College Students Placed On "Do Not Hire" Blacklist Re: Cheney Protests - Utah

[WillyT]

Local Businesses Monitor Names of Cheney Protestors, Form Massive "Do Not Hire" List

<snip>

The madness continues in Provo, Utah.

Last week, news broke that Provo School District had blacklisted students searching for a venue to hold their alternative commencement ceremony (in case you haven't been following this story, Dick Cheney was invited by BYU to speak at the official commencement).

Students had been promised a venue at a local school before a memo was sent out to all principals telling them to turn the students down.

And...

Now BYU Alternative Commencement has received an email from a local businesswoman named Denise Harman, who claims that all BYU students participating in activities against Dick Cheney are being tracked by local businesses. "Many businesses are noting the names involved," she says.

Why are business tracking the names of soon to be graduating students? "You are being tagged as trouble makers and added to massive 'Do Not Hire' lists," says Denise Harman, who hires hundreds of graduates every year.

She adds curtly, "Just thought you should know that activities have consequences."

<snip>

Link: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joe-vogel/local-businesses-monitor-_b_46760.html

Welcome to Amerika...

:mad:

[snappyturtle]

1. I just went to my copy of the U.S. Constitution

and x-ed out the first amendment. K&R

[Scooter24]

4. doesn't always apply

to private business. Same as in private schools, etc.- the first amendment was tailored to apply to governmental actions, not private ones.

[proud2BlibKansan]

67. True, but WHO is sending out this list of names?

And WHERE did they get the list? Could be some privacy violations here as well as violation of the Hatch Act?

I hope these kids contacted the ACLU. I realize this might not violate free speech, but a lawyer should definitely advise them.

[treestar]

121. Any employer who goes by that list an an ass anyway

They don't know if it's accurate!

And if they don't hire good people, they'll go out of business.

I'm sick of big business acting as if they are invulnerable and in total control - as if they can cancel free speech by withdrawing the "job."

We can make our own jobs if we have to. They are not in de facto control.

[snappyturtle]

106. I didn't realize or even think to check to see if the school

is a private one, HOWEVER, if the students had kept their thoughts to themselves (hence free speech issue) none of their present hiring problems would have surfaced. imho

edit--question: Can I be re-assured that not one cent of government money has gone to BYU?

[JimDandy]

116. No, because BYU students

can get Pell Grants and Student Loans just like any other student can who attends a private college.

[snappyturtle]

144. Thank you, you answered my question. nt

[Scooter24]

133. BYU is still able to recieve federal grants and money

for various programs. Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Stanford, and a host of other private universities are also available for government money. Yale, for instance, recieves about $300 million a year in NIH grants for medical research. There was a bit lawsuit recently where the government tied federal money to allowing military recruiters on campus, and the school was forced to allow them space on campus because of these grants.

[snappyturtle]

145. Thank you! You too answered my question. nt

[Critters2]

141. The Provo School District is public, a government body

Can't refuse to rent space for reasons of speech. I hope the students fight that on Constitutional grounds.

[Scooter24]

143. Public schools

are not open grounds for the public to use at their whim. The school said it refused because of the political nature of the event. Though I don't agree with their decision, the school can refuse on these grounds because of the potential for protests and disruptions. They school does have justifiable cause here.

However, my post was geared towards the actions of private businesses and those that are blacklisting these students from employment.

[Rage for Order]

112. Those who supported the firing of Imus, here you go

This isn't censorship, this is the marketplace at work. Some people said or did things that businesses aren't comfortable with. As a result, those businesses have every right to not offer them employment. The students are free to speak their minds, but they do not have a right to employment. Isn't that the argument we heard from those who were happy to see Imus get fired?

Obviously Imus' remarks and the students protesting Dick are not equivalent, but the principal is the same. I seem to remember hearing many people say things along the lines of:

"You (Imus) are being tagged as (a) trouble maker and added to massive 'Do Not Hire' lists," says Denise Harman, who hires hundreds of (radio personalities) graduates every year. She adds curtly, "Just thought you should know that activities have consequences."

If I remember correctly, Imus was tagged as a troublemaker, and his actions had consequences. How can you defend the firing of Imus, but not defend the decision of businesses to not hire people with whom they don't agree? Let the fallout begin.

