How about a heated discussion to warm things up for the snowbound:

[hedgehog]

No name calling please; but

granted, the Mid-Atlantic states are in fact facing a disaster with all this snow and will probably need Federal aid before all is said and done,

but

how do we square things for places like Syracuse, Buffalo, Cleveland and Chicago that handle this stuff on a routine basis? Should these areas get federal grants for the cost of handling this snow every year? Should they get grants when spending hits a certain range over normal?

Sub-thread: what is the cost of maintaining snow removal equipment for storms every 5th year vs shutting down all commerce for a week every 5th year?

[Stinky The Clown]

1. 30" gets you federal aid.

No matter who or where you are. At least that's what I understand.

[Captain Hilts]

3. Were you the one saying that Baltimore added up the snow from the two storms

to get the aid?

[Stinky The Clown]

10. Yeah. Mikulski said that in an interview on teevee

We needed 30" to qualify for federal aid. The last storm, officially, was 27 and change.

The announcer said that thing about 30" being the minimum for federal aid.

[cali]

4. It doesn't where I live. And in all fairness it shouldn't

And it doesn't in many places out west either.

[Captain Hilts]

2. Buffalo, Cleveland, Chicago and Toronto get dry snow and are flat compared to DC. Toronto used to

actually have a SWAT team of folks with plows camped out, outside the city waiting for the call...

They also used to have a huge Metro Melt machine to melt the stuff.

[Berry Cool]

13. Um, no, they do not all get dry snow.

Lake-effect snow is NOT dry. It's heavy and wet.

Toronto doesn't get lake effect, but Buffalo, Cleveland and Chicago sure do. True, places like that have snow SWAT teams, although I have never heard of a "Metro Melt."

We just get too much snow in places like Cleveland to let it cripple us every time it gets bad. So we're better prepared because it makes more financial sense for us to be.

[Captain Hilts]

15. Actually, Niagara gets more than Buffalo. I know it well. nt

[treestar]

5. It is what they are used to

If 30 inches of snow fell on Georgia or Mississippi it would be something they just are justifiably unprepared for.

Or New York getting an earthquake.

For that matter, if New York or Montana got way more than they were used to, or even what they might expect but it caused problems, I would not begrudge the aid.

I live in the Mid-Atlantic - there is snow but only occasionally this much.

[hedgehog]

8. So... the next time a hurricane hits the Gulf Coast or

when the Big One hits California or during next year's wild fires, do we shrug and tell teh local governments that's what they're used to?


:shrug:

[Stinky The Clown]

11. I don't recall anyone who actually meant anything saying that to them. Do you?

[hedgehog]

14. I'm not suggesting that we leave these areas on their own

when a disaster strikes. I'm just pointing out that up here we face disastrous weather on such a routine basis that no one notices. Snow is only a disaster when you don't clear off the roads and build roofs to take the weight. Doing that costs money.

[Raven]

6. Depends where you live. You guys with a bad winter every 5 years

could probably do better without all the equipment but remember, you can't shut down emergency access. EMT's and fire and police have to get through so there needs to be some bare bones snow removal equipment. Here in my town in NH, the plow trucks are used all year round. Plow attachments put on in the winter, road work and hauling done in the good weather. The real cost up here is in salt and sand.

Your questions are interesting ones. I never thought about the cost. It just goes with the territory...a fact of life. But what is a usual event up here is a disaster in another place. Another thing about these southern storms is that they are heavy snow. In NH the temps are colder, easier snow to plow, not so many power problems or roof collapses. Anyway, for what it's worth.

[leftofcool]

7. I have not heard anything about Federal aid for us

but I know one damn thing....For the last decade, maybe longer, I have been on every fucking snail mail mailing list on the planet and Wednesday and Thursday are spam mail days, tons of it. But, does that Post Office deliver to me today? Oh hell no. Just because there is a blizzard outside and 5000 inches of snow, I am not gonna get my mail. I need those circulars, Postal Lady. Ya want me to go into withdrawals?

[northofdenali]

Well, we deal with extreme weather situations here, too also....

I think those cities and towns who have this type of storm or severe weather every year are more prepared infrastructurally (is that a word? if not it should be). i.e., more snow plows, more people used to the overtime, more cops on the street. Also, a better ability to predict how the community will ACT in situations like this.

No schools close here for cold (even 45 or 50 below) weather. The kids play outside up to 25 below. We don't close roads/schools for snow accumulation and our plows seem to know just what roads to plow and sand to avoid the worst of the messes. But we're used to it.

You'll enjoy this perspective from an Alaska Native who writes for the Anchorage Daily News:

Snow: disaster or cleaning moment?

ELISE PATKOTAK
COMMENT

Published: February 9th, 2010 08:27 PM
Last Modified: February 9th, 2010 08:33 PM

Don Young's constant re-election to high office would probably be a sign of the apocalypse anywhere else but here in Alaska. Here it's merely another humdrum moment. Alaskans just react differently to all manner of phenomena than do others.


This is why I am always so startled at the reaction of people back East to the idea that snow might fall on them. While I will admit that two feet over a weekend is a lot even by Alaska standards, I really don't think it is worth the hysteria it produced in everyone from Washington officials to my relatives.

No one seemed to want to take my advice to rent a bunch of old horror movies, fire up the fireplace, mix some cosmopolitans and curl up with your honey all snug and comfy while the wind howled and the snow blew outside. In fact, truth to be told, some of my nearest and dearest relatives responded to this suggestion with language I know for a fact that they did not learn at St. Michael's Grade School.

http://www.adn.com/opinion/comment/patkotak/story/1131759.html

Just don't forget to shut the outhouse door on your way back inside the cabin:

[northofdenali]

9. self-delete. musta hit the post button twice.........sorry.

:blush:

[Wizard777]

12. Thank God this hit during Obama's administration. The Feds are aware of our situation here in Md.

They are going to do what they can to help us out. From what I've heard from Senator Mikulski. Secretary of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano is going to great lengths to help our severely strained budgets. Sen. Mikulski really nailed it when she said this storm was "like Isabel on steroid with snow." Thank God all this water is it's solid form or we would probably be another NOLA. But we are holding our own. Governor O'Malley is doing a wonderful job of managing this Blizzard and keeping us informed. We know President Obama and the federal government is there for us if we really need them. It's winter in hell outside. But I'm not worried. I feel perfectly safe and I'm a 78 y/o man that lives in the middle of nowhere. A very white nowhere. But I'm fine and enjoying the show outside. It's a sight to see.

[Eric_323]

16. A few links

Snow Assistance Policy for FEMA
http://www.fema.gov/government/grant/pa/9523_1.shtm



Disaster Search for your state
http://www.fema.gov/femaNews/disasterSearch.do?action=Main


Average Snowfall
http://lwf.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/online/ccd/snowfall.html