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Tue Oct 2, 2018, 07:02 PM

Another jaw dropping revelation in the NYT bombshell. "Hobbesian"...I learned a new word!

"As the chip episode demonstrated, father and son were of one mind about rules and regulations, viewing them as annoyances to be finessed or, when necessary, ignored. As described by family members and associates in interviews and sworn testimony, theirs was an intimate, endless confederacy sealed by blood, shared secrets and a HOBBESIAN view of what it took to dominate and win.

They talked almost daily and saw each other most weekends. Donald Trump sat at his fatherís right hand at family meals and participated in his fatherís monthly strategy sessions with his closest advisers. Fred Trump was a silent, watchful presence at many of Donald Trumpís news conferences.

ďI probably knew my father as well or better than anybody,Ē Donald Trump said in a 2000 deposition.

They were both fluent in the language of half-truths and lies, interviews and records show. They both delighted in transgressing without getting caught. They were both wizards at manipulating the value of their assets, making them appear worth a lot or a little depending on their needs."

..............

Hobbesian

English philosopher and political theorist Thomas Hobbes, best known for his book Leviathan (1651), in which he argues that the only way to secure civil society is through universal submission to the absolute authority of a sovereign.

Hobbes′i∑an adj.

So not just Hitler, but Thomas Hobbes, not just Mien Kiempf, Leviathan.

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Reply Another jaw dropping revelation in the NYT bombshell. "Hobbesian"...I learned a new word! (Original post)
Fred Sanders Oct 2018 OP
marylandblue Oct 2018 #1
Fred Sanders Oct 2018 #2
marylandblue Oct 2018 #4
Fred Sanders Oct 2018 #5
C_U_L8R Oct 2018 #3
Wednesdays Oct 2018 #6
milestogo Oct 2018 #7

Response to Fred Sanders (Original post)

Tue Oct 2, 2018, 07:06 PM

1. A Hobbesian world is nasty, brutish and dog-eat-dog

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Response to marylandblue (Reply #1)

Tue Oct 2, 2018, 07:07 PM

2. The Trump cult are Hobbesians...explains a lot. Need to read that Thomas Hobbes book...know

the enemy and all that.

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Response to Fred Sanders (Reply #2)

Tue Oct 2, 2018, 07:17 PM

4. Philosophically, they are not followers of Hobbes

Hobbes viewed the Monarch as a benevolent dictator. They are followers of Carl Schmitt, who viewed political expediency as the only way to exercise power and liberal democracy was too slow and geared to compromise to be effective.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Schmitt

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Response to marylandblue (Reply #4)

Tue Oct 2, 2018, 07:22 PM

5. Thanks for that. I think Trump considers himself a benevolent wannabe dictator.

Carl Schmitt - "Crown jurist of the third Reich"

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Response to Fred Sanders (Original post)

Tue Oct 2, 2018, 07:17 PM

3. Leviathan

That describes Trump to a T.
A blathering orange leviathan.

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Response to Fred Sanders (Original post)

Tue Oct 2, 2018, 10:35 PM

6. Hobbes...

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Response to Fred Sanders (Original post)

Tue Oct 2, 2018, 10:38 PM

7. The best Hobbes quote:

"Whatsoever therefore is consequent to a time of Warre, where every man is Enemy to every man; the same is consequent to the time, wherein men live without other security, than what their own strength, and their own invention shall furnish them withall. In such condition, there is no place for Industry; because the fruit thereof is uncertain; and consequently no Culture of the Earth; no Navigation, nor use of the commodities that may be imported by Sea; no commodious Building; no Instruments of moving, and removing such things as require much force; no Knowledge of the face of the Earth; no account of Time; no Arts; no Letters; no Society; and which is worst of all, continuall feare, and danger of violent death; And the life of man, solitary, poore, nasty, brutish, and short."

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