[EstimatedProphet]

138. I disagree somewhat

Imus' real problem was that, whether he wanted to be or not, he was a public face of NBC. What he said automatically became public, because he said it over a public medium. Should these students be denied a job because they say things on their own time? I don't think so, and what Imus said was on company time. I agree it's not censorship, but that doesn't make the situation the same.

[Rage for Order]

146. I agree with you

There is a difference between saying things on company time vs. personal time. However, an employer's next logical step is to weed out those who are potentially "controversial" before they are ever hired. This will nip the problem in the bud since people who are potentially "controversial" won't get hired to begin with, and, as a result, nobody will ever be offended. The problem is that the meaning of "controversial" changes depending on who is using it, and then the slippery slope takes effect.

[annabanana]

2. I hope that blacklist BACKFIRES. . bigtime.

Denise Harman should know that activities have consequences. . . . .

[ReadTomPaine]

16. Bingo.

I just wrote a similar sentiment down thread. I don't think she realizes how uncomfortable life can become for her should a liberal activist group decide to turn its attention toward this and shine some sunlight into her office and professional practices.

People of this sort are generally the least well equipped to deal with such opposition. She'd be eating those words with cheap wine inside a month.

[cascadiance]

26. And there are things called BOYCOTTS which affect local businesses even more so now!

If local businesses choose to "play politics" in who they hire, then many of us can "play politics" right back in who we choose to patronize too!

I've a lot of choices. I've not been to Circuit City since they did that very selfish act of firing decent employees just to make money for their filthy rich execs at the top! That's not a political statement, but certainly my effort to respond to their attack on the middle class!

I also buy all of my gas now at Costco too, etc., etc.!

Perhaps we can start up our own "black list" web site of the blacklisters!! I'm certainly that many who apply for jobs that are affected by this can oblige and help us build these lists too!

[struggle4progress]

44. I think people who send such e-mails are usually kooks.

[davekriss]

102. What IS her business...

...I want to be sure never to buy her products or services ever. Actions do indeed have consequences.

[JimDandy]

118. She's retired

according to a posting by JStraight here.

[Scooter24]

3. An unfortunate consequence

of private business.

[SammyWinstonJack]

5. WFT? Unfreakinbelievable!

Just thought you should know that activities have consequences. Apparently that isn't the case with the bu$h thugs, now is it, Denise Harman. How very UnAmerican of you! :mad:

[derby378]

6. "Are you now, or have you ever been...?"

Can we strip this anti-American Harman creep of her US citizenship?

[ReadTomPaine]

21. Perhaps it's time for the IRS to review her finances as well. n/t

[derby378]

25. Good luck to Harman getting her driver's licence renewed...

We could swap out the eye chart, since she probably memorized the old one... :evilgrin:

[rockymountaindem]

7. It's not "Amerika" when private business decides not to hire people

I assume they're being helped by sympathizers inside the university who are telling this clique of haters who the students leading the boycott are. Add to that the fact that plenty of their names are turning up in newspapers and online and it's very easy to make up a blacklist of that sort. Besides, private employers don't have to hire anybody they don't want to and I don't think it's illegal to discriminate based on political affiliation.

Maybe the blacklisted people can get jobs in Colorado. Anybody who bends over backwards to get away from Cheney is welcome!

[file83]

18. Just because this one person CLAIMS the list is for

small businesses, that doesn't mean that it is. As far as we know, she could have been recruited by Rove to perform these actions. Local businesses may have nothing to do with this.

The purpose of what she is doing is attempting to create direct economic threats against people for purely political reasons.

This will backfire for Denise Harman though, as you pointed out. If this list is what she claims and all these students can't get jobs in Utah, they will leave the state. She is creating a small brain drain, if you will.

Not to mention, she's creating a hostile political environment which will spread to people's attitudes BEYOND the confines of the list. The result being many graduates may decide to leave Utah just on general principles.

[rockymountaindem]

22. True enough

There's always the chance people are lying... but since neither you nor I can prove that there's any conspiracy behind this, I just responded to it on face value.

[Arkansas Granny]

35. Does her email state that she is involved in compiling this list or

is she just letting the students know what is going on so they com counter it? I couldn't tell by the few sentences that were shown.

