The Mueller Report: Republicans in congress will be unable to deny, dismiss, look the other away.

[shockey80]

The Mueller Report will read like an indictment. An indictment so damning congress will have to act. The charges will be severe and the American people will learn the truth. The American people will be shocked and angered by the Mueller Report. The evidence will be overwhelming and foolproof.

Trumps base will not be able to protect him. The Supreme Court will not protect him. Roberts will do right. He will follow law.

If the Democrats take back the house they will do their duty after The Mueller Report comes out. They will vote to impeach. It then goes to the Senate and 2/3 of the Senate must vote to convict. Many people are saying that will never happen. I disagree, The evidence will be so clear they will be forced to convict. Not doing so would be political suicide.

That's how I see it. Only time will tell if I am right or wrong. First, we have to win back the house.

[UniteFightBack]

1. AGREED. Lay them out BARE. nt

[olegramps]

21. I will wait and see what develops.

[calimary]

59. Welcome to DU, UniteFightBack!

We are all waiting for all the findings to come out.

ANOTHER reason why I hope To GOD that we take back at least the House of Reps. THEN we can have some decent investigations, with teeth, that would follow up appropriately and vigorously on the report's results. If the GOP remains in control, that report will go nowhere, and nothing will be done to follow up on it, or launch investigations, or start working on holding these fiends accountable - from trump on down.

[dchill]

2. I'll have what you're having.

[irresistable]

3. What leads you to believe that Congress will even see "The Mueller Report"?

[jcgoldie]

4. I also hope...

That even if GOP controls the senate as is most likely, that they will see enough of a blue wave that they will be eager to cut ties with Trump prior to 2020.

[Scarsdale]

27. They can't!

The Russian money has implicated all of them. They eagerly accepted it, spent it, now they have to face the consequences. Ryan thinks he will escape by not running again, but he is in this DEEP. Traitors, all of them.

[lagomorph777]

57. Many top Russiapublicans will have starring roles in the Mueller report.

They're inextricably part of the plot. We, the American People, will have to save ourselves.

[Squinch]

5. I really hope you are right. But they sure are champions at denying, dismissing and looking away.

[NCjack]

6. I think that immediately Trump, McConnell and Ryan will attack Mueller and the report.

There will be civil violence.

[SayItLoud]

19. If the report is general in nature and

doesn't name names and support the naming with facts the RePUBICS will just keep on keeping on with hanRatty and Fuck News supporting the "flawed, biased" report. VOTE or we are fucked another 6 years....at least!

[Roadside Attraction]

32. I can hear it now:

"FAKE NEWS!!! SEVENTEEN ANGRY DEMOCRATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! FBI IS CORRUPT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "

Let's hope this is how it ends:

[wroberts189]

38. Great pic ..lol :)

[k8conant]

51. Arrested Devolvement!!!

[DFW]

7. Just watch them.

The more scathing the indictment of Republicans, the more they will deny, dismiss, and look the other way.

No elected (kinda, sorta) official THAT guilty pleads guilty right away. Not before plea bargains have even been on the table. Even Agnew got away with "nolo contendere" and resignation.

[Fiendish Thingy]

8. Sadly, many here at DU feel A Democractic Congress should not do its duty and impeach...

"Because we don't have the numbers in the Senate, so why bother?"

I agree with you Shockey, the Dem house should impeach because IT's THE RIGHT THING TO DO in defending the nation and the Constitution.

I also agree that the Meuller report could indeed make a case for impeachment so undeniable that enough Republicans would have to support it or face voter's wrath at the polls.

[Mr.Bill]

11. As soon as we take control of the house,

they should vote for his impeachment every day. Every. Fucking. Day.

[ChazInAz]

17. Until one of Congress people can stand on the floor and declare:

"Cartago delendum est."

[NurseJackie]

9. Fingers crossed!!

[GoCubsGo]

10. I look forward to seeing how many of them will be named in it, as well.

I'm betting there were be many.

[PatrickforO]

12. Join my name to the list of those who hope fervently that you are right.

Trump and his criminal gang represent everything bad, dark, evil about this country. A thoughtless, ignorant, racist, xenophobic, homophobic, learning-averse evil. Sociopathic capitalism, sociopathic government.

[bitterross]

13. And yet, the GOP will ignore it. They are now the The Enemy of the People

Sorry to be a downer. But they'll ignore it. They don't care. That is crystal clear.

If it says he killed babies with his bare hands for fun and sang praises to Satan at the same time they would still not care.

They are immoral, unethical, and void of any real humanity.

