But, but the President promised

[ProSense]

People seem to have no clue about putting together an a agenda, fighting until the reality of the situation is at hand and compromising to get the best bill possible. Take Congressman Weiner, a strong single payer advocate who, unlike Kucinich, voted for the House health care bill.

When Weiner abandoned effort to bring a single payer bill to the floor shortly before the public option vote, he was kicked to the curb by the single-payer or nothing advocates.

Now that Congressman Weiner is back to advocating single payer, he's a hero again.

Here's Weiner's press release on the President's bill:

"I am Glad That the President Has Put His Finger On the Scale at Long Last – But Who is He Negotiating With?"

"This is a 51 Vote Senate Plan, Not 60– That’s Great News”

Washington, DC - Representative Anthony Weiner released the following statement on the release of the White House health care plan:

"I am glad the President has put his finger on the scale at long last. For months I have been saying that the American people need to hear directly from the President what he believes and wants from health care reform.”

"While I’m pleased to see some of the maladies of the weaker Senate bill addressed, this plan still doesn’t include a public option and opts for a weaker state-by-state exchange. These two provisions are the most effective ways to control costs and provide choice and competition.”

“These concessions to Republicans are in the hopes of winning their support. This will simply not happen. We need to stop bargaining against ourselves. Who are we making concessions to? Republicans have shown over and over again that they have no interest in real reform. They are the Party of No and the status quo.”

"But to be clear, this bill is a 51 vote plan and not a 60 vote plan – that is great news. Democrats wasted a year bowing to the altar of Olympia Snowe, Joe Lieberman and Ben Nelson and it got us nowhere.”

Next, Weiner writes to the President to ask, “Where Are The Single Payer Advocates?”

Then, Weiner issues this statement:

“Let’s Put it to a Vote in the Senate Before we Write the Obituary” says Weiner

Washington, DC – Representative Anthony Weiner (D - Brooklyn and Queens), member of the Health Subcommittee and Co-Chair of the Caucus on the Middle Class, released the following statement on the apparent loss of the public option:

“The most vexing mystery in Washington right now is what happened to the public option.”

“The President supports a public option. 72% of Americans support the public option according to a recent poll. The House already passed a health care bill that included a public option.”

“Yet the public option is not on the agenda at the bipartisan health care summit and the President failed to include a public option in his comprehensive health care plan.”

“When asked to explain why the public option is off the table, White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs said that there aren’t enough votes in the Senate.”

“Really? We deserve an answer to this question. Let’s see the U.S. Senate vote on whether they support a public option before the President, the House, and the American people before we write the obituary.”

“At least in the game Clue you find out who committed the murder at the end of the game.”

“Let’s give the American people credit for wanting the answer to this question.”

“If this maneuver was just to court Republican votes, I defy anyone to point to a single one we will have gotten in return for killing the public option.”

Summary: Weiner supports the President's bill, continues to fight for a public option, believes the President still supports it and will vote for the final bill.

[rug]

1. You lost me at "fighting".

[ProSense]

5. So Weiner isn't fighting? n/t

[rug]

21. One of the few. Certainly far more than Obama.

[ProSense]

23. Wanting to have it both ways.

People blame the President for not doing enough to support health reform while accusing him of being the reason the bill is in its current form.

Check out the summit, the bill they're discussing came out of Congress by way of his original proposal, and he has improved on Congress' version.

[hulka38]

38. Progressives blame the President for undermining the PO.

Many progressives, if I can speak for ya'll, think he's done more than enough to support "health reform" that the insurance companies prefer. Agree with the that or not, and I'm sure you don't, but that's where we are. And we've been there for months. Yet you don't seem to understand that. Why? I think you chose the words "health reform" instead of "Public Option" because your misleading accusation of us wanting "to have it both ways" falls apart if you told it like it is.

But I'm not accusing you of lying or calling you out in any way.

[NJmaverick]

2. K & R

[slipslidingaway]

3. Feb 8 - Congressman Kucinich (D-OH) today sent a letter to President Obama...

http://kucinich.house.gov/News/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=169711

commending him for calling for new ideas and a renewed discussion about health care reform. Kucinich requested that supporters of Medicare for All be represented at the upcoming February 25 health care summit.