[slowry]

60. Curtly n/t

[Arkansas Granny]

63. "Curtly" is the interpretation of the writer of the article and isn't

necessarily the tone used by the author of the email. I would like to read the entire email to see if she is actually threatening the students with this list or if she is providing information to them that they may be unaware of. All we've seen are just a few snippets and certainly not enough to be able to ascertain her meaning or intent.

[file83]

79. This statement is a veiled threat: "Just thought you should know that activities have consequences."

That isn't a friendly FYI.

That statement clearly reveals an attitude which not only condones the blacklist, but it also shows she doesn't support the protesting "activities" of the students.

[dansolo]

82. "Activities have consequences"

That phrase tells me that she is behind the blacklisting, because it appears to be a not-so-subtle reference to Sen. Boxer's recent statement of "Elections have consequences"

[JimDandy]

122. She says...

she was just cautioning the students on how the world works -- not threatening them. She apparently used to work for MySpace a couple of years ago and knew that specific types of lists and databases on people were "out there" for the buying. She makes it sound like her email was in the same vein as the warnings we give our own kids about putting personal info on MySpace or anywhere else on the net.

[Arkansas Granny]

137. Without reading the entire email, I couldn't tell if she was being

threatening or just giving them a "heads-up" type warning because she knew that they were being watched. It's hard to tell a person's meaning when you just read a few sentences taken out of context.

[JimDandy]

139. I couldn't tell either. Always good to get the full story. n/t

[JimDandy]

123. Heck yes, private employers can discriminate! The LDS church

though, doesn't hire only Mormons...they hire only Mormons who have Temple Recommends!

How do they get away with doing that, because I thought private employers couldn't discriminate against a potential employee based on their religion.

[ReadTomPaine]

8. The negative publicity this will generate for Ms. Harman and Provo...

will serve to instruct them both on the consequences of their own activities as well, I suspect.

[aquart]

37. Is Provo a tourist community?

[ReadTomPaine]

41. It's a wider issue than tourism, see my other posts in the thread.

and of course there is always turnabout being fair play.

Fire a republican today. Let them be the "pioneers" of unemployment window "A".

[Lord Balto]

90. Nothing besides the silly tabernacle

No one goes to Utah except for genealogy conventions. It's an intellectual and cultural dead zone.

[JimDandy]

126. No. The exact opposite.

It closes up tighter than you know what on Sundays. I found a Burger King open on a Sunday there, but that was it. It's claim to fame is BYU and Mormons run the place. Utah County (where Provo is located) is the reddest county in the reddest state in the U.S.

A Romney presidency would be a disaster of Super-Rovian proportions!

[file83]

9. Umm...isn't that illegal? The way to foil that list is to supply TONS of wrong names...

...have students start e-mailling that Denise Harman "tips" on students that weren't at the protest. Start filling up that list will garbage so then the list won't be worth shit.

[ReadTomPaine]

17. Yes, start with the names of the local young republicans on campus.

[LiberalFighter]

91. Don't forget to include Rove's email

[Joanne98]

10. FASCISTS!

[givemebackmycountry]

11. "Just thought you should know that activities have consequences."

Nice - like the activities that Cheney participated in that caused the deaths of over 3,330 young Americans and countless innocent Iraqi citizens.

So, Denise Harman, I hope one of these blacklisted students walks into your office, and spits into your sanctimonious, self-righteous face, you filthy freaking cow.

[file83]

23. KO should have her on "Worse Person in the World!!". Anyone know how to nominate her?

[ReadTomPaine]

24. That's perfect. Make her price for doing this greater than any she extracts...

from those students.

[aquart]

38. Email him the article.

[file83]

78. Done.

:hi:

[proud2BlibKansan]

69. Not to mention his refusal to serve in the military

He is such a slimeball.

[No DUplicitous DUpe]

12. The best thing for those students, is to move away from Provo, Utah.

PLENTY of people will hire Grads who don't like the VP, almost anywhere in the country. (not that it is anyones Business)

My message to them, "Get out of Provo, Utah."

[Blue Belle]

89. Thats right.... have a mass Exodus to the blue states....

With Cheney at a 9% approval rating - most every state is a blue state.

[Cabcere]

13. Ugh...that's disgusting.

:puke: Don't show any sign of dissent or you won't be able to get a job...what the hell is this, 1984? :mad:

[JimDandy]

127. No dissent allowed. That is what has happened on BYU's campus

for at least the last thirty years. Gordon B Hinkley, the church's president, gave the students special permission to hold this protest. Why? Perhaps because the church is trying to rehabilitate it's image of being Republican and supporting only Republican candidates due to IRS inquires that could have removed its non-profit status.

