Luke Russert supports child rapists.

[Atman]

On Morning Joe he was -- SURPRISE -- the lone holdout who didn't feel Penn State should be punished. He stated that the "death penalty," shutting down the football program for a year would hurt the poor football players (unlike, I guess, a grown man's penis up his ass hurts a young boy). Wait, it gets better...he pointed to SMU's death penalty and the harm it did to that school's football program, and that was even "...for real reasons."

Luke, you're disgusting. I bet even your father would agree.

[trumad]

1. I don't agree with a Death Penalty for the football program.

[Atman]

2. Could you explain? This was part of the football program.

The music department wasn't doing this. The English department wasn't raping boys in the showers. It was the LEADERS of the football program.

[trumad]

5. Yeah---so

You'd kill a 70 million dollar program because of what a couple of douchebags did?

70 million that helps fund many athletic scholarships for both men and women.

Do you think the kids on the football team need to be punished as well.

Talk of a death penalty is simply an ignorant statement by a few.

[Atman]

16. Trumad, I believe the first lawsuit is already $100,000,000

And there will be more. Where will THAT money come from? Doing nothing will cost far more than imposing an inconvenience on some sports fans, Children were being raped, It wasn't "one guy," there was institutional corruption which will not be addressed if there isn't serious punishment on an institutional level.

[trumad]

23. Uhhh-that will come from insurance.

[AngryAmish]

29. How much insurance do they have?

I think there were eight kids in the grand jury report. I think another eight have come forward. Assume an average payout of 4 million each (this is where it gets interesting - punitive damages may not be available under PA sovereign immunity laws which I do not know about. But I do know that insurance does not pay punitive damages).

ANyway 16 x 4 million is 64 million. In large institutions they usually have a primary policy - 5 -10 million, backed up by excess coverage. In IL governmental units are mostly self insured. So this could be a 55-59 million dollar hit to the taxpayers and students. (But the excess could also be a Lloyd's policy - which are not looking too good now- or another excess carrier)

[polmaven]

30. But you do believe

an "inconvenience" on the potential careers of the players is justified due to something with which they had no participation and no knowledge?

The perpetrators should be punished severely. Not the innocent bystanders.

[LiberalFighter]

15. So it would be okay to punish the tennis program if it happened there?

Because they don't bring in enough revenue?

[trumad]

24. Huh?

[whistler162]

3. Congratulations on the illogic of the thought(?)!

[Atman]

4. Huh?

What is this, blank message day?

[Tansy_Gold]

11. Every day is around here any more n/t

[polmaven]

6. Unrec this in a second!!!

The football players who are there on football scholarships, and who are looking for possible pro contracts should NOT be punished for the disgusting sins of their coaches and others. They had nothing to do with this, and nobody has even hinted that any of the players even knew anything about it.

Your headline, in and of itself is so untrue. It isn't Luke who is disgusting.

[trumad]

8. Exactly

basically saying that those who don't support a death penalty support child rapists.

[waddirum]

31. at the very least...

... the entire football staff should be fired. That includes Paterno's son, acting Coach Bradley, and everyone else. Bradley was still doing regular workouts with Sandusky a week before the arrest.

[trotsky]

7. Idiotic, ignorant, ridiculous phrase to use...

but I don't think the football program should suffer consequences. Punish those responsible, and punish them severely. The players and students had nothing to do with this.

[Atman]

14. it is a about Russerts assertion that this wasn't a "real reason" for punishment,

