The average American is going to have to change. That's what it comes down to.

[TwixVoy]

You know I have always taken the majority thought that we are exploiting the average Chinese worker who produces things for us at slave labor wages and work environments.

Most Americans thought "aren't we lucky to be on the receiving side of all this fun stuff?"

In a way though one can look at it as we have consumed ourselves to death. We have sent all of our wealth to that Chinese workers nation.

We have a HUGE infrastructure in this country designed to support our consumption. We eat like pigs thanks to all of our "wealth" and suffer from the incredibly rates of obesity, heart disease, diabetes, etc. Now what do we do since that infrastructure is no longer growing? We can't even all become a nation of Wal-mart clerks. So where are we now that we have too little production capacity AND no more growing consumption sector for the average laid off citizen to turn to?

We literally borrowed against our homes to enable ourselves to buy more cheap plastic wal-mart crap.

We lost our democratic ideals. We no longer THINK. We let ourselves be entertained by the TV, and can't seem to hold a normal conversation with another citizen about simple democratic elements of our society.

This is the century that Chinese worker will come out on top in the long run. History books 100 years from now will describe the coming decades as the period in which the United States was a broke and busted nation.

There will be a LOT of learning, self reflection, and general need for people to learn how to GET ALONG with (and participate with) others in society in a positive way if they are to make it through this.

The tea party people are the ones who are starting to feel it.... deep down they know they too must change.... but like a klansmen during the civil rights movement they can't accept that they will have to learn to do this and they will make a lot of noise rattling their cage in anger before they finally change.

Americans lifestyles are going to have to change or they will go under. Simple as that.

[BlooInBloo]

1. But that's not the American way.

[Swede]

2. The world has to change because of declining oil production.

It doesn't have a choice.

[TwixVoy]

5. Yup

But many people (aka tea baggers) will be throwing a hissy fit and making a lot of noise about it. They'll fight it until they get it through their thick heads they can't fight it anymore... just like the klansmen.

[virgogal]

3. You refer to Walmart crap. It's not just Walmart,it's everyplace.

I just bought some Clark's sandals at a local shoe store. Made in China. The pair I bought two years ago were made in Italy.

Clark's is a British company,so Walmart and the USA aren't the only ones.

Go to Target,Kohls,Macy's. Chinese crap.

[Statistical]

28. Yeah Walmart crap is a cop out. It minizes the issue.

90% of the stuff on the shelves in Walmart is sold in Kmart, target, department stores, home depot, lowes, etc.

If it honestly was just "Walmart crap" it wouldn't be that big of a problem.

[mrmpa]

4. It's the global economy

I have no problem with a global econonmy, but it's working backwards. Instead of it allowing workers in China, India, etc. to rise to rise to American standards, it bringing American workers down to the standards of thse other countries.

[TwixVoy]

8. It's not working backwards

The problem is American standards are unsustainable ANYWHERE. (including here) In China there is actually a very fast growing middle class. Here everyone is getting a reality check that mass unchecked consumption can't go on forever.

[lunasun]

21. We are gonna have to meet in the middle

Unfortunately our unwillingness to accept this realty will delay the fact and may leave us with the short end of the stick for it

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

6. I always pop in every once in a while and ask the question

You have a choice between buying American made, union shoes or imports at half the price. Which do you choose?

Invariably most people pick the cheaper import because of the short term benefit to their personal pocketbook. Impossible to factor in is the effect on the American economy overall. Would you pay more to keep other Americans employed and paying state and federal taxes and benefitting their cities, state and country? Joe and Mary Shit collectively say NO WAY.

Buy American is a great slogan, but it's so late in the game, it's often not an option anymore. Also, who do Joe and Mary shit blame for the high price of the American shoes? The worker who has the nerve to demand a living wage. They could care less about the CEO who earns mega-bucks in the first place and is more than happy to offshore the jobs so that he/she makes mega mega mega bucks.

[Blue Meany]

19. I try to buy locally-produced things, because it is better

environmntally. It's almost always more expensive, but it's often better quallity, especially with food. I do this not because I am virtuous but because I want these producers in business when oil gets so expensive that Chinese goods are no longer a good deal.

[Political Heretic]

24. Actually, "most people" buy what's cheapest because its all they can afford.

That's where "most people" are at.

Then there is the comfy upper middle class that may choose as you describe. Then there's the rich.

[stray cat]

7. Sacrifice across the board.....

[DJ13]

9. As we go down the Chinese (& Indians) will take our place

Consumption will only increase for them.

And you know what, they will far outstrip our consumption due to population.

Something the free trade folks never admit, it really is an us or them thing.

[katandmoon]

10. Generalize much? Hold responsible the people who are actually responsible.

The vast majority are actually victims of them, not collaborators.

[canetoad]

11. Maybe perpetual victimhood

is another thing that should change.

[katandmoon]

12. And you're OK with letting the real perps off the hook. Sounds like somebody else I know.

[gleaner]

13. I Don't think that a dislike for being on the receiving ...

end of all of this crap about being a "perpetual victim." People are responsible for what they do whether they like it or not. It is the same as any other form of exploitation. How are these "perpetual victims" supposed to prevent it or stop it? You can see it coming, but it has the weight of the whole government and many of the governed behind it. They have the guns, they have the money. It is very much weighted against people who have no power to stop it. You can write, call, discuss and take boycott actions until you are blue in the face and it won't change until the fundamental structure of the government and its priorities change. Try that some Sunday afternoon when you have a few minutes. See how far you get as an individual.