Their problem is, it's not an image, it's reality.

[tabasco]

14. Not blindly supporting the criminal Bush cabal has consequences.

WTF happened to make Utah such an un-American hole of ignorance and intolerance?

[WillyT]

19. When You Can Radicalize BYU...

You know the worm has turned.

Go Cougars!!!

:yourock:

[Mme. Defarge]

75. Well said!

[EVDebs]

92. Mormons scare the tar outta me

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=778061&mesg_id=778061

BTW, PBS's upcoming April 30--May 1 thing on the Mormons probably won't mention this !

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

15. If there are any national business doing this we need to know so we can avoid supporting them.

[pretzel4gore]

20. fukkin creepy society...

'do unto others as others do to you'- the Golden Rule lol
i hope we can do something about this- tho we did nada when freeper spat in Jane Fonda's face!
(and why do progressive students need to agitate at all? fukk the USA, fukk the world! They want, need and deserve the cheneys, bushes, hitlers and saddams)
sometimes i wish i was a brainless nazipooh ...reading this crap everyday is getting boring...

[Arkansas Granny]

27. I wish they had published the entire email. It would be interesting

to see what else Denise Harman said. It's hard for me to tell with just the few snippets whether she was warning them of what was going on or bragging about it. I've looked, but couldn't find the text of the whole email.

[Rob H.]

28. I wonder if a boycott of her business would have any effect

The good thing is that now a lot of soon-to-be graduates whose names aren't on any lists know what a flaming fascist arsehole she is and can avoid working for her.

[w4rma]

29. Which businesses are keeping the blacklists. Those businesses belong on a new blacklist. (nt)

[yewberry]

30. The update is good: Harman DOES NOT work for Bell South.

No one seems to know exactly who this woman is, but she was lying.

Figures, doesn't it?

[w4rma]

34. Not lying. Just some people misinterpreted her email address to be her place of employment

instead of her internet service provider.

[yewberry]

54. That misinterpretation is understandable. However,

she did claim to represent local businesses and that her company hires hundreds of grads annually. No one knows who she is or where she works. The only Denise Harman that people have been able to come up with so far is located in DC.

If she were who she's claiming to be, she'd probably be a little more visible in Provo.

Who knows?

[LiberalFighter]

96. Checked a few Republican Party websites in Utah and nothing

She might be a local Young Republican posing as Denise.

[JimDandy]

128. Here's a little more info about her...

http://thegooddemocrat.wordpress.com/2007/04/29/provo-businesses-blacklist-byu-students-who-protested-cheney/#comment-9232

[ReadTomPaine]

36. Typical, indeed! n/t

[Wickerman]

31. If she hires "hundreds" of grads every year

wouldn't she in some way be visible on Google? Perhaps she is an Amway distributer. Amway? Oh, you've heard of it? Well, let me tell you why everything you have heard is wrong...

[derby378]

40. Interesting point - do you think this may be a bad practical joke?

Supposedly she works for BellSouth in Provo, but I haven't been able to track her down, either.

[Wickerman]

48. Turns out she doesn't work for them

"UPDATE: I have just been called by BellSouth and informed that the woman who sent the email threatening to not hire BYU graduates protesting Dick Cheney DOES NOT work there. The woman claimed in her email to hire hundreds of graduates every year and her email included the bellsouth name, but apparently this was her provider, not her employer. I apologize for the confusion and ask that no more complaints be sent to BellSouth since they apparently have nothing to do with this. Thanks."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joe-vogel/local-businesses-monitor-_b_46760.html

[JimDandy]

129. She lives in Louisiana, she doesn't work at all, and she says her son

was the one who sent the email. See "The Good Democrat" web site.

[aquart]

45. What kind of local business would have 100s of new jobs annually?

[ecstatic]

81. wal-mart?

:shrug: lol

[Fovea]

32. activities have consequences

Let us get all copies of that list, emailed to HR people, and let us brighten their lives.
Or at least their places of business.

[IChing]

33. Welcome to Cheney's Amerika

Provo has always been Fascist. ( I have personal stories about that town)
Mormon business have a close knit community so it could effect hiring.
Is this woman a Mormon?