He didn't say he was opposed to SMU getting the death penalty, because at SMU it was "for real reasons," they were cheating. What do you make of that remark? Cheating at football is serious, but having the heads of the program covering up child rape isn't as serious as cheating on a football game? I posted in another thread a few days ago about my junior high PE coach, and how he would stand at the edge of the shower and watch all the boys shower (this was the seventies, we showered naked back then). Occasionally he'd slap a kid on the ass on the way out of the shower. Point being, once this stuff gets out there, everyone knows. It becomes part fo the lore. I don't believe that with the number of people who knew about this, especially the higher-ups, that it wasn't some sort of wink-wink-nudge-nudge joke to them. And it goes beyond the shower incidents. Penn State, under Paterno's leadership, has an abysmal record of criminality that is almost always overlooked. Players received DUI's, assault convictions, all manner of offenses, and they were always allowed to play in the big game. The game was always more important. This is why the program should be penalized. How the hell else to you send a message to ANYONE? So you lock up Paterno (which will never happen) and you lock up Sandusky (if he doesn't run away first, after the judge, who was a volunteer at Second Mile, let him go), you lock up McQuery, and then what? Everyone else just breathes a sigh of relief that they didn't get roped into the scandal.

Further, the death penalty might be the only thing that saves the program, because the lawsuits are already starting. I guarantee that they'll cost the school far more than the loss of football revenue for a year. By imposing a serious penalty, at least it might help mitigate the losses, as the trustees can demonstrate that they take this seriously and have taken steps to change the culture. The cult.

Call me crazy -- as many of you already have -- but I believe that serious punishment is the only way you can counter a serious crime. I don't believe in the death penalty for people, but this is a metaphorical death penalty. No one will die. Many people, however, be forced to sit for a year and figure out what the fuck is wrong with Penn State, where they've allowed a game, a stupid fucking game, become so all-important that the lives of young children became secondary to the almighty dollar.

[izquierdista]

22. You lock up your best witness?

Because why? His attempt to speak up was successfully squelched by the system that was in place? That he didn't get on the PA system at a game and announce what he saw? Yea, that's gonna make the prosecution go well.

[Donnachaidh]

9. He's a posterchild for the worst in US style nepotism

He's about as useful as a paperweight. And has the same level of intelligence.

[Fumesucker]

28. And he has a metric buttload of supporters on DU..

:puke:

[Bunny]

10. LOL!

[tularetom]

12. I feel very strongly both ways

While I hate to agree with little boy puke russert about anything, it wasn't the football program that raped little kids, it was one douchebag who happened to be part of the football program.

On the other hand, the death penalty would send a message to other institutions of higher learning that they need to keep an eye on the kind of people they hire as teachers, coaches and mentors.

Actually it wouldn't hurt my feelings at all if Division 1 college football was given the death penalty. All of it, kaput, shut down, gone.

[LiberalFighter]

13. I guess Luke doesn't understand the reason for punishment

Which would explain why it has been 24 years since the "Death Penalty" has been used.

[jakefrep]

17. No, he doesn't

Get a grip. There is absolutely nothing in that sentiment that indicates defense of child rape.

[alcibiades_mystery]

18. This is precisely the type of post that undermines thoughtful discussion

I'm bookmarking it, so that when people ask me "Who is saying anyone who disagrees with them is a child rape supporter - I haven't seen that anywhere!," I can just link this.

Let me lay out my position: the NCAA sanctions member programs when their actions undermine the fairness of the competitions themselves. That's their jurisdiction and purview. In this case, the actions were criminal, but not related to the fairness of competition. Therefore, there should be no NCAA sanction whatsoever.

Certainly, Mr. Russert's use of the term "real reasons" is bone-stupid (but what else can we expect from Mr. Russert?). But substantively, that's what he was saying. So, that's my argument. Do I "support child rapists?"

Rather than making a substantive case, you're seeking to silence any opposition to your opinion by immediately accusing people who disagree with "supporting child rape." If you have an argument - say, that what went on at PSU is actually within the NCAA's purview - feel free to make it. But enough of these "supporting child rape" accusations. They are beneath you, and beneath this board, and it's time people of good faith stood up and said Enough!

[tammywammy]

20. +1 n/t

[Bunny]

21. I think the best thing you can do is just LOL at them.

Their comments are so outlandish that they simply cannot be taken seriously. I've been LOLing some of the worst of them and it's been pretty funny - one person even thought I was agreeing with him/her!

