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Mon Jul 16, 2018, 10:54 AM

Indictments (Phase Two)

Last edited Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:51 AM - Edit history (1)

In my Saturday evening post, I focused upon some of the current and future results that are indicated by last week's indictments of 12 Russian military intelligence officers. Today, I'd like to look at those indictments' relationship to some past events. I suspect that a better understanding of the events of 2016 can help us better prepare for both the 2018 and 2020 elections.

Yesterday, Trump and some of his backers claimed this was “all Obama's fault.” It's safe to say that everything Trump and fiends say is a lie. But there is reason to look closer at what President Obama did in his confronting the situation. President Obama warned Putin to stop interfering with the elections. It's important to note how the Russians had infiltrated state and local voter rolls. It is reasonable to assume they had the capability to either remove Democrats from the rolls, or to “flip” votes.

At this point, one can only speculate how much damage the Russians may have already done. But what seems clearer is that the step taken by President Obama may have prevented further damage on election day. There are people who believe that President Obama should have done more to assist the Clinton campaign by publicly exposing the Russian operation. However, because it was an active counter-intelligence investigation, he did what he believed was the right thing. I think he did more than the public will ever know.

From the evidence available now, it is evident that the Russian-Trump operation is responsible for Trump's “victory” in 2016. Hence, while people can correctly note the roles that James Comey, Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, the Clinton and Sanders supporters, and the media played, none of these was in and of themselves the reason Trump “won.” Rather, the Russian-Trump operation exploited these, and the synergism dictated the election's outcome.

When we fully recognize this reality, it becomes clear that every time someone blames President Obama for not doing enough, Jim Comey for his October notification to Congress, claims Bernie would have defeated Trump, or points to errors in the Clinton campaign's top staff, it only exasperbates the situation. The focus must be on the Russian-Trump conspiracy, in order to best prevent future damage to the Democratic Party. In the words of the Civil Rights movement, we must keep our eyes on the prize.

Next, two things regarding Trump's meeting with Putin. As I noted yesterday while discussing this with “kentuck” on this forum, it was curious to hear people in the mainstream media ask if Trump would confront Putin on the indictments. The last time I heard a puppet talk back to a puppeteer was in the 1960s, on the Ed Sullivan Show. It's not like Trump was unaware that Putin was helping his campaign.

Finally, regarding if anyone will ever know what Trump and Putin discuss in private, it is important to remember that some of the evidence – in this case, actual recordings of Russian military intelligence officers' conversations about the hacking and distribution of e-mails – came from the intelligence offices of the nation where Trump and Putin are meeting.

Keep your eyes on the prize!
H2O Man

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Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 27 replies Author Time Post
Reply Indictments (Phase Two) (Original post)
H2O Man Jul 2018 OP
Zoonart Jul 2018 #1
H2O Man Jul 2018 #2
sellitman Jul 2018 #3
H2O Man Jul 2018 #5
malaise Jul 2018 #4
H2O Man Jul 2018 #7
Bernardo de La Paz Jul 2018 #6
H2O Man Jul 2018 #8
shraby Jul 2018 #9
H2O Man Jul 2018 #10
shraby Jul 2018 #13
H2O Man Jul 2018 #18
coeur_de_lion Jul 2018 #16
H2O Man Jul 2018 #17
coeur_de_lion Jul 2018 #21
H2O Man Jul 2018 #24
Maeve Jul 2018 #11
H2O Man Jul 2018 #12
spanone Jul 2018 #14
H2O Man Jul 2018 #15
kentuck Jul 2018 #19
H2O Man Jul 2018 #20
shraby Jul 2018 #22
H2O Man Jul 2018 #23
kentuck Jul 2018 #25
byronius Jul 2018 #26
ms liberty Jul 2018 #27

Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 10:58 AM

1. It had better be soon...

because I think we're at defconx1000. They are not even bothering to hide or obsure the treason.

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Response to Zoonart (Reply #1)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:00 AM

2. Right.

Today is a low point for our country. It's as if FDR openly sided with Hitler. Except Trump is far more like Adolph than is Putin.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #2)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:05 AM

3. That in itself is an amazing statement.

Just chewing on it is more than I could ever imagine.

Wow.

