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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhich Trump voters should the Democrats reach out to?
Last edited Sun Nov 11, 2018, 07:01 PM - Edit history (1)
Alex Witt just asked Congressperson Debbie Dingell how Democrats can reach out to Trump voters.
If I were a guest, I would ask Alex Witt the obvious question, which is, exactly which Trump voters should we reach out to?
Should we reach out to the actual Nazis?
Should we reach out to the Proud Boys?
Should we reach out to the KKK members?
Should we reach out to the Kris Kobachs, and the Brian Kemps who do everything they can to to prevent non-white voters from actually voting?
Should we reach out to the Paul Ryans, and the Mitch McConnells who ignore Trump's brutal racism as long as Trump serves as the useful idiot while the GOP remakes America into a plantation economy?
W_HAMILTON
(7,835 posts)Do they ever ask the Republicans what Democrats they should reach out to?
Do they ever ask the Republicans how they can reach out to urban voters?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)The media acts as if 90% of America is rural.
99% of the land is rural, but most Americans live in urban areas.
INdemo
(6,994 posts)Trumps supporters would support Putin rather than vote for Liberals
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)And that is frightening.
exboyfil
(17,862 posts)and he won.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)GOP voters tolerate Nazis, and sometimes, they vote for them.
INdemo
(6,994 posts)That is very scary..
as in 3rd District Illinois?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)blueinredohio
(6,797 posts)dem4decades
(11,269 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)And she can do better.
BigMin28
(1,174 posts)nt
rzemanfl
(29,554 posts)Or maybe just fuck them too but set the horses they rode in on free? It's a conundrum.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Motivate voters who rarely vote with a message of hope.
The harder part is to accomplish it.
rzemanfl
(29,554 posts)Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Arkansas Granny
(31,506 posts)If they are still supporting Trump, they are not likely to listen to any Democratic ideas. They might come around on their own, but I think pursuing them is a hopeless task.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)are too uninformed.
we can do it
(12,169 posts)ooky
(8,906 posts)We govern for all people and need to keep our focus on that. I personally don't give a shit about any of the things I hear Republicans routinely talk about.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)The GOP never reaches out when they cheat and win.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)It's Dems who battled massive voter suppression and turned out by the millions to stop the insanity.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)The GOP always has a mandate.
brush
(53,740 posts)Hayduke Bomgarte
(1,965 posts)The ones with the mental capacity to listen to, and learn from reason... So, none.
Aristus
(66,286 posts)I'm content to wait until they die off.
Granted, they pass their fecklessness on to their brainless broods. But fortunately, like the rest of us, they're having fewer kids. A large family once meant free farm hands. Now it's just more diapers, a bigger grocery bill, and a crowded tarpaper shack.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)We should continue to focus on bread and butter issues - jobs, $15 minimum wage, infrastructure, more healthcare.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)We need to be specific, and we need to pressure our representatives to get it done.
And if the GOP controlled Senate refuses to do anything, we need to be in the streets and in the offices of GOP politicians.
Response to marylandblue (Reply #17)
Name removed Message auto-removed
vi5
(13,305 posts)...Anyone who suggests in any way, at any point moving forward that we reach out to anyone who still considers themselves a Republican in 2018 and forward does not have our best interest at heart.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)The fiction that truth and lies are simply 2 separate and valid points of view.
Paladin
(28,243 posts)meadowlander
(4,388 posts)and voted for Trump because the only thing they know about him is that "he's a successful businessman".
There's also the odd old-school Republican who voted for him out of pure economic self-interest who can be convinced that the kind of instability he brings won't be good for the market long term.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Educate the uninformed and appeal to the greedy.
Power 2 the People
(2,437 posts)octoberlib
(14,971 posts)libdem4life
(13,877 posts)or join the host of new and newly empowered voters...the young, the moderates, racial minorities and the women...many of whom have already racked up surprise victories. Spend our time and political capitol on massive training and information programs. Forget the Tea Party Republicans. Those ready to leave will do so based on results...that we are seeing just in this midterm.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)and we are the iceberg.