[aquart]

43. Don't know, but Harmon is an old Mormon name.

<http://www.xmission.com/~research/family/familyh.htm>

[IChing]

47. Interesting

I wonder if her husband is a deacon in the church.
I am sure it could be researched.

[musette_sf]

59. having read several books about Mormons

(history and first-person story), the concept of freezing the apostate out from the community seems to be a common practice in this cult. the books i've read detail this type of action as done for religious reasons. nice to know that our American values of dissent and freedom of speech need not be followed by the Latter Day Stains.

[loudsue]

39. Isn't this typical of THE MAFIA???? This is the EXACT same thing

as finding a horse's head in your bed....letting you know you have NO FUTURE if you don't "go along"?

Man, I'll bet the wingnuts in Utah are pissed that the despicable Ms. Harman let this cat out of the bag!

:rofl: The rightwing, and Cheney in particular, loves nothing more than to do their dirty work IN THE DARK, IN THE "SHADOWS". She just showed them all for who they are.

:kick::kick::kick:

[magellan]

42. So let me get this straight

Students in the country founded on the principles of democracy and touted as the beacon of liberty and the home of the free and the brave are having their names taken down and will be denied jobs for snubbing the Vice President?

Seriously. Is there a false advertising clause in the Constitution? Because I want my money back.

[The Backlash Cometh]

46. And if they're blackballing them, you know they're blackballing us.

[Miss Chybil]

49. Is this legal? nt

[Strelnikov_]

50. GOP . . . A Kinder, Gentler Fascism n/t

[DBoon]

51. They forgot the stake in Joe McCarthy's heart

because he was never really dead.

In the 1950's, if you had even the most remote ties to the Communist Party, you would find yourself unhireable.

[rocktivity]

52. So what's the inside dope of Harman person? Let's put HER out of business!

:bounce:
rocknation

[DBoon]

53. Maybe DUers' with hiring authority should counter this

Have a few progressive businesses make it know that they value critical thinking, organizational ability, and the willingness to persevere against great adversity.

I think these students would be an asset to any employer who needs self motivated, intelligent employees.

Create our own "please hire these students" list and make it know we are doing so

[Joe Fields]

55. And some people wonder what has happened to open dissent

in this country. Well, here's your answer. When the govt., the community and business leaders threaten dissenter and protesters, people think twice about voicing their conscience.

[DeSwiss]

56. ***Provo, Utah - New Job Application Update***

ACME, Inc. - Provo Utah
BYU Graduate - Job Application
(This application form has been approved by the Republican Party, DOJ and Homeland Security.)

(1) Name: ___________________________________

(2) Address: ___________________________________

(3) City, St. Zip: ___________________________________

(4) Area code, Phone: ___________________________________

(5) Websites (MySpace, etc.), email addresses (all of them): ____________________

(6) Schools/Degrees/Awards: ___________________________________

(7) Major: ___________________________________

(8) Did you attend your official commencement @ your school?:

Yes ( ) (please provide blood sample and UPC bar code from degree for confirmation)
No ( ) (you may stop here and leave thru the BLUE door. Someone will meet you)

(9) Do you like Vice-president Cheney?:

Yes ( ) (please provide copy of voter registration, loyalty oath card and show us your "Official Republican Registration Tatoo")
No ( ) (you may stop here and leave thru the BLUE door. Someone will meet you)

(10) Do you know at least 10 ten people who do not like Vice-president Cheney?:

Yes ( ) Please list names and addresses on the lines below. Add more sheets as needed.
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

No ( ) (to proceed further you must take a lie detector test. You may leave thru the RED door. Someone will meet you to take you to see: Denise Harman, Almost-human Resources Director)

Provo, Utah Chamber of Commerce
Personal Interview

[WillyT]

57. Perfect !!! - Bravo !!!

:yourock:

[stevedeshazer]

66. This deserves a separate thread

You really should start one so more will see it.

Excellent.

[IChing]

68. You need to post this separately...........so everyone can see it.

Damn great post and smiley

[Mme. Defarge]

76. Brilliant!

[Atman]

58. "Activities have consequences."

Truer words were never spoken.

Like starting illegal wars.

Or compiling McCarthy-esque black lists.

And boycotting any business which condones or engages in such outrageous anti-American bullshit.

.