[FreepFryer]

14. It'd better be video or other viral-compatible form, bc many people won't read longform narrative.nt

[pdsimdars]

15. As they say, "Your lips to God's ears!"

[bucolic_frolic]

16. It will be the tip of the iceberg

much will be cleaned up quietly, with retirements, with quiet enforcement. I think it is a mistake to assume the OSC or the FBI will sign on to wholesale political upheaval or chaos. US political sovereignty will be a long term management through adjustment and nuance. Democrats, as officeholders, as incumbents, as part of a new Congress, don't need or want a bombshell dumped in their laps. They need to govern responsibly and help right our ship of State.

[not_the_one]

23. In other words, Democrats need to "make nice".

NO!

The people involved in the destruction of our country's very foundation must be held accountable.

The new members of Congress, especially, must demand it.

Back in the day, when politics was civil and polite (oh, I'd say ending with the installation of saint reagan), common courtesy may have been the way to go. But the reputins have made it crystal clear that AS LONG AS THEY CAN GET AWAY WITH IT THEY WILL CONTINUE. So we must face that reality and say No More.

They must realize that they are no longer dealing with a reluctant populace.

We are taking names, and are prepared to (politically) KICK ASS.

[bucolic_frolic]

24. That's not what I said

And if they go your way, be prepared to deal with the fallout - internationally, domestically, politically, regionally, financially, economically - as you prepare your voting record for re-election in 20 months. Chaos won't be popular.

[not_the_one]

30. I understood what you were saying,

I just don't think we have the luxury NOT treating this as the edge of the precipice that it is.

If he is not addressed in the election, and accountability is not addressed AFTER the election, I really don't think there will be a 2020 election.

I think that the fallout if we DON'T deal with it, means we will be living in a fascist state. That is unacceptable.

I know which one is more important to me.

[marylandblue]

33. We are indeed on the precipice, but backing away is not so simple

Millions of people are already primed to deny the contents of Mueller's report no matter what it says. We can investigate. We can protest. Hopefully we can convince them. But if we can't, and we probably won't, he won't be removed from office. Trump will continue to lie and divide people. Winning back the house won't save our democracy, it will just place it on life support. The next two years may be even harder and more divisive than the last two.

[SayItLoud]

18. First thing we have to do is VOTE.

[Chicagogrl1]

20. I 🙏 you are right

What i dont undetstand is why is Mueller’s report taking so long? I know he’s methodical, but peoples lives are hanging in the balance, literally! My bigest nightmare, is that this report is not enough to bring these traitors down. I am trying to be optimistic, but it is very hard. Almost every day, there is a crime committed by his brainwashed followers. It is truly s nightmare that i feel like i will not wake from.

[Jakes Progress]

22. That's what I tell myself too when I need to sleep.

On waking, I remember the awful villainy of elected republicans and the absolute stupidity of way too many people.

[czarjak]

25. You mean the long arm of the law is going to prevail?

Who knew?

[getagrip_already]

26. Clearly, you haven't been paying attention....

and are vastly underestimating their ability to deny facts.

Or did you miss the kavanaugh debacle?

The gop will never vote to convict in the senate. Unless we have 67 dems in the senate, tiny will finish out his term. Hell, he might stick around.

Don't put it past them.

[Thunderbeast]

28. I do not share your confidence

It assumes a Senate and Justice Department with a spine and willingness to sacrifice in the name of preserving the Constitution. I no longer make that assumption.

The GOP senators are sitting in red states with numeric advantages favoring the minority. They have NO motivation to push off their redneck voters and their aristocratic funding source. Said plainly, there is no way in hell that 67 senators will vote to convict even if he is impeached.

Evidence has been pre-tainted with the narrative of a corrupt witch hunt. For a year, attacks on the DOJ and the Special Prosecutor have been fixed in the brains of the ignorant deplorables. Nothing will change their minds.

We have had three years of prima facie evidence of Trumps corruption and incompetence. His followers don't give a crap about any of it as long as the liberals are complaining and white evangelicals are promised eternal levers of power.

Power only yields when forced. The current power structure will not go quietly. If a constitutional crisis is spawned, a radical Supreme Court will adjudicate.

Their goal is a permanent faciest theocracy where the preachers answer to the aristocracy. I just don't see this ending well.

[Honeycombe8]

29. I'm not convinced the Mueller Report will be what we think it will be. Or that we'll see it.

If we don't get back the House, at least.

We MUST get back the House!

[RHMerriman]

31. I expect so as well...

I expect so as well...

Few things worth pointing out:

1) Trump always folds when faced with a real threat; case in point is the $25 million settlement in the Trump U. case. Law had him dead to rights and he collapsed into a puddle.
2) Trump's absolute inability to see any human interaction as based on something more than money means he has no loyalty to those working for him, and they have no true loyalty to him as their leader. His own children will turn on him in heartbeat, when faced with the consequences of not doing so; so will everyone else.
3) No one is willing to die for Donald Trump, physically or politically, in any real sense, as witness how quickly everyone from Manafort to Gates to Flynn have rolled.
4) Trump is a tool for those who actually own the GOP (the major donors), and what they value above all else is stability; when the costs of keeping Trump on outweigh the benefits (and we're no more than 6-24 months from that, I'd estimate), they will throw him aside like last year's mistress and move on.
5) The best historical precedent is Watergate; there's a reason Nixon went quietly, in the end.