“I hope you will invite a representative of the community that is advocating for the only health care that has consistently proven to address each of the criteria you have outlined for a satisfactory health care plan: Medicare for All,” wrote Kucinich.

Kucinich, who co-authored HR 676, Medicare for All, with Representative John Conyers (D-MI), further pointed out that many states have embraced a single-payer system of health care. Most recently, the California State Senate passed a single-payer health care bill on January 27, 2010.

Read the full letter here."

http://kucinich.house.gov/UploadedFiles/Medicare_for_All_Ltr_to_Obama.pdf

[slipslidingaway]

4. Kucinich: Why I Voted NO

http://kucinich.house.gov/NEWS/DocumentSingle.aspx?DocumentID=153995

Washington, Nov 7, 2009 -

"After voting against H.R. 3962 - Affordable Health Care for America Act, Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-OH) today made the following statement:


“We have been led to believe that we must make our health care choices only within the current structure of a predatory, for-profit insurance system which makes money not providing health care. We cannot fault the insurance companies for being what they are. But we can fault legislation in which the government incentivizes the perpetuation, indeed the strengthening, of the for-profit health insurance industry, the very source of the problem. When health insurance companies deny care or raise premiums, co-pays and deductibles they are simply trying to make a profit. That is our system.


“Clearly, the insurance companies are the problem, not the solution. They are driving up the cost of health care. Because their massive bureaucracy avoids paying bills so effectively, they force hospitals and doctors to hire their own bureaucracy to fight the insurance companies to avoid getting stuck with an unfair share of the bills. The result is that since 1970, the number of physicians has increased by less than 200% while the number of administrators has increased by 3000%. It is no wonder that 31 cents of every health care dollar goes to administrative costs, not toward providing care. Even those with insurance are at risk. The single biggest cause of bankruptcies in the U.S. is health insurance policies that do not cover you when you get sick.


“But instead of working toward the elimination of for-profit insurance, H.R. 3962 would put the government in the role of accelerating the privatization of health care. In H.R. 3962, the government is requiring at least 21 million Americans to buy private health insurance from the very industry that causes costs to be so high, which will result in at least $70 billion in new annual revenue, much of which is coming from taxpayers. This inevitably will lead to even more costs, more subsidies, and higher profits for insurance companies — a bailout under a blue cross.


“By incurring only a new requirement to cover pre-existing conditions, a weakened public option, and a few other important but limited concessions, the health insurance companies are getting quite a deal. The Center for American Progress’ blog, Think Progress, states “since the President signaled that he is backing away from the public option, health insurance stocks have been on the rise.” Similarly, healthcare stocks rallied when Senator Max Baucus introduced a bill without a public option. Bloomberg reports that Curtis Lane, a prominent health industry investor, predicted a few weeks ago that “money will start flowing in again” to health insurance stocks after passage of the legislation. Investors.com last month reported that pharmacy benefit managers share prices are hitting all-time highs, with the only industry worry that the Administration would reverse its decision not to negotiate Medicare Part D drug prices, leaving in place a Bush Administration policy.


“During the debate, when the interests of insurance companies would have been effectively challenged, that challenge was turned back. The “robust public option” which would have offered a modicum of competition to a monopolistic industry was whittled down from an initial potential enrollment of 129 million Americans to 6 million. An amendment which would have protected the rights of states to pursue single-payer health care was stripped from the bill at the request of the Administration. Looking ahead, we cringe at the prospect of even greater favors for insurance companies.


“Recent rises in unemployment indicate a widening separation between the finance economy and the real economy. The finance economy considers the health of Wall Street, rising corporate profits, and banks’ hoarding of cash, much of it from taxpayers, as sign of an economic recovery. However in the real economy -- in which most Americans live -- the recession is not over. Rising unemployment, business failures, bankruptcies and foreclosures are still hammering Main Street.


“This health care bill continues the redistribution of wealth to Wall Street at the expense of America’s manufacturing and service economies which suffer from costs other countries do not have to bear, especially the cost of health care. America continues to stand out among all industrialized nations for its privatized health care system. As a result, we are less competitive in steel, automotive, aerospace and shipping while other countries subsidize their exports in these areas through socializing the cost of health care.


