General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsQuit saying "white people"
It's "people of white." Or perhaps "person of whiteness" in more formal settings. Out of a sense of human dignity, the personhood should always come first.
Thomas Hurt
(13,903 posts)Bucky
(53,997 posts)Why say people with Autism instead of autistic people? You put the "people" first. It's about re- humanizing fellow citizens, where the political dialogue attempts to dehumanize us.
The real question is, do you want a political dialogue that promotes shared civil commonalities, or a political rhetoric that promotes divisiveness?
The greatest friend of the political right is the tendency to otherize fellow citizens and keep us all from pursuing shared interests.
whathehell
(29,067 posts)People of No Color?
Bucky
(53,997 posts)Plus it's not terribly accurate, sociologically speaking, to describe people by the absence of characteristics.
It's like that old stereotype of people from middle-class suburbs saying, "I have no culture. I grew up in the burbs." Of course you have culture! Your sheltered life is just keeping you from seeing it as culture. It's the National Geographic-propounded colonial mentality that culture is somebody else's life.
But mostly I object to the negativity. And frankly I'd rather enlighten people than piss them off.
whathehell
(29,067 posts)SonofDonald
(2,050 posts)whathehell
(29,067 posts)I'm kinda pink too.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)I'm guessing some people are just not consistently any single color.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Sort of tan, light tan, beige people mostly.
I grew up with a red headed friend who was really white. She glowed in the dark.
lastlib
(23,213 posts)whathehell
(29,067 posts)I saw Negro used as a description of POC in reading some S.C.-N.C. everyday news source recently. I chuckled at the term. Is honkie still an okay term to use with people without a clue to their bigotry and racism. Okay to use? People that/who are white? As in POC? White is a colour. Right?
lsewpershad
(2,620 posts)colorless people.
Xipe Totec
(43,890 posts)Funny.
But parodies of socially sensitive language only mock the seriousness of the political divisiveness that's keeping the GOP afloat these days
heaven05
(18,124 posts)that wordplay on race.
So much contention, not enough cooperation. Pitiful.
edbermac
(15,937 posts)elleng
(130,865 posts)The Polack MSgt
(13,186 posts)It's OK to hit my gang...
George Carlin had an insightful mind
DashOneBravo
(2,679 posts)I was laying on the sheets nekkid and my girlfriend came out of the bathroom and starting calling Dash Dash where did you go?
Civic Justice
(870 posts)when they refer to people who are black, brown and Tan (yellow) or what ever the tone is...
Bucky
(53,997 posts)... is to woke us up to the socio-political realities that help or harm our country and its people.
At the end of the day, do you want to alienate Americans from each other, or unite us in fellow citizenhood?
Civic Justice
(870 posts)Bucky
(53,997 posts)Scurrilous
(38,687 posts)No @#$%. LOL
Bucky
(53,997 posts)are not Slavic, Celtic, Norse, and Mediterranean persons of white to be culturally respected? This is America, dammit! We should all be treated equal!!
whathehell
(29,067 posts)It's not exactly correct, but it's not at all offensive, imo.
Scurrilous
(38,687 posts)whathehell
(29,067 posts)LeftInTX
(25,254 posts)I would check "Other" and write it "White. Not Anglo".
I hate that term....
If they create a category Wypipo, I will check it. It sounds kinda cool.
PoindexterOglethorpe
(25,845 posts)and I occasionally refer to myself as Anglo.
I also do volunteer work helping to feed the homeless at a local homeless shelter. Because this is New Mexico, most of our guests are Hispanic. The paid kitchen staff works hard with us to make sure we don't just serve (as I've been known to express it) food for Protestants. Indeed, Raoul, the kitchen manager often whips up some extra spicy salsa to serve alongside whatever else we're offering.
Now all of you Protestants here do not need to take offense, as I'm intending a large degree of irony. I happen to be someone who does not care for very hot as in chili pepper hot food, although I like well-seasoned food. But spicy hot? No thanks.
samnsara
(17,616 posts)Bucky
(53,997 posts)Although your appropriation of that term is inherently colonizing to people who are shorter than you
sl8
(13,736 posts)Last edited Mon May 7, 2018, 12:23 AM - Edit history (1)
It just seems catchier, to me.
But only you people can use that phrase. Everyone else needs to say "person of little oldmess from Pasadena"
Atticus
(15,124 posts)sat a brand new shiny red super stock Dodge!"
Those were the days.
whathehell
(29,067 posts)That term always sounds a tad belittling to me.
sl8
(13,736 posts)whathehell
(29,067 posts)Civic Justice
(870 posts)when they refer to people who are black, brown and Tan (yellow) or what ever the tone is... as 'colored, black, brown and etc... Oh' I forgot many people of white did not respect the "person-hood" of others who were not white.... surely, that's how it got laid out as color description before person-hood.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)But you have to understand that it's inherently prejudicial to judge everyone in the group by the negative behaviors of some in the group.