[Joe Fields]

61. I sent Keith Olberman the the complete info. I hope he uses it on the show.

[sandyd921]

136. Denise Harman for "worst person in the world"

n/t :applause:

[Matariki]

62. Well, Denise Harman must think she's being mighty clever with her reference to Boxer's statement

that "elections have consequences". I bet this is going to bite Denise Harman squarely on her neo-facist ass.

[Forkboy]

64. "Two of my favorite words...Provo and Utah."

PS - Even Satan is in awe of Cheney's evilness.

[Blue_Tires]

142. brilliant nt

[proud2BlibKansan]

65. OMG!!

Where is my country??? :cry:

[icymist]

70. 'Do Not Fly' lists and now 'Do Not Hire' lists?!!! These people want to

destroy this country. When the Hell will the American people wake up?

[EVDebs]

71. Background checks and RFIDS useful as political terrorism domestically

CSMonitor story on background checks used as political retribution
http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0805/p11s02-legn.html

Spychips
http://www.spychips.com/

Welkommen to the fascist USofA !

BTW, this bit of info from the web (for what it's worth) is interesting:

"" Author Alex Schoumatoff expands on the LDS-intel link in his book, Legends of the American Desert:

"One afternoon in the summer of 1983, I sat in the VIP gallery with two fidgety men in their thirties and an old man, who turned out to be William Casey, then director of the CIA, and his Secret Service guards. The Central Intelligence Agency and the Federal Bureau of Investigation recruit heavily from the Saints, who make ideal operatives because they are extremely patriotic and have an aptitude for surveillance technology." Thus, it is no coincidence that Bush's incoming FBI Director Robert Mueller moved Darwin A. John, the LDS church's Chief Information Officer fairly quickly into the spot of CIO for the FBI. John has since left the FBI CIO spot, but continues as an adviser. ""

http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=137152

This is backed up in Time Magazine, August 4, 1997, has an article titled "Kingdom Come" by David Van Biema (in fact, the entire magazine issue is about the Mormon Church, titled 'Mormons, Inc.: The secrets of America's most prosperous religion')

On page 52 I read, "The FBI and CIA, drawn by a seemingly incorruptible rectitude, have instituted Mormon-recruiting plans."

This may be a conservative website, which makes it all the more interesting ! Look who has access to 'punish' fellow citizens...the Mormons. How very lovely. Will this get mentioned in PBS's upcoming series on the LDS church ???? Stay tuned...

[Trillo]

72. Isn't Utah mostly Mormon?

They have a very long history of allowing money inflows from outsiders, but disallowing money outflows to outsiders. In other words, they'll sell to non-mormons, but only buy from other mormons. At least this is how they used to be. I don't know if that's still a policy of thiers or not.

This seems like a formalized business extention of that. Keep the outsiders that disagree with you poor, regardless of what promises you've made or what those outsiders can actually do. Disagree with Ch*ney and his policies, and you'll be broadbrushed with the same aspersion given to druggies and murderers and theives. They may not be able to get you in jail, but they'll make your life as hard as they possibly can.

It flies in the face of pay for performance, and so to the "General welfare" constitutional phrase. Discrimination has a long history in America, it would be nice if someday the discrimination is ended, but just like the battle with spammers, the moment one form of it is ended, another form of it rises to take the prior's place.

Perhaps the silver lining in this is that it's being made public. Same old story though, just corrupt businesses that undermine a nation for their own personal visions of conformity.

What good is school, if one stated purpose is to prepare you to be dependent upon an employer, if those employers refuse to employ you for political reasons. That, is, an, undermining, of, democracy, and a nation.

[EVDebs]

94. See post #92 nt

[Blue_In_AK]

73. McCarthyism lives. n/t

[burythehatchet]

74. This is an unaddressed issue and it is a major issue

I have suspected that there is a infestation of "do not hire" lists in private companies. I've been a victim of them.

[ToeBot]

77. I've spent most of my adult life living in Provo, am I surprised?

Nope!!

[symbolman]

80. The answer, and what worked before

when that Xmas decoration scam was all over the web.. is to BOYCOTT the CITY..

That worked great.

If the Web decides that EVERYONE will NEVER set foot in that town, and attack the Chamber of Commerce, demand THAT PERSON BE FIRED or no one will ever GO THERE.

THEN it will happen.