“Notwithstanding the fate of H.R. 3962, America will someday come to recognize the broad social and economic benefits of a not-for-profit, single-payer health care system, which is good for the American people and good for America’s businesses, with of course the notable exceptions being insurance and pharmaceuticals.”

[ProSense]

6. Is he still going to vote against the bill everyone now wants passed? n/t

[slipslidingaway]

7. Which version of the bill is that? n/t

[ProSense]

8. Did he vote against the House bill?

Is everyone demanding that the House bill be passed?

[slipslidingaway]

10. You know the answer, one reason is that there was no control over premiums...

while mandating that everyone buy their products.

And look what has become a topic of discussion over the last couple weeks, the nasty insurance companies raising premiums - outrageous. Yet many members of Congress voted for a bill with no controls on premiums.

[ProSense]

14. Did he vote against the House bill?

Yes, I know the answer.

[freddie mertz]

41. We all know the answer. So why keep asking it?nt.

[tekisui]

9. What bill? Everyone?

If everyone wanted it passed, Kucinich would not be an issue to you.

[slipslidingaway]

11. Very true :) n/t

[Bluenorthwest]

12. Define 'everyone'

Because this bill is not supported by all Democrats. Many of us want Medicare For All, not a gun to the head to buy crap. Everyone? This is mediocre fear based legislation. The only ones who like it live in the Beltway or work for Big Insurance.
When you begin to think of yourself as 'everyone' discussion is not what is needed.

[ProSense]

13. My bad, "Everyone"

who is dealing with reality, including many who support Medicare for all. Weiner supports single payer, and the House bill.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProSense]

17. No, like this:

health care reform is going to pass despite the all or nothing crowd.

[Bluenorthwest]

18. So snark is all you have

when called out for hyperbole and misuse of words. You said Everyone wants it passed and that is simply not true. Now you need to define 'support'. Because Weiner does not support that which he is not fighting for. If he is for this bill, he is not for Single Payer in any meaningful or reality based way. Words are cheap, a politicians the cheapest of all. Actions are what matters. Saying one thing while doing another is not support, it is mere rhetoric, same as saying 'everyone' when you mean 'everyone who agrees with me'. Spin. Words that have no meaning, meanings of words, in reality, are printed in dictionaries. In reality, 'everyone' has an exact meaning, which is not the fake one you are improvising here. Reality includes a language with precise definitions, and one who can not grasp that is either outside the realm of reason, or is intentionally deceptive.
As many have pointed out to you, everyone does not agree with you, and I'm sure you understand that lashing out with insults is not an argument nor a counter. Not in reality, kid.

[ProSense]

19. Dealing with reality isn't snark.

Single payer was never on the table.

[Bluenorthwest]

25. In terms of this conversation, it is on the table because you put

it there. You used the term as part of your OP rhetoric. Many people do not support this awful bill because they actually support Single Payer, or Medicare For All, and know that this 'reform' is going to do harm to millions of families and enrich abusive companies.
Claiming that you speak for reality, when you will not even answer reality based questions about your field of work, from many different posters here, is just a joke. You are a context free, one note trumpet on this issue. A faceless, masked voice out of nowhere.
I wonder about your objectives, because any reality based person would know that your methods are not persuasive, nor informative. What is the point of any 'discussion' that entails one party declaring that the other is not reality based? What do you hope to achieve from such a logic free, snipy remark, coming as it does from an anonymous set of pixels? To exert peer pressure, you'd need to be a peer, and you are in fact a stranger, even in terms of DU, where most of us use noms de DU, I know much less about you than about other posters I read as frequently. All I know about you is you dig the health care 'reform' and all you can think of to do to express that is act out and make personal comments. You are, even compared to other DUers, an invisible, almost nonexistent thing. I see few other issues addressed by you, I have no idea where you stand on other things, do not know what you do for a living, nothing. Not a thing. And yet you think a sarcastic claim of speaking for 'reality' is going to carry weight of some kind?
What is your objective, really? Persuasion it is not.

[ProSense]

26. "Many people do not support this awful bill because they actually support Single Payer, or Medicare"

I'm glad you didn't say most. Most people support a public option, and most people, including supporter in Congress, realize that single payer doesn't have the votes.