This is equally educational to POCs and POWs.
And with all due respect, I think this country has had enough of this "people of white first" mentality. No one is more deserving than anyone else! If we choose to "be the change we wish to see in the world", should we not start with ending that sort of political segregationism?
sl8
(13,736 posts)"People lacking height got no reason ..."?
Babs certainly wasn't taking any chances with her song, she made sure that "people" came first, last, and between all the other words:
"People, people who need people, are the luckiest people ...".
Bucky
(53,997 posts)I don't pretend to be perfect about this Progressive nomenclature yet, but I hope I can strive to respect all persons in the stature of their humanity rather than the accidental distinctions in their altitude.
Jefferson and Lincoln found greatness in propagating the notion that all men are created equal. But even their language needs an update to "all people are created equal", just to refine the expression of that beautiful and democratic ideal
Solomon
(12,310 posts)Thought you were making a sarcastic point.
But you're serious aren't you.
let me play this out
TDale313
(7,820 posts)While I get your point, I think its pretty silly. Heres the thing: For the same reason people dont really need a reminder that all lives matter or white lives matter in the same way we need the reminder that black lives matter (cause our society makes it clear daily that they dont)... whiteness is pretty much considered the default. Most of us are clear on the fact that white people are people (particularly white men) In our current world, for POC? Yeah, unfortunately, not always so much.
We people of white need to lay off the bullshit that were in a post-racial world and that whites are just as put-upon as people of color. Deep down, you know its crap and that its done to once again dismiss the experiences of minorities.
gollygee
(22,336 posts)and minimizing their experiences.
Thank you.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)After all, is that not the common denominator? Should we not recognize our differences as being subservient to our commonalities? That seems like a more positive and progressive path for subverting patterns of racism in our national culture.
Besides which, "people" means "people." I'm talking about the culturo-poltical wounds aggrivated by the alienating phrase "white people." When did you ever hear that phrase used to promote healing and Interculturalism?
It's the otherization involved in the phrase "white people" that's reinforcing the artificial political divisiveness that supports right-wing identity politics. I'd rather be the change.
LakeArenal
(28,817 posts)gorgeous humanistic sentiments
Depeche Mode
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)Ferrets are Cool
(21,106 posts)I answered HUMAN.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)Excellent!
I got surveyed by the u.s. census recently. Under race I checked off white, because there's legit reasons to track that kind of information. But under ethnicity I responded United States. Specifying any kind of European identity doesn't make much sense for someone whose families have resided on this continent for at least seven generations.
I don't begrudge anyone their sense of European-derived identity, or any other transoceanic identity, but for me I feel about as English as the 4th of July and about as Dutch as chocolate ice cream. I feel as attached to my European ancestors as I do to my earlier Indo-European ancestors from the Russian steppes or earliest Homo sapiens sapiens ancestors from the Rift Valley. I'm sure they were all nice people, but I derive no identity from them.
Ferrets are Cool
(21,106 posts)3catwoman3
(23,973 posts)...doing so for years.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)Well done
Beautiful!
grantcart
(53,061 posts)Still going on.
It appears we need an invasion of aliens to get a perspective.
lame54
(35,284 posts)Bucky
(53,997 posts)but I will refer you to the words of that famous American-American philosopher Henry David Thoreau
winstars
(4,220 posts)TheBlackAdder
(28,183 posts).
There. I made it one word and one syllable shorter.
Or, to really condense things, call white people, Whites! Now we're at a single syllable.
.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)TheBlackAdder
(28,183 posts).
Those who profess grammar to that degree fail to grasp what every linquistics professor teaches.
Language is fluid and changes over time. Regardless of how things are written, as long as the message is conveyed, language served it purpose. They give examples of transposing words, inseting typographical ettors, switching certain words to near words, etc. And pretty much everyone can read it and extract the message intent on being delivered. Language has done its purpose.
.
EffieBlack
(14,249 posts)Cha
(297,143 posts)misanthrope
(7,411 posts)**
Bucky
(53,997 posts)I suppose you could be a wag and argue that white is the absence of color. But that's only true if you're talking about the science of light refraction, not if you're talking about people. In common language white is a color. And the legal phrase "race, creed, or color" applies equally to people of white and people of color.
If someone holds up a typical sheet of copier paper and asks "What color is this?" you would say "it is white" no? But then, if someone held up a typical Caucasian and said "What color is this?" then you'd probably say tan or pink, depending on the season and assuming it isn't George Hamilton. So in reality, there is no such thing as a person of non color.
My point is, you shouldn't hold people up.
misanthrope
(7,411 posts)It's hard to indicate the subtleties of humor in online discussion.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)but the whole point of this thread is to prompt fresh thinking.
Iggo
(47,549 posts)BAM!
If you make the argument about color instead of about socioeconomic violence against vulnerable segments of our society, you can almost miss the point.
