General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWolff's claim that Trump didn't want to win seems at odds
with the claims of cooperate with the Russians; why else but to win?
Any different takes on this?
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)I tried to get to be President like you wanted, now give me a hotel.
GusBob
(7,286 posts)When asked if dealing with the Russians could get them in trouble, he wax quoted as saying
It only matters if we win
They are like most crooks who don't think they are gonna get caught
JDC
(10,084 posts)He is incompetent. He knew he couldn't handle it and didn't want the respondibilities. His ego wouldn't let him back away.
Winning was all the mattered. The actual doing it was always going to be an issue.
triron
(21,916 posts)Yavin4
(35,357 posts)And that's why he wants to hold campaign rallies every other week.
RandomAccess
(5,210 posts)didn't really EXPECT to win.
But he sure put in a lot of miles to hither, thither and yon for someone who didn't want to win.
atreides1
(16,046 posts)But by then it wasn't up to him, whether he won or loss, he had no control over the outcome! Perhaps it was the Russians that wanted him to win, or people running his campaign, or even his adult children, that doesn't mean Trump himself wanted the albatross of the office around his neck!!!
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)And I've been pondering it. I think he liked the idea of cheating to win but still didn't want or expect to. Maybe he didn't think the Russians really could do it so it was safe to try.
I believe Melania really did cry if reports she already had an out clause when he lost were true.
dlk
(11,438 posts)Trump is lazy and never worked a day in his life. He is also greedy and will do anything to make a buck, including going through the motions of wanting to be president. He suckered the Republican voters.
rainy
(6,085 posts)spend the next 8 years bashing Hillary and democrats. Hed rake in the dough and promote Ivankas endeavors and they all live happily ever after
murielm99
(30,657 posts)He became frightened when he realized that he had the job.
Once he had the job, he expected to be able to delegate all of it to underlings. He became even more frightened when he realized that that would not work, and that people could scrutinize and criticize him.
He wanted to create chaos when he lost. I think that was as far ahead as he planned. He did not plan to recognize a Clinton victory. He did not plan to honor the peaceful transfer of power. He said, forcefully, over and over, that he would only honor that if he won. He was planning on urging his followers to riot in the streets when Clinton won. He would have loved the attention and the chaos. That may have been part of a Putin plan, too. Chaos and civil unrest following a Clinton victory would have suited Putin just fine. That would have been enough for Trump to fulfill his side of the bargain.
townie
(38 posts)M
grantcart
(53,061 posts)procon
(15,805 posts)Look at what he's most interested in now; getting dirt on Hillary, bashing the Clintons, tearing down Obama, and trashing Dems. Win or lose, if he got something from the Russians, Trump would have made use of anything they offered to continue his petty vendettas. His base eats that stuff up.
There's also the possibility that the Russians had something on Trump, and the threat of public disclosure kept him in line. And if trump was involved in some sort of money deals with wealthy Russians, Trump would want to keep on friendly terms with them to keep the cash flowing.
sarah FAILIN
(2,857 posts)They all looked shell shocked. Like someone killed someone they care about, the whole bunch. None of them looked happy.
Makes sense to me.
questionseverything
(9,631 posts)trump owes his Russian bankers big bucks(which means putin)
putin wants to hurt hc to make sure her presidency is not productive...trump helps with that, never dreaming he would win, to please his bankers
just because he didn't want to win doesn't mean his conspiring with Russia isn't illegal
C_U_L8R
(44,897 posts)He just didn't think through "what he'd be famous for" very well.
Locrian
(4,522 posts)There is no strategy or thought about consequences.
It's just trump reacting in real time to to his desire for attention
triron
(21,916 posts)I'm probably making too big a deal out of it.
Locrian
(4,522 posts)trump is a product of a system that formed from a LOT of different cultural factors - he's the accidental president
tinrobot
(10,848 posts)Max Bialystock : "How could this happen? I was so careful. I picked the wrong play, the wrong director, the wrong cast. Where did I go right? We forgot one important thing, Bloom. Adolf Hitler always drew a crowd."
Locrian
(4,522 posts)shanny
(6,709 posts)and a trump tower in Moscow.
agincourt
(1,996 posts)and what he was really thinking can easily be two different things. He gives all evidence to me that he is really enjoying his presidency.
Skittles
(152,967 posts)he fucking OWES them and they OWN him
spanone
(135,636 posts)he was shocked he won.
Kirk Lover
(3,608 posts)chaos and sow division anyway so mission complete. I don't know how many times I said during the campaign that it almost looks like he's trying to lose. But I can see him both wanting to win, but then not wanting to. Losing certainly had it's appeal.
PLUS, he has been enamored w/ the Russians for a long time so I think he would of answered that knock regardless.
blueinredohio
(6,797 posts)MaryMagdaline
(6,849 posts)Had wanted a trump hotel in Moscow. Just doing the Russians' bidding would help him in business there. Heck, it helped Kurshner get his loan.
janterry
(4,429 posts)it's just how Wolff reported (and understood) Trump's intention. He's wanted to be President for many years. He ran to win. But when it looked like he couldn't, he looked for other opportunities. At the time, we knew he was going to start his own network - and (he said) take a long vacation.
By the end of the campaign, he'd decided that not winning would be fine and he'd make the best of it.
Melania, otoh, I don't believe ever wanted him to win.
randr
(12,408 posts)oberliner
(58,724 posts)dalton99a
(81,073 posts)Remember headlines like this:
politicaljunkie41910
(3,335 posts)Perhaps start some TV Network, (a losing prospect) as some were suggesting, to get a better contract out of NBC for "The Apprentice."
Awsi Dooger
(14,565 posts)He spent the entire final month of the campaign like a sad desperate man who knew he was likely to fail. You don't use the term rigged system over and over when you know it's being successfully manipulated for you, with a guaranteed outcome.
In particular that contrived outing with employees at the Doral Country Club was about as pathetic as it gets for a presidential nominee. Trump was forcing one hispanic employee after another to walk up there to the microphone and talk about how great it is as a Trump employee.
It's like GOTV. You have to do it just in case of a tight election, but very frequently you know it won't be enough. Trump cheated with the Russians just like he's lied and cheated all his life. But it was not flipped votes. They had no idea they would carry those swing states in the upper midwest. But the angst among working class whites was beyond anything that the polls had captured, and in combination with the fake news on Facebook and elsewhere, and with fluke uplift from James Comey in the final 10 days, it was just enough to produce a result that even the campaign didn't anticipate.
There's so much cynicism here now that everyone wants to believe Trump controlled everything before he gained office. No...now he controls everything and there are atrocities going on that we aren't even aware of. But before November 8, 2016 he was an underdog, but just not as much of an underdog as conventional wisdom preferred. Many of us here posted that it was going to be a tight election, no matter what the polls suggested. I posted countless times that all the simplistic angry right wing males I knew were more energized than ever before. That attached nationwide.
Nate Silver had Hillary as only a 1/2 favorite on election day...high 60s% win likelihood That's not much, the equivalent of a 4.5 point favorite in an NFL game. Somehow the nation and the world wanted to believe the 90-99% garbage was accurate.
bullwinkle428
(20,627 posts)he could spend every day of the rest of his miserable and pathetic life, tweeting about a "rigged system" and "Crooked Hillary" until the world came up with a way to issue a binding gag order.
He could claim to be the "People's Champion", and this would be the overriding proof that the "swamp" wasn't even capable of being drained.