Thanks

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Response to sellitman (Reply #3)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:16 AM

5. It's fucking awful.

I view Trump within the context of sociopathy. Being a retired psychiatric social worker, that is how I can best understand his being and behaviors. And I have anticipated his going all out to destroy our constitutional democracy. Yet, even I am surprised that he would be so open about it today.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #2)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:08 AM

4. A very low point

Lock him up for the sake of our planet

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Response to malaise (Reply #4)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:21 AM

7. Lock him up!

It has been clear since he entered the republican primaries that Trump was running on the white nationalist ticket. Thus, he was supported by the world's leading white nationalist.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:18 AM

6. "my Saturday evening post"


You, sir, are a patriot.

"The focus must be on the Russian-Trump conspiracy". Correct.



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Response to Bernardo de La Paz (Reply #6)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:22 AM

8. Thanks!

I figured some of the older folks here would get my feeble attempt at humor!

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:37 AM

9. Regarding this statement

Finally, regarding if anyone will ever know what Trump and Putin discuss in private, it is important to remember that some of the evidence – in this case, actual recordings of Russian military intelligence officers' conversations about the hacking and distribution of e-mails – came from the intelligence offices of the nation where Trump and Putin are meeting.


You think that if the room was adequately bugged to get the intelligence officers conversations, that trump/putin conversation is now safely in Mueller's hands. Am I understanding this right?

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Response to shraby (Reply #9)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:40 AM

10. It will be

by this afternoon.

Mr. Mueller's opening of the sealed indictments on Friday was part of the on-going counter-intelligence operation. Reviewing the Trump-Putin private conversation is another important part. Mr. Mueller and the intelligence community will have the recordings.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #10)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 12:20 PM

13. I thought so. I was thinking there was no way they would let those two meet

and not know what was said. It is imperative to know.

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Response to shraby (Reply #13)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 01:16 PM

18. Right.

This is beyond unacceptable.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #10)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 12:47 PM

16. I was wondering the same thing

and hoping for the answer you gave.

But I would think Putin would anticipate that, as a former KGB officer.

Wouldn't he insist on conditions where he could not be recorded?

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Response to coeur_de_lion (Reply #16)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 01:16 PM

17. Putin is aware

of the likelihood of being listened in on. It won't be with his permission. So he will be cautious.

Trump is a flaming asshole. He will speak openly.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #17)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 01:30 PM

21. good point

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Response to coeur_de_lion (Reply #21)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 06:20 PM

24. Thank you.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:48 AM

11. kick for exposure! eom

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Response to Maeve (Reply #11)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 11:54 AM

12. Thank you!

Today is "a date that will live in infamy."

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 12:22 PM

14. K&R...

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Response to spanone (Reply #14)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 12:40 PM

15. Thanks, spanone.

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 01:19 PM

19. I would think the odds of him firing Rosenstein or Mueller have dropped drastically...

...since his televised betrayal?

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Response to kentuck (Reply #19)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 01:22 PM

20. I hope so.

But it's hard to say. He'll clearly do the most dangerous things .....anything to please Putin, and discredit Mr. Mueller and the intelligence community. And our country.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #20)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 01:37 PM

22. That should be the point where push comes to shove. I don't expect much from the

house republicans, but Mueller could drop a few indictments to push back with. Some we know he must be ready with and damning enough, but saving the last row of volleys to drive the stake home at the proper time.

We know he has interviewed everyone but Stone and Trump. He has all the information he needs right now.

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Response to shraby (Reply #22)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 01:51 PM

23. Right. Good point.

I believe that there are still some sealed indictments on file. They really should be unsealed today. And hopefully, the grand jury is going to issue some more this week. We are in a national emergency. Mr. Mueller should play that news conference for the grand jury.

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Response to H2O Man (Reply #20)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 06:50 PM

25. Yes, he will do anything to please Putin...

He's a master of distraction, so we will see what he does to change the subject??

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 07:04 PM

26. I agree with your assumption about flipping votes.

All of the Constantly Wrong pundits and commentators seem to be frantically leaning away from this obvious possibility, almost as if they are circling a black hole's event horizon and refusing to acknowledge its existence. It may not be provable; we should still act as if it was possible, and move to prevent such horrors from ever happening. Paper ballots, hand-counted -- if Canuckia can do it, so can we. And we need a seriously verifiable audit trail and recount capability.

Of course, none of this is supported by the GOP, who must continue to cheat to survive. Those pesky demographics...

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Response to H2O Man (Original post)

Mon Jul 16, 2018, 08:43 PM

27. K&R. If it was teevee, I'd be on the edge of my seat waiting for the next episode

As it is, I feel sick and angry. It's reassuring to read your OP and comments in this thread. Thanks, my friend.

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