[cornermouse]

15. Everyone wants passed?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

The GOP doesn't want it passed because they don't want the democrats to get the donations. And voting democrats who actually think about what the senators and representatives are in the process of putting together are emphatically saying "No."

[freddie mertz]

20. Weiner is great. This OP ain't so hot.

Kudos for Weiner's noble efforts.

Unrec for OP doublespeak.

[ProSense]

22. Weiner supports the bill.

He's going to vote for the final bill, despite your unrec.

:rofl:

[girl_interrupted]

28. Weiner has fought for the public option

which is more than Obama has done, despite campaigning on it. It's almost sick to see you laughing, because Weiner may have no other choice but to vote for a shitty bill that leaves out the public option because "something" is better than "nothing". Just like the shitty credit card "reform" bill with no caps and guns in National Parks.

That's just plain sad but thats how it's going to go down. We may have to settle just so Obama & some congressmen can say they "did" "something". No matter how much it may stink.

There is an expression: "When the going gets tough, the tough get going" That describes Weiner not Obama, sorry to say. Weiner has made ever effort to push for pulic option, Obama has not.


And sorry, thats no "laughing matter". Personally I don't think you even give a damn about people struggling over health care, all you ever seem to care about is kissing Obama's ass even when he is wrong. It's fine when he is right about something but for God's sake according to you, he never is. Which is absolutely ridiculous.

In the words of Bill Maher "He's your president, not your boyfriend" And as an elected offical it is only right to hold him accountable and expect him to fufill the promises he made during his campaign.

"Yes, We Can" may have worked in 2008, but voters will not be that gullible the next time. We thought we elected someone who would fight for us. Obama now has a few years to prove it.

[ProSense]

30. "When the going gets tough, the tough get going"

Why did he abandon the vote for single payer?

[freddie mertz]

33. He has not abandoned single-payer, He is trying to get the best he can...

From an obstinate and compromised White House that does not deserve his support, on its own merits.

But he is putting the long-run ahead of his own preferences and ambitions.

It's principled leadership, as opposed to the back room double-dealing we have seen at the WH.

Weiner in 2012.

[ProSense]

34. REP. WEINER WITHDRAWS SINGLE PAYER AMENDMENT FROM CURRENT HEALTH CARE DEBATE

NEWS: REP. WEINER WITHDRAWS SINGLE PAYER AMENDMENT FROM CURRENT HEALTH CARE DEBATE

Washington, DC – Today, Representative Anthony Weiner (D - Brooklyn and Queens), a member of the House Energy and Commerce Health Subcommittee, released the following statement on his decision to withdraw his single payer amendment to H.R. 3962, the House health care reform bill:

“I have decided not to offer a single payer alternative to the health reform bill at this time. Given how fluid the negotiations are on the final push to get comprehensive health care reform that covers millions of Americans and contains costs through a public option, I became concerned that my amendment might undermine that important goal.”

“I am going to continue to press the case for health care reform in every venue I can. And I also will continue to press for a smarter, less-expensive, more-comprehensive alternative to the employer-based health insurance system we have today.”

"I've discussed the issue with Speaker Pelosi, Chairman Waxman, and agree with them that the health reform bill is so close it deserves every chance to gain a majority."

[freddie mertz]

35. Like I said. He stepped back "at that time" to avoid obstructing the process.

He was doing what folks like YOU, who oppose real reform, would have wanted him to do.

And now you try to trash him for helping you out?

[Jakes Progress]

24. But, but. Promises are just words.

Sorry, but People feel differently. I don't know who you think voted for Obama, but it was a majority of the people. You know, those things you show such disdain for in your first sentence.

[ProSense]

27. That doesn't make sense. Still

The majority of voters still support the President, and the majority of people want action. They're not hanging on every campaign promise while ignoring the reality of the situation. They simply are not.

[Jakes Progress]

39. Read your first sentence.

[asdjrocky]

29. It's a good thing that promises mean nothing.

[ProSense]

31. The President promised

to reform the health care system.

[cornermouse]

32. He promised to reform the health care system...

He just didn't promise to make it more accessible or available or cheaper... Yeah. Right.

[freddie mertz]

36. You are expending energy here to no avail.

It's futile.

Just saying.

[cornermouse]

37. I know.

But sometimes you just can't stand it any more and you have to tilt at the windmills.

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.