As a pretty wise Democratic leader once said: The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself.

Keep fighting, keep the faith, and don't start believing the bullshit - especially from the doom and gloom types, whether sincere or simply provocateurs. Much of this is PsyOPs 101; don't fall for it.

Go volunteer at a campaign office, donate money, make calls, write letters to the editor, show up at public meetings and make your positions clear at public comment time, etc.

Don't mourn, organize!

[marylandblue]

35. This isn't Watergate, there is no American precedent for this

The best examples are from other countries, where democracies were destroyed by elected leaders from within. First the power elites legitimize an unfit leader they think they can "control." Then that leader proves he is really in charge by radicalizing the political base. The elites realize they are no longer in charge, but they do not turn against the leader because he still gives them what they really want. The only hope at that point is the opposition unites and takes back power. That's why this election is so important.

Are there even enough people who WANT to preserve democracy? There may not be. Even with the high interest in the election this year, 40% of the people won't vote. Of the ones who do vote, close to half will vote for fascism. They may not realize that they are doing it. Or they may realize, but think it's okay as long as their side is in charge.

[RHMerriman]

36. Agree this election is so important, but:

a) it's exactly like Watergate, except Nixon was smarter than Trump and he still ended up resigning in disgrace and pissing his pants; and
b) you may wish to read up a little more on the Buchanan Administration, who Buchanan's secretary of war was, and what that individual was doing in the years prior to the 1860 election and Lincoln's swearing in... and where that same individual ended up in 1861-65.

Historical perspective is a useful thing.

[marylandblue]

39. You should read "How Democracies Die."

Lot's of history in it. We shouldn't just be looking at our own history when other countries may provide better examples.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/can-american-democracy-withstand-its-latest-assault/2018/01/10/7d364894-f487-11e7-beb6-c8d48830c54d_story.html?utm_term=.d3d7d5edf068

[RHMerriman]

40. With all due respect, none of the democracies that Levitsky and Ziblatt cite are remotely comparable

With all due respect, none of the democracies that Levitsky and Ziblatt cite as examples are remotely comparable to the United States in terms of federalism, longevity, peaceful transfers of power, or civil society.

And the above is not American exceptionalism, it is simple historical fact.

[marylandblue]

43. You take a very narrow view of history

Authoritarianism is rising all over the world. It has happened before. We are not immune. No system can be designed to last for ever. And ours is old and creaky.

[RHMerriman]

44. Old and creaky, by definition, means it has survived.

Old and creaky, however - by definition - means it has survived.

American democracy, however flawed, has survived for more than 200 years, including the crises of the Eighteenth and Nineteenth centuries that led to the Civil War.

None of the case studies cited by Levitsky and Ziblatt compare. Frankly, comparing democracy and civil society in the US to "Venezuela, Georgia, Hungary, Nicaragua, Peru, the Philippines, Poland, Russia, Sri Lanka, Turkey, and Ukraine," is ridiculous.

[marylandblue]

45. The Roman Republic survived 500 years but it got old and creaky too

They didn't even know what was wrong. They though Caesar was the problem, so they killed him. But he was just a symptom. Just like think Trump is the problem.

[RHMerriman]

46. None of which has anything to do with the case Levitsky and Ziblatt try and make, but

None of which has anything to do with the case Levitsky and Ziblatt try and make, but okay.

The US has many problems. The Trump Administration is the biggest one, currently; let's solve that problem first.

[marylandblue]

47. It has to with my case, that this isn't Watergate and it isn't the Civil War

It isn't like anything in American history. Merely being old is no particular advantage. And the case Levitsky and Ziblatt make is that our institutions can only take so much before breaking. It's adherence to democratic norms that make a republic work, not the structure of the Constitution. In Watergate, those norms remained intact. Once all the facts came out about Nixon, there was no question that Congress would remove him from office. Nixon tried to subvert the special prosecutor and failed. He tried to shield evidence but obeyed the court. As more evidence came out about crimes, Nixon's popularity plummeted.

Look what's happening now. 40% of the people support him no matter what. Neither the Senate nor the House has made any serious investigation. If Mueller subpoenas Trump, will the current SCOTUS enforce the subpoena? If it does, and Trump refuses to obey the subpoena, will Congress be able to force him? If the House impeaches Trump based on overwhelming evidence, will the Senate even consider removing him from office? If Trump starts ordering his followers to commit violence, do you think they won't do it? Will any Republican hold him to account? Will any Democrat be in a position to do so?

In a functioning democracy, these wouldn't even be questions. They weren't questions in Watergate.