But I loved your answer.
question everything
(47,431 posts)They have their reasons not to vote for Democrats, yes, many cannot stand Hillary; many Democrats too.
As we've heard before, even the ones who want to flip the House and the Senate, they do like their own member of Congress.
For many the Democrats have moved too much to the left. (Yes, on DU this is a plus, not necessarily for the whole country).
Many hope that at some point the Republican party will return to its roots of free market and less regulations.
And they feel justified with the increase of the stock market - more or less - and with cutting taxes. They also like a strong military.
I was a bit angry with all of a sudden health care, "pre-exisitng" conditions, being on the voters' mind. Where were you in 2010? And 2012, 2014 and 2016? All of a sudden, many (women, mostly) who voted for Trump realized how much they were dependent on the ACA and joined the march on D.C after the 2016 elections.
As for having "more dollars in their pockets" - do they follow their expenses? Out grocery expenses that have been stable are now up. Medicine is going up and here goes the "extra money in the pocket."
Yes, many Republicans were lamenting that Trump did not campaign on the economy but the "economy" has many sides.
We have to talk about kitchen table issues. About cost of everything, about access to affordable health care and forget the divisive issues including, yes, identity politics. Talk about the future, of education, of secure retirements, safe guarding Social Security and Medicare, of safe roads and bridges and the air that we breath. Even talk about immigrants that fills many positions in nursing homes, in the fields, in many restaurants.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)But in the Illinois 3rd Congressional District, 56,000 GOP voters voted for an actual Nazi.
question everything
(47,431 posts)There are many, too many, who do not bother to think of the common good. They certainly want to cut social services to "not us" while enjoying their own.
If our civilization will ever disappear it will be because of Social Media. There have always been people on the fringe with ideas vary from "eccentric" to totally crazy. Of more than 300 million, of course. But Social Media and the twittermonger got them out in public. Now it is OK to express and act upon their lunacy. Unfortunately, our "leader" instead of trying to unite us just flames the feelings.
I don't think that impeachment is the way to go - we don't have the senate votes - but I really think he should stand trial for endangering our national security, for inciting violence.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)This is not a fringe, it is the GOP. The GOP is comfortable with Nazis.
violetpastille
(1,483 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)Last edited Sun Nov 11, 2018, 05:42 PM - Edit history (1)
Instead of focusing on who has what privilege. The language of privilege divides us into little groups that compete for crumbs. But the language of rights and opportunities pulls us together to care of each other. And it goes all the way back to the Declaration of Independence so it is grounded in our historical DNA.
violetpastille
(1,483 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)The connection between ERA and the daily life of average Americans isn't clear enough, and arguments about it can quickly get lost in the weeds, like it did last time we tried with ERA. It would be good if we could get it through though.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)question everything
(47,431 posts)'Live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
After the 2016 elections, when "pundits" suggested candidates to lead the DNC, Ellison's name was mentioned because he was (still is, of course) "Black and Muslim." He has never represented me, but I was hoping that he had, still has, many qualities that supported his candidacy.
After Franken resigned, many locals suggested Ilham Omar - now Congresswoman elect - because she was (still is) a woman, Muslim, Somali... She was freshmen member of the House, had not much of a resume but her identity was enough.
Yes, I realize that such "identities" have contributed to our win five days ago, but I cringe.
And many Republicans, rural, lower class, have used our tilt toward "identity politics" where they could not fit into any, as a reason to abandon us.
violetpastille
(1,483 posts)I know this to be true. Our President knew what he was doing in 1965 when he let the Dixiecrats go with the Voting Rights Act.
I guess what I don't get is it "identity politics" when we say that we should run muslims and not "identity politics" when we say we need to be safe and run white males?
I'm not trying to be cute or lay a trap. I really don't know what "identity politics" are in the concrete.
question everything
(47,431 posts)but I want to vote for someone because of his or her skills, track record, ideas that can work and opened to debates and listen to opposing ideas.