Did the last time. I believe this person is TOAST if anyone decides to start this ruckus, and someone SHOULD.

[happydreams]

83. *&^%$........Protesters should all wear "V" masks.

[Cha]

84. Oh dear..

:scared: :scared: Maybe it's time for those students to go to Salt Lake City OR see the World..who knows?

When a fucking cheney door closes a Window to the WHOLE WIDE WORLD OPENS UP!

[tanyev]

85. Massive 'Do Not Hire' Lists?

I think this woman is vastly overestimating her own importance. I predict she will soon find out that activities have consequences.

[Lord Balto]

88. Wonder How Many on List are Black or Hispanic

Thin ice, lady, thin ice.

[greiner3]

101. If I remember my conversations with a couple of Young Mormons;

Years ago correctly, the Mormon church believes that all the world's blacks are the direct descendants of Judas. Therefore they are are damned and to be shunned as much as possible. This also came out a few decades ago when there was a stink about blacks unable to get into the church. Lol, sort of like when Sammy Davis Jr said that he had converted to Judaism and the Jews did not want him either. I say outlaw organized religions. One more item, the southern protestants (southern baptists) have a 'secret' bible in which holds 'proof' that blacks are the direct descendant of ham, a biblical person, who is apparently not a good Jew or person or whatever. This means that blacks are to be subjugated, enslaved and forbidden the rights of human beings. The faithful still believe this and are just waiting until the political tide turns enough so that they can continue, if not slavery, then lessening the rights of those that their 'bible' says it's okay to shit on. Why do you think that the southern republicans keep pushing for states rights. That was the call word during the desegration days.

[Maven]

97. Hopefully her list comes with a map, because she's heading to Lawsuit City. nt

[purduejake]

86. Is this fascism yet? n/t

[Lord Balto]

87. Can't find much on this so-called businesswoman

Most high profile business people have a web presence. This woman has none. I suspect any job she would prevent these graduates from getting doesn't require a college degree. Not at Denise's House of Pancakes and Porno.

[Maddy McCall]

95. I'd guess that Utah is a lot like Mississippi...

Educate their kids to send them out of state. Most of these graduates probably won't stay in Utah anyway.

This woman is grandstanding for attention--not for tangible impact.

[Maddy McCall]

93. McCarthyism is alive.

America's shame. Reliving it today.

Anyone who ever thought it couldn't happen again, that America had learned its lesson, need look no further than Utah.

[LeftCoast]

98. Seems like a fairly blatant violation of EEOC regulations

Ms. Harman looks like she may have just opened her company up to a big ol' lawsuit.

[Maven]

99. It's also proscribed by the Utah Constitution and a felony under Utah law.

From the Utah Constitution:

Utah Const. Art. XII, § 19 (2006)
§ 19.

Each person in Utah is free to obtain and enjoy employment whenever possible, and a person or corporation, or their agent, servant, or employee may not maliciously interfere with any person from obtaining employment or enjoying employment already obtained from any other person or corporation.

From the Utah Code:

Utah Code Ann. § 34-24-1 (2006)

§ 34-24-1. Blacklisting employees prohibited

No person shall blacklist or publish, or cause to be published or blacklisted, any employee discharged or voluntarily leaving the service of any person, company or corporation with intent and for the purpose of preventing such employee from engaging in or securing similar or other employment from any other person, company or corporation.

§ 34-24-2. Violation -- Penalty

If any person blacklists or publishes, or causes to be blacklisted or published, any employee discharged by any corporation, company or individual, with the intent and for the purpose of preventing such employee from engaging in or securing similar or other employment from any other corporation, company or individual, or shall in any manner conspire or contrive by correspondence or otherwise to prevent such discharged employee from securing employment, such person is guilty of a felony and shall be fined not less than $ 55 nor more than $ 1000 and imprisoned in the state prison not less than sixty days nor more than one year.

[intheflow]

100. Now this is interesting! n/t

[rosesaylavee]

103. Very VERY interesting.

Bet we find out who she is and where she works within the next 48 hours. Love the Internet, don't you?

:popcorn:

[JimDandy]

131. You're right.

Denise Harman
2270 Dawson Drive
Haynesville, LA 71038
318-624-3115


and some more info about her on this site.

