AP FACT CHECK: Trump's misinformation on appeals court

[billh58]

Betraying no trust in an independent judiciary, President Donald Trump is using a federal appeals court in San Francisco as a punching bag for his frustrations about not getting his way on border security. He's spreading misinformation in the process and appearing to misunderstand how appeals work.

Trump drew an unusual rebuke from the Supreme Court's chief justice, John Roberts, earlier in the week after the president assailed the judge who rejected his migrant asylum policy as an "Obama judge." Roberts rejected the insinuation that judges are beholden to the presidents who nominate them.

TRUMP: "Justice Roberts can say what he wants, but the 9th Circuit is a complete & total disaster. It is out of control, has a horrible reputation, is overturned more than any Circuit in the Country, 79%, & is used to get an almost guaranteed result."

THE FACTS: Trump is wrong in suggesting that rulings by the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals are reversed by the Supreme Court more frequently than those of any other federal appeals court. And his description in an earlier tweet of the "shocking" number of overturned cases in the 9th Circuit belies the nature of the appeals system.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/ap-fact-check-trumps-misinformation-appeals-court-59365779

Facts from the article: "Over the past five years, the Supreme Court overturned a greater percentage of rulings from the 3rd Circuit (92.3 percent), the 6th Circuit (85.1 percent) and the Atlanta-based 11th Circuit (81.8 percent) than from the 9th (77.4 percent), according to The Associated Press' analysis of statistics from the legal website Scotusblog."

The Orange Anus-Mouth continues to make up his own "facts" with absolutely no regard for the truth. This malignant cancer on our country is a menace to our Constitution, our Country, and to all we hold dear as Americans. He is a traitor in the highest sense of the word, and needs to be prosecuted by Congress and removed from office as quickly as possible.

[world wide wally]

1. Trump makes it so easy to hate him

That is all

[LAS14]

2. Just curious. I was surprised at the percentage of reversals of...

... appeals court rulings. Does anyone know why this is? (All appeals courts, as the article reports.)

tia
las

[billh58]

4. I'm not sure, but

it may have something to do with the fact that the cases SCOTUS hears from Circuit Courts are "appeals" which needed to have legal grounds for the appeal (legal flaw), as opposed to a "preponderance of evidence."

[karynnj]

14. Not a lawyer, but I suspect that it is how the denuminator is defined

I assume it is the number of cases APPEALED, not the number of cases decided. I assume that it is a high bar to appeal rulings. Only those with the highest chance of being overturned are appealed.

Caveat - this is speculation.

[LAS14]

15. I posted this question stand alone and got a couple of helpful replies. Yes, it is the percentage..

... of those appealed, but more relevant is the fact that the Supreme Court chooses which ones they want to hear. They presumably only choose those that are complicated or that they disagree with.

[COLGATE4]

3. If he had the slightest interest in facts (which is a given since

we know he doesn't) he could ask his sister just how the appeal/reversal process works. She is a Judge on the Court of Appeals.

[FakeNoose]

9. He could, but I don't think they're on speaking terms

His siblings are not close to him and it goes back to a lawsuit over their father's will. Cheeto did something underhanded to cheat the older brother (Fred's) children out of their share. I think the details are in David Cay Johnston's book, The Making of Donald Trump.

[Achilleaze]

5. republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy

republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy
republican lies are profoundly dangerous for America & American democracy

[bhikkhu]

6. Just to add, on the high reversal rates -

the Supreme Court more often than not declines to hear cases if they don't think there is something to be heard or reconsidered.

The reversal rate in no way reflects the actual competence of the circuit courts overall, just that on those few cases where the supreme court sees there is a further issue to be made or precedent set, it does so.

Take a look at a small section of the court register: https://www.ca9.uscourts.gov/opinions/ . It goes without saying, the Supreme Court isn't reversing or even considering the vast majority of the work the court does.

[onit2day]

10. It is the nature of an appeals court to overturn rulings or there'd be no appeals

[bhikkhu]

12. My point was that the 79% overturn rate is not on total court decisions

but on the small fraction of those decisions that are appealed, and have the appeal accepted by the Supreme Court. The vast majority of Circuit Court decisions are either not appealed or not accepted by the Supreme Court.

Its easy to read Trump's words and get the idea that 79% of everything the Circuit Court decides gets reversed, which is not anywhere close to being factual.

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

7. The SCOTUS accepts relatively few cases that are being appealed from the Courts of Appeals.

Most appellate decisions are thus allowed to stand. While one District's decisions only apply to that District, they are at least taken into account by the other Districts as they make their own decisions. The percentages quoted refer only to the appellate court decisions that actually make it to be heard by the SCOTUS. Compared to the total number of opinions an appellate court makes, it's a much smaller percentage that are overturned.

[DallasNE]

8. What That Shows

Is not a problem with the Appeals court, but with the Supreme Court.

But it is an incomplete picture anyway because the vast majority of Appeals court decisions are the final word on the issue meaning these rates have no significant value.

[malaise]

11. Let him lie to the Judicial branch - to the Chief Justice

Please proceed asshole

[bluecollar2]

13. The 9th Circuit

Has been a punching bag for Limbaugh and his clones for years.

Trump's just spouting his pillow talk with Hannity.

No way that loser came up with the bash on his own.