In recent weeks, thanks to Trump, I think, I have seen the term "tribalism." And I think "identity politics" means that we vote for someone because of what he or she is, not because of who they are.
Of course, we always voted for a neighbor, or someone form our church, or who was recommended by a neighbor or our pastor. And this has been the reason for some of the affirmative actions: to remove barriers for a non-tribe person to reach the positions of power.
But perhaps we can find additional traits that merit the elevation of this person beyond "he or she is a Muslim," or "he or she is Native American?"
I hope. I think that this can help us reach some of Trump supporters. We have, to, really.
NRaleighLiberal
(60,006 posts)dembotoz
(16,785 posts)Can't wall these areas off
Gotta convert some somehow
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)We can talk about economic issues, and talk about how terrible the actual economy is.
dembotoz
(16,785 posts)Trouble is they hurt others too.
Perhaps when farmers start going bankrupt due to Trump tariffs
Or SOC sec is noticably cut
Or a gargantuan ecological disaster like love canal on a grand stage
ismnotwasm
(41,965 posts)I am for making voting a fair process and finding out whats in the minds of non-voters.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)andym
(5,443 posts)shanny
(6,709 posts)obnoxiousdrunk
(2,909 posts)For Trump too.
Zambero
(8,962 posts)And no doubt many will. A sudden bolt of self-validated truth and reason works wonders. My first-ever vote was enthusiastically cast for Ronald Reagan in 1970 when he ran for a second term as CA governor. By late 1971 I had became a Democrat. Before then I stood my conservative ground in any argument. When I finally switched, nobody needed to persuade me, once a difference between partisan talking points and objective reality was established. The extremist Trumpites are baked in , and cannot be reached out to. And hopefully some of them will change as well, although it will be in dribs and drabs.
JHan
(10,173 posts)to be an actual fucking President and reach out to ALL people. That's what leaders ought to do, it is not enough to say that "he's just playing to his base" as if that's his right. The ONLY thing they should be talking about is how he is not interested in being an actual leader of America. Instead we get these shit ass questions about what dems are doing to reach out Trump voters.
Same shit over and over.
I Swear some of these people just try to cover for relatives they know who voted Trump and still support him.
No matter what he did, the media called it Reagan being Reagan.
And Reagan was a racist white man. That was the core of his appeal to all of the racist whites who voted for him.
Trump is Reagan without the veneer of politeness.
JHan
(10,173 posts)They liked to talk about Clinton Presidential Scandals, the Reagan scandals were SHOCKING.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)He won because Bush Senior committed treason by dealing with the Iranians.
And the media ignored that as well, calling the election results a mandate for change.
Drives me crazy they let him dictate the narrative and focus on that.
roamer65
(36,744 posts)MI-06 and MI-08. We need to get really good candidates for 2020 who address bread and butter issues in those districts.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Politics is local, and Democratic success in 2018 was the result of local organization.
LovingA2andMI
(7,006 posts)On the Congressional Front come January 2019, which is the best it has been in many years. As for more possible pickups, let's wait for the new Independent Redistricting Commission to see if another district can be drawn with enough of a toss up to give the Democrats a possible pick up. For instance, Grand Rapids, Muskegon if drew right could do such, as well a redrawning MI - 7 to cut its reach into Livingston County to half.
lunasun
(21,646 posts)broken.
Recently turned RW on campus away from sensible families and educated and young maybe will listen or reconsider
. Remember more white millennial voted for trump in 16 than Clinton . These students in the next gen after millennial may change the white vote majority if enlightened
POC trumpers of any age, who can look past religion or economics to see the destruction he brings to the country as a whole.
One issue voters perhaps
other trump voters ? Maybe the wealthy trumpers if they can find a heart from talking to others but
I don't see it unless they have already woke and rejected RW and trump which is possible and then they are not the ones needing to change anyway they would start to lean dem on their own.
Do any trumpers want to be talked to ?
You can't force hearts and minds .
Others have already captured them so they are not blank slates if already trump fans
bitterross
(4,066 posts)They don't care about facts or reality.
