that if I try to help you, you wont try to kill me?" asked the frog hesitantly.

"Because," the scorpion replied, "If I try to kill you, then I would die too, for you see I cannot swim!"

Now this seemed to make sense to the frog. But he asked. "What about when I get close to the bank? You could still try to kill me and get back to the shore!"

"This is true," agreed the scorpion, "But then I wouldn't be able to get to the other side of the river!"

"Alright then...how do I know you wont just wait till we get to the other side and THEN kill me?" said the frog.

"Ahh...," crooned the scorpion, "Because you see, once you've taken me to the other side of this river, I will be so grateful for your help, that it would hardly be fair to reward you with death, now would it?!"

So the frog agreed to take the scorpion across the river. He swam over to the bank and settled himself near the mud to pick up his passenger. The scorpion crawled onto the frog's back, his sharp claws prickling into the frog's soft hide, and the frog slid into the river. The muddy water swirled around them, but the frog stayed near the surface so the scorpion would not drown. He kicked strongly through the first half of the stream, his flippers paddling wildly against the current.

Halfway across the river, the frog suddenly felt a sharp sting in his back and, out of the corner of his eye, saw the scorpion remove his stinger from the frog's back. A deadening numbness began to creep into his limbs.

"You fool!" croaked the frog, "Now we shall both die! Why on earth did you do that?"

The scorpion shrugged, and did a little jig on the drownings frog's back.

"I could not help myself. It is my nature."

Then they both sank into the muddy waters of the swiftly flowing river.

[WilliamPitt]

75. .

[Capt_Nemo]

76. kick

[donheld]

77. Norquist should have be exiled to Uranus years ago

[burning rain]

78. On the plus side, Grover has sturdy principles,...

and was willing to criticize the crony capitalist W on their basis. On the minus side, they're horrid arch-libertarian principles.

[Hekate]

81. On the minus side, they're entirely power-driven, self-serving, evil principles. nt

[burning rain]

82. I entirely agree.

But do you have anything to say on the issue, beyond that?

[Hekate]

87. Only that Norquist, Abramoff, and Ralph Reed set out to conquer the country & divvy up the spoils...

... and they made quite a bit of headway. Each had a particular talent -- as I recall, Reed's was a choirboy's looks and the ability to talk to fundies in their own language, the better to prey on them. They were and are as ruthless as they come, and anyone who forgets that is a fool.

That really sums up my contribution.

Hekate

[Hekate]

79. Odious. Thanks for the reminder. KnR. nt

[LaPera]

86. Fuck Grover Norquist a republican pig in the truest sense, a hater of workers & unions & especially

the poor....

Grover Norquist is a liar, greedy, hateful corporate republican slime!

The more greedy, the more racist, the more hateful, selfish cold-hearted are the ones the republicans worship...and the republicans certainly bow to the incredibly disgusting Norquist.

[Better Believe It]

90. I agree. Democrats and President Obama shouldn't snuggle up to Wall Street,

the private health insurance industry, big Pharma and corporate America and Republican politicians.

Like you wrote:

"remember who you're dealing with here before you snuggle up to him"