[JohnnyLib2]

32. Yup.

[Atman]

33. Yup yup yup! Yessir! Yessiree!

Thanks for your contribution.

[valerief]

19. Puke Russert.

:puke:

[Fumesucker]

25. If it comes down to millions of $ vs child rape it's pretty clear where most people come down..

Priorities man, priorities..

[Atman]

26. EDITED SUB LINE: Luke Russert doesn't feel child rape is a "real reason" for serious punishment

I tried to add this to the original post, but my editing time expired while I was typing it.

ADDENDUM: I know this won't make a difference to many of you, but I understand why my original sub line, that Russerts "supports child rapists" was innaccurate and unnecessarily inflammatory. It also caused many to overlook the "real reason" for my outrage at Russert's statement. He stated that he didn't consider the Penn State incident to be "a real reason" to seriously punish Penn State, not like cheating is a "real reason." I also know that the NCAA has specific guidelines for "death penalty" offenses, not that the NCAA has ever shown any backbone in the recent past. My other points about why serious punishment should be meted out are still in the subsequent posts below.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

27. Which child rapists is he supporting? N.T.

[JohnnyLib2]

34. I'm ok with commentators commenting but I don't expect much from NCAA.

The sad, sickening reality is that nothing can make this travesty better and the bureaucratic stuff (legal, NCAA, University) will take years. I'd like to see awareness and prevention programs strengthened and supported in all directions.

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

35. SMU v. Sacred Cows

As I've written elsewhere, I definitely became disillusioned over college athletics the more engrossed I got in it. It's a sick, cult/tribal culture of yahoos, elitists, idols, sacred cows, and wealthy white men.

There's a cognitive disconnect when it comes to sacred cows. SMU student-athletes, most of whom were innocents, had the misfortune of not being protected by attending an NCAA sacred cow university. There have been, and will always be innocents when a program receives the death penalty, and, in most cases, it's not the players at fault. That's not a prerequisite for the death penalty. With the exception of the point shaving scandal, it's always the actions of adults in, or outside, the athletic department. A few players are participants in corruption, possibly receiving money or having their grades changed, but put that in perspective: there are 85 players on a football team. In other words, about 80 innocents are affected by the actions of a few adults in the program. There always have been innocents adversely affected when the death penalty is handed down, that is an inconvenient truth. Penn State does not deserve special consideration simply because they (WE) ARE PENN STATE!

As to Luke's point that they haven't broken any rules, that may not matter. This incident will fall under the NCAA ethics bylaws. So, the death penalty is, and should be, on the table.

If the NCAA looks at sanctioning Penn State, it appears it would include looking at NCAA Bylaw 2.4, on "principles of sportsmanship and ethical conduct," which calls for "intercollegiate athletics to promote the character development of participants ... . These values should be manifest not only in athletics participation but also in the broad spectrum of activities affecting the athletics program."

This broad bylaw typically has been used to regulate behavior such as trash-talking during a game. It appears to be unprecedented to use the bylaw to penalize an institution over ethical conduct. But this obviously is an unprecedented circumstance that has unfolded in State College.

...they are alleged crimes, but the alleged crimes are horrific. That takes it to another level. Some of the infractions that have occurred in the past did not reach the level of criminality.

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/college/football/view.bg?articleid=1380144&format=&page=2&listingType=colfb#articleFull

The professional aspirations of the prospects won't be much impacted. First, scouts know who the prospects are, and there aren't 85 prospects on any program. Second, only 250 players are drafted each year, the remainder sign free agent contracts. Tony Romo wasn't drafted, he signed on with the Cowboys as a free agent. Third, players may transfer to programs like Ohio State, Michigan, Pitt, etc.. College football will persevere.

Finally, if not the NCAA, PSU may opt for a self-imposed mercy killing. They are inviting a lot of unrest as it is already. These next few weeks will give the university an opportunity to test the winds once the team finally leaves their isolated Paterno compound. They may learn that the rest of the world isn't as forgiving as Happy Valley.

EDIT: death penalty should be on the table