Rizen
(707 posts)we'd only turn away liberals by reaching out to them.
mahina
(17,615 posts)Otherwise its a losing strategy.
The aggressor defines the context of the battle.
Its foolish to passively let them set the issues that define us.
randr
(12,409 posts)Maybe if I had a cult recovery camp I may accept them for reentry
fmdaddio
(192 posts)They are the smartest of the bunch and they aren't angry all the time. As far as I know.
shanny
(6,709 posts)John Fante
(3,479 posts)Gump actually got a smaller share of the electorate than Romney. His total vote was less than one million more than Mitten's.
shanny
(6,709 posts)PUMAs were actually a thing, y'know?
Anyway, you don't have to take my word for it: http://www.centerforpolitics.org/crystalball/articles/just-how-many-obama-2012-trump-2016-voters-were-there/
John Fante
(3,479 posts)The disgruntled Obama voter who switched to Trump wasn't any more sizeable than the "walk away" movement was. Or the Never Trump movement.
The study you linked to is flawed at best:
shanny
(6,709 posts)there were three studies.
g'night
mahina
(17,615 posts)Thats a big question. Those good people who are just being lied to and know no better.
ret5hd
(20,482 posts)it's time to realize you are a nazi.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)ret5hd
(20,482 posts)If you say "Well, I don't necessarily agree with all that other stuff, but I'm voting for 'em 'cause they make the trains run on time"...well, you're a nazi.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)so much that you are willing to overlook that the person running the train is a Nazi. You can tell the difference by delivering an even better train schedule. That person will choose the better train schedule over the Nazi policies whereas the actual Nazi doesn't care about the trains and will remain a Nazi.
ret5hd
(20,482 posts)marylandblue
(12,344 posts)A Nazi is not someone who thinks trains schedules are more important than human life. A Nazi is someone who thinks the most important thing is to kill racial inferiors.
Or turn it around a bit. I am an environmentalist. I think the most important thing is to fight climate change. I am not a socialist. But I am willing to ally with socialists who fight climate change. Allying with socialists to get what I really want doesn't make me a socialist.
spooky3
(34,403 posts)to every demographic they have lost, i.e., EVERYONE except older, less well-educated white males?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)CrispyQ
(36,421 posts)Reach out to the non-voters or the new voters. Make sure they show up again.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)True_Blue
(3,063 posts)We did just fine in midterms without them. In fact, here in AZ we're about to get our first Democratic Senator in 30 yrs. We just need to quit letting them steal elections.
demmiblue
(36,823 posts)In 2008, Obama won by a landslide here (+16%).
Gretchen Whitmer knew this and won the governorship by addressing issues that all Michiganders face (infrastructure, education, healthcare, etc.).
lancelyons
(988 posts)We should have a plan to get into the rural states.
IronLionZion
(45,380 posts)anyone who has ever split their votes across party lines could be won over
John Fante
(3,479 posts)election was 2008, and we didn't need a badly mismanaged war or deep recession to bring them out. Trump's loathsomeness was more than enough.
There is no reason to appeal to Trump voters. Fuck them. If the Democrats present themselves as the antithesis of Trumpism (which they are) they'll repair the Blue Wall in Michigan/Wisconsin/Pennsylvania, hold Colorado/Nevada/Virginia, and comfortably win the 2020 election.
LovingA2andMI
(7,006 posts)N/T...
Mike Nelson
(9,944 posts)
None from those groups. It is a wasted effort... However... I do think there are some Trump voters that could be reached. Those voters don't watch cable news shows and/or read the NYT every day... they work most of the time. They may have voted for Clinton and/or Obama. They were hurting financially, worried about health care, and don't follow politics closely... They voted to "shake up the system." Those voters can be reached.
elleng
(130,727 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)It was on the Alex Witt show around 11am CST.
My apologies.
Algernon Moncrieff
(5,781 posts)Black Lives Matter co-founder Patrisse Cullors spoke for many women of color when she called upon white women angry about Trumps election to focus on their sisters. She said they need to figure out how to win them over. Its hard labor organizing people, and black people shouldnt be the only ones doing it.
