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Thu Jun 28, 2018, 02:50 PM


ALL the lessons of the Trump debacle and more:

Last edited Fri Jun 29, 2018, 06:28 AM - Edit history (2)

* There were many reasons Trump was elected. One thing is that people just wanted change and saw Clinton as the establishment status quo. Certainly much more qualified than the idiot Trump, but that is one very important fundamental thing.

* Hillary ran a B campaign instead of an A campaign. Should have campaigned in WI, MI, northern ME, etc. Also, lackluster delivery and not strong enough on the economy and other bread and butter issues. (She did talk about these, just not forcefully enough.)

* Even if Hillary was not the greatest candidate on the trail, there was NO excuse for staying home or voting third party. NONE. People who did that OWN this f-ing mess as much as anyone. The stakes were obvious and monumental. Those who didn't vote for Hillary are now suffering the consequences and have ZERO right to bitch about it. Next time, vote and vote CORRECTLY.

* Of course Russian interference and the Comey letter played a large role in this mess. What unjust SHIT that was.

* Today, the Dem establishment needs to get in tune and get in touch. The rank and file on our side is rightfully ANGRY and the establishment needs to acknowledge and echo that anger and frustration. Yes, the MOST important thing we need to do is organize to win elections and this time with a strong CLEAR message on the issues. And we need our candidates and political leaders to speak LOUD and with GUTS. In fact on JOBS, HEALTHCARE, COLLEGE COSTS, WAGES, POLITICAL POPULISM, etc. we CAN both energize our base AND win back some of the Trump voters who switched from Obama to Trump on the bread and butter issues. (No, we won't win them all back, but we can win some back.) We also broaden our base on these issues when spoken forcefully with conviction.

* We SHOULD be out there demonstrating, and civilly but strongly confronting the right wing slimebags who work for Trump, Trump himself, and all right wing slimebag asshats in person, social media, and all the rest. NO MORE MR. or MRS. Nice Guy and Nice Gal. Where the hell has that gotten us? Oh, it's fine for THEM to call Obama a communist Muslim from Kenya, and fine for the TeaPublicans to shout and scream at us including their racist shit, and fine for the idiot Trump to threaten violence and be a racist, and fine for them to implement their rotten policies, etc. etc. but it is not ok for our side to fight back on issues like children being seperated from parents? Why do WE always have to the "better person"? It has gotten us NOWHERE. It is time SHOUT DOWN these rotten right wing fuckwads! I am not talking about hurting anyone, but to confront a TrumpHumper in a restaurant and chant SHAME SHAME SHAME is GOOD! MORE MORE MORE!! And go to rallies, and organize, and VOTE and take ten people with you. We want our leaders and candidates to be TOUGH and FIRED UP. In other words, GROW SOME DAMN BALLS AND FIGHT!

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Arrow 8 replies Author Time Post
Reply ALL the lessons of the Trump debacle and more: (Original post)
LBM20 Jun 2018 OP
C_U_L8R Jun 2018 #1
LBM20 Jun 2018 #2
C_U_L8R Jun 2018 #4
MFM008 Jun 2018 #3
murielm99 Jun 2018 #5
LBM20 Jun 2018 #6
murielm99 Jun 2018 #7
LBM20 Jun 2018 #8

Response to LBM20 (Original post)

Thu Jun 28, 2018, 02:53 PM

1. On your last point...

I hope to see everyone out marching this weekend to save the children from Trump.

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Response to C_U_L8R (Reply #1)

Thu Jun 28, 2018, 03:00 PM

2. I will be participating in the one closest to my town.


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Response to LBM20 (Reply #2)

Thu Jun 28, 2018, 03:03 PM

4. Me too !

I'm concerned that Trump stirred up a lot of mess
to diffuse the global outrage. I hope we have a
great loud showing.

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Response to LBM20 (Original post)

Thu Jun 28, 2018, 03:02 PM

3. The "S" crowds

Sarandon, Stein and Sanders voters
still had issues with HRC.
Many Sanders voters did vote gor HRC.
Thank you.
Others in the S.S.S had some
strange deluded idea that
Maggot would bring change.
How do you like your change?
How do you like the destruction of what democrats
Believe in piling up around your ankles.
Civil, individual rights down the crapper.
The US made a laughing stock
Because a Mussolini wanna be
Enjoys seeing our pain?
Hows that change coming.
For every one that voted for anyone
Other than HRC.
Drop dead.

