GOP plans to get rid of Trump

[yardwork]

Now that the tax bill is signed, Trump is more of a deficit to the GOP than an asset. I expect to see the Republicans distance themselves from Trump in the new year, eventually forcing him out of office.

The lavish praise of Trump during the tax bill signing is suspicious. It's the way groups talk right before they betray somebody.

Trump is out.

My worries: Pence would be worse, and will the Republicans succeed in stopping the investigation into Russian interference?

[tymorial]

1. If they're going to do it they're going to wait until closer to the midterms

They will want to test the voter waters to see how they will fare in November. If it looks like they're going to lose then they will dump him and hopes to salvage their own personal political careers. Right now they are giving him everything they want while taking the criticism (at least that is how they view it).

[yardwork]

2. The 2018 midterm election is in full swing in January.

Watch the Republican Party take credit for the tax bill and shift blame for everything unpopular onto Trump.

It will happen. Watch it unfold.

[MoonRiver]

23. Except that the tax bill IS unpopular.

If they have to shift blame onto Chumpy, that won't entirely fly. Pics of jubilant Repukes celebrating the tax scam passage won't work to their advantage.

[yardwork]

25. That is a ray of hope. Maybe the American people will wake up.

[dansolo]

67. Maybe after the primaries

When it will be too late for Bannon to target them.

[Chasstev365]

3. Respectfully, I have to disagree

I think the most underrated aspect of the Russia story is the amount of illegal campaign money the GOP knowingly got from Russia and they are scared shitless that it's going to come out.

If you look at guys like Jim Jordan of OH, Devin Nunez of CA, and Goodlatte of VA, their desperation is getting frantic. It also explains why Jason Chaffetz got out so abruptly.

[yardwork]

4. I don't understand how that disagrees with my post.

[Chasstev365]

17. OK, maybe I misunderstood, but you said the GOP turn on Trump.

Why would Republicans do that if it exposes their own dirty secrets?

[yardwork]

21. Trump is bad at keeping secrets.

I believe that Russian money and support is shifting from Trump to other Republicans, people who - as you say - are already deeply compromised.

The GOP will force Trump out. His usefulness is now exceeded by the danger he poses to them because of his erratic behavior and poor judgement.

[FM123]

32. Do you believe this is why Ryan is getting out?

[Chasstev365]

34. Yes or his pollsters are telling him he's dead and he wants his Koch check.

[Fred Sanders]

77. When the average generic ballot average is +13 Democrats you better start panicking.

+18 per CNN would be an avalanche from Senator to dogcatcher.

Trumpet may be selective on his polling but not stupid people know a wipeout is coming.

Can you say Alamaba and Virginia, kiddies?

[tblue37]

69. And why Ryan wants to get out of Dodge now. nt

[oberliner]

5. No they don't

They are afraid of him.

[yardwork]

7. How so?

[oberliner]

16. He goes after Republicans that get on his bad side

And then the pro-Trump media folks amplify that criticism. It seems that the majority of Republicans are afraid of upsetting that hard-core pro-Trump base and so prefer to flatter and praise Trump to get what they want (like tax cuts for the ultra rich).

[yardwork]

18. Watch them shift the power away from Trump.

[oberliner]

19. Who do you see leading that shift?

To me, the Congressional Republicans all appear to be spineless sycophants to Trump and company.

[yardwork]

24. They're spineless sycophants to the money.

Putin, the Kochs, the Mercers.... they're calling the shots.

[Kaleva]

41. The facts show otherwise

In order to get the bill to repeal Obamacare to pass in the House, Trump caved to the demands of the Freedom Caucus.

Trump couldn't get the votes in the Senate to repeal Obamacare.

Trump's demand that the Senate get rid of the filibuster rule has been totally ignored.

Trump's support of Roy Moore was in opposition to the Senate Republicans.

The Tax bill would have passed even if Hillary was president.

Efforts to obtain funding for the wall have gotten no where.

Trump's vow to push for a constitutional amendment to place term limits on all members of Congress has also gotten no where.

Trump's legislative track record is dismal.

Trump's own base ignored his pleas to support and vote for Luther Strange in the Alabama primary. And Trump couldn't motivate his base to support and vote for Moore in the general election.

[oberliner]

43. The facts show that Republicans are afraid of Trump

Not a single Republican has spoken out against Trump in any meaningful way on any subject.

The few that have criticized him a little bit still come around and vote the way he wants them to.

Republicans have thrown all pretense of standing for anything whatsoever and have allowed Trump to turn their political party into the Trump party.

[Kaleva]

46. If the Repubs vote the way Trump wants them to, why is his legislative record so poor?

[oberliner]

82. Not one Republican bucked him on this tax bill vote

In spite of the supposed concern Republicans pretend to have about the deficit.