...
Jackie Payne is trying to answer that question. Payne is a longtime activist who struggled with whether, and how, to engage persuadable white women who supported Trump. She wanted to do it in an authentic way that took them seriously, yet didnt betray her racial justice roots. Her first step was to bring other interested women together to found GALvanize USA, an organization focused on persuading more white women to make common cause with the progressive base on Election Day.
The group has been conducting research and testing strategies in four key states: Maine, Michigan, Washington and Iowa. Their work wont have much impact in the 2018 election cycle but they hope to learn enough lessons this year and next to move some of these voters in the 2020 presidential cycle.
violetpastille
(1,483 posts)A simply stated article and I got a lot from it.
Tried to look at the comments below and... yikes.
The words "cruddy underbelly" spring to mind.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)Our party won so convincingly on Tuesday (except blood red states, one where republicans cheated, and Florida, which is Florida) because a lot of those people voted for our candidates. I say keep them in the fold, our candidates ran on progressive issues.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)but reaching them requires dialogue and access.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)And expanding access to it is a sub-issue. Medicare for all trades on a familiar name.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)have a large number of democrats or have democratic control must keep legislating improvements to healthcare access and costs. If voters view republicans as roadblocks to affordable, accessible healthcare, republicans are screwed in 2020. Mitch McConnell seems to realize that, even beyond that he is up for reelection in 2020.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)So rather than change their position, they lied about it and hoped that their voters would be uninformed enough to buy the lie.
tinrobot
(10,885 posts)All we need to do is make sure our side votes.
Small-Axe
(359 posts)white voters who are uncomfortable voting for black candidates, economic nationalists, anti-traders, those who'd put the white working class ahead of minorities and women, and pro-gun types.
Is he on the right track here?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)Welcome to DU.
Small-Axe
(359 posts)1) He says those whites who are not comfortable voting for black candidates are not racist?
2) That he opposes trade deals like the TPP?
3) That he seems to place economic issues (class warfare) over what is disparaged as "identity politics."
4) That he has a cozy relationship with the NRA and is seen as pro-gun?
Which part did I get wrong?
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)2) many progressives oppose the TPP.
3) He does focus on economic issues and class-based analysis. In my view, he failed to see that structural racism is the foundation of US capitalism.
4) He is pro-gun in the sense that he does not support a ban on firearms.
But on the actual subject of this post, the question of reaching out to Trump voters, what is your opinion?
Small-Axe
(359 posts)2) We may not agree on who are (and are not) progressives.
3) We agree here. How he could get this wrong is unfathomable to me and most Democrats.
4) I think you understate his cozy relationship with the NRA and arms manufacturers.
I think we can reach many (most) of the Trump voters who previously voted for Barack Obama by adopting programs that they see leading to job growth and economic expansion.
doc03
(35,295 posts)prove otherwise they call it "fake news".
Stellar
(5,644 posts)we should reach out to those constituents on the right by first saying, we're going too far to the left.
What the hell is too far to the left, anyway?
I think those constituents on the right are already batsh!t crazy, So Dems gotta go a little crazy to reach them? Why is it that I never hear about those on the right reaching out to constituents on the left?
Who wants a middle of the road contender for office. Well, at least I know that I don't.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)is always the Democrats moving to the right to meet the GOP. And the GOP is steadily moving farther to the right.
Stellar
(5,644 posts)I think we're losing those people that are not going more Liberal anyway.
Liberty Belle
(9,533 posts)small business owners - many voted for him for economic reasons but don't like the racism and other insanity
farmers/rural voters - same argument
women on the misogynist crap
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)As was his blatant misogyny.
As was his racism.
stopbush
(24,392 posts)because WE are on the right side of justice and history.