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Response to LBM20 (Original post)

Thu Jun 28, 2018, 03:16 PM

5. Hillary did NOT run a B campaign.

Stop repeating that tired old propaganda. And she did too campaign in WI, MI, etc.

She did talk about economic interests and all of that was covered in her platform. The media chose to ignore it and concentrate on her emails.

She was the greatest candidate on the trail. She killed it in the debates. She was one of the most qualified and experienced candidates we have ever had.

Russian interference and Comey? Oh yeah. That....

I don't know where you are getting your information that we are out of touch and not speaking to the issues.

Look at today's news and events. We are out demonstrating.

We have plenty of balls. But we don't necessarily need balls. I see plenty of female candidates running circles around people with balls. Go criticize some Republicans and do some work for the party. In the meantime, your concern is duly noted.

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Response to murielm99 (Reply #5)

Thu Jun 28, 2018, 05:01 PM

6. I have worked for this party all my life and for christ sake learn what a metaphor is.


NO she did not campaign in MI and WI (or BARELY did) and it was not an A campaign so read my ENTIRE piece and don't give me this shit. If you think that was an A campaign you are in fantasy land. If you don't learn from mistakes you are NOWHERE.

Next, enough of your selective hearing. In my post I have SLAMMED the right wing and have advocated civil but TOUGH confrontation. I have also called Trump an idiot and said that anyone who didn't vote for Clinton is guilty of helping that scumbag get into office. I voted for her and donated to her. So again, enough of that.

And "balls" is a METAPHOR. Enough of the ultra politically correct nonsense. People are sick to death of that. Yes, I know some women with more "balls" than some men and have heard them say that they have "balls." It is a wonderful traditional metaphor.

I have not said we are all not speaking to the right issues, but too many are NOT. The message is fuzzy and flubbed and too metaphysical. Tell me, right now, with one short clear sentence what the Democratic Party is and what it stands for so that the average Joe and Jane on the street gets it simply and clearly, and then prove that is what ALL Dems are saying. Put 100 Republicans in a room and they can all articulate ONE message. Put 100 Dems in a room and you get ONE HUNDRED messages. We need to do better.

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Response to LBM20 (Reply #6)

Thu Jun 28, 2018, 09:04 PM

7. I know what a metaphor is.

I know that it is a shame that I have to defend Democrats on a board called the DEMOCRATIC Underground.

Bye bye.

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Response to murielm99 (Reply #7)

Fri Jun 29, 2018, 06:20 AM

8. I am not attacking any Dems. Enough of the selective hearing. Please stop it.


I am a loyal Dem and have been all my life. But if you don't open your eyes, see mistakes, and learn from them, you are doomed to repeat them.

I have said, crystal clear, that I voted for Hillary, donated to her, and I wanted her to win. And I have said that ANYONE who voted third party or didn't vote OWNS this mess as much as anyone. However, Clinton and her people also carry some blame because they should have run a better campaign. Not that their campaign was terrible as some have said, but it could have been better. Their main strategy was to turn out heavy moderate Indy and Republican women in the suburbs to support Hillary, and that was not enough. Yes, Trump needed to be attacked hard, but their own positive message around working and middle class bread and butter issues needed to be better presented and articulated. Not that she didn't talk about these because she did. But the Trump attacks were front and center and not the bread and butter issues and she just did not have the populist FIRE that she needed in this era. She has even acknowledged such mistakes.

And now, going forward, we need a very clear, short, strong, POPULIST message that FIRES UP our base, and our lackluster establishment needs to get fired up too. And we need strong campaigns and strong activism. In my view here is the right message: WE ARE TAKING BACK AMERICA FOR WORKING FAMILIES AND MAKING A GOVERNMENT THAT WORKS FOR EVERYONE EVERYWHERE WITH GOOD JOBS, GOOD WAGES, AFFORDABLE HEALTHCARE, AND GOOD EDUCATION FOR EVERYONE EVERYWHERE.

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