[Kaleva]

87. Lets look at how the Repubs voted on the Bush tax cuts

H.R. 1836 (107th): Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001

Every Repub in the House voted for it and only two Repubs in the Senate (McCain and Chafee) voted against it in the Senate

Jobs and Growth Reconciliation Tax Act of 2003

One Repub in the House voted against it and 3 Repubs in the Senate (McCain, Chafee, and Snowe) voted against it.

They voted overwhelming in in favor of the budget busting tax cuts despite their supposed concern about the deficit.

[yardwork]

54. You have it backwards. Trump is the patsy.

[oberliner]

83. Sure doesn't look that way - the Congressional Republicans seem pathetic

And Trump seems like he gets away with doing and saying whatever he wants without consequence.

[Jspur]

84. How would the tax bill

pass if Hillary was president? Hillary could just veto the tax bill and that would have been the end of it. The only way they could have passed the bill in that scenario would have been to get a 2/3 majority in the Senate. That would have never happened.

[Kaleva]

86. Same way all those bills to repeal Obamacare passed when Obama was president.

I think you are confusing "passed" with "signing into law".

[randr]

6. The lsos has a hold on the only people left who will vote for them

One word from him or his henchman, Bannon, and their political careers are history. Watch for big effort to disenfranchise voters and to call the elections rigged for our last chance to save this once great nation.

[tanyev]

8. And the second they start criticizing him he will turn on them like a rabid animal.

That should be a thing of beauty.


Pence is not good, but for fecks sake, I don't think he'll drop a nuke on Los Angeles just because some celebrity tweets something mean about him. I honestly can't say the same about Trump.

[yardwork]

11. They won't criticize him openly. It will be subtle.

Beginning in January, look for Republican surrogates on the talk shows that start to spread uncertainty and doubt about Trump. Just a kind of gradual erosion, a negativity.

Trump will continue to cause "incidents" and the GOP won't be there to cover up or fix things. Trump's health will become more of an issue. Republicans will start talking about the president's health, about his need to rest, their concern about him...

[LonePirate]

9. I am fine with the Repubs betraying 45 and invoking the wrath of the deplorables.

The deplorables have no loyalty to Pence so without their votes, the Republicans will endure a history making slaughter next November. Several southern legislative chambers will flip from red to blue if the Republicans and deplorables wage a war of words against each other. That’s not to mention what happens in swing states and blue states. This country will be much better off if that happens.

[yardwork]

13. The deplorables are easily duped.

[Lee-Lee]

10. Ive suspected this talk of Ryan retiring was to position him

So when Trump is forced out, has “medical issues” and resigns or whatever Ryan can pretend like he is reluctantly coming out of retirement for the good of the country.

You have to look 3-4 steps ahead with these types.

[yardwork]

15. I believe that the Russians are dropping Trump.

They're supporting others. Pence for sure. Ryan and McConnell for sure. There's definitely a long plan.

[kentuck]

12. They tied themselves to his wagon....

they have decided that they cannot win without his base and they will lose that base if they get rid of Trump, in my opinion.

[yardwork]

14. They won't lose his base. They'll co-opt it.

[kentuck]

29. How so?

Trump voters are very loyal to Trump.

[yardwork]

30. Because they were brainwashed to support him. They can be brainwashed again.

The Russians and their billionaire buddies own social media, AM radio, Fox News, etc.

[kentuck]

47. It's not easy to de-program a cult.

[yardwork]

57. All they have to do is point the deplorables at the new focus.

It's not deprogramming.

And remember, most Trump voters are the wealthy elites. They got their tax bill, representing a huge reallocation of wealth to them. They'll do what's best to stay in power now.

[The Genealogist]

51. This

The deplorables will do whatever faux snooze and the wingnuts on the radio tell them. If they decide to turn on Trump and call him a secret Democrat who is actually a lizard man from mars the deplorables will eat it up with a spoon.

[kentuck]

55. That is assuming that FOX News will follow the GOP instead of Trump.

I'm not so sure about that.

[The Genealogist]

58. Not saying they will

Just saying that the deplorables will do what faux et all tell tthem to do.

[yardwork]

60. Who owns Fox News?

Loyalty has NOTHING to do with this. It's all about the money.

[yardwork]

65. They'll have video. They won't even have to fake it.

[onenote]

20. I guess some people here never learn.

Last edited Fri Dec 22, 2017, 12:49 PM - Edit history (1)

Predictions about Trump being forced out, or quitting voluntarily, have been appearing on DU for more than a year.

It was predicted that he would drop out of the campaign during the primaries. That he would drop out of the campaign before the convention. That he would drop out of the campaign after the convention but before election day. That he would quit between election day and inauguration day. That he would quit shortly after inauguration day.

Now it's predicted that he's going to quit or be forced out by republicans because the tax bill has passed.

Guess what... that prediction is no more likely to come true than any of the ones that preceded it.