This administration has done its share as well and most of us who voted it in specifically supported it because we were promised a different and better way of doing things. They lied. They are responsible for that and for all the harm that has come from their lies. Nobody else. We suck it up because short of leaving this country there is not much else that we can do other than what we are doing. Protest, push and then wait for others to blame us or mock us because we don't like it, say we don't like it and expect accountability while we get dizzy trying to adapt to the fallout. If you are casting blame about, you can have mine back. I am not accepting responsibility for the actions of people who take power knowing they are going to reduce the quality of the lives of the people they are sworn to protect.

[katandmoon]

14. Thank you. You said it much better than I could.

[gleaner]

22. You' re welcome ...

I have always felt strongly that people are responsible for their own actions. We have free will, we can make our own choices. Blaming the people who are harmed by your actions is cowardly. Especially when the purpose of casting the blame is to protect the reputation of those who were cruel enough or dishonest enough to trigger the harm in the first place.

I feel it even more strongly now. I keep seeing the picture of the 21 year old girl who killed herself because she blamed herself for not being able to find a job when their were no jobs to be found and no one had attempted to remedy that situation, like the sitting government. They have the power to do it, but they don't feel like it for whatever reason and everyone down here at the receiving end of their indifference and inaction suffers for it. That girl had her whole life ahead of her and she had the most beautiful smile. It will haunt me forever. She was a victim, but not a victim of her own making. People who are scornful about other people's suffering and blame them for things that are out of their control should look at her too. I wonder what she would make them think of?

[HughBeaumont]

15. OP is not well known for placing blame where blame belongs.

The corptocracy is responsible for this. We never had a chance.

[FarCenter]

16. The US and much of the world is in a second "Long Depression"

The "Long Depression" was a period of low economic growth, economic crisis and recessions from 1873-1896. It followed the Panic of 1873 and had the effect of reordering the Great Powers as well as a rotation of wealth from one economic sector to another. For example, Great Britain declined relative to Germany and British agriculture suffered due to cheaper agricultural imports from the US, Australia, Argentina, etc, while certain industries like steamship building thrived.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Depression

The same reorderings of countries and industries are occuring again, also against a backdrop of competition for natural resources and a buildup of population pressures.

In the 1800s the Long Depression gave way to a re-emphasis on the imperial systems, arms buildups, tensions between the Great Powers and then World War I.

In the 2100s, the outbreak of hostilities should be around 2040, probably coinciding with a major exhaustion of fossil energy supplies.

[kelly1mm]

20. I call the current economic situation "The Great Resetting". We

are never going to go back to "normal". Our standard of living will decrease. This is not ALL bad in that we (America and, to a lesser extent, Canada, Europe, Japan, Australia - AKA 1st worlders) were/are way overconsuming - bad for the planet and bad for our culture/health/civic life. Be prepared to walk more, live with temperature extremes (less HVAC), grow/collect some part of your food.

[Dreamer Tatum]

17. Who is "we?" I thought you were leaving. nt

[kenny blankenship]

18. Yeah, let's not forget to change the "above-average" Americans, too, while we're changing

They've pigged out on a generation's worth of asset bubbles spawned for their class's narrow benefit, while the average American has seen their income stagnate, jobs vanish, and futures dwindle.

Change the above average Americans while you're changing the living standard of the average American. Change the shit out of them, or you average Americans' standard of living will feature wearing chains pretty soon.

[Political Heretic]

23. The economic elite are saying the same thing, only they mean we need to work for less wages.

When we stop welfare for the rich in this country, then you can talk to me about "Average American" lives changing. Until then, I don't want to hear it.

[RandomThoughts]

25. Here is the thing.

You talk about, "making it through this"

There are some people that try to dictate what that means. Sure I also have ideas of some things that should be, and agree with many of your comments.


But there are people out there saying that we have to accept certain things as realities, that are not the only options, and far from the best options.


So weather we make it through what you call 'this' is really not as important as where we come out when we do make it through. Which is one of the things many people forget that just try and make it through.


Some groups think getting along, is following what they think is best. If you have a side that will not compermise, and one that will, then the non compermisers get there way. So you end up with two or more sides that will not compermise, and then let the chips fall where they may.

The thing is, I know the side that wants oligarchy control does not care if the world exist, or even if they themselves do, an actually they may not know it, but much of there policies come from there grand notion of how much better it would be if some other group was completly gone. Weather it be Dr Strange love and how the world will die off and they will then rule, or Manson, or Sara and her Alaska group, or racist, or culturalist, or even Kissenger and his useless eaters comment. Many people want lots of people to die, and mostly they all want people of the other group to go away. It is not new, so by getting along, first you have to have people actually want other groups to even live, which is a far distance from them finding agreement. So there is a ways to go.

Hence why things get ugly, if a group is wrong, they have to have power removed from them. It is there choice what form that removal is requiered to be. But it is not about getting along, when things are not acceptable.

[Cid_B]

26. You assume it will change the way you think it should...

nt

[ShortnFiery]

27. That's horrible news for the SUPER-RICH. Let's start with THOSE people?

:evilgrin: