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bigtree

(85,920 posts)
Sat May 26, 2018, 11:19 AM May 2018

This isn't a warning sign. It's a crisis.

The Hoarse Whisperer @HoarseWisperer 3h3 hours ago
The ritualized dehumanization of a minority population was the first step toward genocide in Nazi Germany.

The world has seen this kind of rhetoric about immigrants - and this kind of brutal, cruel treatment of women and children.

This isn’t a warning sign. It’s a crisis.

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This isn't a warning sign. It's a crisis. (Original Post) bigtree May 2018 OP
And a symptom of a systemic disease dalton99a May 2018 #1
racism and bigotry have always been virulent bigtree May 2018 #5
He's following Hitler's playbook. Many are still snoozing IMO not getting what's going on. And RKP5637 May 2018 #2
And big business thought they could use Hitler to gain more wealth and power without losing tblue37 May 2018 #4
It is, it's the SOS again, just different places, times, people. ... but the same tactic, find a RKP5637 May 2018 #10
Then and now they discover that it's not good for "business" n/t MarcA May 2018 #34
It would be helpful if ooky May 2018 #6
MSM is often such a failure. n/t RKP5637 May 2018 #9
RKP, one of the most disgusting things about the GOP in relation to this is... KY_EnviroGuy May 2018 #16
Yes, I've been amazed at how many are just going along with it. It's strange and dangerous. n/t RKP5637 May 2018 #39
Just saw this on a Twitter thread... KY_EnviroGuy May 2018 #46
Stunning. "White evangelical Protestants" today is just a code word for hateful demented racists RKP5637 May 2018 #48
I sincerely hope that apathy is not as wide spread as it appears. Also, right wing Pepsidog May 2018 #36
Murdoch has IMO been one of the most destabilizing forces in the US. Yet, as far as I know, his RKP5637 May 2018 #40
I agree. This man made billions dividing and weakening our country. Why the left hasn't been Pepsidog May 2018 #41
Agree!!! It's like a sickness has overtaken the US. I too don't understand why the lefty RKP5637 May 2018 #43
this is the real problem, and people are overly fixated on donnie. unblock May 2018 #3
we often underestimate the power of leadership bigtree May 2018 #7
Republicans are the enemy. Trump isn't smart enough to take down the republic. The republicans in Pepsidog May 2018 #37
320,000 immigrants lost legal status ripped from them, now in hiding from the knock on the door grantcart May 2018 #8
Don't Be a Sucker demmiblue May 2018 #11
gee heaven05 May 2018 #15
+1 n/t jaysunb May 2018 #50
K & R Duppers May 2018 #12
Depressingly correct Moral Compass May 2018 #13
Something you can do EndGOPPropaganda May 2018 #55
Depressingly correct Moral Compass May 2018 #14
Depressingly correct. calimary May 2018 #18
Whoops Moral Compass May 2018 #19
HAH! I have to go back and correct a lot of my own posts for the same reason! calimary May 2018 #22
I find it difficult to believe the US public will stomach this for very long. Ligyron May 2018 #17
"I find it difficult to believe..." handmade34 May 2018 #21
That parent/child separation abomination hurts my heart. calimary May 2018 #23
I don't. llmart May 2018 #26
I pray you are correct. Pepsidog May 2018 #38
I absolutely agree. This is a test of what kind of people we are. bronxiteforever May 2018 #20
Don't get too excited. :) Over a third of our citizens Hortensis May 2018 #24
we probably shouldn't be sanguine about that bigtree May 2018 #27
Agree. These are dangerous times. But there are very Hortensis May 2018 #29
but, this is America 2018, Hortensis bigtree May 2018 #35
Our problem are psychology and information tech Hortensis May 2018 #42
it's always been about whose freedom bigtree May 2018 #44
Yes, it does. And the enormous setbacks the Hortensis May 2018 #45
Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe May 2018 #25
K&R smirkymonkey May 2018 #28
Agreed Gothmog May 2018 #30
The German people paid Turbineguy May 2018 #31
K&R 100 times BlueJac May 2018 #32
It's hard to fathom that we fell back defacto7 May 2018 #33
and it's been brought about by the insecurities, greed and narcissism of one little man Demovictory9 May 2018 #47
Kicking for us way-north folks. Saved. Bookmarked! raven mad May 2018 #49
K&R Puzzler May 2018 #51
Damn Straight! From Adam Schiff.. Cha May 2018 #52
The Third Reich started this way.....with words! donkeypoofed May 2018 #53
+1.000 malaise May 2018 #54

bigtree

(85,920 posts)
5. racism and bigotry have always been virulent
Sat May 26, 2018, 11:29 AM
May 2018

...once again practiced and encouraged from the highest offices of the land.

Anyone still sanguine about the future? We're already seeing emulation of the president's particular bigotry among his rabid following, with escalating, and often violent effects.

RKP5637

(67,032 posts)
2. He's following Hitler's playbook. Many are still snoozing IMO not getting what's going on. And
Sat May 26, 2018, 11:22 AM
May 2018

others are complicit and complacent like the GOP congress!!!

tblue37

(64,982 posts)
4. And big business thought they could use Hitler to gain more wealth and power without losing
Sat May 26, 2018, 11:27 AM
May 2018

control.

RKP5637

(67,032 posts)
10. It is, it's the SOS again, just different places, times, people. ... but the same tactic, find a
Sat May 26, 2018, 11:41 AM
May 2018

target and pound them into the ground to rally some herd of followers and the deplorables adore him. And the GOP congress is perfectly OK with it all.

ooky

(8,889 posts)
6. It would be helpful if
Sat May 26, 2018, 11:31 AM
May 2018

mainstream media would get down to the border and put their cameras on this shit instead of interviewing assholes like Hugh Hewitt.

KY_EnviroGuy

(14,483 posts)
16. RKP, one of the most disgusting things about the GOP in relation to this is...
Sat May 26, 2018, 12:32 PM
May 2018

their co-opting of many American religious faiths, who then do the GOP's bidding regardless of their theology.

Churches should all be up in arms over the cruel treatment of refugees and immigrants, and yet many stay silent. This is an abomination of any religious creed, and these churches should be called out at high volume with protests.

....... ...........

KY_EnviroGuy

(14,483 posts)
46. Just saw this on a Twitter thread...
Sat May 26, 2018, 07:06 PM
May 2018

by Philip Bump @pbump, National correspondent for The Washington Post:

Pew asked Americans if the U.S. had a responsibility to accept refugees. No group -- racial, by age, religious or political -- was less supportive of that idea than white evangelical Protestants.

From: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/05/24/the-group-least-likely-to-think-the-u-s-has-a-responsibility-to-accept-refugees-evangelicals/?utm_term=.c97e96e26daf

-------------
This is way beyond appalling. Let's take away their tax exempt status just simply for being cruel assholes.

........

RKP5637

(67,032 posts)
48. Stunning. "White evangelical Protestants" today is just a code word for hateful demented racists
Sat May 26, 2018, 07:27 PM
May 2018

and bigots.

Pepsidog

(6,252 posts)
36. I sincerely hope that apathy is not as wide spread as it appears. Also, right wing
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:27 PM
May 2018

demogauges must be held accountable. Fox, Hannity, and Limbaugh’s on the air must be reckoned with. Murdoch is the enemy of Democracy as is Sinclair Broadcasting. Should we win in 2020 there must be a swift and complete repudiation of all the harm republicans have inflicted upon our country.

RKP5637

(67,032 posts)
40. Murdoch has IMO been one of the most destabilizing forces in the US. Yet, as far as I know, his
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:34 PM
May 2018

agenda and tactics remain unquestioned.

Pepsidog

(6,252 posts)
41. I agree. This man made billions dividing and weakening our country. Why the left hasn't been
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:51 PM
May 2018

able to devise a strategy to combat him and others on the right is beyond me. I believe it was Ken Langome (sp?) who hired privates investigators to follow Elliot Spitzer which led to his downfall. Why don’t lefty billionaires employ their own black ops crews. At this point, there is only Mueller and the 2018 & 2020 elections who can save our country. The ignorance of so many in our country is truly worrisome. I come across Trump supporters and other than professing their support for him, cannot articulate why they support him. It’s sad, shocking and deeply discouraging to hear and see.

RKP5637

(67,032 posts)
43. Agree!!! It's like a sickness has overtaken the US. I too don't understand why the lefty
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:57 PM
May 2018

billionaires don't do more. For the most part, it seems the left ... left/leaning are quite quiet and passive. Do they think this is just going to blow over ... I don't think so. Core changes are occurring and the Trump regime just seems to roll along.

unblock

(51,974 posts)
3. this is the real problem, and people are overly fixated on donnie.
Sat May 26, 2018, 11:25 AM
May 2018

it's obviously true that donnie is the festering boil of this disease, but he's spreading so much hate it will be very easy for someone else to come along and pick up right where he left off even if we do get rid of him somehow.

*then* what?

bigtree

(85,920 posts)
7. we often underestimate the power of leadership
Sat May 26, 2018, 11:33 AM
May 2018

...for good and bad.

We have to assert ourselves at every instigation of this evil with our values and our passion.

Pepsidog

(6,252 posts)
37. Republicans are the enemy. Trump isn't smart enough to take down the republic. The republicans in
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:30 PM
May 2018

the House and Senate are the real enemies of the state.

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
15. gee
Sat May 26, 2018, 12:20 PM
May 2018

glad I was never a sucker like ALL those "free" people in the film. Aren't all the lies that ALL "free people could vote, except certain "free" people. The old McCarthyite, talking about Negroes, alien foreigners, is this era's 'deplorable wypipo.

And "hey that fellow is talking about me" And the reply, "makes a difference, doesn't it". Sounds so familiar today with the controversy over privilege and entitlement.

1947-2018, same, same.

Moral Compass

(1,498 posts)
13. Depressingly correct
Sat May 26, 2018, 12:06 PM
May 2018

We no longer have to compare to Nazis we are the Nazis.

Joined at the hip with Israel which with incredible irony have also become Nazis. Their Jews are the Palestinians. Our Jews are Central Americans coming to us for sanctuary from violence and oppression.

Our Judicial branch is now so politicized that they routinely deny entry to the US even though the plaintiffs meet every condition for admission. ICE now, as a matter of explicit policy, is separating children from parents so as to remove any hope that draws these refugees to our Southern border. The Border Patrol is now opening fire under the flimsiest of pretexts on the illegal aliens Trump is calling animals.

We have lost our country. The crisis is here. Our vaunted Constitution has been laid bare as utterly naive and wholly inadequate to deal with those in power who have no honor, no morals, and no ideals.

Our task now is to take our country back with our votes but with electronic voting systems that are completely unauditable that may be impossible. We are competing against an opponent that is willing to cheat, steal—do anything to hold on to power.

My wife and youngest daughter are in Ireland. I want to ask them what it was like to witness a functioning democracy in action. The people spoke there and an honest vote was held and abortion now has a chance to be made legal. But they’re on a site seeing tour and I do t want to ruin it with the gloom of our political disaster. They’ll be back soon enough.

History is not going to judge us kindly.

Moral Compass

(1,498 posts)
14. Depressingly correct
Sat May 26, 2018, 12:06 PM
May 2018

We no longer have to compare to Nazis we are the Nazis.

Joined at the hip with Israel which with incredible irony have also become Nazis. Their Jews are the Palestinians. Our Jews are Central Americans coming to us for sanctuary from violence and oppression.

Our Judicial branch is now so politicized that they routinely deny entry to the US even though the plaintiffs meet every condition for admission. ICE now, as a matter of explicit policy, is separating children from parents so as to remove any hope that draws these refugees to our Southern border. The Border Patrol is now opening fire under the flimsiest of pretexts on the illegal aliens Trump is calling animals.

We have lost our country. The crisis is here. Our vaunted Constitution has been laid bare as utterly naive and wholly inadequate to deal with those in power who have no honor, no morals, and no ideals.

Our task now is to take our country back with our votes but with electronic voting systems that are completely unauditable that may be impossible. We are competing against an opponent that is willing to cheat, steal—do anything to hold on to power.

My wife and youngest daughter are in Ireland. I want to ask them what it was like to witness a functioning democracy in action. The people spoke there and an honest vote was held and abortion now has a chance to be made legal. But they’re on a site seeing tour and I do t want to ruin it with the gloom of our political disaster. They’ll be back soon enough.

History is not going to judge us kindly.

calimary

(80,700 posts)
18. Depressingly correct.
Sat May 26, 2018, 12:37 PM
May 2018

I don't mind this repeat post of yours, Moral Compass. Not at all. Deserves to be repeated.

Because the weaponizing of the message has now included repeating things three times (three repetitions, repeating three times), we need to make a habit of doing that, too. WHENEVER we're in a place or situation when there is a chance to promote and defend OUR positions. Repetition.

Repetition, repetition, repetition.

Because they have weaponized the message. Weaponized it. They have thoroughly WEAPONIZED the message.

And if we don't turn that technique back on them, and use it as OUR weapon, we're sunk.

Moral Compass

(1,498 posts)
19. Whoops
Sat May 26, 2018, 12:56 PM
May 2018

Accident. But thank you for your comment. This is what happens when I’m using a miniature computer (my phone). 😉

I think you are correct—the disloyal opposition has shown us that repetition cements the message—no matter how noxious or absurd.

Trump today is blaming the separation of refugee children from parents is the fault of the...wait for it...the Democrats.

His base will believe him. Fox will endlessly expound on the rightness if his insane message.

calimary

(80,700 posts)
22. HAH! I have to go back and correct a lot of my own posts for the same reason!
Sat May 26, 2018, 01:28 PM
May 2018

Doin' it on the phone. And I don't know how to do half the maneuvers of the italicizing and bolding and such on the phone, either.

Ligyron

(7,592 posts)
17. I find it difficult to believe the US public will stomach this for very long.
Sat May 26, 2018, 12:34 PM
May 2018

To say nothing of our Judicial system. I think this parent/child separation is new and few know about it thus far.

handmade34

(22,755 posts)
21. "I find it difficult to believe..."
Sat May 26, 2018, 01:11 PM
May 2018

everything that has happened in the past 2 years... I find it difficult to believe there are U.S. citizens that still support DT...

this parent/child separation was put in place by Jeff Sessions a few weeks ago and well beyond something I can comprehend

calimary

(80,700 posts)
23. That parent/child separation abomination hurts my heart.
Sat May 26, 2018, 01:35 PM
May 2018

I can't believe we've stooped this low, as a nation. I can't believe people aren't protesting in the streets! This is a black mark on all our souls if we don't at least try to do something about it. To intentionally cause pain and heartbreak upon some of the most vulnerable people on earth - immigrants escaping war, threats, danger, destitution, and hopelessness - I can't even believe this has been considered as a doable state-sanctioned response, much less implemented.

Sure doesn't conform to that "least of My brethren" thing in Matthew 25:35-45.

llmart

(15,502 posts)
26. I don't.
Sat May 26, 2018, 01:40 PM
May 2018

I'm not so certain that the US public cares much outside their own selfish interests. Some people say, "This is not who we are." I say, "Maybe this IS who we are but we don't want to admit it."

bronxiteforever

(9,287 posts)
20. I absolutely agree. This is a test of what kind of people we are.
Sat May 26, 2018, 01:03 PM
May 2018

Do 2018 Americans want a country that terrorizes children and families?
Or do we want to be humane?

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
24. Don't get too excited. :) Over a third of our citizens
Sat May 26, 2018, 01:36 PM
May 2018

consider themselves Hispanic in some way. Some disapprove almost as strongly as any whitey trumpster of undocumented immigrants, but they're not going to support genocide, and they're also perfectly aware that UIs are being kicked around and abused as surrogates for them because as citizens they're relatively untouchable.

It might help also to know that Jews weren't much more than 1% of Germany's population, which made them much better victims than our Hispanics. Far from commonly turning in neighbors, most people didn't even know any Jews.

But agree this is an atrocity. Let's hope more of our Hispanic people decide to vote what they think of it, understanding that large numbers are conservative.

bigtree

(85,920 posts)
27. we probably shouldn't be sanguine about that
Sat May 26, 2018, 01:57 PM
May 2018

...I'm old enough to remember when folks were telling us to 'give Trump a chance.'

Worth remembering

ian bremmer? @ianbremmer

Madison Square Garden, February 20, 1939
Worth remembering




American Nazi organization rally at Madison Square Garden, 1939




Supposedly 22,000 Nazi supporters attended an American Bund rally at New York's Madison Square Garden in February 1939, under police guard.