So, yeah, fuck em all.
brooklynite
(94,333 posts)It's easy (and lazy) to slap every Trump voter with the label of "nazi", "KKK", Bible Thumper, etc. It ignores the real world facts: that a not insignificant number of Trump voters were previously Obama voters, and that between the Trump Base and the Democratic voters is 5-10% of the electorate who voted for Trump because they thought that politicians in both Parties weren't addressing your needs. But perhaps winning elections isn't as important to you.
guillaumeb
(42,641 posts)But there is a reason that Nazis and KKK members are apart of the GOP big tent.
Downtown Hound
(12,618 posts)We should bring new voters into the fold, not waste our time with the Thugee Cult.
Johnny2X2X
(18,969 posts)Fuck reaching out to them, Dems need to see what will depress them into staying home in 202.
njhoneybadger
(3,910 posts)Jim Lane
(11,175 posts)These groups would overlap, of course.
Both Obama and Trump benefited from the general "throw the rascals out" idea and, more specifically, from promising change to people who felt that the system wasn't working for them. In 2020, the GOP will be the rascals, and people will have seen that Republicans are the tools of the elite, not the champions of the 99%. (Yes, that should have been clear before, but some people who missed it before will now see it.)
Bear in mind that one of Trump's campaign promises was to provide better health care for all at less cost. That's a popular plank. Single payer can actually deliver on that.
Now let me address the delicate subject of Hillary Clinton. It's delicate because so many people on DU idolize her, consider her the most qualified candidate in the country's history, etc. I'm not asking you to abandon those beliefs, but simply to recognize that they're not universally shared. She had the highest "Unfavorable" rating of any Democratic nominee in the modern history of polling. There were a lot of people who disliked Trump, but who voted for him because they disliked Clinton even more.
I believe her when she says she won't run again. There are some Trump voters whom we can win over simply by running just about anyone else.
The alternative strategy championed by many in this thread is, apparently, that we'll start the campaign by spotting the Republicans more than 60 million votes. I say that's ludicrous. Yes, register new voters, yes, press progressive policies that will make people's lives better, yes, strive for an honest count -- but none of those is inconsistent with trying to win over at least some of the Trump voters.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)We shouldn't be derailed by the fallacious implication that we can only try to convert all Nazis with a wave of a wand.
All we need to do is convert a handful, peel off a few from voting R, and make a bunch of them waver a bit. American politics is so polarized that we are playing, at the moment, only for the several percent of possible voters who are undecided, plus some at the edge of the neocon movement.
People tend to vote their values rather than their interests, but that's only a strong tendency. We can and will shake some Nazis loose by making clear cases for an agenda that benefits them in concrete ways. People gotta eat, gotta sleep, and gotta work. That means reaching them is possible. We already do, and we will continue.
dansolo
(5,376 posts)That election shows that the Democrats reached quite a bit of Trump voters. The key is to keep reaching out to the non-voters.
ck4829
(35,038 posts)and more.
lark
(23,061 posts)Anyone who truly likes him is beyond help and is either a -
Nazi
KKK
White Nationalist
rich fuck without a conscience
irredeemable idiot
Only those who have a brain are worth bothering with, they already know they fucked up and lots of them voted Dem this year. A good friend of my husbands who was a LT. in the military is one who voted for him out of ignorance, is really sorry, and voted for both Gillum & Nelson because he knows things have to change. He will vote against drumpf next year unless it's Bernie and then he won't vote president at all because he won't vote for a socialist. He says he will vote for any other Democrat running against drumpf.
Basic LA
(2,035 posts)Those are hard-won Democratic paid-benefits that their beloved R's have tried to kill since day one (1935 & 1965 respectively). Surely we can unite behind saving & improving Social Security & Medicare.
dlk
(11,512 posts)The long-term hate propaganda campaign has done significant damage to the electorate and will be a long-term project to address; as it involves cognitive psychology and neuroplasticity. When something repeated often enough, the brain begins to accept and believe it, even when it is a complete fiction. Unlearning information takes a concentrated effort over time.
Given Millennials are the largest group of eligible voters, it makes more sense to focus on getting them registered and out to vote. We can also focus our time and attention on addressing the hate media problem in our country. However, it will take decades, if ever, to undo the damage.