[rosesaylavee]

135. Sherlock! How did you find her?

So she is just ADVISING but not THREATENING the students about their actions? Bet she felt hunted. Guess she realized rather quickly that email threats have consequences. Heh. Heh. Heh.

[JimDandy]

140. The same way she was warning the students about -- googled her.

I think "hunted" is very apropos.

[ChaoticSilly]

104. Something is fishy with the bellsouth email address

Bellsouth, according to http://www.bellsouth.com/consumer/bellsouth_area.html">this, services the south east - not Utah. If she is using Bellsouth for her ISP, something tells me she isn't a local business woman.

[Divine Discontent]

111. it does serve the SE

esp FLORIDA... and my relatives have bellsouth addresses. I guess I could see how people would mistake this as an employer. If I had a connection at bellsouth, I'd figure out who she is, maybe someone does?

Her actions have consequences and someone needs to let her know threatening students for using their 1st ammen. rights is pretty sicko and reichwing....

www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<-- check it out, top '08 stuff

[JimDandy]

132. Good catch! She's certainly isn't local to Provo...

See posts 113 and 131.

[MasonJar]

105. Utah DUers, you are in a red state. Is this going to work? Could we

at DU do anything to help? If so, what? It is time for freedoms to be respected. Who cares is it is private business? She needs to feel the consequences of her unacceptable actions. She should not get off scott free for threatening students who are exercising their Constitutional rights by protesting the mad bomber.

[ToeBot]

115. The bulk of BYU's student body are not locals...

Since the tuition break for attending BYU is based on being a Mormon not on residency, most the graduating students will not be staying in Utah or Utah Valley. I think that the number of locals participating in the alternate graduation and protests will be very small (the locals are far more likely to be supportive of Cheney and his totalitarian view points). I don't see the blacklisting as having much impact, it's more a reflection of cruelty and small-mindedness of the Utah Valley population. These are the same type of people that organized against Michael Moore when he spoke at UVSC.

[ContraBass Black]

107. Sounds more like an empty threat from a Cheny supporter

Who may or may not work in a business that hires people.

[sofa king]

108. Not coincidentally, Utah's been on my "Do not live or work there" list for my whole life.

In fact, I wish all the conservatives would move out there and make the desert bloom at $4.00 a gallon.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

109. Tell Denise that emails have consequences too

What is her business and can it be boycotted?

[bluerum]

110. Ahhh,, the sweet smell of fascism in the morning. eom

[JimDandy]

113. "The Good Democrat" web site has an update about this.

JStraight says:

"I just spoke to the woman in Louisiana who’s email started this firestorm...."

"...She said she was saddened that the student protesters mistook what was said in the email as a threat..."

"She said she has worked for large companies, such as Myspace two years ago, (she’s retired now) that keep huge databases of info on everyone, and just wanted the young students to PLEASE be cautious about what they say and do in this information age — that every bit of info on them is put in these databases, where even years later, some former activity of theirs could end up being seen by a prospective employer who politics are different from theirs."

..."The whole conversation she was being VERY careful about what she said and stated that BellSouth, the national media and an attorney have already contacted her about this."

[mainer]

114. She sounds whupped! I guess she tasted the consequences.

Since BellSouth and an attorney have already contacted her.

And she's in Louisiana?

Nods to the canny DUer who realized that a Bellsouth address couldn't be local provo.

[JimDandy]

124. Yes. Utah uses Qwest, not BellSouth. n/t

[Octafish]

117. Nazi States of Amerika

N.S.A.

[Rex]

120. It is as if there is a blacklist out there already in place for 'some people'

that the BFEE 'does not really have' on thousands of 'potential' political opponents. Why, for that you would need a mainframe like, oh I dunno, a fantasy system like the one the Pentagon 'does not really have' and call it...oh I dunno, just for fun something like Total Information Awareness. To spook the shit out of the CT crowd.

It doesn't exist nor is anyone taking bets on wars and poverty in a global booking game. Life is priceless, good conquers evil, money really isn't the root of all evil. By more stuff and soon.

Sup Octafish! :hi:

[treestar]

119. What type of position must they be looking to fill that they want

people who do not think for themselves?

They can take that job and shove it.

[DemGa]

125. Who does Denise Harman hire for?

[bdamomma]

130. free speech is not allowed in bush world.

[skipos]

134. Bush/Cheney won this county 86% to 12% in 2004

Poor kids.