[yardwork]

26. I was the second person on DU to predict that Trump would be the nominee.

One other person posted that earlier than me.

I know how these people think.

[USALiberal]

80. LOL, OK! How did the New York Times miss this idea??? nt

[onenote]

81. I'll accept your rather bold statement about your foresight regarding Trump

because I'm too lazy to check.

But the reality is that Trump got nominated notwithstanding the opposition of the repub establishment. That establishment remains terrified of the Trump base and how it could kill them in 2018. And the Trump base listens not merely, or even primarily, to Fox. They pay attention to Breitbart and Dally Caller and the such, and those sites aren't going to turn on Trump.

[spanone]

22. naw, they have fallen deeply in love with the donald

he'll sign any bill they put in front of him....the perfect stooge

[yardwork]

27. ANY Republican would do the same!

[GreenEyedLefty]

28. And a useful idiot.

They have learned that all they need to do is flatter him and they'll get whatever they want.

It's sickening.

[yardwork]

33. That's why Putin picked him up years ago, but Donald's losing it now.

They're going to have to switch him out for another tool.

[Paladin]

31. Pence would be awful, but he sure as hell wouldn't be worse.

And if the repubes are planning on getting rid of trump, they're not doing it anywhere near fast enough to suit me.

[yardwork]

35. I think Pence would be worse. We'd have a religious dictatorship.

Also, Pence is not as obviously insane as Trump. Imagine if Trump were competent. That's Pence.

[GreenEyedLefty]

37. They are all horrible. Every last one of them. Pence is a freak in a can.

He gives me the heebie jeebies.

[yardwork]

39. +1

[Merlot]

75. yes.

[NewJeffCT]

44. I think Pence is far more of a true believer

and is probably more competent than Trump, though that is a low bar. He was very unpopular in conservative Indiana at the end.

However, Pence is far less charismatic than Trump and won't have the media falling all over themselves to report every tweet and every outrageous statement. The media might actually focus on the horrific policies instead of Trump's latest word vomit.

[ProfessorGAC]

70. Especially Not. . .

. . .if he's just the guy who takes the reins. Even worse if it ends in scandal. Then, he's a toothless tiger.

[NewJeffCT]

73. True

if Trump resigns in disgrace and a ton of people around him go down, Pence will be a bigly lame duck and likely will not even offer to run in 2020, clearing the slate for Kasich, Bush, Cruz or somebody else for Republicans.

[ProfessorGAC]

79. I Remember Jerry Ford

A quite honorable man who was almost a national joke because he had no moral authority at all given the circumstances.

[Orsino]

36. They didn't need Trump for their tax bill. Not at all.

Unless you mean that they didn't want too many more indictments of his staff when they were trying to sneak it through to passage?

But yes, Pence will be worse. He won't be torpedoing their agenda on a daily basis with gaffes and pratfalls.

[yardwork]

38. I think that they needed Trump in order to pass the tax bill.

It just barely passed. They needed every single vote. They needed whatever support they could get from Trump. Everything. And it's all the Republicans wanted. Passing it was essential. Billions of dollars shifted to their billionaire donors.

Now that's done and the next goal is their re-election.

[Orsino]

42. Trump had nothing to do with the few GOP holdouts who wanted slightly bigger slices of the pie.

That was all Congress.

Trump doesn't make deals. He signs his name and takes credit.

[David__77]

40. Unless he becomes incapacitated I dont see that happening until 2020.

Why would he voluntarily resign the presidency?

[yardwork]

61. I didn't say that he will voluntarily resign.

[MFM008]

62. Obstruction of justice charges

The Republicans will attempt to ignore until November when they are swept out in a tsunami wave of extraordinary proportions.

[C_U_L8R]

45. They've just gotten their beaks wet

They'll want more... and more... and more

[SammyWinstonJack]

50. Yeah and they'll get it ALL. Who's gonna stop " em?

TEA PARTY. TAKE EVERYTHING ASSHOLES.

They're going to what's NOT theirs to take, Social Security benefits.

[mythology]

48. How exactly was Trump a benefit to passing the tax bill?

It clearly is designed to benefit him to the tune of millions of dollars. That didn't exactly help sell the bill to the public. How was he an asset?

[yardwork]

64. They couldn't afford to undermine him while their focus was on the bill.

Now the bill is passed, they move on to the 2018 election. Watch them begin to put a lot of blame on Trump.

[Joe941]

49. No. they still have their eye on destroying social security.

[Irish_Dem]

52. I think this is one of the scenarios they are considering.

The kiss fest was the eulogy, we are just waiting for the burial.
And if the GOP can stop Mueller, Pence can go to the WH.

[yardwork]

63. That's what I think. Putin is going to abandon Trump.

And Putin and his business partners have a lot of power right now.