A Nazi guard stands before a massive portrait of George Washington.


1934-1939 Nazis in Madison Square Garden

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
29. Agree. These are dangerous times. But there are very
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:03 PM
May 2018

significant differences between us and Germany during its 12-15 year experiment with democracy between prosperity as an advanced nation under the Kaiser, WWI's devastation, and deciding on a return to an authoritarian government to rescue them from crippling tribulations after. We've never had any of that.

bigtree

(85,920 posts)
35. but, this is America 2018, Hortensis
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:23 PM
May 2018

Last edited Sat May 26, 2018, 03:03 PM - Edit history (1)

...toying around with the very elements of Jim Crow and fascism, this very recognizable bigotry and racism wielded from the highest office in the land.

I do think it's essentially a non-sequitur to hold out genocide as a measure of how secure we are from the effects of this demagoguery. After all, there is already a record and pattern of abuses, most of the accounting of which doesn't include the consequences to the tens of thousands of individuals sent back into dangerous situations, and the plights of those denied entry.

We probably shouldn't be judging America by pre-war Germany standards. We're a long way from that time and we're supposed to be better than this. It can happen here. We have our own history of genocide of our citizens.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
42. Our problem are psychology and information tech
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:56 PM
May 2018

used against us by people with virtually unlimited means. That's new. It's not that it can't happen here, only that many factors are very different. And as you point out yourself, we've done many bad things in the past yet did them without trading in representative democracy for fascism.

Large numbers of people on the right are just as afraid as we are and they've been at it longer. Unfortunately, they were told we were the fascists they have to stop, and right now many believe it. But the point is, in spite of the usual weakness for authoritarianism among the usual percentages our national cultures and traditions have, overall, always been firmly about individual freedom and worth.

bigtree

(85,920 posts)
44. it's always been about whose freedom
Sat May 26, 2018, 03:25 PM
May 2018

...not always about freedom for all of us here in America.

The presidency's (government's) power ultimately rests with whatever or representatives and Senators and courts allow. A corrupt government, or one with an overly acquiescing Congress, might assume a facade of democracy while it wields autocratic authority with impunity.

We're witnessing, experiencing a direct challenge to the notion, the ideal of our democracy. It rests, like you say, on the sentiment of our countryfolk, which is no certain hedge against hysteria and fear toward minority communities - generated by government-inspired, enabled hatred.

That corruption can spread and infect, not only our government offices, but our courts, as well, our last refuge in our democracy (besides our vote) against tyranny. I appreciate the optimism, but it remains to be seen whether America rises to this pernicious and dangerous challenge.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
45. Yes, it does. And the enormous setbacks the
Sat May 26, 2018, 03:45 PM
May 2018

corrupters are experiencing are just making them fight harder and nastier, using the same techniques they've done so well with, and no doubt more. I've also heard that viewership/listeners are way up on right wing media. Sounds like more conservatives are becoming interested in understanding what's happening but looking the wrong places.

 

smirkymonkey

(63,221 posts)
28. K&R
Sat May 26, 2018, 01:59 PM
May 2018

I despair for the future of this country. I never thought it could get this bad and it will only get worse while he remains in office.

defacto7

(13,485 posts)
33. It's hard to fathom that we fell back
Sat May 26, 2018, 02:17 PM
May 2018

so far, so hard and so fast. After several failed election coups it took the Russians to pull it off. Who do we have on the left to push it back the other way? Only ourselves.

Demovictory9

(32,324 posts)
47. and it's been brought about by the insecurities, greed and narcissism of one little man
Sat May 26, 2018, 07:09 PM
May 2018

a 71 year old who won't be around to experience the full results of his complete transformation of america.

raven mad

(4,940 posts)
49. Kicking for us way-north folks. Saved. Bookmarked!
Sat May 26, 2018, 09:26 PM
May 2018

Spousal-type sweetie can forward. Thanks, bigtree.

donkeypoofed

(2,187 posts)
53. The Third Reich started this way.....with words!
Sun May 27, 2018, 06:12 AM
May 2018

On this Memorial Day, how can we forget?! This is so sickening, watching this happening. The overt racism, hate and intolerance. Life under Drumpf is eerily similar to what happened in 1930's Germany. Oh boy,I am scared.

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