This isn't like the Civil War either. There isn't going to be a civil war this time. There may be civil unrest and violence, but we won't have an actual war. Either Trump becomes a dictator and half the nation applauds or shrugs, or democracy remains and the other half of the nation applauds. But we'll still have half the nation looking for another, better Trump.

[RHMerriman]

48. And if that's your case, then I can only say:

Lack of foundation, counselor.

One can go by the lessons or history in THIS country, or one can imagine all sorts of fiction based on what's happened elsewhere... I prefer facts in evidence, and given I lived through Watergate, it seems somewhat more on point than the Ides of March, much less what's happened in a bunch of developing countries with no significant tradition of democratic self-governance.

As far as Nixon goes, his approval ratings were at 48 percent the month before the hearings began; Trump's are at 38 percent today, without the results of the Mueller investigation or the mid-terms, much less serious hearings. As far as your questions go:

1) SCOTUS. Yes, the Court will enforce a subpeona, even with Kavanaugh. None of them will go down with Trump's ship, from simple self-interest, if nothing else.
2) Will Congress enfore? Yes, same reason as above.
3) If the House impeaches, will the Senate move to remove him? Yes. Self-interest trumps all.
4) If Trump orders his followers to commit violence, they will laugh at him and change the channel. These yahoos are not the SS; hell, they're not even the Klan. On their "best" worst day, they are the Branch Davidians, maybe the Order or SLA. Any that cross the line will be met with deadly force, and they will die quickly.
5) Will Republicans hold him to account? Yes, for the same reason Goldwater, Rhodes et al told Nixon to scram.
6) Will any Democrat be in a position to do so? Yes.

Here's some evidence; perhaps you should consider it:

]

[lancelyons]

34. If we dont take the house then the GOP will just bury the report.

This is part of why Dems need to take the house.

[wroberts189]

37. Lock him up !! :) n/t

[Bettie]

41. I suspect that you overestimate the

capacity for reason of our Right Wing "friends"...and underestimate their baseness, their craven disregard for anything except their quest for more money in their own pockets.

[VOX]

42. Doubtful, unless Republicans suddenly develop a conscience and a healthy sense of shame.

Which I wouldn’t bet on. Mueller’s efforts aside, there are already countless obvious and sound reasons why Trump is thoroughly unfit to lead anything, let alone serve as president.

But Republicans have quickly grown quite comfortable with being top dogs in a fascist regime. Their billionaire donors are giddy, and major corporate entities are now unregulated. There are a large number of individuals who appear to be gleefully done with the idea of living in a liberal democracy.

Even if Mueller’s report is utterly damning, it will be treated as a partisan attack from the left. There is no evidence that it will be viewed otherwise. Republicans will fight it, claim that leftists are destroying America, and then they’ll stall, ignore, falsify and finally retaliate in the courts, where they are now positioned to win without effort.

All of which is why Democrats, liberals, progressives, disaffected Republicans, and anyone who’s had enough of this waking nightmare of a shit-show, all need to get to the polls and VOTE as if life itself depends on it, because it does.

[calimary]

49. We just have to hope the Dems take back the House.

At least we’ll have the legitimate investigations we need to expose all the trump crimes.

Even if there’s ultimately an impeachment in the House but no conviction in the Senate, there’d still be the impeachment. The impeachment would still stand. On that miscreant’s record for all of history. Impeachment was left a tawdry joke by the GOP desperate to leave a mark on President Clinton since they’d failed to beat him or otherwise get rid of him. Impeachment should mean something. It should be a serious penalty instead of the glorified peep show that the CONS turned it into.

I believe Robert Mueller will turn up some damning stuff - in real crimes. High crimes and misdemeanors ranging from fraud, perjury, and tax evasion to outright fraternizing with the enemy. Should we just let that go? Shrug it off? Let him get away with it? NOT holding him accountable for credible, provable felonies that would send any other offender up the river for years? No consequences?

What kind of message would that send? What’s the lesson? What’s the takeaway that goes into the history books? That the president IS above the law after all? That crime DOES pay?

Sure doesn’t sound like that “liberty and justice for all” stuff I learned about in school.

[ck4829]

50. Kick

[beachbum bob]

52. republicans in congress can ALWAYS deny, dismiss. look away....been doing it for 100 years

[no_hypocrisy]

53. IOW: You bought him, you own him.

[avebury]

54. The Rethugs will look for a way to bury the report. nt

[Firestorm49]

55. That is, IF we are privileged enough to even see, hear, or read the results.

You now damn sure that the cowardly power mongers will do whatever it takes to obscure the report.

[Catherine Vincent]

56. Well, we all have to keep in mind that it is only a report

That's about all Mueller can do.

[pangaia]

58. Good luck with that....

If you are right I will buy you dinner at a restaurant of your choosing- anywhere in the world.