[Irish_Dem]

66. I am also sure Putin has other assets in the US. He did not put all of his eggs in the Trump basket

That would have been stupid, and he is not stupid.

[yardwork]

72. Exactly.

[greymattermom]

53. Russians are experts at

making people disappear. Trump will disappear, and his cult can still worship him while the others take over.

[unblock]

56. why? this makes zero sense. donnie contributed nothing that any replacement couldn't have done.

they didn't need his inept leadership, they didn't need his incompetent salesmanship, they didn't need his non-existent arm-twisting.

they have no use for his legislative ignorance, and they didn't need donnie to rally public support all the way up to the low 30s.


donnie was completely useless, if not an active hindrance to the process. his sole contribution will be signing the damn thing, and pence or any other republican president would do just as well in his stead.


the only thing they ever needed from donnie was to defeat hillary. after that, he was and has been essentially useless to republicans.


they are no more likely to turn on him now than a week or a month ago.

if anything, they have fallen in line behind him because unity going into campaign season is probably more important than jettisoning their leader (a huge, huge risk in their authoritarian culture).



keep in mind that even if they pine for donnie to simply go away, **they can't be seen as playing any role in making that happen**.
maybe they quietly pray for donnie to die, but they know donnie still has big support among republicans and there would be hell to pay in the primaries for any republican who actively tries to kick donnie out or even to be seen as opposing him.

[yardwork]

59. Your points seem to reinforce my point.

Trump was a useful tool to the Russians because they wanted him to get Congress to lift the sanctions. There's trillions of dollars at stake and the sanctions are blocking Putin and his business partners from making the deals.

Trump was forced on the GOP. He's not a politician, he's a lousy deal maker, and now he's coming unglued. Putin will drop him and install somebody more reliable.

The Republican Party and its leaders are deeply compromised with Russian money and they will do what they're told.

[unblock]

68. republicans cannot move on donnie until he is massively unpopular among the republican rank-and-file

if the russians have similiar control over foxnews, that can be achieved, and then, sure, republicans in congress will then be happy to remove donnie, though they'd still prefer resignation, especially seemingly voluntary, to impeachment.

but as long as donnie has meaningful support among primary voters, their hands are tied, kompromat notwithstanding.

[yardwork]

71. I never said anything about impeachment.

And the rank and file Republicans are rich, not poor. They got what they wanted. They don't need Trump.

[unblock]

74. i can't follow your argument at all.

donnie still has 30% support. that's way, way, way beyond the number of rich people in this country.

any republican in congress who opposes donnie risks getting primaried.


as far as the rich donors, they haven't needed donnie in particular since the election. pence would have signed the bill just as well. any republican would serve their interests, they never had any particular attachment to donnie as opposed to any other republican.

[yardwork]

76. Read my posts in this thread and see if this makes sense.

In summary, this is my thinking:

Putin installed Trump to get the sanctions lifted in Congress. Putin did this by influencing the American voters via social media, AM radio, Fox News, etc. That campaign influenced enough Republicans to get Trump nominated and enough voters (on the left and right) to get Trump installed in the White House.

But Trump has failed to come through for Putin. Trump turns out to be so erratic he's useless. And now there's investigations and talk about Russian collusion, and the sanctions can't be lifted in this environment. But we can be sure that lots more people than Trump were helped by Putin.

The Republicans wanted that tax bill more than anything. Their wealthy donors counted on it, and threatened to stop campaign contributions if it wasn't passed. So nobody was going to rock the boat until the tax bill is passed.

That's done now. Now, Trump is, in balance, more of a hindrance than a help to the Republican Party and to Putin.

There will be a move to push him out - in ways that don't rile up the deplorables - and replace Trump with a more reliable tool.

People are easily brainwashed to go along with things like this. Watch it unfold.

[unblock]

78. i won't discount the possibility of donnie going out,

in fact, i'm mildly surprised he hasn't been taken out already. he's made the world a vastly more dangerous place for many, and people get killed for less. everyone here would certainly oppose that approach, but there are people in this world who do such things. foreign intelligence agencies who don't like getting their secrets told, for instance.

and sure, if russians can engineer an exit for donnie that doesn't make it look like republicans in congress had anything to do with it, ok, could happen.

i'm just saying that there was never anything magical about signing the tax bill. they could have gotten rid of donnie a week, a month, three months ago, or on january 20 an hour after he was sworn in and they still would have gotten their tax bill.


if they wanted donnie out, they never needed to wait for him to sign the damn thing. pence would have signed in a heartbeat.

[kwassa]

85. Trump is still useful to the GOP.

He is so desperate to win that he will support almost all of what they want him to support.

His sole desire is to be seen as a winner, with appropriate adulation. He really has no coherent philosophy, just positions, many quite changeable.

[former9thward]

88. These OPs and predictions started in the summer of 2015.

They have not got rid of him yet. And I have seen no evidence they have any interest in doing so.