That's part of what's so brilliant about the Russians targeting both left and right Americans with their race-trolling. We get so wound up talking about race, we forget that this is supposed to be the land of opportunity for all. We forget that when we help other people overcome historic discrimination, we're really helping ourselves as well
Well done.
GoneOffShore
(17,339 posts)That cat in 'Get Fuzzy'.
http://www.gocomics.com/getfuzzy
My nickname actually precedes Get Fuzzy by a generation or so. But I've had friends notice some similar personality traits
GoneOffShore
(17,339 posts)DFW
(54,341 posts)European-American.
Problem solved!
Bucky
(53,997 posts)No, I am not European. I don't think, act, or dress like a European. I'm sure those people are very nice people. But I feel zero connection to their culture (other than the usual "brotherhood of man" sentiments I feel to all humans, of course)
DFW
(54,341 posts)That's where the "A" part comes in. Your ancestry has only to do with your physical ancestry, not your current cultural makeup. For that matter, my younger nephew, when at work, is just as likely to dress in a Dashiki as anything else, But he looks Japanese because his mom is Japanese, and he received a larger proportion of her genes than his older brother did. But since he works a lot in Abuja and Kano these days, he sometimes dresses like the people he works with. Since he speaks little Hausa, he communicates in English or Arabic. It still doesn't change his ancestry--he is and remains Asian-American. The fact that he talks like a guy from northern Virginia (when he speaks in English, that is) doesn't change that.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)Thanks for sharing your family's
people who are white?
Cary
(11,746 posts)I always coveted that flesh colored crayon that only came in the best crayon pack.
I am a flesh supremacist.
but everyone is "fleshtoned" (see below), how can I discriminate between people when we just treat everyone like a human being?
hate don't got a color ==>
Cary
(11,746 posts)Orange isn't flesh.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)words can hurt
oberliner
(58,724 posts)LeftInTX
(25,254 posts)For those with more melanin: Coppertone Baby.
Orange Free State
(611 posts)You may have heard of us, Jerry Lewis raised money for us for years. It has been a terrible handicap my whole life. I wear SPF 150 sunscreen all winter. On the Osmond Whiteness Scale, my score is 1.83 Maries. I once met Johnny Winter and he said You play guitar pretty good, for a white boy. I am somewhere between a fish belly and a bedsheet. When I was a child I was sent to the Institute for the Very Very White for scientific study. My spirit animal is the Samoyed.
Okay, so lets let Wypipo go, its a dead subject. Sounds like a small town in Wyoming anyway. On second thought, we could use it as a euphemism for a rural white town in a red state. Wypipo, Wyoming. Pop 375, of whom 400 voted for the Dotard. It kind of turns it back on them.
csziggy
(34,136 posts)In a science fiction book I am reading - one of the Elizabeth Moon books of the Vatta's War series - there is a system that is described as "melanin deficient" whose inhabitants are very prejudiced against people with increased levels of melanin. The nickname given to them is "Fishbellies." At one point before they prove themselves to be thieves, slavers, and murderers, the captain objects to calling them Fishbellies because of their coloring. One of the crew members claims it is not their color that gained them that nickname but their attitudes towards outsiders.
That series of books was published between 2003 and 2008 so Elizabeth Moon was anticipating what we face today.
mainer
(12,022 posts)Since anglo, white people, wypipo, all seem to offend.
thucythucy
(8,045 posts)BTW I identify as a person with a disability.
IronLionZion
(45,427 posts)since Latinos and Middle Eastern people and mixed people can look white.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Caucasian, that is. Indians are too, though there is some sense they are preferring to be considered Asian.
IronLionZion
(45,427 posts)Obama was also half white. White supremacists deliberately like to divide people.
White supremacists only allowed Southern Europeans and Catholics into their ranks recently. They used to limit it to Anglo-Saxons and Protestants.
treestar
(82,383 posts)was directed at southeastern European immigrants and Irish. Which makes me believe that even if they had the country all white again, another division of upper and lower would be created in their minds.
IronLionZion
(45,427 posts)and it wasn't that long ago.
Some folks want to take us back to that time. After they finish off black and brown people, the southern Europeans and Irish will get it in round 2.
Bucky
(53,997 posts)All the ancestors of mine that I know of come from North America.
infidel621
(36 posts)African-American, Asian-American, why not tack European-American into the ridiculous hyphenated grouping.
Civic Justice
(870 posts)lastlib
(23,213 posts)Or, thinking of tRump and Boehner, are they actually persons?? IDK......
Response to Bucky (Original post)
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Tipperary
(6,930 posts)Tipperary
(6,930 posts)LAS14
(13,783 posts)unblock
(52,196 posts)doc03
(35,325 posts)kwassa
(23,340 posts)Bucky
(53,997 posts)I mean, it's not meant to mean literally white. It's a social convention meaning people in the pink-to-tan range